Why do you recomend the PS vendors you do?

[strmrdr]

Someone asked me this the other day and I thought it would be intersting to get other consumers thoughts on how they pick who to recomend.

My answer was:

1. Has an expert presence on PS and helps out often.
2. Has the type of diamonds I like in stock and available
3. Proven track record of good service but more importantly a record of resolving problems well when they come up and they will.
4. Up front information and lots of it without having to fill out a form or contact anyone.
5. has a strong reputation for being upfront and honest.

Whats your answer?
(no need to name names if you dont want too)

 

[belle]

Date: 7/19/2005 9:48:28 AM
Author:strmrdr

1. Has an expert presence on PS and helps out often.
2. Has the type of diamonds I like in stock and available
3. Proven track record of good service but more importantly a record of resolving problems well when they come up and they will.
4. Up front information and lots of it without having to fill out a form or contact anyone.
5. has a strong reputation for being upfront and honest.

6. has very competitive pricing for the highest quality goods
7. has a good selection of ''in house'' stones
8. has a website that is user friendly and easy to navigate

 

[MissAva]

Date: 7/19/2005 10:01:30 AM
Author: belle

Date: 7/19/2005 9:48:28 AM
Author:strmrdr

1. Has an expert presence on PS and helps out often.
2. Has the type of diamonds I like in stock and available
3. Proven track record of good service but more importantly a record of resolving problems well when they come up and they will.
4. Up front information and lots of it without having to fill out a form or contact anyone.
5. has a strong reputation for being upfront and honest.

6. has very competitive pricing for the highest quality goods
7. has a good selection of ''in house'' stones
8. has a website that is user friendly and easy to navigate

Yup exactly though I tend to favor reasons
1,4,5and8 the most. That is why I like GOG and WF so much becuase I can see the stones without having to bother anyone. I am in the look and learn pahse and wont be buying for another 2-3months. I really love the GOG has all that wonderful information and WF also post pictures and Idealscope shots. These things make it easier to find and run numbers through the HCA and I must say I just like being able to see what I am telling someone else might be a good buy.

 

[widget]

I only recommend vendors I''ve personally dealt with.

I might mention others, but always with the caveat: "I''ve heard good things about.."

widget

 

[kenny]

The vendors that require you to contact them for price or any info are losing tons of business.

People want lots of information about the stones, but they cherish their privacy.
Customers like to get information without giving any in return, until the sale is made.

Also I like published prices.
If I have to call for a price I suspect the seller is feeling me out to get the highest possible price for each transaction.
I perfer published prices because they are set by *open* and *public* competition and not dependent on the savy and the negotiating skills of the buyer.

I don't like it when the posted xerox copies of the reports are so poor that you can't see every inclusion on the plots.
This is important, employ some QC, people.
After you post the report check it on the web.
Count the inclusions on the screen.
Compare to the original.
If inculsions are missing post a new xerox or photo.
Posting plots with missing inclusions is misleading.
This has cost one PS vendor one decent sale of mine.
Then when I returned the stone and explained the reason in email I got no reply.

The best sites are those who post everything.
There should be no reason to contact them except to buy the stone.


End of rant.

 

[Rhino]

Date: 7/19/2005 10:53:32 AM
Author: Murph

In this day of picture and information piracy, GOG has removed much of their info after some of their picture were pirated.

Removed much of their info? Like?

 

[Murph]

Rhino,

I just went onto your site and focused on a 1.78 HSI1 round. It clearly says: "Email us for a copy of the certification".
Don''t get me wrong: I prefer that pertinent information not be posted for all to steal. I think the labelling of your images is a great idea. Anybody who is seriously interested in a stone should have no problem communicating with a vendor or at least submitting their email address (which can be a hotmail account or some other secondary account for those of us who are weary of disclosing too much info).

Cheers,

Murph

 

[Mara]

-up front data and images or easy to get more info (aka with an email), but definitey alot of info up front on page
-quick to respond via email and/or phone (though sometimes even my preferred vendors lack on this!)
-range of services, aka diamonds and custom work and jewelry offerings
-nice selection of stones
-proven quality of stones and/or work, either by myself or people i respect who have purchased there
-recognizes the value of PS and contributes often
-willing customer service, aka if something goes wrong they are willing to fix it rather than making it your problem
-competitive pricing policies

the above are listed in no particular order...

 

[Regular Guy]

I agree with #4 and Kenny''s sentiment

I would highlight:

- reliable inventory
- good business practices

and while I find some your points interesting, Murph...

Date: 7/19/2005 10:53:32 AM
Author: Murph
Great topic strmrdr,

I agree with the gist of what you say, but have a slightly different opinion of your items #1 and 4: As far as constantly offering expert opinions and helping out, I find that many of these posts are self serving. Don''t get me wrong, the opinions offered are always on point, but if you read them carefully, they''re usually a soft sell for whichever site they work for. Everybody knows that many of these vendors are on here mostly to keep their names in front of our faces. If this forum did not generate business for them, I doubt we would ever see them.

I think this enlightened self interest practice of some of our vendors benefit us all, and your concerns as regards their motives is unfortunate.

Regards,

 

[Dancing Fire]

Date: 7/19/2005 9:48:28 AM
Author:strmrdr
Someone asked me this the other day and I thought it would be intersting to get other consumers thoughts on how they pick who to recomend.

My answer was:

1. Has an expert presence on PS and helps out often.
2. Has the type of diamonds I like in stock and available
3. Proven track record of good service but more importantly a record of resolving problems well when they come up and they will.
4. Up front information and lots of it without having to fill out a form or contact anyone.
5. has a strong reputation for being upfront and honest.

Whats your answer?
(no need to name names if you dont want too)

if they''re selling H&A stones,i like to see H&A pictures on their web site.

 

[kenny]

Oh one more thing.

How about posting darkfield photos?
Darkfield lighting is the only way to really show the inclusions.

We customers are frequently making decisions based on inclusions.
Buying diamonds sight-unseen is tough.
There is a huge trust factor.
We want clear honest documentation of inclusions.
A vendor that reveals all, and must be hiding nothing, earns more trust.

You can post an explanation of darkfield under each one so customers don't freak. (They DO look ugly.)
Your customers will become educated and be suspicious of your competitor's photos with cherried-out lighting.
It will give your site the edge.

There is one vendor here that is so good at lighting and photography that all of their stones, regardless of clarity, look superb.
Very annoying.

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 7/19/2005 12:38:02 PM
Author: kenny
Oh one more thing.

How about posting darkfield photos?
Darkfield lighting is the only way to really show the inclusions.

We customers are frequently making decisions based on inclusions.
Buying diamonds sight-unseen is tough.
There is a huge trust factor.
We want clear honest documentation of inclusions.
A vendor that reveals all, and must be hiding nothing, earns more trust.

You can post an explanation of darkfield under each one so customers don''t freak. (They DO look ugly.)
Your customers will become educated and be suspicious of your competitor''s photos with cherried-out lighting.
It will give your site the edge.

There is one vendor here that is so good at lighting and photography that all of their stones, regardless of clarity, look superb.
Very annoying.

I hear you on that one.
Thats why I always recomend having the vendor look at the diamond and tell you about the inclusions either on the phone or in email.
Darkfield pictures dont eliminate that step on all diamonds but on some it does.
Im not sure if the payoff on time spent taking them would be worth it.
On si1 and si2 diamonds It would be worthwhile I think and a total waste on vs2 or above diamonds in most cases.
The nice thing is that if its something that you want there are vendors that supply them upfront.
They do make my life easier when im recomending diamonds.

 

[valeria101]

These guys are fun, open to chatter and part of a really terrific experiemnt (Pricescope) I am glad to have found and taken part in. I''ve seen enough in a year or so to like the place and trust the people involved. From my point of view, one doesn''t get much more than this (if even the same) via brief personal interraction: it is nice, warm and fuzzy to look someone in the eye when handing over that check, but written communication is safer - not to mention this much of it. So, yes, I post on Pricescope because I trust it''s lot and because I admire the way they build such trust.

Thank for asking the question !

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 7/19/2005 12:25:26 PM
Author: Regular Guy

Date: 7/19/2005 10:53:32 AM
Author: Murph
Great topic strmrdr,

I agree with the gist of what you say, but have a slightly different opinion of your items #1 and 4: As far as constantly offering expert opinions and helping out, I find that many of these posts are self serving. Don''t get me wrong, the opinions offered are always on point, but if you read them carefully, they''re usually a soft sell for whichever site they work for. Everybody knows that many of these vendors are on here mostly to keep their names in front of our faces. If this forum did not generate business for them, I doubt we would ever see them.

I think this enlightened self interest practice of some of our vendors benefit us all, and your concerns as regards their motives is unfortunate.

Regards,

Couldnt say it better myself.
imho the consumers benifit far more than the vendors from the experts helping out here.
You have to take into account that only a small percentage of the people using this forum for gathering information will buy online.
Most of them will take the information and shop elsewhere.

It is actuaaly the most important consideration when Im considering recomending a diamond from a vendor is how much the vendor helps out here.
The more they help out here the better I know them.
Dont get me wrong the diamond has to be top notch but I know a lot of places to find top notch diamonds.

Diamonds can be found anywhere a trusted vendor is more valuable and that is what they do is build trust by helping out here.

 

[coconut]

I agree that the vendors' expertise help out alot.
It was much participation from vendors on PS that actually intrigued me to learn about the real deal with diamonds. Also, as an ignorant consumer, it is a somewhat comforting to know that there are vendors out there to educate you rather than to rip you off. I would want to purchase from someone who dedicates time to educate people, especially people purchasing a diamond for the first time to propose. It is kind of like scratching each other's back: a relationship where both the purchaser and the vendor can benefit from.

Just another opinion to the upfront web info:

I would highly recommend pricescope and its vendors because I feel that once you are educated enough, it all come down to availability, convenience and money.
(1) I find that PS vendors have more extensive list of stones(with their specs)
(2) Prices are conveniently listed.
(3) You don't have to go through negotiations with a local jeweler and still come out of the store wondering if you've gotten a good deal.

Although I meant to ask why on some web pages prices are listed for some stones and not others: many are CALL FOR PRICE. Is there a particular reason that they are not listed?

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 7/20/2005 3:20:57 AM
Author: coconut

Although I meant to ask why on some web pages prices are listed for some stones and not others: many are CALL FOR PRICE. Is there a particular reason that they are not listed?

Some suppliers do not want the prices listed online because they feel it hurts their dealer network.
This is true mostly of the patented cuts that have only one supplier.
For example with several lines GOG is the only vendor allowed to list them online but as a condition of that he cant list prices.
There are a few other situations where prices wont be listed but that is the main one.

 

[Rhino]

Please forgive my participation in this thread as I know this is primarily for consumers but just wanted to respond to Murph.

Date: 7/19/2005 12:06:35 PM
Author: Murph
Rhino,

I just went onto your site and focused on a 1.78 HSI1 round. It clearly says: ''Email us for a copy of the certification''.
Don''t get me wrong: I prefer that pertinent information not be posted for all to steal. I think the labelling of your images is a great idea. Anybody who is seriously interested in a stone should have no problem communicating with a vendor or at least submitting their email address (which can be a hotmail account or some other secondary account for those of us who are weary of disclosing too much info).

Cheers,

Murph

Hi Murph,

I appreciate your comments but your initial one is misleading. You had stated that we have removed "much of our information" when in fact we have actually added a new bit of information (our brightness graphic) which demonstrates the metric of brightness & contrast now considered on AGS and GIA Reports. Regarding the 1.78ct, there are times we get in a stone for review and the original lab report is not sent along with the diamond. We will post the information online so consumers know we have it and it is available and will forward them a scanned or faxed copy of the cert that we get from the supplier until we get the original ourselves. That was the reason for that one stone (and any others on our site with with the report may not be posted). Would you say this is the "norm" on our site or the "exception"? I''m just curious why you would say we have pulled down most of our information?

 

[belle]

Date: 7/20/2005 10:14:14 AM
Author: Rhino
Regarding the 1.78ct, there are times we get in a stone for review and the original lab report is not sent along with the diamond. We will post the information online so consumers know we have it and it is available and will forward them a scanned or faxed copy of the cert that we get from the supplier until we get the original ourselves. That was the reason for that one stone (and any others on our site with with the report may not be posted).

i''m trying to understand the procedure here.
are these stones actually ''in house'' or just ''available''?
for instance, if i come to see you (with an appt.

) will i be able to see these stones, or do you have to bring them in?

 

[Maxine]

Date: 7/20/2005 10:14:14 AM
Author: Rhino
Please forgive my participation in this thread as I know this is primarily for consumers but just wanted to respond to Murph.

Date: 7/19/2005 12:06:35 PM
Author: Murph
Rhino,

I just went onto your site and focused on a 1.78 HSI1 round. It clearly says: ''Email us for a copy of the certification''.
Don''t get me wrong: I prefer that pertinent information not be posted for all to steal. I think the labelling of your images is a great idea. Anybody who is seriously interested in a stone should have no problem communicating with a vendor or at least submitting their email address (which can be a hotmail account or some other secondary account for those of us who are weary of disclosing too much info).

Cheers,

Murph

Hi Murph,

I appreciate your comments but your initial one is misleading. You had stated that we have removed ''much of our information'' when in fact we have actually added a new bit of information (our brightness graphic) which demonstrates the metric of brightness & contrast now considered on AGS and GIA Reports. Regarding the 1.78ct, there are times we get in a stone for review and the original lab report is not sent along with the diamond. We will post the information online so consumers know we have it and it is available and will forward them a scanned or faxed copy of the cert that we get from the supplier until we get the original ourselves. That was the reason for that one stone (and any others on our site with with the report may not be posted). Would you say this is the ''norm'' on our site or the ''exception''? I''m just curious why you would say we have pulled down most of our information?

Rhino,
Don''t want to hijack the thread OR ask anything you shouldn''t answer here, but do you explain on your site which items relate to the new guidelines, and how they relate??? Is that in one of your tutorials....I think lots of us are curious as to how to tell if stones are making the "new" grades.........

 

[Maxine]

Date: 7/20/2005 10:31:37 AM
Author: belle

Date: 7/20/2005 10:14:14 AM
Author: Rhino
Regarding the 1.78ct, there are times we get in a stone for review and the original lab report is not sent along with the diamond. We will post the information online so consumers know we have it and it is available and will forward them a scanned or faxed copy of the cert that we get from the supplier until we get the original ourselves. That was the reason for that one stone (and any others on our site with with the report may not be posted).

i''m trying to understand the procedure here.
are these stones actually ''in house'' or just ''available''?
for instance, if i come to see you (with an appt.

) will i be able to see these stones, or do you have to bring them in?

Belle, Rhino is the one to answer this, of course, but it is my understanding that he owns/has in house the stones on which there is extensive information online (pice,lightscope, etc.)....some of the ones that come up on the search engine but do not come up on the site are AVAILBLE, but not yet in house.....hopefully he will chime in on that!!!!

 

[phoenixgirl]

I really think it depends on what the person is looking for.

If somebody is looking for a certain clarity/color combo with a budget, I look for whatever I can find to match with an emphasis on the best cut stones and best prices.

Some sites have more fancy shapes with cut info, some have more small H&A stones, some have a larger inventory of big stones. Since I sadly have no personal knowledge of any of the vendors here

(but I love my heirloom ring!), their inventory is what recommends them. If they have what a customer is looking for, great, I''ll link it. If not, let''s keep looking elsewhere until we find it.

The one thing I need to work on is being more accepting of people''s clarity and color wishes vs. cut. I often find myself recommending that people lower color and clarity and increase cut quality, but I need to accept that people have different goals and expectations. To me, it''s what makes the most sense for my dollar, but these are their dollars, so it''s not really my say (of course, don''t visit PriceScope if you don''t want to hear people''s two cents).

 

[Rhino]

Date: 7/20/2005 10:31:37 AM
Author: belle

Date: 7/20/2005 10:14:14 AM
Author: Rhino
Regarding the 1.78ct, there are times we get in a stone for review and the original lab report is not sent along with the diamond. We will post the information online so consumers know we have it and it is available and will forward them a scanned or faxed copy of the cert that we get from the supplier until we get the original ourselves. That was the reason for that one stone (and any others on our site with with the report may not be posted).

i''m trying to understand the procedure here.
are these stones actually ''in house'' or just ''available''?
for instance, if i come to see you (with an appt.

) will i be able to see these stones, or do you have to bring them in?

99% of the time they are here in house.

The common procedure is as follows.

1. Either I ...

a. Find the stone on a wholesale search engine or
b. Suppliers email me lists of their inventory and I see some there I want to inspect further

2. The stone gets here and we run it through our analysis. If it meets our minimum requirements for purchase we''ll scan and post the results.
3. Most suppliers we do biz with and *know* the consistency of their product will usually send along the original cert. If I''m not familiar with the consistency of the factory cutting the goods, the original cert will generally NOT be sent over with the stone. It will only be sent when I give final approval. When this happens we''ll do as I described in the prior post. We''ll scan and post the data, let people know its here and available and forward the faxed copy of the cert (which is what is generally sent).

This is the common procedure.


Now ... there are instances when we''ll call in stones, scan them in and send them back too and the data will still be posted. This is rare though as 99% of the stones posted are here in house and ready for Belle to see with an appointment.

 

[Rhino]

Date: 7/20/2005 10:42:11 AM
Author: Maxine
Rhino,
Don''t want to hijack the thread OR ask anything you shouldn''t answer here, but do you explain on your site which items relate to the new guidelines, and how they relate??? Is that in one of your tutorials....I think lots of us are curious as to how to tell if stones are making the ''new'' grades.........

We can let clients know this privately in email at the current time. Until the systems are officially released and the tools distributed can we post that publicly. We have the capabilities of knowing if a stone meets the new GIA Grade 1 or AGS Ideal criteria. Once I get the go ahead you can expect indepth tutorials on both with graphical demonstrations explaining pros/cons of each.

 

[kenny]

Phoenixgirl wrote, "The one thing I need to work on is being more accepting of people's clarity and color wishes vs. cut. I often find myself recommending that people lower color and clarity and increase cut quality, but I need to accept that people have different goals and expectations. To me, it's what makes the most sense for my dollar, but these are their dollars, so it's not really my say (of course, don't visit PriceScope if you don't want to hear people's two cents). “
Phoenixgirl, may I respectfully disagree?

When I came to PS I thought cut was the least important C.
Now I understand why it should be the first.
I assumed the most sparkly diamonds must be the D IFs.
I probably revealed this ignorance in my first post.

I'ts ironic that good cut wastes more rough while the public puts the highest priority on weight.
There is a financial incentive to sell poorly cut stones.
I think the diamond industry, which like all businesses pursues maximized profits, has intentionally, and perhaps understandably, dropped the ball when it comes to cut-education.

So please keep preaching about cut.
It will increase demand for well-cut stones.
The industry will supply what is demanded/

In the last 3 months I have walked into several B&Ms with my idealscope in hand. A few stores told me they are seeing more of this.
Others were very intimidated and nervous dealing with an informed customer.
Cut quality will rise with consumer education.

 

[Jennifer5973]

I have a local jeweler whom I love and from whom I will continue to purchase most of my jewelry.

Recently, I ventured into the online dimaond territory and bought a diamond from Whiteflash. Here's why:

- They had the best prices for what I wanted (my local jeweler could match on price but didn't have the precise stone I
wanted in inventory)
- Their reputation here is pretty consistent
- Their website is very user-friendly and gave me the exact info I wanted in a visual layout/format I found to be very
convenient.
- They were responsive to my first email, although I agree that it's best to contact the vendors by phone for best results.
- The transaction was extremely pleasant and professional.
- I got the feeling from Denise that she wanted me to be happy and would do whatever that took, including running
around on a Friday night at 5 PM before the July 4th holiday when I changed my mind on what stone I wanted.

Based on this, I am considering WF for a 2nd major purchase--again, local jeweler can match pricing, but WF has the 2 matching stones I need right now. I don't have a lot of time or patience for diamond projects that go one for months...I am not a patient person by nature...Once I decide what I want, I want it right away and to be done with it. WF had the right goods at the right prices with the right service level when I needed them. I would recommend them without a doubt, just as I recommend my local jeweler.

 

[phoenixgirl]

Thanks for the encouragement Kenny!

Sometimes we can go overboard in the quest to be objective . . .