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19K White Gold a true white metal?

clearfading

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Mar 29, 2016
Messages
256
Hi guys, anyone ever heard of 19K white gold and it being a "true white metal and not requiring rhodium plating?" I was told this by someone quoting me for a setting. They also told me that white gold/palladium alloy is not recommended because palladium is brittle. Any merit to this? I think that is far fetched since it's not even 100% palladium.
 

Laila619

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 28, 2008
Messages
11,608
It doesn't make sense to me as gold is inherently yellow in color, and with 19k, you are at over 75% pure gold. So 19k white probably has a lot of nickel in it and the rhodium plating will wear away. I much prefer platinum or palladium for settings. White gold alloyed with palladium will be much more white than nickel white gold coated in rhodium. Can it be brittle? Sure. But with any competent jeweler, it's a non-starter.
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,198
These BM's and the BS they feed people.

Gold is yellow. Period.

Now, there are alloys of white gold that don't need plating. Like the X1 by Stuller. That doesn't make the "true", they are just alloyed so that they are as white as possible and do not need rhodium. It's the alloy that matters. Not the 19kt which refers to the amount of gold in the alloy. And since 19 kt is a HIGH amount of gold, which, again, is yellow, the statement makes no sense.

If you want a "true" white metal, stick to platinum. Not palladium. Platinum.

Okay? And find a new jeweler. Okay?
 

ChristineRose

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
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Aug 5, 2012
Messages
926
19K vs 18K is an advertising gimmick. But the alloys are proprietary and there is lots of individual variation. Some are brittle but "too brittle" is going to depend on the type of ring, how it's worked, etc.

Ask them to show you unplated and plated rings. Gary Holloway suggests brushed and polished. Then if it's white enough to make you happy, consider buying it. If they don't have the demo rings, then don't buy it and consider finding a better jeweler.

Also, if you have an issue with nickel, it's guilty until proven innocent. The sales clerks will always tell you there's no nickel or if there is it won't be a problem because magic.

ETA: Old thread about Stuller's X1, which is the best known alloy of the type we're discussing:

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/best-white-gold-alloys.163572/page-3']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/best-white-gold-alloys.163572/page-3[/URL]

It's not ideal because it was new enough that people really didn't know what was up, but there's a lot of good technical stuff in there.
 

MollyMalone

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jun 2, 2013
Messages
3,084
Scott K's settings are 19K white gold, not 18K (although Scott Kay dealers' showcase 19K settings are rhodium-plated, probably because that's what most people are used to seeing). Scott Kay's 19K white gold is alloyed with palladium, so they have obviously mastered it, don't find it unsatisfactorily brittle.

Here are info sheets re Argen's white alloys (based in Canada, Argen is the other outfit, in addition to Stuller, mentioned in the PS thread that ChristineRose linked). The first shows the "whiteness" of their various alloys compared to rhodium plating; the second tells you, in the Ingredients column, what metals are in their various alloys:
http://www.argenjewelry.com/index.php?doc_id=23
http://www.argenjewelry.com/Casting+Grain+Temperatures/id/30/
Their whitest WG alloy is their 19K that consists of gold, nickel, and zinc.

Similar "whiteness" chart from Stuller that includes their X-1 alloys:
http://www.stuller.com/apps/images/kbpdfs/x1.pdf

Here are 2 threads with a number of photos of Hoover's lovely 19K WG rings: first, a 3-stone with August Vintage Rounds from Good Old Gold, and then, a 5-stone AVR ring:
[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/avr-3-stone-ring.178237/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/avr-3-stone-ring.178237/[/URL]
[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/2-10-tcw-graduated-5-stone-avr-ring.187752/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/2-10-tcw-graduated-5-stone-avr-ring.187752/[/URL]
Would you be happy to leave this particular alloy unplated? (looks pretty darned white to me)
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
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Jan 11, 2006
Messages
55,631
I recommend platinum. And even then, the most common alloy is not one of the harder ones, which means it scratches more easily and develops the gray patina faster. The best and harder platinum alloys are:

90% platinum/10% iridium

95% platinum/5% ruthenium
 

cflutist

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jul 12, 2004
Messages
3,903
From left to right:

Platinum
Stuller 14X1 (it comes in 14K and 18K with 14K being whiter)
18K White Gold

small_plat-14-x1_wg_comparison_-_1.jpg
 

ChristineRose

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Aug 5, 2012
Messages
926
I just want to add that I was looking for pics like these and couldn't find any...awesome Pricescope!

Also note how much difference there is in density and melting point on the Argen chart. The makers will have very particular thoughts about what alloys should be used for what ring.
 

clearfading

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Mar 29, 2016
Messages
256
That's true. I was told 90% plat 10% iridium would be best for this fancy shape stone. I will go with that but loved the thread, info and photo posted. All those metal colors are so pretty!
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 11, 2006
Messages
55,631
Very nice picture, Cheryl! You can really see the difference in whiteness in that photo. I am saving it in my picture files!
 
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