What are your thoughts on how government is handling COVID-19

[arkieb1]

I know two people that have committed suicide because they lost their jobs, because of the virus.

The virus is killing people indirectly as well as directly. In Australia and globally there is and will be massive unemployment, massive job losses. Families that are force to stay home together in these uncertain times face the prospect of job losses, small businesses going under, family businesses going under, family members dying, mortgages they cannot pay, the inability to be able to afford food and so on.

The stress and strain of all of that, and on people such as health workers will manifest itself in higher rates of things like domestic violence and higher rates of suicide as well as the mortality rate from the virus.

 

[bludiva]

@bludiva, I agree with everything you say above except that the thread is non-partisan. In your own post you are making remarks that many would consider partisan. I think it's impossible to have a discussion about government action in the US without discussing the policies and actions of republicans vs. democrats.

i deleted that or at least thought i did b/c it was part of a post i started to write a week or so ago that autosaved and autoposted. at the time i thought maybe we could get back to the original intent of the thread which seemed to me non-partisan.

as this has evolved, especially w/ the spending bill and remarks like what the lt gov of texas said today, trump blaming others instead of showing leadership, etc....changed my pov. republicans aren't the only leaders failing at this but they have the most power and are therefore the most responsible. the senate needs to stop using this as an opportunity to push through their agenda and the house shouldn't be responding in kind.

makes me want to cry to see this country such a mess.

 

[Bonfire]

what?????

https://twitter.com/x/status/1242231879488716800

Are we sure this isn’t an SNL skit?
This is cringeworthy! I’d love to hear the thoughts in her head as she’s standing there.

 

[voce]

Racism is always wrong. I am sad that people are fearful because of hateful actions of others. But saying that this virus originated in China and that the Chinese government was not being totally honest is not racist. The Chinese gov’t should be held accountable for this huge crisis the entire world is going through.

Sad, though, that since there's no international police that can even touch the Chinese government, there is no realistic means of holding them accountable, at least not in a way that would not also harm the billions of Chinese citizens who are entirely blameless.

So trump wants to call it the China virus because that's where it originated and the government of China initially suppressed information pertaining to it. If trump has such difficulty calling it the coronavirus then let him name it after the head of the government, Xi Jinping, or whomever is responsible for suppressing the information. Calling it the China virus can create racism toward Chinese Americans.

What the government of China did in hiding the truth of what was happening was terrible. By the same token, trump is also responsible for what he did to the American citizens. My son saw this coming at the very beginning of this year and became more concerned as soon as it started spreading. It was agonizing having to listen to trump downplay this and tell us there were only 15 Americans infected with it and it was going to go down to 5 then 2 and then miraculously go away. By this point my family had already stopped going out and had purchased all of our necessary items. Then we had to hear his excuses that no one saw this coming. I am exhausted by his ignorance and ineptness. He chose to disband the NSC pandemic unit, rejected test kits from the World Health Organization and lost valuable time because of his failure to recognize this crisis. He should have ramped up production of ventilators, prepared for testing and implemented necessary lock downs.

Now he states he knew it was a pandemic long before WHO declared it as such! So either he is lying or he is inept and guilty for not taking aggressive action at that time. There's no double standard here. Just as the head of the Chinese government made catastrophic errors so did trump.

Very good point. What the government of China did was terrible, but I don't see how Trump is doing anything qualitatively different from what the Chinese government did. Downplaying the virus at the very beginning and then having to go back on their/his original word? Check. Blaming the virus on foreigners? Check. Lying to their/his own people just to make themselves look good? Check. Not admitting how they/he bungled it at the beginning? Check. Not ever admitting they/he made a mistake? Check.

Those of you who are outraged by the Chinese government, should be equally outraged with the Trump administration, if you don't want to be effectively a bunch of hypocrites. Why is Trump any better than the Chinese government? The only way out is if you make the argument that ineptitude is better than deliberate deception, but I have my own opinions on whether Trump is truly inept, or whether he's actually quite intelligent and spinning public opinion in his base, EXACTLY where it needs to go.

Let things become a crisis, and then he can act the part of a savior? It's plausible, but I definitely have no proof Trump is a megalomaniac who is capable of the worst. I'm just saying how he has handled the coronavirus so far has conveniently increased the difficulty of fundraising and getting Biden elected in the general election. I was just reading an article about that from The Atlantic today.

Just to clarify, I'm not defending the Chinese regime, but I'm not giving Trump a pass on how he has handled the coronavirus.

My post was to throw that passive aggressive right back at you.

I don't think any of this "back at you" behavior is helpful, especially when it comes to passive-aggressiveness.

I experienced racism and bullying growing up in America. One time I got suspended from school because a bully spit at me, pulled my hair and slapped me, and my response was to punch her to get her to let go of me; she told the teachers that her tooth was loose from my punch in the principal's office. I had to do that because I was a kid with a language barrier who couldn't out-talk the liars and explain my own situation but who sure wasn't going to let bullies have their cake and eat it, too. I don't think what I did was unequivocally "right", but the effect was that nobody bullied me physically afterward.

With passive aggressiveness, all it does is spawn more passive-aggressive behavior, which is the opposite of what is helpful.

We should send the $2.5 tillion bill to China.

I find this a prime example of passive-aggressive behavior? Why even waste your time saying it? You can invoice China all you want, but no one will give you the time of day.

 

[redwood66]

NM. Not worth it.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Sad, though, that since there's no international police that can even touch the Chinese government, there is no realistic means of holding them accountable, at least not in a way that would not also harm the billions of Chinese citizens who are entirely blameless.

That's not true. FYI, At least 1.5 million people fled Wuhan 3 days before they lock down the city. A lot of the residences in Wuhan hear a lock down was coming soon. How do you think this virus spread so quickly all over the world?

 

[Dancing Fire]

I find this a prime example of passive-aggressive behavior? Why even waste your time saying it? You can invoice China all you want, but no one will give you the time of day.

I know, at least not the liberals here.You can side with communist China all you want, but I will not!

 

[voce]

That's not true. FYI, At least 1.5 million people fled Wuhan 3 days before they lock down the city. A lot of the residences in Wuhan hear a lock down was coming soon. How do you think this virus spread so quickly all over the world?

China has 1,435 million people. 1435 million - 1.5 million people who escaped Wuhan - 100 million people who work in the Chinese bureaucracy (I could be wrong, this is what I remember from Yuen Yuen Ang's talk at the 2019 Camden Conference) = 1333.5 million people who are not to blame.

The vast majority of the Chinese population aren't even member of CCCP and do not deserve being equated with the government they are ruled by. The majority of the Chinese people are powerless to effect change because they are unwilling to protest violently or suffer as activists in jail.

I know, at least not the liberals here.You can side with communist China all you want, but I will not!

You know, I liked that post where you told the story of how your son got thrown in jail for unknowingly possessing an anti-government poster. I agree with you when you say or you imply that the Chinese government is capable of the worst.

If you actually read my posts with a clear logical head, I don't know how you can think I would side with communist China. Drawing equivalence between Trump and the Chinese government is not siding with the Chinese government. It is because of what the Chinese government does that I do not want my Canadian future in-laws to identify me as Chinese rather than as American, which they do and I consider that a sign of a milder form of racism. Make no mistake that I am being equally critical of the Chinese government and Trump. I think you're just failing to see the similarities, but that's on you. Your misunderstanding does not make me pro-Communist.

Trump has definite authoritarian leanings. He has courted authoritarian leaders like Putin and Kim far more publicly than Xi has. The way he's been running things from the White House speaks volumes.

 

[AGBF]

On the topic of how the government is handling this: although I am not a citizen of New York State, I live in a town that borders it. I think that Governor Andrew Cuomo is handling the crisis admirably. I was never a fan of his. (In fact saying I was not a fan is putting it mildly; I found him heartless.)

I think he is showing true leadership in a time of need now, however. He may actually be the son of Mario Cuomo. I think Mario Cuomo would be proud.

 

[missy]

On the topic of how the government is handling this: although I am not a citizen of New York State, I live in a town that borders it. I think that Governor Andrew Cuomo is handling the crisis admirably. I was never a fan of his. (In fact saying I was not a fan is putting it mildly; I found him heartless.)

I think he is showing true leadership in a time of need now, however. He may actually be the son of Mario Cuomo. I think Mario Cuomo would be proud.

Yes I agree on all the above. He is doing a good job. And I wasn't a huge fan of his before this either.
He is the son of Mario Cuomo.

 

[Asscherhalo_lover]

In brighter news the community at large has been exceptionally kind and supportive and people have been donating to kickstarters to pay local restaurants to deliver food to our ICU and ED staff. If your community doesn’t have something like this, it’s a lovely idea and a great way to support local restaurants and show love to your front line providers!

Mine has a huge group doing this! Every time we order out whatever we've spent we donate the same amount to the group

 

[Asscherhalo_lover]

On the topic of how the government is handling this: although I am not a citizen of New York State, I live in a town that borders it. I think that Governor Andrew Cuomo is handling the crisis admirably. I was never a fan of his. (In fact saying I was not a fan is putting it mildly; I found him heartless.)

I think he is showing true leadership in a time of need now, however. He may actually be the son of Mario Cuomo. I think Mario Cuomo would be proud.

Same and same. I was never a fan of him but he is handling this admirably.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Trump has definite authoritarian leanings. He has courted authoritarian leaders like Putin and Kim far more publicly than Xi has. The way he's been running things from the White House speaks volumes.

FYI, Kim is control by Xi. Putin and China have been doing a lot of business together. Comparing Trump to Xi, Putin and Kim is ridiculous. How many people had Trump executed?

 

[voce]

FYI, Kim is control by Xi. Putin and China have been doing a lot of business together. Comparing Trump to Xi, Putin and Kim is ridiculous. How many people had Trump executed?

Comparing Trump to Xi, Putin and Kim is not ridiculous, because all three are the chief executives of their countries. You have a point in that Trump has not executed people. However, the allegation that Kim is controlled by Xi is unprovable and, although quite plausible, is not something that I consider fact.

Although I despise Xi with fervor, I don't like to mix assumptions with facts.

 

[arkieb1]

This is a major health crisis AND a major economic crisis like the world hasn't seen in over a century.

Trump barely seems able to grasp the scope of both let alone deal with both adequately.

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

Wrong wrong wrong.
Put oldies and at risk in quarantine isolation and protect them until there are treatments and a vaccine.
Ruining the economy = economic hardship beyond belief and mental health and suicide will cause more damage and result in more deaths and misery that from the virus.

 

[arkieb1]

Wrong wrong wrong.
Put oldies and at risk in quarantine isolation and protect them until there are treatments and a vaccine.
Ruining the economy = economic hardship beyond belief and mental health and suicide will cause more damage and result in more deaths and misery that from the virus.

It already is here in Australia I know two people that have committed suicide because they lost their jobs, one was a young, beautiful flight attendant.

 

[Lilith112]

It already is here in Australia I know two people that have committed suicide because they lost their jobs, one was a young, beautiful flight attendant.

There's still a lot of people flouting quarantine/social distancing rules though. Moreover, 39% of U.S. hospitalizations thus far are people aged 20-54; it's hitting younger cohorts hard too, particularly given the prevalence of underlying health conditions e.g. asthma, obesity, hypertension, diabetes, etc.

From what I've observed, letting younger people go back to work while keeping the elderly in isolation only works if everyone complies with health advisories. That is to say, the elderly stays put and doesn't interact w/their children/nieces/nephews, etc. Also that every single young person takes it seriously and takes every precaution e.g. wearing a face mask in public, constantly disinfecting hands. Here in Asia, everyone is still wearing face masks even though numbers have been down for a while *knock on wood*

But there's still a lot of younger people in Europe/U.S./Australia, especially Gen-Z, who aren't taking this pandemic seriously and are behaving recklessly, ranging from partying in Florida for Spring Break to hosting "coronavirus parties" (unfortunately a thing). Beyond that, there's also shortages for basic precautions like hand sanitizer/face masks, making it even more difficult :/

I don't think it should be advisable to go out until each country secures the necessary protective gear for healthcare workers and workers. For example, my company's office only re-opened after our admin procured enough face masks.

 

[arkieb1]

@Lilith112 I'm not disagreeing with you, the time to lock down the elderly only for both countries, the US and Australia has passed. We have to now deal with the economic fallout from that, that's what I'm saying and it will be as bad as the disease itself.

 

[Lilith112]

@Lilith112 I'm not disagreeing with you, the time to lock down the elderly only for both countries, the US and Australia has passed. We have to now deal with the economic fallout from that, that's what I'm saying and it will be as bad as the disease itself.

Oh okay, sorry about that! I've just been a bit riled over some recent convos on Twitter and whatnot that it's OK for younger workers to go back to work...when there' isn't anywhere enough protective gear for even front-line medical workers. Hell, my Chinese-American parents are afraid to wear face mask in public even though that's what they should be doing. I also don't want to underplay the economic impact, but that's why it's so important to get testing up to speed and for everyone to comply with quarantine laws. Flouting them will just result in longer lockdown and a worst economic situation imo.

 

[Matata]

 

[AGBF]

Lawrence O'Donnell had a brilliant show about this on MSNBC last night. My daughter giggled all the way through the beginning of the show. His was the blackest of black humor as he used the theme of Donald Trump's desire for packed churches on Easter to foster the realistic vision of what would follow: packed morgues a week or two later. He pointed out that even the Pope had cancelled Easter services at the Vatican and had done it two weeks ago. He was scathing. He was brilliant.

 

[Maria D]

It already is here in Australia I know two people that have committed suicide because they lost their jobs, one was a young, beautiful flight attendant.

Do you know them personally?

 

[AGBF]

This article opines on how the slow response of the Trump administration to the coronavirus will affect the availability of ventilators. In brief: ventilators that could have been available in mid-April will not be available until late June because Tump did not act.

At this point we can only imagine what a loss of life a shortage of ventilators will cause.

Slow Response to the Coronavirus Measured in Lost Opportunity (Published 2020)

If the administration had reacted to the ventilator shortage in February, a private sector effort starting now might have made lifesaving equipment in mid- to late April. Now it is unlikely to be before June.

www.nytimes.com

 

[arkieb1]

Do you know them personally?

I met one but did not know her well the other is someone my husband knew, I find it sad and disturbing people are committing suicide over lost jobs in Australia, this might become something that occurs in the US as more things are forced to shut down as well. The economic destruction and personal impact it will have on many is another aspect of this epidemic....

 

[chrono]

I recall seeing rent and mortgage freeze in England or something? I think all countries should follow suit as this is something that can't be helped and it's not the people's fault that they cannot work.

 

[Queenie60]

I recall seeing rent and mortgage freeze in England or something? I think all countries should follow suit as this is something that can't be helped and it's not the people's fault that they cannot work.

I agree @chrono - it isn't their fault. I have taken the back seat at my job (minimal at-home hours) so that the young lady that works under me can have the hours she needs to survive. It's my way of helping, standing aside and allowing the more needy person to collect a paycheck. As for rents, this is a tough one, we own rental property and collect those rents to pay the mortgages and to use as income to survive. Again, we will take the backseat on this one as we can't evict a person because they lost their job. Very trying times. I pray for those who are ill and those who have lost their jobs and can't maintain the most basic of lives. God help us.

 

[Calliecake]

I’m watching Governor Cuomo‘s press conference as I type this. The citizens of NY should be proud of their governor. It’s a shame Governor Cuomo isn’t the leader of the country right now.

 

[Slickk]

I’m watching Governor Cuomo‘s press conference as I type this. The citizens of NY should be proud of their governor. It’s a shame Governor Cuomo isn’t the leader of the country right now.

I agree. #PresidentCuomo is trending right now. He is the new ‘Most Eligible Bachelor now since he and Sandra Lee broke up.
Friends in San Francisco texted us to praise our Governor as well. He’s really stepping up here!

 

[Matata]

The reports of Cuomo and other governors trying to find the thin line between asking for federal aid and pi$$ing off tRump are expected and disappointing. That an alleged leader would think of withholding aid to anyone because of petulance and thin skin is an abomination. I think he needs to be removed from office, Pence stays in charge of CV task force, and Pelosi should be put in charge of the country until this pandemic is under control.