Would appreciate feedback on this diamond

[THALE WILBERDING]

Hello all. I have been reading posts on here for almost two years, and would like some input on my search for a replacement ering stone. For our 25th anniversary we bought a new Tacori setting and GIA XXX 2.01 E I1 (gasp!) stone. The inclusions are not black, and in the jewelry store lighting, we were swayed (putting it nicely). In other lighting I noticed the stone looked dark, which is how I found this site. This stone scores 5.6 on the HCA.

Long story, but we have been trying to work with this jeweler for over a year to remedy this situation. We have purchased no less than 20 items from them over the past 30 years. They will not take this diamond back, nor will they give us what we paid towards an upgrade. I also can’t get an online buyer to buy it for even half what we paid. So, that is unfortunate, but we are moving on, and it’s sad that we have lost confidence in the jeweler that we trusted.

I am looking for a better cut stone. Given the setting I do need to stick with colorless. I found this E SI1 feom BN that I’d appreciate feedback on. It has strong fluorescence but they have told me it does not impact the performance of the diamond. The vault inspector has also said its eye clean, but with that inclusion right in the table, I’m not sure if it makes sense or if that would affect light performance. This stone scores 1.2 on the HCA scale.

I have been stressing so much over this situation. I’m so sad I traded in my 1.5 H VS2 that was beautiful for what I have now. I really do need to find the best value for my money, since we have to eat the mistake we made.

I would appreciate some honest and expert insight on this stone. If you love it please don’t buy it out from under me!

https://www.bluenile.com/diamond-details/LD12864000

Thank you for listening and I’d appreciate feedback!

 

[the_mother_thing]

That’s really unfortunate your other jeweler won’t work with you on a return/upgrade; I wouldn’t give them another penny of my money, and would be sure to let others know with reviews on Google, Yelp, etc. Sorry you’re in that situation.

I would recommend - if you’re serious about buying this diamond - putting it on hold. I’m pretty sure BN will hold a diamond for you for 24-48 hours.

Clarity is really dependent on the person and their tolerances/preferences. It may be that the inclusion blends in against the arrows in most light settings; that’s something you’d just have to assess for yourself once you have it in hand and can see it for yourself.

It’s not a bad diamond, and the HCA score is in the recommended range. Did it say it faced up ‘normal’, and had excellent/very good results for light return, fire, scintillation, etc? I’d also ask BN if they can provide any additional light performance imaging to help you (and those on here) know better how it might perform.

Lastly, just as an option to consider given your last experience ... if cut is a priority for you, might it be possible to start with a smaller diamond that is for-certain an ideal performer in a simple setting from a vendor who offers better upgrade policies, then upgrade back to your 2-ct size over time so it’s not a huge financial hit all at once? With WF or HPD, you have generous upgrade policies, where you only need to spend $1 more ... just something to consider.

 

[THALE WILBERDING]

Thanks for your input.
I did have it on hold, that has expired.
It has very good and excellent performance in the light performance categories. I don’t know if it faces up normal; I can ask them.
My Tacori setting has a halo and was made specifically for my 2 ct stone. So I have to stay with that size (maybe another mistake).

Thank you again!

 

[the_mother_thing]

@THALE WILBERDING According to the HCA, it faces up big for it’s carat weight, but that’s probably because it’s shallow-cut. The angles appear to be complimentary, but HCA is a rejection tool vs. an ‘acceptance’ tool, if that makes sense. An ASET and/or IdealScope image would be able to confirm performance short of seeing it in person yourself. If you have the funds available to order it and see it for yourself, it might be worth doing that to see how you like it in person. Blue Nile has a pretty easy return process if it doesn’t make you happy.

It being a 60/60 diamond (when table and depth are both at/close to 60), based on those who own/have seen these, I believe they tend to show more white light return vs. fire; however, the HCA indicates this one could give you both. Hopefully, someone who is ‘60/60’ savvy will chime in, as I’ve not seen a 60/60 to speak knowledgeably about them. The other thing to keep in mind is that the shallow cut may result in more obstruction. But again, I think - with these types of diamonds - you really have to see it for yourself to know if you like/love it or not.

 

[headlight]

I think that dark inclusion smack in the middle of the table is a problem. Your eye is going to always go to that.
I also would not buy an E color with strong fluorescence.
I had a diamond with a large table, similar in # to the depth, with a shallow pavilion and, while much bang for the buck so “spready”, I didn’t like the flat top aesthetic.
Also, you need to make sure the measurement of the stone will fit in your halo, in this case it would need to accommodate an 8.17mm stone. All 2.01 stones are not the same measurement. As example, the one you are considering is a more shallow stone with 8.17mm... by comparison, I have a 2.01 that is more deep which only measures 8.01mm. So you see my point, especially with a halo.
With all that said, I do have to say that the visual optics are very aesthetically pleasing to my eye. But you need to be sure to give consideration to these things.
We are seeing it totally blown up... will they take a little video for you? Also, can it be returned if you don’t like it when you see it in person?
Please show us a photo of your Tacori halo... I love Tacori.
Also, your story reminds me of elements of my journey... hang in there. I so very much feel your pain about the regret of giving up your original... you may have read about that in posts here. You’re not alone!
Also, do you have images with the current diamond? Can we see what is bothering you about it’s performance... maybe it isn’t as bad as you think.

 

[lovedogs]

Before doing anything, you need to ask your jeweler what mm size the setting will fit. Ct weight isn't enough bc some stones are too deep so face up small for their weight. If you don't know what size your setting can take, then the stone might not fit

 

[TODiamonds]

I'm not a fan of this one:

1) That inclusion is nasty. I don't know if it'll be eye clean but I wouldn't risk it on a 2ct rock - and even if it is eye clean, knowing there's such a big inclusion smack dab in the middle of the table would bother me.

2) This is more personal taste, but I'm not a fan of shallow crowns and big tables. I like the look of a 55-57 table with 15% crown. 60/60 at 13% looks like a flat top in my opinion. The fire may be lacking too. I encourage you to go to a store and look at a deeper diamond vs shallower ones to see which look you prefer. Some people like the shallow diamonds.

3) That E might be closer to an F since GIA grading incorporates UV light in its environment and the Strong Flo can alter the color. It's dumb IMO but their position is that natural sunlight has UV (even most of us spend our time indoors). Not a huge deal with lower colors but when you're paying a premium for E... it better be a true E and not an artificially inflated E. This is why high color stones that have strong flo trade at meaningful discounts.

 

[headlight]

I'm not a fan of this one:

1) That inclusion is nasty. I don't know if it'll be eye clean but I wouldn't risk it on a 2ct rock - and even if it is eye clean, knowing there's such a big inclusion smack dab in the middle of the table would bother me.

2) This is more personal taste, but I'm not a fan of shallow crowns and big tables. I like the look of a 55-57 table with 15% crown. 60/60 at 13% looks like a flat top in my opinion. The fire may be lacking too. I encourage you to go to a store and look at a deeper diamond vs shallower ones to see which look you prefer. Some people like the shallow diamonds.

3) That E might be closer to an F since GIA grading incorporates UV light in its environment and the Strong Flo can alter the color. It's dumb IMO but their position is that natural sunlight has UV (even most of us spend our time indoors). Not a huge deal with lower colors but when you're paying a premium for E... it better be a true E and not an artificially inflated E. This is why high color stones that have strong flo trade at meaningful discounts.

Ditto that... the dark inclusion in the middle of the table and the strong fluorescence with an E are both reflected in that price.
Please post photos of your current diamond and also the specs if you have them... perhaps you are better in keeping what you have.

 

[THALE WILBERDING]

Here are some photos I have taken over the past year and a half of this driving me crazy.

I will post specs when I find my cert. I had it out visiting different jewelers about trading it in; it’s here somewhere.

I was told that if I keep the diamond measurements (length and width) to within .1 mm it would fit. Do you all agree?

I very much appreciate everyone’s feedback. It is so helpful.

 

[PreRaphaelite]

What a gorgeous ring set. I’m sorry that your center stone has been a source of unhappiness for you. You have certainly come to the right place for advice. The experts here will help.

The setting seems slightly vintage-aesthetic, very feminine and romantic. Have you looked at antique stones? If not, may I recommend just including them in your search?

 

[THALE WILBERDING]

Thank you. That is the style I was going for and I love the milgrain.

I have not looked at antique stones. I’d be open to that but know nothing about them. Are you referring to something like OEC and/or AVC? I also was told I could put a cushion in this setting.

 

[PreRaphaelite]

Yes, OEC or OMC. The AVC is lovely, as are many cushions, but if I were looking for a stone to perfectly fit that stunning setting I would look for OEC and AVR.
Could you remind me the millimeter size of the current stone please?

 

[the_mother_thing]

@THALE WILBERDING I’m not a huge Tacori fan, but I happen to love that particular one! It would be lovely with an OEC!

Two additional thoughts come to mind that you might consider:

1) selling your current Tacori setting, choosing a new diamond, and getting the same Tacori setting for the new stone if the new diamond’s size difference is an issue with using the current setting. There is a market for pre-loved Tacori settings so you’d recoup some of your costs there, and would have more flexibility with a new stone that may potentially be a little smaller but perhaps far better performing.

2) long shot, but maybe consider a recut on your current stone. Yes, you’d lose some carat weight, but it may not be so much that the improved visual performance and light return doesn’t outweigh that loss. This option, also, may result in your diamond not fitting the Tacori, but at the same time, it wouldn’t cost you near as much as a new diamond.

Just a couple additional thoughts to consider. I think I’d start listing the pros & cons of all the options, taking into account your budget and costs of each option, and weigh each options in that regard to decide.

 

[THALE WILBERDING]

Yes, OEC or OMC. The AVC is lovely, as are many cushions, but if I were looking for a stone to perfectly fit that stunning setting I would look for OEC and AVR.
Could you remind me the millimeter size of the current stone please?

It’s something like 8.08 x 8.13 x 5.? Or 4.98. I need to find the cert and I’ll get back to you.
Thanks!

 

[THALE WILBERDING]

@THALE WILBERDING I’m not a huge Tacori fan, but I happen to love that particular one! It would be lovely with an OEC!

Two additional thoughts come to mind that you might consider:

1) selling your current Tacori setting, choosing a new diamond, and getting the same Tacori setting for the new stone if the new diamond’s size difference is an issue with using the current setting. There is a market for pre-loved Tacori settings so you’d recoup some of your costs there, and would have more flexibility with a new stone that may potentially be a little smaller but perhaps far better performing.

2) long shot, but maybe consider a recut on your current stone. Yes, you’d lose some carat weight, but it may not be so much that the improved visual performance and light return doesn’t outweigh that loss. This option, also, may result in your diamond not fitting the Tacori, but at the same time, it wouldn’t cost you near as much as a new diamond.

Just a couple additional thoughts to consider. I think I’d start listing the pros & cons of all the options, taking into account your budget and costs of each option, and weigh each options in that regard to decide.

Thank you for your kind words and the suggestions. I have thought about selling the whole thing. I know we would lose a fortune though. Honestly no matter what I do (except nothing) it will cost me.

 

[PreRaphaelite]

One of the ways I ‘reframed the narrative’ to feel better about a stone I took a huge loss on was to consider it as Cost Per Wear. In light of that, I reset my diamond ring as a pendant and wear it casually every day. Instead of losing over a grand, I think of it as spending pennies per day.

Others spend more than that on fresh flowers, or bottles of wine, or vacations, or even chocolate.... just mentally amortise the cost

 

[Wewechew]

First, I LOVE your set!!!!!

Second, I would see about a recut first, especially if you are eating the cost of this diamond regardless. Get in touch with Southwest Diamond Cutters. Ashley is amazing and you will be in good hands.

 

[Wewechew]

I want to also add- Ashley won't have to unset your diamond in order to give you a rough estimate on what needs to be done. I took my heirloom 2.83ct engagement ring to him and he was able to eyeball it in the setting to give me an idea the carat weight and spread I would lose.

 

[TODiamonds]

This might actually be one of those rare instances where a recut makes sense.

Serg (no idea how to link him - look him up) might be able to help answer any questions you have about that here.

 

[OoohShiny]

Would you be happy to post your current stone's stats? It might help us work out if a recut would be possible!

 

[THALE WILBERDING]

Here are my current stone's stats.
8.1-8.13-4.98
T 60%, D 61.4%, C 33.5 (13.5 %), P 41.6 (44%)
Cert: https://www.gia.edu/report-check?reportno=6187853031&s=1569429544883

I may be interested in a recut, but am curious if you all think that will help this stone given that it's an I1. If the cut is the biggest thing hurting it, maybe it makes sense.

Thanks again all for your feedback and help!

 

[mwilliamanderson]

Here are my current stone's stats.
8.1-8.13-4.98
T 60%, D 61.4%, C 33.5 (13.5 %), P 41.6 (44%)
Cert: https://www.gia.edu/report-check?reportno=6187853031&s=1569429544883

I may be interested in a recut, but am curious if you all think that will help this stone given that it's an I1. If the cut is the biggest thing hurting it, maybe it makes sense.

Thanks again all for your feedback and help!

Welcome to the wonderful world of diamonds! We spend all that money on one and it suddenly drops in value by 50-80% the moment we walk out of the store with it . It’s not just the poorly cut ones either.

Maybe you could have it recut...but I’d sell it for whatever you can get and put it towards the best cut diamond of a clarity and color you can live with from HP Diamonds (CBI) or Whiteflash (ACA). You can do upgrades as you are able with either vendor and HP Diamonds even has an 80% buy back plan for life. Most importantly you will have a diamond which performs at it’s fullest potential.

 

[Wewechew]

Maybe you could have it recut...but I’d sell it for whatever you can get and put it towards the best cut diamond of a clarity and color you can live with from HP Diamonds (CBI) or Whiteflash (ACA). You can do upgrades as you are able with either vendor and HP Diamonds even has an 80% buy back plan for life. Most importantly you will have a diamond which performs at it’s fullest potential.

Adding onto this- HPD does take trade non-CBI trade ins. The offer price they give you will be wholesale, but that is another option.

 

[mwilliamanderson]

Adding onto this- HPD does take trade non-CBI trade ins. The offer price they give you will be wholesale, but that is another option.

I just got a non-CBI trade inn offer of about 38% of what I paid for an AGS000 diamond. It is heartbreaking ! I think it’s worth it to try and sell on Loupe Troupe or Diamond Bistro for a bit more, but I also know it will be worth it to take the loss either way to join the HPD family of great product, service, upgrade and buy back policies.

 

[Wewechew]

I just got a non-CBI trade inn offer of about 38% of what I paid for an AGS000 diamond. It is heartbreaking ! I think it’s worth it to try and sell on Loupe Troupe or Diamond Bistro for a bit more, but I also know it will be worth it to take the loss either way to join the HPD family of great product, service, upgrade and buy back policies.

 

[OoohShiny]

Here are my current stone's stats.
8.1-8.13-4.98
T 60%, D 61.4%, C 33.5 (13.5 %), P 41.6 (44%)
Cert: https://www.gia.edu/report-check?reportno=6187853031&s=1569429544883

I may be interested in a recut, but am curious if you all think that will help this stone given that it's an I1. If the cut is the biggest thing hurting it, maybe it makes sense.

Thanks again all for your feedback and help!

I am certainly no expert, but it seems like you have some 'meat' on that diamond so it could be recut to something that performs better - I reckon they'd reduce the pavilion depth so that it matched the crown angle a bit better, and there might even be the option to reduce the size of the table and get a touch more fire out of the stone.

I think Brian Gavin does recuts but I can't remember if Whiteflash also does recuts - either way, it could be an option, although you would of course have to take a hit on the carat weight of the stone and drop it below the psychological 2ct marker.

 

[Wewechew]

@OoohShiny WF no longer does recuts; they recommend Southwest Diamond Cutters

 

[PreRaphaelite]

If recutting is an option, and you like old style cuts, I’d suggest contacting Jonathan at August Vintage first to see if it is a candidate for transforming the stone into an AVC or AVR. It might be possible to keep the original setting with minor adaptations to the head and then you’d have everything you want.

If a modern cut is more appealing, there are several vendors to choose from. Good luck! I can’t wait to see what you’ll choose!

 

[lydial]

OP : you may be better off keeping the I 1 for a solitaire necklace rather than selling. If you will lose that much $. CBI’s that size, in much lower color, are much more expensive. I think it is worth it, but it is all about budget. And if your budget stretches perhaps ask HPD about selling your I 1 for you.

 

[THALE WILBERDING]

OP : you may be better off keeping the I 1 for a solitaire necklace rather than selling. If you will lose that much $. CBI’s that size, in much lower color, are much more expensive. I think it is worth it, but it is all about budget. And if your budget stretches perhaps ask HPD about selling your I 1 for you.

I agree. WF has already told me they don’t want it, and other offers are also much less than half what we paid, so I don’t think I’ll get anywhere there. I think I should recut and use elsewhere like a pendant. I definitely don’t want to modify my setting to hold a smaller stone.