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Advice on this 3.5+ Emerald Cut - Pic

M

Millennistar

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 21, 2009
Messages
62
Dear PS'ers,

I would be so grateful for your thoughts on this diamond. I just received it from a PS-recommended online vendor, and have about 30 days to determine if this is "the one". Personally, I haven't been able to take my eyes off it, and get giddy every time I try it on in a temporary setting. But, this is the first diamond I've ever really considered, and thus would appreciate your more experienced views.

In your opinions, is this a keeper or would you keep looking? My budget for the stone is <$40K (preferably $35K) and I would like the measurements to be at least 10mm x 8mm.

Shape: Emerald
Measurements: 10.10 x 8.14 x 5.10
Carat: 3.59
Color: I (I am not seeing ANY color)
Clarity: VVS1
Polish: Very Good
Symmetry: Good
Fluor: Strong Blue
Table: (GIA cert) 70% (Sarin) 68.4%
Depth: (GIA and Sarin) 62.6%
Crown Height/Angle: (Sarin) 9.2% / 23.5*
Pavilion Height/Angle: (Sarin) 52% / 40.0*
Culet: Very Small
Girdle Min - Max: 0.3% to 2.1%



And here's a hand shot, just in case it helps. It's sends off some fire in daylight.

_11103.jpg

_11104.jpg
 
i think its a stunning stone and a great value. love the shape!
 
Thank you for the reassurance, bgray. I know this seems crazy, but I'm wondering if I might be able to find something a little bigger and not sacrifice on cut quality. I should have specs for two additional stones shortly, both 4+ carats, but J color.
 
It's not going to be fiery. It's got a large table and the crown height is under 10%.

The depth has it facing up large.

If you haven't seen it in person, I would get an ASET. Then post it here. Make sure you have at least 2 week return policy (full refund no questions asked). And make sure you try it out.

If you have seen it in person, make sure you have a bullet proof return policy (full refund no questions asked) of at least two weeks and try it out before you spend a lot of money setting it. Take it home, make sure you view it while its dirty. Put lotion on your hands and then wipe your fingers across the surface of the stone.
 
Millennistar|1382329165|3541459 said:
Thank you for the reassurance, bgray. I know this seems crazy, but I'm wondering if I might be able to find something a little bigger and not sacrifice on cut quality. I should have specs for two additional stones shortly, both 4+ carats, but J color.
Click to expand...

possibly ..you may want to also look at K if you are not too color sensitive. A K will medium blue fluor would be a great find. Often you will find older EC that are JKL and quite stunning. I have seen old Cartier and Harry Winston Ec's in lower colors. I would take a look at the fancy cut guide up under knowledge and follow the cut parameters for 1A or 1B. vs 2 or better plus the cut are key. EC's are definitely eye of the beholder. you want a decent crown height ideally 10 or better and to see alternating bands of light and dark when you look at the stone as opposed to blacked out areas and big block of light and dark. i do think this stone looks great though
 
I love it! I think it's a keeper. :love: :love:
 
that is GORGEOUS! And I'm not even a fan of emerald cuts, but that one? :love: :love: :love: :love: :love:
 
Did the vendor supply you with ASET images to see leakage and light return? I wouldn't buy a diamond without that. When I bought a small asscher there was great variation in cut quality. I have hesitation about the cut because the table really is too large and a crown height of only 9% is very low.

As far as color goes, I looked at some large J EC's this summer and I thought I could handle the color in an emerald cut, even though I would not consider it in a round. It won't be as white as an I or higher, obviously. It will take on more color in certain environments. So consider that carefully. I really think I color is a great choice to have little to no visible tint and still maximize size.
 
Gypsy|1382331559|3541470 said:
It's not going to be fiery. It's got a large table and the crown height is under 10%.

The depth has it facing up large.

If you haven't seen it in person, I would get an ASET. Then post it here. Make sure you have at least 2 week return policy (full refund no questions asked). And make sure you try it out.

If you have seen it in person, make sure you have a bullet proof return policy (full refund no questions asked) of at least two weeks and try it out before you spend a lot of money setting it. Take it home, make sure you view it while its dirty. Put lotion on your hands and then wipe your fingers across the surface of the stone.
Click to expand...

In 100% agreement although I think Gypsy has a typo in that the 70% depth means it is facing up smaller than it should for a 3.5 carat EC.

ETA
I'm the one with the typo. :oops: The depth is actually fine, it faces up the correct size that it should (I prefer depths between 60% to 65%) but my personal preference is for a much smaller table.
 
Depth is 62.6 which is more shallow than I have seen for most EC's and asschers.
 
DiamondSeeker is correct that most ECs are typically deeper but 62.6% is not too shallow for an EC. If anything, it's the right depth to be at since it isn't too shallow and not too deep. My EC's depth is 63% but it also has a high enough crown that allows it to be fiery.
 
So there are always compromises when picking a fancy cut stone.

In this case you have a HUGE diamond that faces up huge with very nice clarity and good color, add Fluoro and its even better. You have lovely step patterning.

The downside is the crown is on the shallower end and the table a little larger. So the stone won't be a firey as others might be -- You will find white light return and brightness to be better than colored light return and broad firey flash. Perhaps the stone will be more glisteny and shimmery looking most of the time.

So it all depends on how you like to enjoy your diamond and what aspects of their performance are most important to you. Can you find another "better" stone? Not sure. But you can find one with a different combination of "traits" so to speak.

I encouage you to compare this diamond to others with different combos of characteristics. For this money, I would feel best if you compare this diamond to at least 2-3 others that are equally appealing and then choose the one you like the best.
 
I'm not really good at picking step cuts, but it looks beautiful from the photo -- and HUGE!! :love: :love: :love:
 
I dived straight to the pic and thought the colour was a bit warm, however, I am colour sensitive.

Can't comment on the numbers, as I am still learning myself, sorry!

DK :))
 
dk168|1382388074|3541846 said:
I dived straight to the pic and thought the colour was a bit warm, however, I am colour sensitive.

Can't comment on the numbers, as I am still learning myself, sorry!

DK :))
Click to expand...


You can't tell color from either of those pics. First one is black and white. In the second one everything is tinted with a reddish/yellow color.

Pics like that can't tell you color. My F would look 'warm' in that second pic. And an L would look white in the first.
 
Gypsy,

As I had mentioned, it was my first reaction after seeing the first pic (not mentioned in my last post) without reading the text/spec.

However, I must admit it looks whiter in the second pic.

So much to learn!

DK :))
 
Diamondseeker,

Thank you very much for the advice. I understand the importance of an ASET and asked the vendor for one. Unfortunately, the vendor said he did not have the technology to provide it. I went ahead and purchased the diamond anyway, with a 30-day money back guarantee in writing, thinking that my eye should be the guide. After all, I think that the beauty of a fancy step cut is often in the eye of the beholder.

Even so, I am taking this stone to an independent appraiser shortly who is in the American Society of Appraisers, and who can provide an ASET image. I hope to be bringing another diamond for comparison as well. I should have those pics and stats to post shortly.

That said, I am getting some fire off of the current diamond, very distinct step patterning, and lots of white light. It is very clear and bright. I love staring into the stone, which is why I love ECs, so for that reason alone I'm not ready to throw this one back just yet because of its shallower crown and its larger table.
 
Thank you, Dreamer_D, for your comment!

Yes, there are definitely compromises when picking fancies, and since I don't have more to spend I had to pick my non-negotiables and go from there. While the stone may not be as firey as others, it does fulfill much of what I'm looking for in an EC. I love the stark contrasts of the step patterning. I love that it appears icy white and mirror-like. I love the broad, bright flashes, and I treasure the pastel fire. I guess all of this is to say that while it may not be the best cut stone out there, I am still pretty impressed with how it is performing. It is certainly not hemorrhaging light. :D

I will certainly take your advice and compare this diamond to others. I'm getting one more sent to me (with a return policy), and another is being brought in by a local jeweler. Both are lower in color, but have a larger crown %.

Again, please accept my sincere thanks. You have been very helpful!
 
Emerald Cuts are a whole different barrel of fish to a Round Brilliant. Ones that should work by numbers alone sometimes look flat, glassy and like smuck and others with bigger tables, that should look like a blur or piece of glass actually can and do look amazing. Taking it into other jewellers particularly high end ones with a range of emeralds in different sizes (even smaller ones) might not be a bad exercise. What it will do is educate your eyes to see ones with a smaller table, a decent crown height and a respectable depth and see they have a faster scintillation pattern and more fine fire and flash and ones like yours which have bigger flashes of fire and a more steady white light return.

Neither is better than the other, it's simply what your eye prefers. Seeing as many as you can will help you with your decision.
 
Arkie and Gypsy have given you sound advice, and you are obviously covering your bases taking it to an appraiser and getting an aset. I just LOVE how that stone looks! It's so bright and gives great coverage! I didn't see any "warmth" but I am not "color-sensitive" so take my opinion with a grain of salt. I can't wait to see the results of the aset!
 
I am not an emerald cut expert but I think this one is very pretty. I love the w x l proportions. To me it is calling out for a 3-stone setting with 2 side traps.

Anne
 
Millennistar|1382396785|3541930 said:
Thank you, Dreamer_D, for your comment!

Yes, there are definitely compromises when picking fancies, and since I don't have more to spend I had to pick my non-negotiables and go from there. While the stone may not be as firey as others, it does fulfill much of what I'm looking for in an EC. I love the stark contrasts of the step patterning. I love that it appears icy white and mirror-like. I love the broad, bright flashes, and I treasure the pastel fire. I guess all of this is to say that while it may not be the best cut stone out there, I am still pretty impressed with how it is performing. It is certainly not hemorrhaging light. :D

I will certainly take your advice and compare this diamond to others. I'm getting one more sent to me (with a return policy), and another is being brought in by a local jeweler. Both are lower in color, but have a larger crown %.

Again, please accept my sincere thanks. You have been very helpful!
Click to expand...

You are welcome!

I find with my own diamonds I don't notice fire all that much, so for me its not paramount. I don't know if its how my eyes work or just the lighting I am in on a daily basis, or else the fact that I don't keep my diamonds very clean :rodent: ... but the end result is that for me, I enjoy two things about my diamonds on a daily basis: Nice bold contrast patterning and scintillation between the "on" and "off" facets, and white light return. I also like to enjoy my diamonds at a very close viewing distance. So for me, symmetry of the cut, lack of obstruction and leakage, and beautiful scintillating patterning when viewed up close are the most important features. And nice brightness and speed of scintillation for the eye-catching factor. All this is to say that not everyone feels the same way about the various components of diamond optics, and you should choose the stone that maximizes the features you DO care about.

Once you have checked that the diamond does not possess any rejection-worthy features -- like too much obstruction or obvious hazy and imprecise facets (leakage), or unfair pricing, to name a few -- then in my opinion the selection factors can become more idiosyncratic. I think your stone passes the rejection criteria. Now you have to evaluate your own selection criteria.
 
anne_h|1382397921|3541942 said:
To me it is calling out for a 3-stone setting with 2 side traps.

Anne
Click to expand...

Good call! That would be amazing.
 
Dreamer_D|1382398367|3541947 said:
anne_h|1382397921|3541942 said:
To me it is calling out for a 3-stone setting with 2 side traps.

Anne
Click to expand...

Good call! That would be amazing.
Click to expand...

I can't wait to discuss settings!!!
 
Here's another diamond that I'm considering. I understand that EGL has looser grading standards than GIA, so I'm expecting the color to be closer to a J, and the clarity to be closer to an SI1. The small inclusions in the vendor pics below don't bother me, but I think this one might be leaking some light. We'll see when I view in person and get an ASET. In the interim, here's a pic the vendor sent.

Shape: Emerald Cut
Cert: EGL
Carat: 4.46
Color: H
Clarity: VS2
Measurements: 10.86 x 8.21 x 5.76
Polish: Excellent
Symmetry: Excellent
Fluor: None
Table: 71%
Crown Height: 10%
Girdle: Thin
Depth: 70.2

_11138.jpg
 
You are right; I'm not liking this one because I suspect leakage too.
 
Chrono|1382448499|3542219 said:
You are right; I'm not liking this one because I suspect leakage too.
Click to expand...

Yes, you can see an awful lot of skin through the stone.

ETA: You should always ask yourself why a stone was sent to EGL rather than GIA. Usually a diamond is sent to EGL when it would receive a damning "black mark" from GIA that would affects its sellability. So diamonds are often send to EGL when they might get an I1 clarity grade from GIA, or a K color grade, or a poor cut grade, or similar. EGL exists primarily to allow diamond vendors to make more money on their diamonds by misleading consumers. In this case, its hard to identify the red flag, but there will be one! The fact that its not obvious makes me nervous. Remember EGL is loose on all their grades, including polish etc, not only color and clarity.
 
Chrono and Dreamer_D,

In your opinions, would it be helpful to evaluate this stone in person (it has a 7 day full money back return policy), or is the EGL cert enough to disqualify it?
 
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