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What happened here?

Nardil

Rough_Rock
Joined
Aug 26, 2015
Messages
35
Is this normal? Sure it was dark outside but normally the diamond still looks white even in dark conditions :confused:

bild_0.jpg
 

Niel

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Jul 23, 2012
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19,640
Who's diamond is it?

I would say just don't take bling pictures in the dark.
 

Nardil

Rough_Rock
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Aug 26, 2015
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It is mine :)

Haha I was just surprised that it turned black all of a sudden, no light reflections what so ever, so I had to take a picture of it. Maybe its normal I just haven't seen it like that before.
 

Nardil

Rough_Rock
Joined
Aug 26, 2015
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35
I mean, I know that diamonds can turn dark in direct sunlight and mine does that but then with some flashes. Here it was no direct bright light at all, it just went completely black..
 

kenny

Super_Ideal_Rock
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I'll just say, there is lots to learn about photography, lighting, diamonds ... and the 'cameras' people use today.

'Effortless' 'learn-nothing' 'everyone-is-a-photographer' cameras are fine for a few low-demand uses like the kids in the backyard in the sun for a birthday party ... but not for challenging shots.
 

Nardil

Rough_Rock
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Aug 26, 2015
Messages
35
Thank you for your answer. I absolutely agree, my intent with the photo this time was to show that the diamond looked black though. What I am curious about is if it is normal for a diamond to turn black (I've read that it is normal fot diamonds to turn black for example in direct sunlight but as I guess you can tell from the picture it was not any direct bright light)?
 

tyty333

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They forgot to tell you that you bought a chameleon diamond...it turns black at night! :eh: ;-) :eh:
 

kenny

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Nardil|1447055013|3947219 said:
Thank you for your answer. I absolutely agree, my intent with the photo this time was to show that the diamond looked black though. What I am curious about is if it is normal for a diamond to turn black (I've read that it is normal fot diamonds to turn black for example in direct sunlight but as I guess you can tell from the picture it was not any direct bright light)?

It is 'normal' for a diamond to turn black when the environment, lighting and camera setting (or lack of setting) cause it.

Photography is not always automatic or easy ... regardless of what manufacturers lead us to believe.
We've had point and shoot cameras over 100 years that work well for 'regular' subjects, in 'regular' settings, in 'regular' lighting.

But when those things are out of the ordinary you need a more flexible camera and knowledge of how to use it and knowledge about lighting and post processing.

As for diamonds 'turning black' in sunlight that's more about our eye's iris constricting to make the pupil smaller to block out bright light.

This is all less surprising when you separate what is happening at the diamond from how perception systems like the eye/brain or the camera capture and process what they 'see'.

IOW you can't always believe what your eyes or your camera tell you.
It all makes perfect sense when you understand the limitations of these two systems that we mistakenly take for granted as being believable or only telling the truth.
 

Nardil

Rough_Rock
Joined
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Messages
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tyty333|1447089483|3947327 said:
They forgot to tell you that you bought a chameleon diamond...it turns black at night! :eh: ;-) :eh:
:bigsmile: chameleon diamond sounds pretty cool! I was scared that I had bought a mood stone that turned black every time I got angry :shifty:

kenny said:
Nardil|1447055013|3947219 said:
Thank you for your answer. I absolutely agree, my intent with the photo this time was to show that the diamond looked black though. What I am curious about is if it is normal for a diamond to turn black (I've read that it is normal fot diamonds to turn black for example in direct sunlight but as I guess you can tell from the picture it was not any direct bright light)?

It is 'normal' for a diamond to turn black when the environment, lighting and camera setting (or lack of setting) cause it.

Photography is not always automatic or easy ... regardless of what manufacturers lead us to believe.
We've had point and shoot cameras over 100 years that work well for 'regular' subjects, in 'regular' settings, in 'regular' lighting.

But when those things are out of the ordinary you need a more flexible camera and knowledge of how to use it and knowledge about lighting and post processing.

As for diamonds 'turning black' in sunlight that's more about our eye's iris constricting to make the pupil smaller to block out bright light.

This is all less surprising when you separate what is happening at the diamond from how perception systems like the eye/brain or the camera capture and process what they 'see'.

IOW you can't always believe what your eyes or your camera tell you.
It all makes perfect sense when you understand the limitations of these two systems that we mistakenly take for granted as being believable or only telling the truth.

Okay, so if I understand this correctly. It could not have been due to the camera since it looked just as black to the naked eye as it did in the photo. It was probably not the eye blocking out bright light since it was dark outside and not that much light for the diamond to reflect. However, the white gold around the diamond is reflecting light so there should be some light for the diamond to reflect. Could it have something to do with the angle with which the light hit the diamond? I'm curious about what the actual cause was because it looked quite cool. It created the illution that the diamond swallowed all light :D
 

kenny

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Diamonds are little boxes of mirrors reflecting what is in front of them.
I suspect there was a lot of dark above the diamond and light was only coming from the side not above the diamond for it to reflect.

Plus the light was low and/or the camera exposure was inadequate ... this could be fixed by a longer exposure or opening up the aperture ... but if it was a cameraphone or other low-cost camera it may not have this capability.

Also I agree, you'd think some reflection of light would have been returned by the diamond.



Perhaps the diamond appearing this solid-dark is explained by one or a combination of the following:

Inadequate resolution ... the diamond's image on the camera's sensor is taking up few pixels for the flashes/facets being too small
IOW the system may not have the resolution to resolve the small points of light. Moving in closer may have helped that if your camera can focus closer. A macro setting or macro lens may have helped.
Also it's underexposed, raising the exposure in post-processing program like Photoshop (or one of many cheaper or free programs) may recover some flashes in the diamond.
This depends greatly on the quality of the camera's sensor.
Nikon's current DSLR sensors (made by Sony) are exceptional at capturing detail in deep shadows that can be recovered with post-processing.

I'm not sure of anything, but thanks, brainstorm this is fun. :wavey:

May I ask what camera you used?
What and where was the light source?
Describe the room/environment of this pic.

screen_shot_2015-11-09_at_12.png
 

kenny

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Here, I lifted the exposure a bit and recovered some flashes of light in the diamond.
Original is on left, processed copy is on right.
This proves the diamond appearing to be solid black was a photography artifact.

I only have the file from PS, but you have the original file so you may be able to recover more detail in the shadows than I could.
PS software heavily compresses pics to save bandwidth, aka money.

If you shoot in RAW format instead of JPEG you could recover even more detail from the shadows.
If you shoot with one of Nikon's latest sensors you could recover even more detail from the shadows than a Canon or likely any other brand.
Even Sony, who makes sensors for Nikon does not use the same sensors that Nikon co-designs with Sony in their own best cameras.

I'm only going into all this geeky detail because you seem interested in pursuing an explanation.
Interesting thread BTW. :appl:

Again, cameras and eye/brain systems sometimes lie because of their limitations.
Unfortunately we usually believe our eyes and cameras to be telling the truth.

0001000.png
 

Nardil

Rough_Rock
Joined
Aug 26, 2015
Messages
35
Thank you so much for your answers Kenny, I really appreciate it!

Oh yes, there they are, very weak flashes but they do exist. To weak for my eye to discover though.

The picture is taken with an iPhone. I was walking the dog and looked down on my ring (which I tend to do every 2 seconds...) and instead of my, normally, white diamond all I saw was a black hole. Since I thought it looked quite cool :ugeek: I grabbed my phone to take a picture so that I could show my (not so very interested) FI when I got home. Normally when I take pictures I use a Sony NEX 6 though :)

So the light came from street lights (yellow light) and the surroundings were dark. I think you could be right in that the light came from the side and the diamond maybe mirrored the dark sky? As I continued my walk I actually tried make it look that black again by holding it in different angles under the street lights but I couldn't...
 

kenny

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Thanks for the explanation.
It all makes sense.

... and that NEX 6 was a fine choice! :appl:
 

Nardil

Rough_Rock
Joined
Aug 26, 2015
Messages
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Oh I'm really glad to hear that, buying a camera was almost as stressful as finding a diamond. I think I need to get a macro lens now to get some good pics of the little gem :)
 

kenny

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Nardil|1447107382|3947453 said:
Oh I'm really glad to hear that, buying a camera was almost as stressful as finding a diamond. I think I need to get a macro lens now to get some good pics of the little gem :)

Macro lens?
Yes!
Oh Baby! Oh Baby! ...

If you want to really geek out on diamond macro-photography look up some of my threads here on fancy colored diamonds or Octavias.
Girl, I'll spend AAAALL your money. ;( ;( ;(
 

Nardil

Rough_Rock
Joined
Aug 26, 2015
Messages
35
Haha maybe I shall wait to look until I get a more well paid job :bigsmile: diamonds and photography, I don't know why but I seem to pick very expensive hobbys...
 
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