Too much Diamond Info - need help w/ selection!!

[DiamondDumbie]

OK… I am one of those. One of those men that want to surprise his girlfriend with an engagement ring. Yet… One of those men who knows nothing about diamonds.

However, I am now One of those men has learned sooooo much from reading, reading and reading some more from this website. Unfortunately, this website now has me doubting myself. I would appreciate any personal assistance you can and or may provide.

First, I found a brand diamond at a local retail store. (Tycoon Diamond) It has always caught my eye and knowing my girlfriend the way I do, I am confident she will be thrilled with it too. It is subtle, elegant and beautiful. She is not a “jewelry girl”, meaning she wears ear rings and occasionally wears necklaces. She is not a ring person per say so a solitaire Tycoon Diamond with a nice platinum band is ideal for her.

As I was looking at retail diamonds and reading almost everything available on this site, I now doubt myself because my favorite diamond is a brand stone from a department retail store. It is not about the money with me because she deserves so much more. At the same time, I do have a small issue with paying more for a brand diamond at high end retail store, if I can get her so much more at a better value or for the same cost.

This is my dilemma. I still do not feel confident enough about buying a diamond because there are too many options and too much information, so I feel like my head is starting to spin. At this point, I have analyzed until becoming paralyzed about this decision.

Therefore, I will start with these two questions so hopefully someone can shed some light and perhaps my sanity will return.

Tycoon “emerald shape” Diamond
GIA – Feb 2007
2.01 ct, H, Si1
8.81 x 5.86 x 4.07 - Measurements
Polish – Very Good, Symmetry – Good, Florescence – None
Very Thin – Extremely Thick, 77 % Table and 69.5% Depth

Diamond is $21,200 (total is @ $24,500 with the platinum band and taxes)

Is this Tycoon Diamond reasonable priced?
Is it really worth the extra money for a brand diamond?
Is it really worth the extra money to feel some comfort from a retail store?

My gut says buy the Tycoon Diamond. However, it is not like I am buying a car or something with familiarity. Based on a car analogy, I do not want to be buying my girlfriend an overpriced Ford Pinto at a really nice car dealership who has sold me on the idea we are getting a high-end sports car!! In reality, I could have purchased a Mercedes for the same price they sold me the Ford Pinto.

Thank you in advance for your thoughts, suggestions and or comments!!

 

[Lorelei]

Welcome!

I quickly Googled the Tycoon diamond assuming it was a branded cut, it looks nice, but to my taste, a traditional EC is more attractive, but it depends on what your GF loves! I would be careful in an SI1 grade looking at the faceting, make sure your diamond is eyeclean, in that size with that cut you need to look carefully. Likewise make sure an H is white enough for you ( should be.) Or you can work with online vendors such as Good old Gold, Whiteflash, Engagement Rings Direct etc and perhaps get more for your money and use their expertise to find you a lovely EC or Radiant.

Also it depends on what you mean by comfort with going with a department store - paying more because of this? What do they offer you, a trade up policy and if so, what are the terms for example? Perhaps have a look at what some online vendors have to offer before pulling the trigger, you have a lovely budget and could get a stunning diamond for it just to see what else is out there, but be sure that this Tycoon cut is what your GF will love and importantly for years to come, in case she might prefer something different.

 

[chrono]

Just throwing this out to others who are more knowledgeable on the Tycoon Diamonds; isn't the Tycoon Diamonds a specialty cut too, not just a branded diamond? I think if it is a branded specialty cut, then it cannot be replicated elsewhere due to patent issues. The TD is a very different look from an Emerald Cut.

DD,
Do you know if your GF/FF likes this type of look? It is a rectangular stone but different from the step cut of an EC. If so, I'd say it is a very unique cut which I don't think you can purchase/find elsewhere. There is always a premium for a branded specialty cut and whether you think the markup is worth it is ultimately up to you.

 

[Regular Guy]

If you like Emerald, I''d choose this one first.

See below my signature for other ideas.

Relax and welcome!

 

[Kaleigh]

Date: 7/9/2007 2:18:56 PM
Author: Chrono
Just throwing this out to others who are more knowledgeable on the Tycoon Diamonds; isn''t the Tycoon Diamonds a specialty cut too, not just a branded diamond? I think if it is a branded specialty cut, then it cannot be replicated elsewhere due to patent issues.

That''s my understanding as well.

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 7/9/2007 2:18:56 PM
Author: Chrono
Just throwing this out to others who are more knowledgeable on the Tycoon Diamonds; isn't the Tycoon Diamonds a specialty cut too, not just a branded diamond? I think if it is a branded specialty cut, then it cannot be replicated elsewhere due to patent issues. The TD is a very different look from an Emerald Cut.

DD,
Do you know if your GF/FF likes this type of look? It is a rectangular stone but different from the step cut of an EC. If so, I'd say it is a very unique cut which I don't think you can purchase/find elsewhere. There is always a premium for a branded specialty cut and whether you think the markup is worth it is ultimately up to you.

Hehehe... found this site from a very old PS thread, here you go Chronie

http://www.tycoonjewels.com/

Ira - that is a stunning EC you linked.

 

[belle]

Date: 7/9/2007 2:09:38 PM
Author:DiamondDumbie



Is this Tycoon Diamond reasonable priced?

well, that is up to you. ....'reasonable priced' is in the eye of the pocketbook holder.

a regular emerald cut of the same color/clarity would be around 12-15k for comparison. it seems to be priced in line with what one would expect to pay for a branded stone from a retail store.

Is it really worth the extra money for a brand diamond?

it sure can be. it is a personal decision though.

Is it really worth the extra money to feel some comfort from a retail store?

i'm going to sound like an unhelpful broken record, but yes, it can be. for example, cut quality is important to me so i will pay more for a well cut diamond. i know i can find other diamonds for less money but a good cut is important, so i make it a priority. you just need to decide what is a priority for you and make sure you are comfortable with your purchase. whatever that takes.

 

[chrono]

Date: 7/9/2007 2:20:23 PM
Author: Regular Guy
If you like Emerald, I''d choose this one first.

See below my signature for other ideas.

Relax and welcome!

Storm and I recently dissuaded another PSer from this EC. The table is huge at 72% and coupled with a low crown height at 9.7%. Both these stats made us pause and speculate that this could be a glassy and brilliant stone rather than the fiery type that we both love.

 

[Hest88]

Do you need to totally surprise her? Can you slip a picture to her or ask a sister/girlfriend to show her a picture to see if she loves the Tycoon enough to have you pay a premium? I think if she adores it you have little choice, but if she''s okay with something like an emerald cut (*my* favorite standard shape

), then you can save quite a bit of money or get bigger bang for your dollars.

 

[Regular Guy]

Date: 7/9/2007 2:20:23 PM
Author: Regular Guy
If you like Emerald, I''d choose this one first.

Correcting self...

There are 3 strong reasons to like the selection I quickly picked up off the search by cut db.

- better color
- less expensive
- selected by a) a recognized expert for selecting diamonds, who has b) a host of resources for testing their brilliance.

But...there may be lots of reasons magnetizing you to this one you''re talking about...and you may have a subconscious relationship with the store you''d like to make into a reality.

To do due diligence...Jonathan at GOG give you 30 days. Consider just ordering it and comparing. If you can''t tell the difference at worst...maybe your guy will knock of $5K to get your business. Either way, he''ll know you''re trying, and you have a relationship with him for the future for the effort. Maybe he''ll even get you the setting.

Just some ideas.

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 7/9/2007 2:30:45 PM
Author: Chrono

Date: 7/9/2007 2:20:23 PM
Author: Regular Guy
If you like Emerald, I'd choose this one first.

See below my signature for other ideas.

Relax and welcome!

Storm and I recently dissuaded another PSer from this EC. The table is huge at 72% and coupled with a low crown height at 9.7%. Both these stats made us pause and speculate that this could be a glassy and brilliant stone rather than the fiery type that we both love.

That is a shame as it looks lovely in the pics and GOG have given it lifetime trade up too. Maybe it looks better than the numbers indicate in real life, also as Jon does have a good eye it might be worth consideration.

 

[Regular Guy]

Date: 7/9/2007 2:30:45 PM
Author: Chrono

Date: 7/9/2007 2:20:23 PM
Author: Regular Guy
If you like Emerald, I''d choose this one first.

See below my signature for other ideas.

Relax and welcome!

Storm and I recently dissuaded another PSer from this EC. The table is huge at 72% and coupled with a low crown height at 9.7%. Both these stats made us pause and speculate that this could be a glassy and brilliant stone rather than the fiery type that we both love.

Oops...just saw these comments. You may want to consult with Jonathan, anyway. He''s good at non-rounds, and may have advice.

 

[poshpepper]

I have never seen that cut before, it is very unique. I actually really like it (from the pictures).
Like some others have said, make sure your gf likes this cut of diamond before committing to purchase it.
And I also agree with belle on her points.

 

[diagem]

Date: 7/9/2007 2:09:38 PM
Author:DiamondDumbie

OK… I am one of those. One of those men that want to surprise his girlfriend with an engagement ring. Yet… One of those men who knows nothing about diamonds.

However, I am now One of those men has learned sooooo much from reading, reading and reading some more from this website. Unfortunately, this website now has me doubting myself. I would appreciate any personal assistance you can and or may provide.

First, I found a brand diamond at a local retail store. (Tycoon Diamond) It has always caught my eye and knowing my girlfriend the way I do, I am confident she will be thrilled with it too. It is subtle, elegant and beautiful. She is not a “jewelry girl”, meaning she wears ear rings and occasionally wears necklaces. She is not a ring person per say so a solitaire Tycoon Diamond with a nice platinum band is ideal for her.

Since the Tycoon Diamond is an out-of-the-ordinary cut incorporating a unique look that you dont find in standard Diamond cuts, you will need to make sure (certain!!) your gf would like and appreciate that look!

As I was looking at retail diamonds and reading almost everything available on this site, I now doubt myself because my favorite diamond is a brand stone from a department retail store. It is not about the money with me because she deserves so much more. At the same time, I do have a small issue with paying more for a brand diamond at high end retail store, if I can get her so much more at a better value or for the same cost.

This is my dilemma. I still do not feel confident enough about buying a diamond because there are too many options and too much information, so I feel like my head is starting to spin. At this point, I have analyzed until becoming paralyzed about this decision.

Therefore, I will start with these two questions so hopefully someone can shed some light and perhaps my sanity will return.

Tycoon “emerald shape” Diamond
GIA – Feb 2007
2.01 ct, H, Si1
8.81 x 5.86 x 4.07 - Measurements
Polish – Very Good, Symmetry – Good, Florescence – None
Very Thin – Extremely Thick, 77 % Table and 69.5% Depth
All this info. does not mean anything as it is proprietors info for this cut only.

Diamond is $21,200 (total is @ $24,500 with the platinum band and taxes)

Is this Tycoon Diamond reasonable priced? Hard to point a ''reasonable price'' on a unique Diamond
Is it really worth the extra money for a brand diamond? If you like this look... answer is yes.
Is it really worth the extra money to feel some comfort from a retail store? If you prefer the B&M experience, yes.

My gut says buy the Tycoon Diamond. However, it is not like I am buying a car or something with familiarity. Based on a car analogy, I do not want to be buying my girlfriend an overpriced Ford Pinto at a really nice car dealership who has sold me on the idea we are getting a high-end sports car!! In reality, I could have purchased a Mercedes for the same price they sold me the Ford Pinto.

Thank you in advance for your thoughts, suggestions and or comments!!

One thing is for certain..., you cant compare this cut to a common Emerald Cut as its is nowhere near in looks.
The closest cut I can point out to you (but also extremely hard to locate) is the French-Cut.

Good luck,

 

[Lorelei]

DiaGem, I found this link with French Cut diamonds, are these what you mean? They do look similar to the Tyc.

http://www.langantiques.com/detail/110-1-805.html

 

[Regular Guy]

Poshpepper for encouraging me to review...

Date: 7/9/2007 2:27:33 PM
Author: belle


well, that is up to you. ....'reasonable priced' is in the eye of the pocketbook holder.

a regular emerald cut of the same color/clarity would be around 12-15k for comparison. it seems to be priced in line with what one would expect to pay for a branded stone from a retail store.

Belle, good observation. That is quite a disparity. I don't know non-rounds so well. Review further.

Regards,

 

[diagem]

Date: 7/9/2007 2:59:20 PM
Author: Lorelei
DiaGem, I found this link with French Cut diamonds, are these what you mean? They do look similar to the Tyc.

http://www.langantiques.com/detail/110-1-805.html

Yes, these are one type of French-Cuts...
But I mean this type:

 

[DiamondDumbie]

Tycoon''s website...
http://www.tycoondiamond.com/



This picture is a very similar Tycoon Diamond and ring. This gives you an idea of what I am looking at.

Thank you again for your comments. They are truly appreciated and needed.

Tycoon “emerald shape” Diamond
GIA – Feb 2007
2.01 ct, H, Si1
8.81 x 5.86 x 4.07 - Measurements
Polish – Very Good, Symmetry – Good, Florescence – None
Very Thin – Extremely Thick, 77 % Table and 69.5% Depth

Diamond is $21,200 (total is @ $24,500 with the platinum band and taxes)

 

[diagem]

Date: 7/9/2007 3:10:50 PM
Author: DiamondDumbie


Tycoon''s website...
http://www.tycoondiamond.com/



This picture is a very similar Tycoon Diamond and ring. This gives you an idea of what I am looking at.

Thank you again for your comments. They are truly appreciated and needed.

Tycoon “emerald shape” Diamond
GIA – Feb 2007
2.01 ct, H, Si1
8.81 x 5.86 x 4.07 - Measurements
Polish – Very Good, Symmetry – Good, Florescence – None
Very Thin – Extremely Thick, 77 % Table and 69.5% DepthSince the Tycoon Cut is a bad cut for hiding inclusions..., you have got to make sure the SI1 clarity is "eyeclean"!!!


Diamond is $21,200 (total is @ $24,500 with the platinum band and taxes)

 

[Lorelei]

WOW - I like that style DiaGem, thanks for posting that!

 

[DiamondDumbie]

Date: 7/9/2007 2:18:56 PM
Author: Chrono
Just throwing this out to others who are more knowledgeable on the Tycoon Diamonds; isn''t the Tycoon Diamonds a specialty cut too, not just a branded diamond? I think if it is a branded specialty cut, then it cannot be replicated elsewhere due to patent issues. The TD is a very different look from an Emerald Cut.

DD,
Do you know if your GF/FF likes this type of look? It is a rectangular stone but different from the step cut of an EC. If so, I''d say it is a very unique cut which I don''t think you can purchase/find elsewhere. There is always a premium for a branded specialty cut and whether you think the markup is worth it is ultimately up to you.

First of all, thank you for your input!!

Yes, Tycoon diamonds are a specialty cut with a patent.

No, I do not know for sure if my girl friend likes the Tycoon diamond. I do know she likes the solitaire engagement rings with a unique diamond. However, we were talking about Princess cut diamonds as being unique to the more common Round cut diamonds. I am 99.999% confident my girl friend will like the engagement ring even if it had a Round, Princess, Emerald, Tycoon diamond or any other style diamond, as long as the ring is subtle, classy yet beautiful (similar to the picture I attached).

My dilemma really comes down to how comfortable I am with my “diamond purchase”, since this is uncharted territory.

My safety net is this retail store also offers a few other perks that I understand may or may not always be available with other diamond suppliers (stores, online, etc).

This retail store (who has the best reputation in town) will let us return the diamond and ring within 30 days for a full refund. Therefore, I can always surprise her and see what she thinks afterwards. She will tell me if she wants to look at others.

This retail store will apply the purchase price towards another purchase that is made at any later date (trade-in / buy bigger). Now I need to verify if they will apply a market price versus a purchase price, if ten or fifteen years from now the same diamond market price is higher than the original purchase price. I would bet it remains the purchase price, but I do not know for sure.

This retail store will also replace the diamond if it is damaged within the first year.

 

[DiamondDumbie]

Date: 7/9/2007 2:30:45 PM
Author: Chrono

Date: 7/9/2007 2:20:23 PM
Author: Regular Guy
If you like Emerald, I''d choose this one first.

See below my signature for other ideas.

Relax and welcome!

Is it really worth the extra money to feel some comfort from a retail store?

i''m going to sound like an unhelpful broken record, but yes, it can be. for example, cut quality is important to me so i will pay more for a well cut diamond. i know i can find other diamonds for less money but a good cut is important, so i make it a priority. you just need to decide what is a priority for you and make sure you are comfortable with your purchase. whatever that takes.

Cut Quality is one of the biggest issues for me.

What is the best way to determine if the Cut Quality is Ideal? The GIA reports do a horrible job with this area even though most people (eventually) understand this is the most important "C" to consider.

I have read about the Scope, etc. However, I am not sure that is the best means to determine Cut Quality. I prefer the reports that come with some Diamonds that include the Cut Quality images and results. Is this available if I requested it from the retail store? Or is this an unusual request? After all, the retail store says a free appraisal is included.

 

[Lorelei]

With something like the Tycoon we don't know anything about this cut, so would not be able to advise you as consumers. Rounds are easier to judge for cut as there are proven proportions and combinations which can lead to reasonably predictable standards of performance, fancy cuts are another kettle of fish, numbers give you a place to start but they really need evaluating by your own eyes. Certain technologies such as Idealscope Images, ASET etc are useful to help evaluate fancies and some online vendors use these. What is considered to be Ideal for cut quality can be reasonably straightforward for a round diamond, with fancies it can be a subject of great and continuous debate. I would research the Tycoon as much as you can, not only so you know that you are picking the best example of this cut you can get, but also because in my opinion, it can add interest and enjoyment in owning such a piece, if that is the way you decide to go. Whether any of the technologies would be useful in evaluating this Tycoon diamond are debatable.

 

[chrono]

Date: 7/9/2007 3:52:24 PM
Author: DiamondDumbie

This retail store (who has the best reputation in town) will let us return the diamond and ring within 30 days for a full refund. Therefore, I can always surprise her and see what she thinks afterwards. She will tell me if she wants to look at others.
Many online stores like Whiteflash, GOG, SignedPieces, etc offer full refunds as well, depending upon the stores, some offer a 30 day guarantee, others just 14 days, no questions asked at no added cost.

This retail store will apply the purchase price towards another purchase that is made at any later date (trade-in / buy bigger). Now I need to verify if they will apply a market price versus a purchase price, if ten or fifteen years from now the same diamond market price is higher than the original purchase price. I would bet it remains the purchase price, but I do not know for sure.
Many reputable online stores also offer this same option at no added cost.

This retail store will also replace the diamond if it is damaged within the first year.
This is a new one! Does it matter who damaged it and how it was damaged?

 

[DiamondDumbie]

Date: 7/9/2007 3:17:39 PM
Author: DiaGem

Date: 7/9/2007 3:10:50 PM
Author: DiamondDumbie



Tycoon''s website...
http://www.tycoondiamond.com/



This picture is a very similar Tycoon Diamond and ring. This gives you an idea of what I am looking at.

Thank you again for your comments. They are truly appreciated and needed.

Tycoon “emerald shape” Diamond
GIA – Feb 2007
2.01 ct, H, Si1
8.81 x 5.86 x 4.07 - Measurements
Polish – Very Good, Symmetry – Good, Florescence – None
Very Thin – Extremely Thick, 77 % Table and 69.5% DepthSince the Tycoon Cut is a bad cut for hiding inclusions..., you have got to make sure the SI1 clarity is ''eyeclean''!!!



Diamond is $21,200 (total is @ $24,500 with the platinum band and taxes)

Thank you for the recommendation! Fortunately, the inclusions were the first thing I noticed about the Tycoon Cut. The retail store actually had four Tycoon Diamonds around the same criteria. They had a 2.02 E-Si2 that was the same price as this one. The color was marginal but I prefered the better color (E versus H). However, the Si2 inclusions were visable to the naked eye (even from about 1.5 feet away). Therefore, I am considering the H - Si1 because you cannot see any inclusions with the naked eye. This was very important, especially when I considered the H color was not that obvious unless the E colored diamond was righ next to it. I prefer finding a Tycoon diamond with E-F color and Si1, but the Tycoon diamonds are not easy to find.

 

[DiamondDumbie]

Date: 7/9/2007 4:07:01 PM
Author: Chrono

Date: 7/9/2007 3:52:24 PM
Author: DiamondDumbie


This retail store (who has the best reputation in town) will let us return the diamond and ring within 30 days for a full refund. Therefore, I can always surprise her and see what she thinks afterwards. She will tell me if she wants to look at others.
Many online stores like Whiteflash, GOG, SignedPieces, etc offer full refunds as well, depending upon the stores, some offer a 30 day guarantee, others just 14 days, no questions asked at no added cost.


This retail store will apply the purchase price towards another purchase that is made at any later date (trade-in / buy bigger). Now I need to verify if they will apply a market price versus a purchase price, if ten or fifteen years from now the same diamond market price is higher than the original purchase price. I would bet it remains the purchase price, but I do not know for sure.
Many reputable online stores also offer this same option at no added cost.


This retail store will also replace the diamond if it is damaged within the first year.
This is a new one! Does it matter who damaged it and how it was damaged?

This is on their website and it was also explained to me. I need to get the fine print, because I am sure there is more to it than this. However, I will say, their reputation is outstanding in this city. I replaced the store name because I am not positive on the rules with this website. I realize this is not advertising but it is easier to be certain I am not breaking any rules.

Because of our commitment to your satisfaction, we offer you the (Store Name) Promise. If your diamond is damaged in your first year of ownership, we will replace it at no cost to you with the return of the damaged diamond. The plan includes free cleaning and inspection for as long as you own your diamond. (Store Name) also offers a special trade-in policy and a permanent record of your purchase. More good reasons to buy your diamond at (Store Name) Jewelers.

 

[chrono]

I have heard of such fancy replacement warranties from the normal mall stores where the fine print requires that the stone be brought back to them for rechecking every 6 months. Should THEIR paperwork for these regular checkups go missing or the diamond owner being 1 day late from the 6 months date, the warranty then becomes void. Crazy but true. I just wanted you to be aware of it.

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 7/9/2007 4:23:37 PM
Author: Chrono
I have heard of such fancy replacement warranties from the normal mall stores where the fine print requires that the stone be brought back to them for rechecking every 6 months. Should THEIR paperwork for these regular checkups go missing or the diamond owner being 1 day late from the 6 months date, the warranty then becomes void. Crazy but true. I just wanted you to be aware of it.

Good points - do check carefully to make sure.

 

[DiamondDumbie]

Date: 7/9/2007 4:05:45 PM
Author: Lorelei
With something like the Tycoon we don''t know anything about this cut, so would not be able to advise you as consumers. Rounds are easier to judge for cut as there are proven proportions and combinations which can lead to reasonably predictable standards of performance, fancy cuts are another kettle of fish, numbers give you a place to start but they really need evaluating by your own eyes. Certain technologies such as Idealscope Images, ASET etc are useful to help evaluate fancies and some online vendors use these. What is considered to be Ideal for cut quality can be reasonably straightforward for a round diamond, with fancies it can be a subject of great and continuous debate. I would research the Tycoon as much as you can, not only so you know that you are picking the best example of this cut you can get, but also because in my opinion, it can add interest and enjoyment in owning such a piece, if that is the way you decide to go. Whether any of the technologies would be useful in evaluating this Tycoon diamond are debatable.

I just noticed your avatar image of a cat pulling the toilet paper offer the roll. Since we are talking about my girlfriend, you will get a kick out of this. Her cat does this every time we ignore him for the day. And we go out of town; her cat will pull the toilet paper completely off every roll in every washroom!!

I will ask the store if they provide or can provide a report and image of the cut quality. This is a must.

 

[belle]

Date: 7/9/2007 4:23:37 PM
Author: Chrono
I have heard of such fancy replacement warranties from the normal mall stores where the fine print requires that the stone be brought back to them for rechecking every 6 months. Should THEIR paperwork for these regular checkups go missing or the diamond owner being 1 day late from the 6 months date, the warranty then becomes void. Crazy but true. I just wanted you to be aware of it.

yes, as chrono mentioned, there are usually requirements that must be fulfilled on your part for the warranty to be honored. also, keep in mind that the $$$ premium that you are paying upfront by going with a more expensive b&m experience (as opposed to a reputable online vendor) is still more than what you would pay to have the ring insured through your own insurance company.