Yeesh GIA vs EGL

[necedemalis]

I've been filling up on as much diamond education as possible & have decided to take the stance to just flat out not consider EGL certified diamonds. My reasoning is that I am a novice with very little point of reference to say how far off the EGL cert will be from a GIA cert. But I tell you, some of these deals are insane for the comparative EGL cert diamonds. I've been looking at the inventory from IDJ in NYC & in a matter of moments, shifting to the GIA-only mind-set, I went from a strong chance to no chance of getting a 2+ ct stone with my ~$8-9k budget for a loose radiant.

 

[necedemalis]

Oh yea and this guy:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ig34MVGeubc

 

[SirGuy]

I think it's prudent to limit yourself to GIA triple excellent and AGS0 stones. EGL isn't worth too much consideration anyway, but especially in your time crunch circumstances. The supposed "good deals" with those EGL stones are phantom deals, which disappear as soon as the stone is graded by a reputable lab.

It's like if you got a "great deal" on a Ferrari for $90,000 and then found out it was actually a Pontiac Fiero.

 

[necedemalis]

Nice, I like that analogy.

 

[Gypsy]

There is a lot that goes into buying a diamond. The best choice you can make is to stick with GIA and AGS graded stones.

What shape are you looking for, what is your budget FOR JUST THE STONE, and what is your budget for the setting. What setting style do you want? Where are you located ?

That will help us give you the information you need to make an educated purchase.

 

[Rockdiamond]

Given the scarcity of certain diamonds on the market, and the fact we know how to grade them ourselves to determine market prices, we will consider EGL graded stones for purchase.
We then send them off to GIA, and the results are quite enlightening.
One particular stone was graded H by EGL International- admittedly one of the labs held in lowest regard.
GIA gave the stone N.
Yep.
H- N
Yep.

Undoubtedly EGL USA would have been closer- but just how much closer is anyones guess.
Stick with GIA

 

[necedemalis]

There is a lot that goes into buying a diamond. The best choice you can make is to stick with GIA and AGS graded stones.

What shape are you looking for, what is your budget FOR JUST THE STONE, and what is your budget for the setting. What setting style do you want? Where are you located ?

That will help us give you the information you need to make an educated purchase.

I would like to spend $8-9K on the CD & $1-2 on the setting. I am flexible.

I would like the CD to be a radiant cut & the setting to be a halo style but supported by 2 whatever-you-call-the-side-parts: http://i.imgur.com/84VczBo.jpg(I know that is not a radiant; just an example)

Not this style: https://www.pricescope.com/files/tutorial/halo-diamond-settings.jpg

 

[necedemalis]

Thanks for this info!! It really is good to have the support. Especially when I feel like this most of the time: http://i.imgur.com/gwcSByE.jpg

 

[Gypsy]

OK. You want a Radiant in a Split shank halo setting.

Got it.

Total budget 11k CAD = $10260 USD.

And you would want a vendor that has experience working with International buyers.

Let's work backward to the stone budget from the setting.

That setting style can easily run you 5k. But there are some nice quality ones for less. This is the one I'd recommend, and you can have them customize it for a radiant center. http://www.beverleyk.com/engagement-rings/split-shank/r9412-a-d-d-cz.html It should cost under 1,500 for you in white gold.

The setting is great quality and will stand up to everyday wear, and it is also very budget friendly, even with the customization for the Radiant center stone.

This is another option from the same designer but I don't know the price of it off the top of my head so you would have to get a quote, and be prepared if it comes back too expensive to pursue. http://www.beverleyk.com/engagement-rings/split-shank/r1224-a-d-d-wt.html

I strongly prefer Beverly K for pave settings in a tight budget, but Gabriel is another option and this is a setting available through them:

https://bridal.gabrielny.com/product/ER5874W44JJ

 

[Gypsy]

Thanks for this info!! It really is good to have the support. Especially when I feel like this most of the time: http://i.imgur.com/gwcSByE.jpg

That's okay. I know, and I'll help you.



There are also this one:
http://www.engagementringsdirect.com/31-547-fy-14e-bpid-1111-18.html

So I've listed all the best quality settings for your budget.

And you could also go custom through ERD but that would cost about 3000.



So... let's leave 8K for the stone. Now, do you have to have a rectangular radiant, or will a square be okay?

 

[Gypsy]

Here are some stones for your consideration:
http://www.b2cjewels.com/dd-5026294-1.30-carat-Radiant-diamond-G-color-VVS2-clarity.aspx Lovely stone, great performance. SQUARE.
http://www.b2cjewels.com/dd-5129499-1.01-carat-Radiant-diamond-F-color-VVS2-clarity.aspx Nice stone, acceptable performance/above average performance. Rectangular.
http://www.b2cjewels.com/dd-5116524-1.24-carat-Radiant-diamond-E-color-VVS1-clarity.aspx Lovely stone, strong performer, top of your budget... so we would have to make sure you setting cost less than 1500.

Squares are going to be much easier to find with top performance. So if your lady likes squares, that's going to be easier. But rectrangles are possible. It will just take more hunting for them.

 

[necedemalis]

Thanks for this info!! It really is good to have the support. Especially when I feel like this most of the time: http://i.imgur.com/gwcSByE.jpg

That's okay. I know, and I'll help you.



There are also this one:
http://www.engagementringsdirect.com/31-547-fy-14e-bpid-1111-18.html

So I've listed all the best quality settings for your budget.

And you could also go custom through ERD but that would cost about 3000.



So... let's leave 8K for the stone. Now, do you have to have a rectangular radiant, or will a square be okay?

I actually prefer the square radiant. This was my fav so far but it looks like it is gone: http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/12181/

Why would I want a vendor that has experience working with International buyers?

 

[luvdajules]

Hi, does CD=cut diamond? or Center Diamond? Maybe Gypsy thought CAD=Canadian dollar? You are US based, then?

 

[Gypsy]

And from JA there are these:

Rctangular:
Most expensive, but also the largest one I found (compare dimensions with radiant and fancy cuts not carat weight): http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/radiant-cut/1.20-carat-g-color-vvs2-clarity-sku-22317
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/radiant-cut/1.02-carat-e-color-vs1-clarity-sku-325411 Probably going to ASET out mostly green, so it will be bright, but not have a lot of contrast. Still, that's acceptable in a rectangular radiant.
Not my favorite, but big and budget friendly: http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/radiant-cut/1.21-carat-f-color-vs2-clarity-sku-299432
I personally love this facet pattern, and actually there are several of them available on JA right now, this one is the largest (dimensions, not carat weight): http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/radiant-cut/1.03-carat-f-color-if-clarity-sku-23475


Square:
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/radiant-cut/1.02-carat-g-color-vs2-clarity-sku-178252
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/radiant-cut/1.01-carat-e-color-vs2-clarity-sku-217475

 

[Gypsy]

Hi, does CD=cut diamond? or Center Diamond? Maybe Gypsy thought CAD=Canadian dollar? You are US based, then?

Yup. That's exactly what I thought!

Good catch!

Okay, so you are US based then? Where are you?

 

[Gypsy]

I actually prefer the square radiant. This was my fav so far but it looks like it is gone: http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/12181/

That's lovely. But very pricey and I color, which, isn't as conservative as it could be.

This stone is a GREAT value: http://www.b2cjewels.com/dd-5026294-1.30-carat-Radiant-diamond-G-color-VVS2-clarity.aspx It heavier and faces up the same size as that one (6x6) , whiter, and has higher clarity than the one from GOG and is VERY budget friendly at $6,661.58

And the best part about it is: You can afford a nice platinum custom split shank setting. WHICH IS AWESOME. And much better than getting a stock setting. With pave, platinum is best and pave quality REALLY matters.

 

[Gypsy]

Sorry I also meant to say that the performance is great on the G 1.30

 

[necedemalis]

I actually prefer the square radiant. This was my fav so far but it looks like it is gone: http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/12181/

That's lovely. But very pricey and I color, which, isn't as conservative as it could be.

This stone is a GREAT value: http://www.b2cjewels.com/dd-5026294-1.30-carat-Radiant-diamond-G-color-VVS2-clarity.aspx It heavier and faces up the same size as that one (6x6) , whiter, and has higher clarity than the one from GOG and is VERY budget friendly at $6,661.58

And the best part about it is: You can afford a nice platinum custom split shank setting. WHICH IS AWESOME. And much better than getting a stock setting. With pave, platinum is best and pave quality REALLY matters.

I mean center diamond with, "CD." I am in NYC.

Am I missing something about what is more desirable in a diamond? The clear cuts (or arrows?) in the GoG seems more appealing that the scatter of the one on the right. Please. School me. I need to know.
http://i.imgur.com/aIMVf1K.png

Also don't I have to buy the b2c online?

Also thought I'd mention I'm making my way to ID Jewelers next week.

 

[necedemalis]

I see that b2c has an address

16 West 46 Street, Suite 902
New York, NY 10036.

... but can I walk in? Do you guys suggest I meet with anyone there in particular?

 

[Gypsy]

ERD can make you a cushion split shank for about 3,000-3,500 and it would be amazing quality. http://www.engagementringsdirect.com/kelly-micro-pave-split-shank-diamond-halo-engagement-ring-bpid-135-15.html

And it would look similar to this, and you can make any modification you want:

 

[Gypsy]

I see that b2c has an address

16 West 46 Street, Suite 902
New York, NY 10036.

... but can I walk in? Do you guys suggest I meet with anyone there in particular?

You'd have to call them.

 

[necedemalis]

I see that b2c has an address

16 West 46 Street, Suite 902
New York, NY 10036.

... but can I walk in? Do you guys suggest I meet with anyone there in particular?

You'd have to call them.

Awesome, thank you. On another note, I just realized there will be another ~$1k in taxes to account for

 

[Gypsy]

Faceting PATTERN is a matter of preference. There is no "BETTER" with radiants and PATTERN. Some have hearts and arrows pattern faceting like the GOG stone. Some have Lucida type pattern faceting . Some have princess type pattern faceting. Some have true 'crushed ice' patterns. Some have modified brilliant pattern faceting like the G 1.3.

With respect to the PATTERN, that's up to you and whoever will wear the ring. Whatever you like, goes. Some patterns result in larger flashes of light. Some in smaller pinpoint flashes of light. Some have high contrast, some do not. It's just a matter of what your eyes like.

What is not really as subjective is PERFORMANCE. That's what the ASET is for. It measures the type and quality of the light return in stones. And it is INFLUENCED by pattern, but it is separate and distinct.

While the PATTERN of the G 1.30 I posted for you is completely up to you. The PERFORMANCE QUANTITY is very close to that of the GOG stone. That's what the ASET shows. So it will similiar in terms of brightness as the GOG stone. In terms of QUANTITY.


If you really LIKE the hearts and arrows type pattern these are closer to that look:
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/radiant-cut/1.02-carat-g-color-vs2-clarity-sku-178252
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/radiant-cut/1.01-carat-e-color-vs2-clarity-sku-217475

Pattern is A) a matter of preference and B) separate and distinct from performance. You can get a stone that has perfect hearts and arrows and still be a dud performance wise. You can get a stone that has pinpoint crushed ice faceting patterns and have excellent performance.

So, no by going for the 1.3 you aren't getting inferior stone. The performance is excellent.

All that remains is whether or not that pattern appeals to you.

 

[Gypsy]

I see that b2c has an address

16 West 46 Street, Suite 902
New York, NY 10036.

... but can I walk in? Do you guys suggest I meet with anyone there in particular?

You'd have to call them.

Awesome, thank you. On another note, I just realized there will be another ~$1k in taxes to account for

OK well.

http://www.b2cjewels.com/dd-5026294-1.30-carat-Radiant-diamond-G-color-VVS2-clarity.aspx
$6,662
$3,500.00 ERD custom setting
$1000 taxes
_______
$11062.00

Only 62 dollars over your budget. And you are getting a TOP performing stone. And a custom top quality platinum setting.

So... I think you are still okay, right?

 

[necedemalis]

I see that b2c has an address

16 West 46 Street, Suite 902
New York, NY 10036.

... but can I walk in? Do you guys suggest I meet with anyone there in particular?

You'd have to call them.

Awesome, thank you. On another note, I just realized there will be another ~$1k in taxes to account for

OK well.

http://www.b2cjewels.com/dd-5026294-1.30-carat-Radiant-diamond-G-color-VVS2-clarity.aspx
$6,662
$3,500.00 ERD custom setting
$1000 taxes
_______
$11062.00

Only 62 dollars over your budget. And you are getting a TOP performing stone. And a custom top quality platinum setting.

So... I think you are still okay, right?

Yea, that budget is perfect. I guess I have to see the stone in person. I really like the hearts and arrows pattern but cannot knock the lucida till I see it up close. In terms of performance - less white is better? How do I judge aset?

 

[SirGuy]

Check out this link from Wink at High Performance Diamonds. Good and brief education on interpreting Ideal-Scope and ASET images. Nice photos to help with the learning.

http://www.highperformancediamonds.com/index.php?page=education-performance

 

[necedemalis]

Check out this link from Wink at High Performance Diamonds. Good and brief education on interpreting Ideal-Scope and ASET images. Nice photos to help with the learning.

http://www.highperformancediamonds.com/index.php?page=education-performance

Sweet! TY

 

[necedemalis]

"In general RED should be maximized. Some BLUE is necessary. Too much GREEN is undesirable. The distribution of the three colors is important. WHITE should be minimized."

 

[Gypsy]

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/thoughts-on-this-radiant-stone-cert-and-photo-attached.203341/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/thoughts-on-this-radiant-stone-cert-and-photo-attached.203341/[/URL] You can see my post here.

 

[Gypsy]

Here is another:
http://www.b2cjewels.com/dd-4754070-1.05-carat-Radiant-diamond-H-color-VVS2-clarity.aspx only SLIGHTLY smaller (dimensions) at 5.7 excellent performance. Price point is even better.

And since you sticking it in a halo, I'll be honest. The spread difference between 5.7 and 6.0 is going to be negligible when set. Best thing about halos.

Something to think about.

If they CAN have to go in and see diamond in person. I'd ask about this one too.