Why seldom see Fancy color diamond in Princess cut?

[Chantan]

Hi guys,

I am new to the forum. I was wondering why there are not many Fancy color diamonds in Princess cut? Is it just not the cutting style that can retain as much color as in cushion or radiant? Because I heard princess cut pretty much yields the most from the rough.

Thank you guys, really appreciate your help.

Tan

 

[hippi_pixi]

I'm probably going to get slammed for this but I tend to think princess diamonds are a fairly new design favoured a lot with younger generations and are maybe a trend whereas coloured diamonds can be extraordinarily expensive for even tiny sizes so buyers tend to be older/richer/collectors and these people favour more classic styles. That's just my guess but then I'm not a fan of princess cuts...

 

[pinkjewel]

FCDs are expensive, so cutters will generally cut in whatever will yield the largest cut stone. Probably not going to be square. As far as cutting in mainly classic shapes and to an older crowd-not really sure about that (not slamming you hippi_pixi ).
there are many younger people buying FCDs, especially fancy yellows for E rings. Also, there are always lots of heart shaped FCDs (the argyle tender has many every year). Not a very classic shape at all. I was told that many times the rough just favors that cut. But with all that said- I have seen FCDs cut in princess shapes-you just have to take your time and look for them.

 

[John P]

Hi guys,

I am new to the forum. I was wondering why there are not many Fancy color diamonds in Princess cut? Is it just not the cutting style that can retain as much color as in cushion or radiant? Because I heard princess cut pretty much yields the most from the rough.

Thank you guys, really appreciate your help.

Tan

You're on the right track. Cutting is critical to the finished appearance of a fancy colored diamond. The goal is typically the opposite of cutting common (D-Z) colored gems: Instead of trying to get light paths in and out of the stone quickly the cutter wants to lengthen the path of light rays passing through the stone. The longer light stays trapped in the stone the more the body color is enhanced. This is why round fancy colored diamonds have shallower or deeper proportions than those fashioned in D-Z colors, and why their cut is not graded by the same standards.

The radiant and emerald shapes are generally more suitable to fancy colored cutting goals than the princess: The radiant cut is mixed, with brilliant facets on the pavilion and step facets in the crown. Its configuration aids in the concentration of color while producing elements of dispersion/scintillation. The clipped radiant shape omits those sharp cornered areas where color can "pool" in a princess. The emerald is step cut, top and bottom, with long flat facets. This style makes inclusions more obvious, but exaggerates body color nicely when well-configured.

Of course every piece of rough is unique. Each presents its own opportunities and challenges. As with anything, including D-Z RBCs, you'll find some done extremely well and others done not-so-well.

 

[Karl_K]

In general they can get one+ color grade higher out of a radiant.
Overly dark rough can be cut into an emerald to lighten it up a grade or so.

Like a round the rough would have to be the perfect color for it to work, then you have issues with evenness of color to design around.
So overall it just does not make economic sense for natural rough.
You do see MMD colored rough cut into princess cuts.

 

[kenny]

I was curious just how uncommon princess-cut FCDs are so I did a check over at the FCD vendor I bought my collection from.
Sure, this is only one vendor, but the order of the shapes probably would not vary much vendor to vendor.
They currently have 788 FCDs in stock.
Using their Advacned Search function I selected for each cut.

I was surprised there were so many rounds since that is not one of the shapes that amps up the color as much as some shapes lower on the list.
I suspect it's just because round is such a popular shape.
I was also surprised pear was #1.
I thought it would be 4 or 5.
I was also surprised how many hearts there are.

Here are the FCD shapes (listed in descending quantity) that are currently for sale.

165 Pears
159 Radiants
109 Cushions
99 Rounds
95 Oval
53 Emerald (If you check, some of these are actually asschers)
48 Heart
32 Marquise
19 Princess
4 Trilliant
3 Triangle
1 Asscher (See Emerald cut above)
1 Shield
0 Octagon

 

[John P]

Good information. It buoys my impression that cushions are on the radar with more frequency for FCD as well as D-Z.

I was surprised there were so many rounds since that is not one of the shapes that amps up the color as much as some shapes lower on the list.

It's all in the cutting. Deep or shallow rounds can show quite a lot of color when cut away from Tolkowsky angles. Of course you risk obstruction in shallow combos, just as you risk a bow-tie or dead zones in other shapes. It's all a balance. One good reason to cut FC rounds, pears and ovals is that the brilliant-style faceting, on top as well as bottom, promotes performance that can help mask inclusions.

 

[Karl_K]

A vendors inventory while very interesting is not a good snapshot of the overall market.
The vendor just carries what they think they can turn over in a reasonable amount of time.

 

[kenny]

A vendors inventory while very interesting is not a good snapshot of the overall market.
The vendor just carries what they think they can turn over in a reasonable amount of time.

Doesn't the entire FCD "market" want "what they think they can turn over in a reasonable amount of time"?
Everyone is in business to make money.

This vendor's website design made it easy.
If anyone has the time to visit every FCD vendor site and compile the numbers, be my guest.
It may take a while as some may not be searchable by shape so you'd have to crawl through the inventory and count shapes one by one.

But like I wrote I doubt the order of shapes on the list will vary much vendor to vendor.
When numbers are very close like pear and radiant, those orders are likely to vary.

 

[Rockdiamond]

Princess cut diamonds are more rare in yellow, for example, as compared to cushion or radiant- John mentioned some of the reasons but it's really a lot more complex.
Take brown diamonds, also fancy colored- yet a lot more princess cuts exist by comparison to the proportion of yellow. If we check the ratio of pink princess cuts compared to radiant/cushion, it will also be different than yellow.
Why is this?
It has a lot to do with the nature of different colors in diamonds, and how they manifest themselves. The way a brown diamond looks brown, with regards to cutting- is totally different than why a yellow diamond looks yellow, in a majority of cases.
Then we have the massive inequities in value.
It makes no sense to make the same type of decisions cutting a $20,000 piece of yellow rough- which might be a $5000 piece of brown rough, or a $200,000 piece of pink rough if they were all the same size. Each color requires different techniques, and yield considerations vary.
There's a HUGE difference in cut quality from one stone to the next.
Although cut is less of a consumer factor in fancy colored diamonds than in white- there's actually far more possibilities with fancy colored fancy shaped rough.So in that regard, a cutter's skill means everything.

For this reason, checking one vendors inventory tells us very little. There are certain channels where dealers buy, some have better cuts, some less so.
Also, if one looks at different fancy colored diamond websites, you'll find that each of the ones that actually shows diamonds seems to focus on different types of stones- inventories vary widely, so not "norm" can be drawn from one.

 

[kenny]

FWIW my assumption was wrong.
I sampled a few other vendors and the mix of shape quantities vary quite a bit.
If you want to discuss this aspect of the topic please respond here . . .

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/comparing-availability-of-fcd-shapes.180193/#post-3273820#p3273820']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/comparing-availability-of-fcd-shapes.180193/#post-3273820#p3273820[/URL]

 

[Chantan]

wow thx guys for the quick reply. really appreciate your help!!!

 

[diagem]

One of plurality of factors that influence play of color in FCD's  is contrast.
Most others factors can either enhance or negatively  influence color quantity & play based on the lightness or darkness of the original rough material. 
Based on my experience contrast will negatively influence both lighter & darker hues & materials.

Due to the Princess facet design which usually requires a deep pavilion combined with a shallow crown,  long & thin faceted chevrons from culet ending at 90 degree sharp corners..., these natural Princess facet design factors are not the preferable options for cutters to enhance or evening (from the word even, I hope I spelled correctly color appearance.

But it's not absolute, as RD mentioned..., for example some medium hues in brown shades may enjoy a pleasurable appearance when cut to Princess Cuts. That's why they might be available on a more consistent basis.