When will you allow your children to drink alcohol?

[iheartscience]

Date: 11/17/2009 4:06:17 PM
Author: SanDiegoLady

Date: 11/17/2009 3:41:01 PM

Author: TravelingGal

SDL, correct me if I am wrong, but there are often laws that can seem to contradict one another, yes?

Here is a site for state by state underage drinking laws.

http://alcoholpolicy.niaaa.nih.gov/stateprofiles/

TG, I''m going on what the California PC states. I dont see anywhere on there about pc''s. That''s up for heavy interpretation unless you can provide othewise. Given where I work and what my husband and I both do and my background, I''m still going to stand firm in my opinion on this subject. I can appreciate that others may have a different view on it, I dont have to agree with it. The next time I get a call from a teen or a college student under the age of 21 who has been provided alcohol and been taken advantage of, I''ll remember this thread. I have taken plenty of those calls. You be the one to listen to the distraught parent on the phone or the hospital that calls for the report.

SDL, how many of these under 21 victims were taken advantage of after given a glass of wine in their parents'' home? I think the leap from a parent letting their kid have a few sips of wine here and there to "I''ll remember this thread when I hear about girls getting raped" is a ludicrous stretch.

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 11/17/2009 5:03:16 PM
Author: SanDiegoLady
No TG, that is not the part of California PC I am speaking of. That of which you are quoting is California PC 272 (a) (1). If I were at work, I could provide you the more specific section along with the writings therein, however I am not at work. And, I am not going to argue this further. I will politely bow out of this discussion as I won''t further argue my feelings or my standing on this matter. I think its fairly clear how I feel.

SDL, as I said your position is clear. My position is that if you are going to quote codes, then let''s actually see it so we can all make informed decisions, because obviously I am quoting the wrong thing.

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 11/17/2009 5:04:14 PM
Author: thing2of2

Date: 11/17/2009 4:06:17 PM
Author: SanDiegoLady

Date: 11/17/2009 3:41:01 PM

Author: TravelingGal

SDL, correct me if I am wrong, but there are often laws that can seem to contradict one another, yes?

Here is a site for state by state underage drinking laws.

http://alcoholpolicy.niaaa.nih.gov/stateprofiles/

TG, I''m going on what the California PC states. I dont see anywhere on there about pc''s. That''s up for heavy interpretation unless you can provide othewise. Given where I work and what my husband and I both do and my background, I''m still going to stand firm in my opinion on this subject. I can appreciate that others may have a different view on it, I dont have to agree with it. The next time I get a call from a teen or a college student under the age of 21 who has been provided alcohol and been taken advantage of, I''ll remember this thread. I have taken plenty of those calls. You be the one to listen to the distraught parent on the phone or the hospital that calls for the report.

SDL, how many of these under 21 victims were taken advantage of after given a glass of wine in their parents'' home? I think the leap from a parent letting their kid have a few sips of wine here and there to ''I''ll remember this thread when I hear about girls getting raped'' is a ludicrous stretch.

Agreed T2, not to mention somewhat insulting to those of whom who believe that letting minors try alcohol in their privacy of their own home is OK.

 

[lucyandroger]

Date: 11/16/2009 8:24:53 PM
Author: SarahLovesJS

Date: 11/16/2009 5:35:34 PM
Author: TravelingGal
OK, I know this is spliting hairs and I didn''t look this up, but...


Is the legal age for BUYING alcohol? You can legally drink at a much younger age in your own home in many states. In fact, I am not sure that at some bars, it wouldn''t be technical legal to drink, as long as you weren''t buying it underage. Of course, no bar is going to allow that in case of a bust, they can''t prove they didn''t serve it to a minor.

Don''t feel like looking up the VA Code so just looked at the VA ABC website and according to it 21 applies to purchase, possession, and consumption. http://www.abc.state.va.us/Education/parent2/parent2.htm

ETA: That is of course very possibly not true in other states, VA is very conservative legally.

Hey there fellow Virginian

It''s actually NOT illegal if the person less than 21 years of age is in possession of alcohol due to making a delivery of alcoholic beverages in pursuance of his employment of an order of his parent. It is also NOT illegal for someone to provide lawfully acquired alcoholic beverages to "his family" in his residence and can even lawfully provide alcoholic beverages to guests under 21 if their parent/guardian or spouse is present.

Relevant sections of the Virginia Annotated Code below:

§ 4.1-305. Purchasing or possessing alcoholic beverages unlawful in certain cases; venue; exceptions; penalty; forfeiture; deferred proceedings; treatment and education programs and services
A. No person to whom an alcoholic beverage may not lawfully be sold under § 4.1-304 shall consume, purchase or possess, or attempt to consume, purchase or possess, any alcoholic beverage, except (i) pursuant to subdivisions 1 through 7 of § 4.1-200; (ii) where possession of the alcoholic beverages by a person less than 21 years of age is due to such person''s making a delivery of alcoholic beverages in pursuance of his employment or an order of his parent; or (iii) by any state, federal, or local law-enforcement officer when possession of an alcoholic beverage is necessary in the performance of his duties. Such person may be prosecuted either in the county or city in which the alcohol was possessed or consumed, or in the county or city in which the person exhibits evidence of physical indicia of consumption of alcohol. It shall be an affirmative defense to a charge of a violation of this subsection if the defen-dant shows that such consumption or possession was pursuant to subdivision 7 of § 4.1-200.

§ 4.1-200. Exemptions from licensure

7. Any person who keeps and possesses lawfully acquired alcoholic beverages in his residence for his personal use or that of his family. However, such alcoholic beverages may be served or given to guests in such residence by such person, his family or servants when (i) such guests are 21 years of age or older or are accompanied by a parent, guardian, or spouse who is 21 years of age or older and (ii) such service or gift is in no way a shift or device to evade the provisions of this title.

 

[packrat]

Regardless of the legality, doesn''t it all boil down to it''s the kids choice what he/she does? Some kids are served small glasses for celebrations and maybe they grow up and are raging alcoholics, while other kids in the same situation have a healthy attitude towards it when they''re older. Some kids are forbidden from even looking cross eyed at a can of beer and turn out to be raging alcoholics, while other kids in the same situation grow up and have a healthy attitude towards alcohol. Some go wild after high school..some don''t. It''s just about the kids themselves, and I don''t see a way to predict beyond a shadow of a doubt which way your kid is going to go based on anything.

Alcohol was free wheeling in JD''s house..he drank heavily and then realized he didn''t want to be like his parents, so straightened up. My brother and I were allowed sips very infrequently and had a no drinking policy pounded into us, and we did the same thing as JD. Some kids don''t mess w/it at all after seeing their parents like that, and some do the exact thing their parents do and just don''t grow out of it. No way of knowing, really. Education and communication, and cross your fingers they listen.

 

[qtiekiki]

Packrat, you are right. It really depends on the kids.

As parents, we can only educate them of the effects and consequences of alcoholics. We can''t control their behavior outside of our presence, and can only hope that they make good decisions.

I think people are mixing up two concepts here:
1. Letting your children take a sip of alcohol for special occasions or to enjoy with special meals.
and
2. Letting your children drink regularly in the home, or being the party house for your children and their friends.

There''s a big difference between the two, and I would not let my children drink regularly and would never let my house be the party house. I would never let any underage person who is not my child drink in my house. Period.

 

[Tacori E-ring]

Let us also not forget that alcoholism is a disease. Someone once described it as an obsession of the mind and allergy of the body. A child is born with this gene so alcoholism is not something you can cause or teach. You can enable but ultimately the child will write their own story. Problem drinkers are different than alcoholics but both will choose to (or not to) abuse alcohol with or without "tastes" from their parents.

 

[fieryred33143]

Date: 11/17/2009 8:39:08 PM
Author: Tacori E-ring
Let us also not forget that alcoholism is a disease. Someone once described it as an obsession of the mind and allergy of the body. A child is born with this gene so alcoholism is not something you can cause or teach. You can enable but ultimately the child will write their own story. Problem drinkers are different than alcoholics but both will choose to (or not to) abuse alcohol with or without ''tastes'' from their parents.

It''s very interesting you should mention this Tacori.

When I was in high school, our psych teacher did a test. She gave us all a piece of paper and asked us to put it in our mouths. Some students tasted nothing, others had somewhat of a sour taste, and others (myself included) literally felt like we were going to throw up. I wish I could remember what the paper was called. Anyway, the teacher said that those that tasted nothing were more likely to be alcoholics than those that were very sick from it.

I agree with you. It ultimately depends on the child. You can shelter them from alcohol all their lives and they can grow up to either really desire it or have zero interest in it.

 

[AGBF]

Interesting thread. I think I saw its title at one point, but I wouldn''t have been aware of its existence if it hadn''t been for an e-mail from someone! I have been so wrapped up in my own concerns that I haven''t spent very much time on Pricescope. Luckily, some people still send messages into the void, however. (Hello friends who write even if I never write back!)

I have to say that I have been very, very lucky about this issue. My daughter, who is now 17, has not-yet-had any substance abuse issues. (Of course that is one of the only issues we have not had!) She has emotional problems that started when she was in sixth to seventh grade. She has had social problems. After a great academic start as a youngster she has had, due to her emotional problems, academic problems. She has made two suicide attempts and been hospitalized twice. She does not, however, drink, take recreational drugs, or smoke cigarettes. Since she has been attending alternative schools for the past few years, I have come to see how rare a specimen she is among her peers. Almost everyone else in these schools smoke cigarettes and use alcohol and recreational drugs.

We didn''t have a strict "hands off" policy about sips of wine, but we also didn''t have a lot of wine (or other alcohol) around. I do not drink at all. I do not think my daughter wants to emulate her father and his drinking, which tends to be solitary. Her sips of wine were probably taken at Passover seders...although I recall that when we had them children were provided with grape juice. My husband is Italian, so we might have been a family that has wine with meals, etcetera. Certainly there was no taboo on drinking as my husband grew up, no age limit. Drinking wasn''t glamorous to me, however, and I don''t think I made it look that way to my daughter.

I have always feared that my daughter could become an alcoholic or drug abuser due to her emotional problems. That is why I wrote that she has not had any substance abuse issues yet. I have made her aware that AA exists. AA is a great resource...and the only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking.

AGBF

 

[princesss]

Date: 11/17/2009 8:39:08 PM
Author: Tacori E-ring
Let us also not forget that alcoholism is a disease. Someone once described it as an obsession of the mind and allergy of the body. A child is born with this gene so alcoholism is not something you can cause or teach. You can enable but ultimately the child will write their own story. Problem drinkers are different than alcoholics but both will choose to (or not to) abuse alcohol with or without ''tastes'' from their parents.

Very, very true.

 

[elrohwen]

DH and I drink a glass of beer or wine almost every night, so I don't think that will change too much when we have kids. It might be only on weekends, for example, but we won't cut it out totally. I want our kids to see responsible drinking and to realize it can be a normal part of having dinner.

I will let my kids try something if they want, and maybe give them a small glass of wine on special occasions around 16, but that's about it until college. I would certainly like to know if they're drinking and would pick them up from any party, as many of you said. I know they'll drink in college, but I'm not going to host parties for their friends unless they're 21 (even then, who wants a bunch of drunk 21 year olds running around? not me). Once the kids are in college and drinking on their own, I don't think I'd have a problem sharing a beer or glass of wine with them while they were home even if they were only 19 or 20. But it wouldn't go past one or two drinks and only with me or DH there - no getting drunk in my house.

ETA: I agree with what some of you have said about high quality alcohol. When I started drinking in college, I was ok with chugging down the awful cheap stuff. Once I was 21 and could buy good stuff, I would rather have only a few good beers than a whole case of cheap beer. I'm still that way and won't drink anything that doesn't taste good, so I think if a kid has some sense of taste they may be likely to drink less. However, since early college is all about other people buying the alcohol you drink, there isn't much of a choice there - if the legal age was lower (like in Canada) this might apply.