shape
carat
color
clarity

DejaWiz

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Apr 23, 2021
Messages
6,111
Boom here it is! This morning email! LB finest DEF , excellent cuts in 18 kt gold for $1500/ ct. Another sneaky move!

Not a bad deal for the 4Cs, if one doesn't mind NOT being able to choose on proportions, angles, pictures/videos, grading lab, growth method, etc.
The $1500 price tag is about 25-33% less than other popular/recommended sellers.
Personally, I think I'd rather spend that extra 25-33% per carat and have full control over picking the specific diamond. The LB pricing is highly enticing, however.
 

distracts

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Oct 11, 2011
Messages
6,144
They are delivering the 2 cts and the 2 cts for the most part look beautiful. Not as pretty of course as WF but for the price pretty enough. The 1 ct were rare when they came out and now they are easier to get. They know exactly what they are doing and it’s working like a charm. Wait for the new cuts. I’m sure they are coming.

I agree with this - the 1 cts were also rare when they came out in the solitaire pendants. Rarity when something first comes out is an intentional strategy to create hype. Look at makeup palette releases, hot clothing/handbag releases, video game console releases, etc - a lot of times the first wave is intentionally small just so those hooked in who are most likely to be influencers get the things and brag about them, then there may be a few more waves that aren't quite as exclusive, before they finally are available all the time. It's a common marketing strategy. Annoying, but it must work, because so many companies do it and I assume they have the data.

And look at all the PSers who got in on the first batch of 2 ct LB diamonds - and ran here to post about it. Creating hype. I know I saw those posts and as a mostly-non-diamond person immediately began dreaming of what rings I could create that I'd never get in mined diamond because I'm just not into diamonds enough to spend that kind of money on them when I could get a really killer mined color gem for that price.
 

oncrutchesrightnow

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Apr 17, 2006
Messages
2,920
Agreed. The fact that these tech and trade conversations about MMDs keep happening in RT, not in the LGD forum with the most invested consumers just smacks of the ol’ boys club hanging out in their exclusive - and exclusionary - parlour as always. Even more so when contrasted to the quick rerouting to MMD when a consumer asks for help choosing a specific lab grown stone.

C’mon folks. Especially the professionals who are contributing here. PS is supposed to be a community. Which includes the LGD forum. Act like it.

I have reported the original post to request that this thread be moved to MMD.

Another perspective is that we are not saying that no one ever got a 2 carat LB diamond, but rather that those diamonds sold out so quickly, it is likely that the goal was to make a few sales at the $1600 price point for the purpose of undercutting other LGD vendors, rather than to make money at that price point. Intentionally lose money in the short term for the purpose of driving other vendors out of business.

I agree with the sentiment that there do not need to be separate forums for lab grown v. Earth grown.
 

oceanblue

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jun 14, 2020
Messages
231
Plenty of PSers have bought and received their 2ct Lightbox stones. There's a whole thread on it right here in MMD:

The fact that the above thread was apparently completely missed in this thread tells me a lot. I'm sure it would tell the MMD regulars a lot too, if they cared about RT at all. Which they mostly don't - and why would they? They're getting the message that their interests and activities are of little consequence here loud and clear.

Ha, ha. Me thinks the content and placement of DeBeers blogs has a lot to do with their advertisement agreement with PS, just a thought though.
 

mwilliamanderson

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Aug 13, 2013
Messages
1,221
Very interesting article @John Pollard! I enjoyed reading about the history of DeBeers over the years. We can say a lot about the DeBeers of the past, but it seems to me, they have been listening to someone.

You make an interesting point @yssie. I spend time in MMD and I'm always saddened by how little love is shown in the SMTB thread there. The rings are just as beautiful as they are in the mainstream thread! Often, threads there seem to get as many views, but not as many comments. Is it fear of being associated with MMD? I notice there are far fewer comments from professionals on the threads there as well.

In the last weeks, we've seen HPDiamonds close, we've seen LB release some very nice large diamonds and just yesterday they have released their finest. We might not know the proportions, but they look good to my eye. I feel like the rug has been pulled out from under us all. Obviously the industry will need to adjust and Pricesope will too. The time has come to stop holding our noses at the mention of LG diamonds. If I was strictly a natural diamond seller, I think I'd be starting to hatch a back up plan at this point. Time will tell.

As an aside. I clicked on a 1ct loose diamond on LB yesterday and it said "Made in India".
 

FL_runner

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Aug 23, 2020
Messages
1,519
There are currently 2ct stones in pendants, although loose are still showing sold out.

I think they are going for two sub-groups of consumers with the standard and finest lines, and are undercutting competitors in each of the categories. It will be really interesting to see what happens over the next few years with the LGD market…
 

AprilBaby

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jul 17, 2008
Messages
13,301
Very interesting article @John Pollard! I enjoyed reading about the history of DeBeers over the years. We can say a lot about the DeBeers of the past, but it seems to me, they have been listening to someone.

You make an interesting point @yssie. I spend time in MMD and I'm always saddened by how little love is shown in the SMTB thread there. The rings are just as beautiful as they are in the mainstream thread! Often, threads there seem to get as many views, but not as many comments. Is it fear of being associated with MMD? I notice there are far fewer comments from professionals on the threads there as well.

In the last weeks, we've seen HPDiamonds close, we've seen LB release some very nice large diamonds and just yesterday they have released their finest. We might not know the proportions, but they look good to my eye. I feel like the rug has been pulled out from under us all. Obviously the industry will need to adjust and Pricesope will too. The time has come to stop holding our noses at the mention of LG diamonds. If I was strictly a natural diamond seller, I think I'd be starting to hatch a back up plan at this point. Time will tell.

As an aside. I clicked on a 1ct loose diamond on LB yesterday and it said "Made in India".

I think they are Made in Oregon and cut in India.
 

Karl_K

Super_Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Aug 4, 2008
Messages
14,978
I notice there are far fewer comments from professionals on the threads there as well.
I have no problems answering technical questions on mmd or mined or pretty much anything else. If I dont know the answer I can often find someone who does if its something other than diamond.
Its pretty much force of habit just to check RT and hangout these days but if anyone on any subforum wants/needs my help they can @Karl_K me.
 

mwilliamanderson

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Aug 13, 2013
Messages
1,221
I have no problems answering technical questions on mmd or mined or pretty much anything else. If I dont know the answer I can often find someone who does if its something other than diamond.
Its pretty much force of habit just to check RT and hangout these days but if anyone on any subforum wants/needs my help they can @Karl_K me.

Thanks @Karl_K . I appreciate you saying that!
 

vintageloves

Shiny_Rock
Joined
May 30, 2013
Messages
473
I have been hearing that Lightbox is just an operation to undercut lab and not serious about selling products since before Lightbox launched. And then industry insiders said the 1ct pieces were bait and only the smaller sizes were being shipped. As I had one of those 1ct pieces, that was kind of a laugh. Now I have one of the 2 ct stones that they aren’t “really” selling.

In that time, the not serious Lightbox has only expanded into more shapes, bigger sizes, loose stones, higher quality options and 14k gold pieces (the originals were silver only). They are moving in the opposite direction that people predcited.

At a certain point, it needs to click that Lightbox is serious and here to stay.
 

Garry H (Cut Nut)

Super_Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Aug 15, 2000
Messages
18,559
I have been hearing that Lightbox is just an operation to undercut lab and not serious about selling products since before Lightbox launched. And then industry insiders said the 1ct pieces were bait and only the smaller sizes were being shipped. As I had one of those 1ct pieces, that was kind of a laugh. Now I have one of the 2 ct stones that they aren’t “really” selling.

In that time, the not serious Lightbox has only expanded into more shapes, bigger sizes, loose stones, higher quality options and 14k gold pieces (the originals were silver only). They are moving in the opposite direction that people predcited.

At a certain point, it needs to click that Lightbox is serious and here to stay
I agree Vintage
1. De Beers are the largest or close to it industrial abrasives and high tech synthetic diamond producers - have been for 65 years.
2. They to scientists and heaps of patents via Maidenhead / Cambridge Uni
3. The cost of rough from Asia and South East Asia is falling
4. I dont believe the rest of the world including the USA (MINUS LightBox) produces even 20% of the rough.

The margins are on each step are currently high and only have one way to go - falling
 

oncrutchesrightnow

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Apr 17, 2006
Messages
2,920
Another idea is that they had one strategy and then a backup strategy. And continue to do so
 

distracts

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Oct 11, 2011
Messages
6,144
Another idea is that they had one strategy and then a backup strategy. And continue to do so

Yeah, I think DeBeers is fine with any combination of:

1. Becoming the biggest player in the lab diamond world for consumers
2. If not the biggest, at least having a large amount of the market share and a good reputation
3. Tanking lab diamond prices (and their competitors' margins)
4. Positioning lab diamonds as costume jewelry
5. Positioning lab diamonds as replacements for mined diamonds in every way, as long as they're a major player

They're really covering every eventuality by being heavily invested in both mined AND lab diamonds. They probably have multiple scenarios mapped out. I think the releasing of the larger sizes and the loose stones is because that's what the market wants, and DeBeers is happy to give them what they want at the best price as it sets DeBeers up better for future profits, no matter the eventual outcome.
 

sparklyshrink

Shiny_Rock
Joined
May 5, 2020
Messages
200
Another perspective is that we are not saying that no one ever got a 2 carat LB diamond, but rather that those diamonds sold out so quickly, it is likely that the goal was to make a few sales at the $1600 price point for the purpose of undercutting other LGD vendors, rather than to make money at that price point. Intentionally lose money in the short term for the purpose of driving other vendors out of business.

I agree with the sentiment that there do not need to be separate forums for lab grown v. Earth grown.

I feel like this is a tone deaf reply. Lightbox has been charging 800/carat from day one. There is no indication that they intend to only make a 'few' sales at the 1600 price point whatsoever for 2 carats. I really think this whole forum would benefit from allowing conversations about MMD in the other forums, if to at least stop all the group-think/quasi-conspiratorial hogwash.
 
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distracts

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Oct 11, 2011
Messages
6,144
I feel like this is a tone deaf reply. Lightbox has been charging 800/carat from day one. There is indication that they intend to only make a 'few' sales at the 1600 price point whatsoever for 2 carats. I really think this whole forum would benefit from allowing conversations about MMD in the other forums, if to at least stop all the group-think/quasi-conspiratorial hogwash.

Yeah... I think the most likely MAIN reason why LB 2 ct stones and loose stones dropped when they did is that the holidays are coming up. LB wanted to create buzz about their brand right before people make their Christmas lists/plan Christmas purchases! That it affects other vendors is a nice side-effect, but I suspect it was more about their own branding than anything else. I know I went from not thinking about LB to putting a LB 2 ct diamond on my Christmas list. I wouldn't be surprised if there's at least one more drop of two-carat loose stones before Christmas, and possibly more than one drop.
 

sparklyshrink

Shiny_Rock
Joined
May 5, 2020
Messages
200
Yeah... I think the most likely MAIN reason why LB 2 ct stones and loose stones dropped when they did is that the holidays are coming up. LB wanted to create buzz about their brand right before people make their Christmas lists/plan Christmas purchases! That it affects other vendors is a nice side-effect, but I suspect it was more about their own branding than anything else. I know I went from not thinking about LB to putting a LB 2 ct diamond on my Christmas list. I wouldn't be surprised if there's at least one more drop of two-carat loose stones before Christmas, and possibly more than one drop.

lol they dropped today! there's 2 carats loose right now. That's why I'm saying all the remarks about them not actually existing are ridiculous.

 

distracts

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Oct 11, 2011
Messages
6,144
lol they dropped today! there's 2 carats loose right now. That's why I'm saying all the remarks about them not actually existing are ridiculous.


omg thanks for replying to me with that because now I've ordered one, lol
 

distracts

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Oct 11, 2011
Messages
6,144
lol they dropped today! there's 2 carats loose right now. That's why I'm saying all the remarks about them not actually existing are ridiculous.


And yeah, that further points to drops that sell out being a specific marketing strategy rather than due to things not actually existing. This is a classic "artificial scarcity drives demand" strategy.

 
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