1st time buyer looking at asscher

[Schafenm]

hi everyone. I am new to this forum and to diamond engagement ring shopping. My boyfriend and I have just recently started looking and am thinking about getting engaged in a year. We are looking at 1.5 - 2.0 carat asscher cut engagement rings. The setting that seems to be the front runner so far is a tapered baguette, long baguettes not the short ones. We have looked at a few stores and are leaning towards a 2.0 since I don't have tiny hands (ring size 7). We are meeting with a private jeweler next week and would love some advice or opinions. Thank you very much!!

 

[Gypsy]

Budget?

 

[Schafenm]

Around 16,000

 

[Gypsy]

Okay. Good budget.

There are a lot of unattractive asschers out there. Please make sure your local jeweler is aware of what a good asscher looks like.

AND make sure you do.

Here's a little test to help you train your eyes.

What's wrong with each of these from the pics and which are the nicest looking. (Ignore carat weight, color and clarity for purposes of this. Just look at the pictures and the depth and table measurements and the girdle, that's all you'll need).

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/E-VVS2-Good-Cut-Asscher-Diamond-1483844.asp

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/J-VVS1-Very%20Good-Cut-Asscher-Diamond-1463011.asp

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/E-VVS2-Ideal-Cut-Asscher-Diamond-1424517.asp

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/F-VS1-Ideal-Cut-Asscher-Diamond-1336812.asp

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/D-VS1-Ideal-Cut-Asscher-Diamond-1423134.asp

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/D-VS1-Very%20Good-Cut-Asscher-Diamond-1465418.asp

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/D-IF-Ideal-Cut-Asscher-Diamond-1289311.asp

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/D-VS1-Ideal-Cut-Asscher-Diamond-1268456.asp

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/F-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Asscher-Diamond-1260282.asp

 

[Schafenm]

Thank you very much!! This whole process is very overwhelming, yet very exciting at the same time.

 

[Gypsy]

Thank you very much!! This whole process is very overwhelming, yet very exciting at the same time.

You're welcome. Take your time. Look at the links. Then post back for me what you see in each of them. I'll help you train your eyes so you know what to look for so when you are shopping in person you will know what to look for and what to avoid.

 

[Christina...]

Yah! I'm glad that you decided to start your own thread! And I'm delighted that Gypsy is here to help you. The forum has a few asscher experts that I was hoping would chime in to help you. Gypsy is one, Kenny is another and KarlK, all come to mind, as do others. You have a great budget, but as Gypsy already told you, the process is finding a great performing asscher is a daunting task and the people here can help you make it more pleasant.

I also forgot to officially welcome you...so, welcome to PS, the first rule, what ever you purchase you must post lots and lots of pics of in the SMTB (show me the bling) forum. You may want to take a look at this thread as well, lots of beautiful step cuts around here.

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/asscher-lovers-post-ur-fave-e-rings.27951/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/asscher-lovers-post-ur-fave-e-rings.27951/[/URL]

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/ecs-show-me-some-life.82527/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/ecs-show-me-some-life.82527/[/URL]

 

[Christina...]

Gypsy, I'm curious, in the second JA link that you posted, it looks as thought the steps are more rectangular like an EC than square like an asscher steps tend to be, yet the stone itself is perfectly square why is that?


EDIT: That will teach me to read a post before I respond. I thought that you were making recommendations and I wondered when I got to the second one what you were thinking. 2nd edit well the first one too, but I won't give away the reasoning yet and let OP decide.

 

[Schafenm]

Ok here goes my best untrained effort to find what is wrong with these stones... Lol

Link 1: The angle cut that runs down each corner diagonally in does not stay open all the way to the center. It makes it look a little off in my opinion.

Link 2: I'm going to agree with Christina that the facets are cut emerald. I'd like to think I would have figured that out.

Link 3: The top and left facets toward the center are making thicker dark lines then the other sides. I'm not sure if this an issue or not when looking at an asscher, but that's the only nonsemetric thing I can see.

Link 4: In all honestly it looks like the angles coming down are different widths. The top right angle seems to be wider than the rest.

Link 5: Again on this one the angular lines don't stay open all the way down. Also the top dark shadow line is not completely parallel. The bottom line of that cut looks to taper up some and not create a level facet.

Link 6: I'm not quite sure what is wrong with this one.

Link 7: ??????

Link 8: Not quite sure

Link 9: Same as link 6,7, and 8

I hope I didn't botch this up too bad!! Lol, I tried to pretend I knew what I was looking for a little bit.

 

[Christina...]

I'm sorry Schafemn! I started with the first link Gypsy posted and I thought, 'hhmmm, that's an interesting recommendation, I wonder why she chose that one" Then when I got to the second link, I was really really confused and thought that maybe gypsy had wine with her dinner and thats when I stopped and posted. I know better and should have read the post instead of assuming that they were all recommendations.

Didn't know that you were going to have to pass a test did you?? Can't wait for Gypsy to come back and tell you what you should have seen. When you start shopping on your own this is going to come in very handy!

 

[Christina...]

All three are beautiful choices and it appears WF already rated the ACA as eye clean. There doesn't appear to be any issue with the two from JA either. Are you sure you want to stay with an E F color? You can purchase much more diamond buy dropping down to a G or H and it will still appear super white when it's face up and set in it's setting. Color is a very personal choice though and you have to know what your comfortable with.

 

[Gypsy]

Ok here goes my best untrained effort to find what is wrong with these stones... Lol

Link 1: The angle cut that runs down each corner diagonally in does not stay open all the way to the center. It makes it look a little off in my opinion. Yup, good call. Aside from that though, it's a bright stone.

Link 2: I'm going to agree with Christina that the facets are cut emerald. I'd like to think I would have figured that out. Yup, good call, the pavilion has a keel instead of coming to a point. and the facets follow that giving you the look of an EC in a square stone. It also had some dark facets under the table that don't look like they will light up when you move them.

Link 3: The top and left facets toward the center are making thicker dark lines then the other sides. I'm not sure if this an issue or not when looking at an asscher, but that's the only nonsemetric thing I can see. This one was a harder one. Do you see the dark box under the table? All the pavillion facets below that look like they are likely to be dead. These could light up when you tilt them, but it's likely to be very underperforming.

Link 4: In all honestly it looks like the angles coming down are different widths. The top right angle seems to be wider than the rest. This one has some potential possibly. The photo isn't the best really hard to discern whether the 'issues' are from the photography or the diamond, I can't tell whether it just has a strong contrast pattern or if there are really just way too many dark facets. Yes, some of the facets are uneven looking. Also it has a really big table and might be glassy.

Link 5: Again on this one the angular lines don't stay open all the way down. Also the top dark shadow line is not completely parallel. The bottom line of that cut looks to taper up some and not create a level facet. Yup, good call on the corner facets not going all the way down. Compare it to number one though. That one was brighter and with the exception of the corners was a nice stone. This one is a dud and is going to be dead pretty much all under neath the table. The facets aren't reflecting light back. If you compare it to number one you'll see what I mean.

Link 6: I'm not quite sure what is wrong with this one. This one has very nice faceting and the pic is indicative of a lot of potential. This one's problem is in the depth and spread. You want a one carat asscher to face up at least 5.5mm square at a bare minimum but the 70% depth is making it face up at 5.3 x 5.7. This asscher should be discounted because of the depth because of it's depth leading it to look smaller than it's carat weight. BUT this is the best looking asscher by FAR so far. Still, this is why you want to shop for SPREAD (measurements) with asschers NOT carat weight.

Link 7: ?????? The windmills are very dark on this stone, and don't look like they are reflecting light well. This contrast pattern isn't what you want to see, you want bright windmills (the corner angles are referred to as windmills on here).

Link 8: Not quite sure Horribly dark under the table. Those facets are dead, dead dead. Compare the contrast and brightness to number 6. See all that deadness under the table? It's got what is referred to as a problem with the P3 facet of the pavilion. This is HORRIBLY prevalent with asschers, and is what you are REALLY likely to see at full carat marks, because it means the diamond was cut NOT for light return but for weight retention to hit the 1 carat mark. If this diamond had been cut for light return it would weight 96 points instead of a carat, but wouldn't cost as much but would be much prettier. You DO NOT want an asscher that does this, and you will likely see it often. This is why you will find some of the most beautiful stones at 'weird' carat weights, 96 points, 1.88 carats, 2.13... so when you are looking make SURE you tell your jeweler you care more about the faceting and the light return and the spread and NOT the weight.

Link 9: Same as link 6,7, and 8 This one really has nothing wrong with it. It's the best asscher of the lot. It's not less facets than number 6 (count the steps on the table and you will see what I mean) and is a different style stone. But the steps are incredibly even, there is contrast but no facets that look dead, and the darker ones look like they will light up when they are in motion (and diamonds are in motion on your hand). This one is also a VERY VERY hard to find eyeclean SI asscher. At the weights you are looking at I would stick to VS2 and higher clarity. But this is a needle in a haystack stone.

I hope I didn't botch this up too bad!! Lol, I tried to pretend I knew what I was looking for a little bit.

You did good. My best advice to you is to go on James Allen and just look through these links again. Try to see what I've written in the pictures of the stones. And then go and look at others on there (there are 100s) and train your eyes. If you can't figure out if a stone has a problem or is a good choice, post and ask. Training your eyes is going to be the best thing you can do.

Here's more information to help you. That last stone. The F SI, the one I said is the best of the lot. You can see it here in this thread in real life pics: [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/dilemma-between-the-two-asschers.172652/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/dilemma-between-the-two-asschers.172652/[/URL] and here you can see the ASET for it in this thread: [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/new-asscher-from-james-allen-to-evaluate.172436/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/new-asscher-from-james-allen-to-evaluate.172436/[/URL] Studying these links will help you understand how a well performing asscher will look in person and in ASETs

You can buy a simple ASET scope for yourself and teach yourself how you use it http://www.ideal-scope.com/cart_zoom_item.asp?Id=23&ShowAdd=Y It's 50 bucks and it will show you how the diamond is performing. Here's a tutorial: http://www.lexusindia.in/products/gb-aset-scope.aspx Step cuts have strong contrast patterns (and should) so they will read differently than brilliant cuts under the ASET and the ASET isn't as important with asschers as it is with brilliant cuts. Trained eyes will be your greatest resource. BUT an ASET will confirm potential problems with light return that you may see but not be certain of.


My last advice here is-- carry hand lotion. Use it before going into the jewelry store. Once on your hand your stone will rarely if ever be perfectly clean for longer than an hour at a time. While you are walking around with the stones you are considering (and you should always walk around with them, see them in natural day light but not in direct sunlight , then see them in bright sun light, then see them inside and away from the jeweler's lights) rub your hands on them and get them dirty with some of the linger hand lotion that will help you see how it performs dirty.

LMAO Christina. When someone is shopping in person for a step cut in person I try to post problem stones (and they are SOOOO sadly easy to find) so that I can show them common problems to train their eyes to spot things to avoid.

 

[Gypsy]

Opps forgot.

A 1.5 carat asscher should face up at around 6.4-6.5 (same as a one carat round brilliant). And a 2 carat stone at around 7mm square.

If I were you I would shoot for an H VS2 stone or higher in terms of color and clarity.

Here's a gorgeous 1.5 carat, but it is deep and faces up a bit small and since the table is a bit bigger than ideal I would ask for the crown height (a Sarin will give you that and James Allen can do Sarins). You want a crown height of AT LEAST 10-11% on an asscher, but really the best and brightest stones tend to have crown heights of around 14% and over. http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/E-VS2-Ideal-Cut-Asscher-Diamond-1375385.asp You don't need an E color. But with fancy cuts you have to keep your color and clarity open. You might end up with an H or an E... to me color is much less important than faceting and light return.

The brightest stone and the prettiest faceting is what you want. You might have to sacrifice some spread for that... depending on what's available. That's a trade off many make, and it's not a bad thing, it's just something you should be aware of so that if you do make the trade off it's made with eyes wide open.


Recommended riorities with asschers:

1. light return/faceting (cut quality)
2. eyeclean clarity
3. spread
4. color
5. actual carat weight

 

[Christina...]

All three are beautiful choices and it appears WF already rated the ACA as eye clean. There doesn't appear to be any issue with the two from JA either. Are you sure you want to stay with an E F color? You can purchase much more diamond buy dropping down to a G or H and it will still appear super white when it's face up and set in it's setting. Color is a very personal choice though and you have to know what your comfortable with.

Aye yi yi!! I don't know what is going on with me tonight...too many windows open, obviously this post was for another thread!



Gypsy: I think it's a perfect idea! I wish that I had been on PS longer before I purchased my asscher. It was so overwhelming and I had very very little knowledge and experience. I could have used you, and Scha is very likely to have your guidance!

 

[Schafenm]

Thank you Gypsy. You really are an angel of diamonds. I would probably have bought a crappy diamond if I would have never stumbled across this site. Thank you so much!!! Hopefully in a year I will be able to post pics of a beautiful asscher diamond!!! I will be studying up on all your advice until we meet with the jeweler.

 

[Christina...]

All three are beautiful choices and it appears WF already rated the ACA as eye clean. There doesn't appear to be any issue with the two from JA either. Are you sure you want to stay with an E F color? You can purchase much more diamond buy dropping down to a G or H and it will still appear super white when it's face up and set in it's setting. Color is a very personal choice though and you have to know what your comfortable with.

Aye yi yi!! I don't know what is going on with me tonight...too many windows open, obviously this post was for another thread!



Gypsy: I think it's a perfect idea! I wish that I had been on PS longer before I purchased my asscher. It was so overwhelming and I had very very little knowledge and experience. I could have used you, and Scha is very likely to have your guidance!

 

[Gypsy]

All three are beautiful choices and it appears WF already rated the ACA as eye clean. There doesn't appear to be any issue with the two from JA either. Are you sure you want to stay with an E F color? You can purchase much more diamond buy dropping down to a G or H and it will still appear super white when it's face up and set in it's setting. Color is a very personal choice though and you have to know what your comfortable with.

Aye yi yi!! I don't know what is going on with me tonight...too many windows open, obviously this post was for another thread!



Gypsy: I think it's a perfect idea! I wish that I had been on PS longer before I purchased my asscher. It was so overwhelming and I had very very little knowledge and experience. I could have used you, and Scha is very likely to have your guidance!

It's okay honey. Happens to us all Christina. My asscher was pre-PS too. I just got lucky because I had a jeweler who knew asschers. I had a list of specs, but didn't know that a beautiful asscher could have very similar basic specs (table, depth, polish/symmetry, color and clarity) as a dog asscher. And the majority of asschers out there are problematic.

 

[Gypsy]

Thank you Gypsy. You really are an angel of diamonds. I would probably have bought a crappy diamond if I would have never stumbled across this site. Thank you so much!!! Hopefully in a year I will be able to post pics of a beautiful asscher diamond!!! I will be studying up on all your advice until we meet with the jeweler.

Welcome sweetie. And if you are in need of further of assistance, please post here. You can even page us by nickname if you want to.

Here's an article that will help you too. https://www.pricescope.com/journal/performance-and-p3-facets-discussion-about-step-cut-diamonds

The article applies to Diamond 8 above as well as:

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/E-VVS2-Ideal-Cut-Asscher-Diamond-1424517.asp (Number 3)
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/D-VS1-Ideal-Cut-Asscher-Diamond-1423134.asp (Number 5)

All three have P3 problems.

 

[madelise]

wow gypsy, I looked up this thread b/c OP mentioned in her other thread about you testing her. You are so awesome!!

 

[Gypsy]

Asschers are hard to shop for *shrug*

I'm so happy the OP has her dream ring. I can't wait to see it.

 

[oohsparkly]

Gypsy you should be in business for yourself as a personal shopper for diamond buyers! Your attention to details and knowledge is amazing.

 

[Gypsy]

Gypsy you should be in business for yourself as a personal shopper for diamond buyers! Your attention to details and knowledge is amazing.

Thank you honey. Within PS parameters I'm helpful. But I'm not a GG or a professional. I do wish I could be though, and I do what I can on here. I had a lot of great teachers, the older posters on RT who have moved on now. We have a lot of newer posters like Christina who are taking over the ropes though. They can take over when I retire. It's a good circle.

 

[Christina...]

Awww! Thanks for the compliment Gypsy. You have no idea how much that means coming from someone as knowledgeable and irreplaceable as you. I only hope one day to be as informed and helpful as you have been to so many here! You're a fantastic mentor Gypsy! Thank you!

 

[Schafenm]

Hey gypsy!!

I just wanted to say thanknyou so much for your help with the search for our diamond. I looked at this post again the night before we met with the jeweler. I see that you read my other post and know that we have decided on a diamond. I tried to take some pictures of it yesterday, we went and saw it again. Unfortunately, I did not read the thread on how to take pictures of your diamonds before we left. All the pictures are blurry and you cannot see anything I will now have to wait until I receive the ring, because I am Not involved anymore.

I just wanted to come here and give credit where credit is due, and say THANK YOU!!!!!!

 

[Gypsy]

Awww! Thanks for the compliment Gypsy. You have no idea how much that means coming from someone as knowledgeable and irreplaceable as you. I only hope one day to be as informed and helpful as you have been to so many here! You're a fantastic mentor Gypsy! Thank you!

Anytime sweetie. You and a few others (not going to name names unless I leave anyone out) have been so awesome. There were a couple of months last year where there were only 6 of us posting (I think it was me, charmy, dreamer, DS, and Yssie, and slg only for the most part and only 3 of us on a time) substantive posts and I was really worried because I would tell we (and me) were getting burned out. Now it's so wonderful to click on a thread and see the "next generation" posting with such knowledge and insight that I can either just move on to a different thread or just basically ditto the posters before me. I'm so happy you are here helping, and you are doing a lovely job.

 

[Gypsy]

Hey gypsy!!

I just wanted to say thanknyou so much for your help with the search for our diamond. I looked at this post again the night before we met with the jeweler. I see that you read my other post and know that we have decided on a diamond. I tried to take some pictures of it yesterday, we went and saw it again. Unfortunately, I did not read the thread on how to take pictures of your diamonds before we left. All the pictures are blurry and you cannot see anything I will now have to wait until I receive the ring, because I am Not involved anymore.

I just wanted to come here and give credit where credit is due, and say THANK YOU!!!!!!

I'm SO EXCITED FOR YOU! I can't wait to see your ring (I know you can't either). Congratulations honey and you are more than welcome. I'm just happy you've got a stone you are excited about and in love with! That's our goal here! ((HUGS))