2.5ct Tiffany vs 3ct Super Ideal with Tiffany setting

[Austina]

If I had the choice between a bigger, better diamond over a brand, I’d go bigger every single time.

 

[Bluevan]

Thank you for all the input everyone. My gf was torn about this but is now leaning more towards the Tiffany because she feels that a 2.5ct is a size that she would be totally happy with. I am sure a 3 ct from any of the super ideal vendors would be mind blowing but unfortunately we don't live in the US so she can't see the comparison herself.

She has also seen all the other more exclusive brands and whilst she loved the look of many of Harry Winston's rings, none spoke to her like the Tiffany solitaire did.

 

[motownmama]

I think you should just do that!! I understand the LOGIC, but I too am a Tiffany fan. Last anniversary my husband surprised me with a trip there and said "choose anything!" (We're old married types btw). I won't be forgetting THAT anytime soon!
Please come back and post pics.

 

[rockysalamander]

Thank you for all the input everyone. My gf was torn about this but is now leaning more towards the Tiffany because she feels that a 2.5ct is a size that she would be totally happy with. I am sure a 3 ct from any of the super ideal vendors would be mind blowing but unfortunately we don't live in the US so she can't see the comparison herself.

She has also seen all the other more exclusive brands and whilst she loved the look of many of Harry Winston's rings, none spoke to her like the Tiffany solitaire did.

Can you get the actual proportions of that stone? That may be what she is drawn to...

She can see a comparison with a super-ideal. There are CBI dealers overseas.
http://www.craftedbyinfinity.com/web/locations/index.html

 

[msop04]

I think part of the danger of Tiffany is that it’s not as “high end” a jewelry house if you eventually become really into jewelery. Depending on her age, I’d worry that as she got older, if she started looking into Cartier, VCA, boucheron, Harry Winston etc, the Tiffany name might not seem as fancy anymore lol. Where as a super ideal will always be a super ideal, the numbers are what they are.

In my teens and twenties I thought “oooo Tiffany!” Now in my 30s I’m like “eh, Tiffany’s”. If I’m going to pay the mark up I want real quality. And Tiffany to me feels too mass produced. Yes they sell gorgeous expensive unique pieces but they also sell buckets of silver keys and charms and I see them everywhere.

Just my opinion.

This. As many others have said, I believe it comes down to one question for your FF... Does she want (A) a smaller diamond with less than super ideal cut BUT WITH THE NAME for bragging rights, or would she rather have (B) a much larger super ideal diamond in a very similar setting?

If she can't get past the Tiffany name, then buy her a Tiffany. But if it's the superior sparkle and size of the super ideals she craves, then go with CBI, WF, or BG in a Vatche U-113.

I happen to love the classic Tiffany 6-prong solitaire, so I can understand why she fell in love with it.
That said, that setting has been duplicated and arguably made better by several designers. The closest is the Vatche (it's shank is a bit thinner, but it's been fooling salespeople at T&Co for years). WF makes a great version as well. I'm biased, but my favorite is the "Jovyn" by Caysie Van Bebber of CVB... which I had her modify with petite tab prongs reminiscent of vintage Tiffany (see avatar). To me, it's an elevated version of the classic T&Co.

 

[cmd2014]

Thank you for all the input everyone. My gf was torn about this but is now leaning more towards the Tiffany because she feels that a 2.5ct is a size that she would be totally happy with. I am sure a 3 ct from any of the super ideal vendors would be mind blowing but unfortunately we don't live in the US so she can't see the comparison herself.

She has also seen all the other more exclusive brands and whilst she loved the look of many of Harry Winston's rings, none spoke to her like the Tiffany solitaire did.

If she's seen the Tiffany ring and loves it, get the Tiffany ring. The exact one she saw. That's the dream ring.

 

[CareBear]

@Bluevan I am not sure if this has been mentioned already, but if you are going to be paying the Tiffany premium, make sure the stone you choose has ideal cut proportions! Tiffany has ideal cut stones and they also carry so-so cut stones. Most Tiffany buyers don't bother beyond the carat, color, clarity.

 

[motownmama]

CONGRATS on making a decision!!! PLEASE come back with handshots!

 

[junebug17]

It sounds like you've discussed this with your gf so she is making an informed decision. Some are going to disagree with me, but I love the Tiffany setting and I would want the real deal, sort of a mind-clean thing I guess. (The same thinking as people who avoid SI1 diamonds, just the idea of inclusions bothers them). Yeah, other people might not know or be able to tell, but she'll know, and that will probably give her a good feeling about her ring. And a 2.5 carat stone is not too shabby in the size department, especially on a 4.25 ring finger. It sounds like her heart is set on the real thing, so in that case I feel that is what she should get!

 

[diamondseeker2006]

@Bluevan I am not sure if this has been mentioned already, but if you are going to be paying the Tiffany premium, make sure the stone you choose has ideal cut proportions! Tiffany has ideal cut stones and they also carry so-so cut stones. Most Tiffany buyers don't bother beyond the carat, color, clarity.

This. At least be sure you get one of the better Tiffany diamonds considering very few of their stones would qualify as superideal cut like Whiteflash and CBI. If money was no object and I didn't care about the brand markup, I wouldn't settle for anything outside these parameters:

table 55-57
depth 60-62.3 (don't go greater depth than 62.3 or diameter can be smaller)
crown angle 34-35 (but 34.5 would be my target)
pavilion angle 40.6-40.9 (with 40.8 as the target if crown angle is close to 34.5)

 

[Swirl68]

A couple of years ago one of my daughter's teachers was given a "family" Tiffany engagement ring. It had belonged to the future groom's grandmother. There's just something kind of awesome about being able to pass down a Tiffany ring through the generations. It was whispered about in our circle for weeks. It was kind of funny how her finance suddenly became a man of good taste and fine
breeding. My daughter, who knows a thing or two about diamonds because she's spent enough time with me in jewelry stores and pawn shops, proclaimed it to be HUGE. I got a look at it one day- .75 max. Apparently, Tiffany diamonds appear to some as much larger stones than non-Tiffany diamonds.

I would absolutely want the real deal 2.5 carat Tiffany over a 3 carat super ideal. DANG, just thinking about an iconic 2.5 carat G VS2 Tiffany on my finger gives me goosebumps.

 

[bmfang]

This. As many others have said, I believe it comes down to one question for your FF... Does she want (A) a smaller diamond with less than super ideal cut BUT WITH THE NAME for bragging rights, or would she rather have (B) a much larger super ideal diamond in a very similar setting?

If she can't get past the Tiffany name, then buy her a Tiffany. But if it's the superior sparkle and size of the super ideals she craves, then go with CBI, WF, or BG in a Vatche U-113.

I happen to love the classic Tiffany 6-prong solitaire, so I can understand why she fell in love with it.
That said, that setting has been duplicated and arguably made better by several designers. The closest is the Vatche (it's shank is a bit thinner, but it's been fooling salespeople at T&Co for years). WF makes a great version as well. I'm biased, but my favorite is the "Jovyn" by Caysie Van Bebber of CVB... which I had her modify with petite tab prongs reminiscent of vintage Tiffany (see avatar). To me, it's an elevated version of the classic T&Co.

I finished work early yesterday and decided to walk in to the flagship T&Co store for my state before picking up my son from childcare.

Their promotional literature is always exceptionally produced with lots of beautiful photography (the retail markup partially goes toward this), so I went in there to pick up the latest edition of “This is Tiffany” along with their Christmas catalogue. Mission success.


While there, decided to browse around at their solitaires and apart from the pricing (there was one there for AUD$18.8k which looked to be between 0.75-0.85ct in size by my eyeballs) it did look utterly stunning... in their showroom lighting. At that price, expecting high colour clarity given that the 1ct stones start from A$20.4k at lowest colour-clarity combo.

I was also paying a fair bit of attention to the quality of the setting and, tbh, I find the prongs on the classic Tiffany setting to be a little... unrefined (diplomatically speaking). This is compared to the custom rings I’ve seen on this forum done by HPD’s bench, Victor Canera, David Klass, CvB, etc. Heck, even compared to my wife’s BGD Freya solitaire in 18k white gold, they look more like what I’d expect from BN or JA.

I agree with @msop04 that while it is an iconic setting, and one that would have been considered super refined back when Tiffany first started selling it, there are plenty of folks who have refined and improved on the basic design over the years. Vatche being one of them, HPD’s New York solitaire, Victor’s Gabriella raised band 6-prong solitaire, WF’s in-house version, BGD’s knife edge solitaire, etc.

Also, while I was there, I heard plenty of women ooh-ing and aah-ing over rings with stones in them with nary a question prior to purchase about actual specifications of the centre stone.

It was just a “look at fiancee/hubby, bat eyelids, say “this is the ring”* scenario. This for me sums up the ideal customer for Tiffany: I don’t care about the actual quality and light performance of my diamond, I just want it to come from T&Co.

 

[LLJsmom]

I finished work early yesterday and decided to walk in to the flagship T&Co store for my state before picking up my son from childcare.

Their promotional literature is always exceptionally produced with lots of beautiful photography (the retail markup partially goes toward this), so I went in there to pick up the latest edition of “This is Tiffany” along with their Christmas catalogue. Mission success.


While there, decided to browse around at their solitaires and apart from the pricing (there was one there for AUD$18.8k which looked to be between 0.75-0.85ct in size by my eyeballs) it did look utterly stunning... in their showroom lighting. At that price, expecting high colour clarity given that the 1ct stones start from A$20.4k at lowest colour-clarity combo.

I was also paying a fair bit of attention to the quality of the setting and, tbh, I find the prongs on the classic Tiffany setting to be a little... unrefined (diplomatically speaking). This is compared to the custom rings I’ve seen on this forum done by HPD’s bench, Victor Canera, David Klass, CvB, etc. Heck, even compared to my wife’s BGD Freya solitaire in 18k white gold, they look more like what I’d expect from BN or JA.

I agree with @msop04 that while it is an iconic setting, and one that would have been considered super refined back when Tiffany first started selling it, there are plenty of folks who have refined and improved on the basic design over the years. Vatche being one of them, HPD’s New York solitaire, Victor’s Gabriella raised band 6-prong solitaire, WF’s in-house version, BGD’s knife edge solitaire, etc.

Also, while I was there, I heard plenty of women ooh-ing and aah-ing over rings with stones in them with nary a question prior to purchase about actual specifications of the centre stone.

It was just a “look at fiancee/hubby, bat eyelids, say “this is the ring”* scenario. This for me sums up the ideal customer for Tiffany: I don’t care about the actual quality and light performance of my diamond, I just want it to come from T&Co.

I feel for you and all guys that are in this situation, which is especially frustrating when you do know better. I’m so sorry. Tiffany has done a remarkable job of marketing and product placement, all due to one very chic and well dressed Audrey Hepburn who ate her breakfast in front of a Tiffany storefront. Good job in trying in trying to educate and fight it.

 

[ringo865]

I’d punch my husband in the face if he got me a solitaire e-type ring from Tiffany. He knows it too. Of course, he’d rather drop that kind of money on a muscle car.

Not saying I would never consider an eternity band, but definitely not a solitaire.

 

[msop04]

A couple of years ago one of my daughter's teachers was given a "family" Tiffany engagement ring. It had belonged to the future groom's grandmother. There's just something kind of awesome about being able to pass down a Tiffany ring through the generations. It was whispered about in our circle for weeks. It was kind of funny how her finance suddenly became a man of good taste and fine
breeding. My daughter, who knows a thing or two about diamonds because she's spent enough time with me in jewelry stores and pawn shops, proclaimed it to be HUGE. I got a look at it one day- .75 max. Apparently, Tiffany diamonds appear to some as much larger stones than non-Tiffany diamonds.

Maybe it was cut shallow?? ...although Tiff seems to like the "steep/deep" combo, so IDK.

 

[bmfang]

I feel for you and all guys that are in this situation, which is especially frustrating when you do know better. I’m so sorry. Tiffany has done a remarkable job of marketing and product placement, all due to one very chic and well dressed Audrey Hepburn who ate her breakfast in front of a Tiffany storefront. Good job in trying in trying to educate and fight it.

I educated my wife. She’s happier to save the cash and get something better value for money and use the savings for something else.

I’m trying to spread the education at work amongst work colleagues who are looking at purchasing.

Some have done the sensible thing and purchased solitaires elsewhere and gone to T&Co for bands (though some of them have said afterwards that they didn’t feel the band quality was worth it relative to price and they could have gotten the bands done at the same vendor as the solitaire).

T&Co and De Beers have one thing in common that has resulted in them continuing to make money all these years: the knew the power of good ear-wormy advertising and branding. Ok, that’s two things. Lol.

 

[rockysalamander]

Maybe it was cut shallow?? ...although Tiff seems to like the "steep/deep" combo, so IDK.

I've seen many 60/60 stones too.

 

[msop04]

I've seen many 60/60 stones too.

I'm sure they have all flavors. When I used to frequent TPF years ago, most of the chicks with T&Co diamonds were cut "steep/deep"... But, I mean, Tiffany turns down like 99.99999999999657 of all diamonds, so they must be the best regardless, right??

I was really just being cheeky about the comment that Tiff stones appear larger... I can understand b/c it seems they come with big egos. LOL **KIDDING!!!** #kinda

 

[bmfang]

I've seen many 60/60 stones too.

The 0.75-0.85ct stone under spotlights yesterday was throwing out some serious brilliance with less fire and scintillation as I was moving my head around. I suspect it was a 60/60 stone. Didn’t get a chance to ask as all the sales associates were with customers.

I should have taken a free glass of bubbly that was being offered to all who were in store (again, that’s where the retail markup is going...)

 

[MandyPandy]

What about a 2.5 super ideal and with the savings of ~$20K get:
- an “engagement” purse, like an Hermès or Chanel
- designer jewelry, I.e. Cartier Love bangle and
- some fun shoes?
If name brand is important this could be a good way to get a top quality diamond and the designer names. IMHO seeing someone with all those things would be more impressive than a Tiffany ring.

 

[msop04]

The 0.75-0.85ct stone under spotlights yesterday was throwing out some serious brilliance with less fire and scintillation as I was moving my head around. I suspect it was a 60/60 stone. Didn’t get a chance to ask as all the sales associates were with customers.

I should have taken a free glass of bubbly that was being offered to all who were in store (again, there’s where the retail markup is going...)

It would take a LOT of bubbly for me to even consider those prices - YIKES!!!

 

[rockysalamander]

If you are stuck on Tiffany, follow the parameters above and buy your own ASET scope.

https://ideal-scope.com/product/expert-aset-scope-kit/

On this same site, is information on using it. Take a photo and you can post it here for help. We can still help you maximize quality at Tiffany. Just push for the angles/% above and insist on using the ASET. They are always intrigued when my dad uses his and he ends up educating them.

 

[Johnbt]

"Tiffany has done a remarkable job of marketing and product placement, all due to one very chic and well dressed Audrey Hepburn who ate her breakfast in front of a Tiffany storefront. Good job in trying in trying to educate and fight it."

I was successful earlier this year and we even have a Tiffany store in town. All I did was tell my beloved that Avon Products owned Tiffany from 1978 to 1984. That's right, once upon a time the famous Tiffany brand was sold to Avon. What were they thinking? Was business that bad? And just like that it was no longer your mother's - or grandmother's - Tiffany. Tiffany was sold to an investor group in '84 and in 1987 they went public and sold common stock. Yes, I just used Tiffany and common in the same sentence.

Try to visualize Audrey Hepburn standing in front of an Avon store. Concentrate and don't laugh.

But hey, if she wants Tiffany get her Tiffany. It's easier to just agree.

 

[sledge]

As others are pointing out, even Tiffany diamonds have variances and personalities because of the exact proportions of the diamond.

If she found one that made her all gaga then ask for the proportions. Better yet snap a photo as I'm sure we will want more info than they give. Run them by us and we can tell you what it is she likes.

Also ask to see that same ring in a variety of lighting and not just their showroom with million dollar jewelry lighting that could make frozen spit look sparkly. Outside if possible. Back office with florescent type bulbs. And so on and so forth.

Not that I expect the results to be as bad but @Garry H (Cut Nut) has a video showing two stones that both look great in jewelry lighting. But when you put it under the counter the larger stone magically shrinks in size as that awesome lighting isn't tricking your eyes anymore.

Also I would pick up an ASET scope and take with you. They may frown but reality is you are paying a hefty premium for a name and blue box, and quite frankly not every Tiffany is identical but rather falls within a range of acceptable values.

Good luck with all this. I would not choose this myself but I respect the fact people have different preferences and needs.

Please be sure to come back and post photos of the ring.

 

[crbl999]

As others are pointing out, even Tiffany diamonds have variances and personalities because of the exact proportions of the diamond.

If she found one that made her all gaga then ask for the proportions. Better yet snap a photo as I'm sure we will want more info than they give. Run them by us and we can tell you what it is she likes.

Also ask to see that same ring in a variety of lighting and not just their showroom with million dollar jewelry lighting that could make frozen spit look sparkly. Outside if possible. Back office with florescent type bulbs. And so on and so forth.

Not that I expect the results to be as bad but @Garry H (Cut Nut) has a video showing two stones that both look great in jewelry lighting. But when you put it under the counter the larger stone magically shrinks in size as that awesome lighting isn't tricking your eyes anymore.

Also I would pick up an ASET scope and take with you. They may frown but reality is you are paying a hefty premium for a name and blue box, and quite frankly not every Tiffany is identical but rather falls within a range of acceptable values.

Good luck with all this. I would not choose this myself but I respect the fact people have different preferences and needs.

Please be sure to come back and post photos of the ring.

Here is that video. Amazing how the diamond shrinks in size under the counter.

 

[Dancing Fire]

I would absolutely want the real deal 2.5 carat Tiffany over a 3 carat super ideal. DANG, just thinking about an iconic 2.5 carat G VS2 Tiffany on my finger gives me goosebumps.

I would get more goosebumps looking at this one.
https://www.hpdiamonds.com/en-us/diamonddetail/HPD10480

And I would get more goosebumps after I see the price tag of a Tiff & Co. ring...

 

[Weecam]

I think maybe I’ll chime in....
I upgraded my .88ct old European Cut diamond solitaire ring to a Tiffany & Co. 1.18ct G VS1 diamond in their platinum solitaire setting for my 21st anniversary. It didn’t wow me but I wore it for a few months.
Shortly after that I found PriceScope. I learned about ideal cut diamonds and the recommended vendors. Believe it or not, I sold my Tiffany & Co. ring and purchased an A Cut Above diamond and setting from Whiteflash. And I’m so happy I did!!!! The customer service was phenomenal and I’m still blown away by the crystal clear sparkle bomb of a diamond I’m lucky to own. It’s a 1.42ct G VS1 in their platinum Elegant setting. I also prefer this setting as I didn’t find the Tiffany knife edge very comfortable.
I honestly thought that when I purchased the Tiffany ring that it would be top of the line but boy was I wrong. I also thought that having the brand would make me happy but in the end it didn’t. No one knew it was a Tiffany & Co. diamond ring and it’s not like I was going to broadcast it anyways.

Finally, you wouldn’t believe how many compliments I get all the time!

 

[Dancing Fire]

 

[LLJsmom]

What about a 2.5 super ideal and with the savings of ~$20K get:
- an “engagement” purse, like an Hermès or Chanel
- designer jewelry, I.e. Cartier Love bangle and
- some fun shoes?
If name brand is important this could be a good way to get a top quality diamond and the designer names. IMHO seeing someone with all those things would be more impressive than a Tiffany ring.

Genius. I would be at VCA in two seconds flat. I guess I’m just as big a sucker for branding. If any of your honeys are allergic to money send them to VCA. Look at their prices for semi precious stones, and you’re lucky if you get on the waiting list.

 

[MarionC]

I was so in love with Tiffany at one point that I wanted to buy stock in the company. My finacial advisor said no, because they are just not that successful. I found that interesting and it kind of took the glow off.
If Tiffany were the best quality I would not be so adamant about looking elsewhere. It seems illogical to me to sacrifice cut to be able to say I made a purchase there. I would rather be wowed by the cut than the brand name. But I do understand what it is like to be in awe of a brand. I’ve been there myself. Lol