Tiffany''s Evaluation?

[FirstTime]

I am just starting to look for an engagement ring to propose in late April. I want to do it right and realize that the blue box (or whatever it is) screams quality. Is Tiffany''s price range comparable to diamonds and settings found elsewhere?

Thanks in advance for your input to this retail novice!

 

[MichelleCarmen]

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On 1/22/2004 8:45:44 PM FirstTime wrote:

I am just starting to look for an engagement ring to propose in late April. I want to do it right and realize that the blue box (or whatever it is) screams quality. Is Tiffany's price range comparable to diamonds and settings found elsewhere?

Thanks in advance for your input to this retail novice!----------------

Hi,

Do a search on Tiffany & Co. here on PS. There are tons of discussions about Tiffany & Co. and the more you read the more you'll see that it's in strong belief that Tiffany diamonds are no better than many other diamonds and you're basically paying a huge premium to have the Tiffany brand stamped on the inside of your ring.

Also, do an extensive search on H&A and Hearts and Arrows diamonds. READ all you can about diamond cut! A well cut diamond is what screams quality, not a Tiffany box.

Michelle

 

[hoorray]

MichelleCarmen is spot on about doing some research here. You'll get up to speed pretty quickly.

Just a comment on Tiffany's pricing, I recently tried on 1.31 tcw (that's 2 x.65 diamonds)H VS1 earring studs. The sales rep counldn't give me any cut details, but they were probably decent at least -- probably not super ideal or H&A. They were $10,600. I could find equal or better online for $4000 - 5,000 easily.

 

[aljdewey]

Ha.....I guess it all depends on interpretation.




To me, the blue box screams "overpriced".....but I've been known to hear "different" voices....hehehehe

 

[mike04456]

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On 1/22/2004 8:45:44 PM FirstTime wrote:





Is Tiffany's price range comparable to diamonds and settings found elsewhere?

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Tiffany's quality and prices are comparable to other high-end jewelers, where you typically see a significant mark-up. Compared to mid-range "mall" jewelers, you will often see a similar markup, but the quality is usually a lot lower. Compared to internet diamonds, the quality is no better than the "premium" outfits but the prices are much higher. If you're just starting out, take your time and do your research--you'll find that, while Tiffany's is a good place for high-quality diamonds and jewelry, they are far from the only place to get it, and you can usually do far better than their prices.

 

[Mara]

Hee Hee that's funny. To me the blue box screams I bought this box at eBay for $1.00 (which I have done!)...

The blue box don't scream nothin' but lots of money flowing out of your pockets. Definitely read up on Tiff threads. Everyone has a strong opinion and Tiffany threads tend to get rather heated!

Lastly, Tiffany diamonds are going to be about 40% MORE than a typical excellent cut H&A stone. And you don't even get the guarantee of H&A excellently cut from Tiffany like you would with another stone.




For some people, money is not the issue. But personally, I would want my fiance doing the homework, figuring out what is best for him and knowing ALL the options, then taking the best road for him. If that is Tiffany, fine...but chances are in the education process you will learn enough about diamonds to realize that there are other options out there that are just as beautiful (same stones even), and less money...AND you can build a custom setting or similar that really speaks from the heart.




Disclaimer: I am not a Tiffany engagement ring fan.

I do however buy other jewelry there, so I am by no means a Tiffany-hater...

 

[sumi]

To me, the blue box means more than the fact that you paid lots of money for it. The blue box, to me, means that the quality of the craftsmanship will be excellent, the design will be well thought out, and the materials used will be pretty good. You pay a lot of money because the reputation of that design house is so great. There wouldn't be so many people eager to own Tiffany piece if they didn't deliver a great product.

I love Tiffany jewellery, they have really great stuff. That said, my engagement ring/wedding band is not from Tiffany. When the focus of the piece is on the stone itself, as it is in a solitaire, I believe you can get a great stone from just about anywhere. Tiffany has great settings and it's hard to replicate that quality of work. However, Tiffany is not the only place where you can get a great stone. You can get even better stones if you look. However, where the emphasis is on the design/craftsmanship of the piece, and not just on the quality of materials used, Tiffany is hard to beat.

 

[Nicrez]

Tiffany's in a lump sum...same as buying Gucci sneakers. Sure it's cool to have the name, but when it comes to Jewelry, it all has it's worth. I have 5 pieces from Tiffany's, and I love them all. However, an engagement ring is an investment that should refelct the uniqueness and intention of your relationship. If your relationship is based in something real, with real value, than it will take homework on prices, quality and varieties.

My sister has a Tiffany's Lucida 1.25 carat ring. I think it was upwards of $24K or so...I am looking at Radian stones (similar to Lucida) at 2.0 for $16K with better diamond standards that Tiffany's has. Not worth it for US, because we could use the money for a house. If dropping that kind of money on name doesn't bother you, then go for it! But remember, you can always get her Tiffany's later on...My BF gave me a lovely white gold ring from Tiffany's as a birthday gift/promise ring, and we gladly relized that on such an investment as a e-ring, we are DEFINATELY looking for a better investment (and a better rock!)

Also not a fan of TIffany e-ring for sooo many reasons, including their only carring 4 settings, and NO leeway on customization. None. They have certain diamond shapes, not ALL. They are cookie cutter, over-priced and like Burberry's and Coach, everyone has one already, you never see someone gasp at how "unique" it is, because it isn't. They do have other lovely jewelry though!!! Check out white gold rings for a later gift!!!

 

[Mara]

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On 1/23/2004 12:48:40 PM sumi wrote:





To me, the blue box means more than the fact that you paid lots of money for it. The blue box, to me, means that the quality of the craftsmanship will be excellent, the design will be well thought out, and the materials used will be pretty good. You pay a lot of money because the reputation of that design house is so great. There wouldn't be so many people eager to own Tiffany piece if they didn't deliver a great product.

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I don't agree with the quality of craftsmanship guarantees.....Tiffany sells a BRAND. As someone who is inmarketing...I know this field well. Tiffany has brainwashed you into thinking that yes, their blue box means excellent quality, craftsmanship and design...when in reality..OTHERS make Tiffany pieces and Tiffany brands them as their own and sell them for oodles of $$. Yes some are exclusive and very beautiful, I love some pieces and you cannot find them elsewhere..but I don't delude myself into believing that Tiffany means some holy grail of jewelry nirvana. It's just a store, like any other store...with a good reputation. You pay alot of money because YES, the reputation is great...not because of their design house...but because of their perception of quality to a large amount of the general buying public (worldwide).

We had a poster here a few months ago who had a huge cache of Tiffany jewelry from her hubby. She had problems with EVERY PIECE it sounded like!! This guy had spent what seemed like hundreds of thousands at Tiffany and his wife was miserable with her items. She couldn't get good Customer Service to save her life. That is the reality. There is good and there is bad with every company. Paying more DOES NOT always mean better quality OR better service.

Compare to Gucci as others noted, or even LV. I buy LV bags, but not because the company name means quality of craftsmanship. I just like the bags! My fiance thinks they are made of VINYL...which probably 80% of other people do as well which definitely does NOT scream quality of anything....hehee.....but I don't care. I just like the bags and the look, colors, and yes the monograms. Worth it to me to pay more for something like that. A knockoff just won't do. But I know this and freely admit to it.

My point is that...buy Tiffany. Buy LV. Buy whoever you want. But don't delude yourself into thinking that a BRAND NAME means anything but the paper that it is printed on...or the blue box in this instance. There can always be something better gotten for cheaper..in terms of Tiffany it would be a replica of their beautiful pieces, made with superideal melee stones for cheaper. Or it would be a superideal ACA or H&A stone with a dossier a mile long on how great the stone is, rather than just a 'Tiffany' cut stone and setting with a letter from Tiffany saying 'Hey this diamond is great'. There is always better quality, better craftsmanship, better price...elsewhere in a custom-made piece. Buying from a store like Tiffany just means you are buying into the hype. That's fine...we all do it in some area of our lives...just admit to it. If you can't? Then you've been assimilated!!

Tiffany would make an excellent case study in terms of what people's perception of them and then the reality behind the scenes.

Excellent branding case study as well.

Tiffany is always a HOTTTT topic around here...because you have people on different sides of the fence. I always like to say that I am by no means a 'Tiffany-hater'....I love Tiffany stuff for what it represents..a cool piece of jewelry. I don't expect any more or less by paying more...I've got their #.

 

[sumi]

of course you're paying more for the name, everyone knows that. With any brand name, a chunck of the price tag is for name value alone. However, there's a reason why that name can bring in more money than others. Marketing is definitely one part, but quality is another.

I don't think there is any denying that Tiffany does great work. There is a difference between good craftsmanship and good materials. Yes, Tiffany does use good materials. But, that's not the same as saying they use the BEST. Nor is that the same as saying you can't get anything better anywhere else. Their metal work is amazing. Their lines are so fluid and smooth. That is what I mean by good craftsmanship. Their designs are amazing. You are also paying for the design. I'm married to an architect and I know that there is a lot that goes in to the design process. It's not a cheap process, you are paying for the talent behind the design.



*************"You pay alot of money because YES, the reputation is great...not because of their design house...but because of their perception of quality to a large amount of the general buying public (worldwide)." ****************

I think you are misunderstanding what I mean by "design house". This just means, overall, the designers and the whole design process. You've said before that Tiffany has great design. So, it seems we are on the same page on this issue.



I don't think anyone is saying that you can't find comparable quality elsewhere. Tiffany is not the only producer of jewellery that does good work. You can find beautful pieces that are beautifully made at a lot of places, Tiffany just happens to be one of them.

And there is a difference in the craftsmanship of brand name bags vs. others. Again, that's not to say that you can't find a fabulous no-name bag. My mom has bags from Gucci, Fendi, Chanel, Ferragamo, Prada and there is definitely a difference in their construction and the materials. Look at the seams, look at the durable construction, look at the little details. The buckle, the quality of the leather. The design is well thought out by very talented people. Yes, you are paying extra for the name, but you're also paying for a well constructed bag. I would certainly not compare my cheap bags to my mom's nice ones.

 

[mike04456]

I hope we haven't scared FirstTime off.

Tiffany's is a hot-button issue around here in large part because we've had some people come here posting about how they got their g/f's ring at Tiffany because it was the best, etc., the implication being that you can't get that anywhere else, which isn't true.




There is nothing wrong with buying by brand; virtually everyone does it. I myself have a closet full of Polo dress shirts (albeit purchased at Costco for 50% of the dept. store price

). I like them because they are consistently well-made and I like the way they look, but yes, there is the brand cachet there too. An attachment to a brand should be based on actual rather than perceived value, but different people are always going to be attracted to different types of value--and don't forget that many people value being part of some exclusive group, i.e., having a Tiffany & Co., engagement ring.

 

[valeria101]

There's more to Tiffany's jewelry than the name of the brand. The pieces are well designed and made, even the cheaper stuff. On their trademark designs the execution of the pieces is just about as good as it gets. There may be quite a few places where you can get a simple solitaire made as well as the Tiffany's (I would think of a top cuality custom-made ring for that). Finding better diamonds at better prices should be easy (given the markup of the respective house) but it would take a while to find a jeweler crazy enough to reproduce on of the more intricate Tiffany designs. Tiffany's reputation was not made from selling thousands of look-alike engagement rings, some of their profit is though...
If you want to buy a ring commissioned somewhere by the same firm which produced those world-class designs touring the met, why not.

 

[fire&ice]

Just a few *FACTS*

Tiffany does not design their own items. They market them - period. They do not make their own items. They farm that out on the recommendation of the hired designer (elsa peretti for example). My peretti belt w/ fluid silver heart is made in Italy - a manufacturing facility that makes items for many retailers. I am a firm believer in the rumor that Vatche designs & creates Tiffany's e-ring settings.

Save a few designs/commissions & periods, Tiffany always bought from other silver makers. Search their archives - they have code numbers for various makers including Gorham, etc. The only time I can remember when they actually set up shop to create & design is their "Special Hand Work" in the first part of the century. As someone who has handled thousands of silver items, even that venture did not produce the best designs & craftsmanship. And, doesn't command the kind of money that some of the great Chicago makers do.

The Tiffany name does reflect a certain level of quality. But, much more mainstream than their perceived reputation - sadly, now more than in previous decades.

Also, do not confuse Tiffany & Co with Tiffany Studios - two very different firms. Tiffany Studios warrants any reverance sent their way.

 

[Mara]

I also don't have a problem with buying brands...I do it all the time.




But I freely admit I am buying the brand. No perceived value as to what is nebulous and assumed (e.g. great customer service)...actual confirmed values.




Also, as noted...Tiffany doesn't make any of their own stuff. Others do. It's not as though Tiffany sits down and crafts it themselves. So I know I can go elsewhere, get the same thing from a skilled designer who doesn't charge that markup for some idea of grandeur. Then if I really feel like it, I can put my custom piece into the blue box from eBay and get that same warm happy feeling.

I'm so tired of hearing talk about the blue box having some sort of significance, in reality its ALL MENTAL. You're buying a brand. We all do it. Just admit it. /idealbb/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

 

[FirstTime]

WOW!!! Okay, I apologize for starting the same ol' thread that you folks are used to. I read your replies, and researched the other forums and it sounds as if the ladies would greatly appreciate the time, effort, research, and love put into a quality ring much more than that #### blue box.

I sincerely appreciate everyone's input. This is a difficult decision for many of us male diamond novices and everyone had great input, even if it was the same argument.

Thanks again!!!

 

[sumi]

I'm so tired of hearing talk about the blue box having some sort of significance, in reality its ALL MENTAL. You're buying a brand. We all do it. Just admit it. /idealbb/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif
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Actually, when I buy something from Tiffany, I buy it because I think it looks really pretty (which includes good design and good production). I never buy any of their items that prominently have their name displayed on it. I have pieces from Tiffany and I have pieces from other places without a name brand. I buy what I think looks nice. If I like a Tiffany piece, I'm going to buy the real thing instead of having it copied. I don't feel special because I'm wearing a Tiffany piece. I feel special because I'm wearing something that I think looks really pretty that I really like. In fact, I don't even know where I put the little blue box that my pieces came in.

So no, I won't admit that I'm just buying a brand. (Believe me, I was a starving student for most of my adult life so far. You just can not spend money like that when you're a starving grad student

) I will admit that I buy what I think is pretty and that is what makes me happy.

Hey, just out of curiosity...I think we can all agree that Tiffany is controversial around here. Does that also apply to other brand name jewellery stores like VCA, Cartier, Mikimoto, Harry Winston, etc, etc?

 

[mike04456]

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On 1/23/2004 5:25:07 PM sumi wrote:





Hey, just out of curiosity...I think we can all agree that Tiffany is controversial around here. Does that also apply to other brand name jewellery stores like VCA, Cartier, Mikimoto, Harry Winston, etc, etc?

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No, but that's probably only because no one comes through here on a rant about how great HW, Mikimoto, etc., are, even though a lot of the same criticisms could be leveled at them (for example, you can get pearls from the same farms Mikimoto uses at other places for less, though you really have to search).

 

[Nicrez]

First time, a last two cents before you scream in frustration. Consider Tiffany's like a big employer, like GE. Known to recruit top notch engineers with exactling standards for their resume, they do emply others as well...But the caliber of everything at Big names tends to be higher, BECAUSE they are bigger. People want to work for the better name, for it's prestige. Like a brilliant person wanting to teach at Harvard, versus local community college.

Not to say only Harvards and GE's have smart people, it's just a bit of a find to get those people elsewhere. Same with jewelers. Many talented diamond cutters, sellers, and jewelery makers out there who have not been "snatched up" by Tiffany's, Bailey Banks & Biddle, Harry Winston's, etc...or they just want to work for themselves. By the way Movado is dealing in stones now and carry diamonds with a "patented" extra facet stone (but they are supplied by Ritani. So you see, when you like someone's work, you can either go through the name and pay for it, or you can seek out the experts themselves, or find the up and coming stars out there.

To be a little devil, when you sell a Tiffany diamond, people do pay more because of the name, so resale is there. They pay more for the same reason you buy it first hand...becuase it's Tiffany's...

Try Vatche, try Ritani, but try Tiffany's and Movado at your own expense...literally!

 

[Mara]

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On 1/23/2004 5:25:07 PM sumi wrote:





If I like a Tiffany piece, I'm going to buy the real thing instead of having it copied. I don't feel special because I'm wearing a Tiffany piece. I feel special because I'm wearing something that I think looks really pretty that I really like.

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To play devils advocate

....if you feel special because you are wearing something that looks pretty that you like...why would you ONLY want to buy the original and not have it replicated? Esp if it could be 40% less?

If it's just about wearing something pretty...why pay more for the 'original'?

As for HW, Cartier, I think LG is right about the perception...people are much more rabid about Tiffany than any other type of brand when it comes to jewelry...love it or hate it, there's no in-between. I guess WE could all be a case study too!!

 

[fire&ice]

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On 1/23/2004 5:46:40 PM Mara wrote:

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On 1/23/2004 5:25:07 PM sumi wrote:


If it's just about wearing something pretty...why pay more for the 'original'------------

I've seen a few of their designs that I would never buy the knock off - like the peritti bracelet w/ the bump for the wrist bone. Designed & manufactured w/ the correct *intent* involved. That said, if Elsa opened her own shop, I'd buy from her.

The actually Tiffany e-ring is of interest to me - but to hold that design hostage w/ having to purchase their overpriced stones would make me look elsewhere.

 

[Mara]

Yes I actually like the shape of the e-ring setting...but yep..since it's not available without the stone...I'll never own one.

 

[mike04456]

God, I love these Tiffany threads.

 

[Mara]

Livens up a dull Friday.

 

[valeria101]

I obviously need some enlightement here...

Why is Tiffany getting all the heat and no other jewelry brands get the beating? I know that Tiffany stamp their name of relatively more trinkets, is this the only reason?

 

[Mara]

Val...it may have something to do with blanket statements made which make it sound like Tiffany is what I term the holy grail of jewelry nirvana...bow down to the blue box. Since NO brand or company ever gets that kind of adoration from me...and I tend to think alot of mis-information is perpetuated about Tiffany and their brands, quality, etc....I, of course, must speak up.

Or maybe I just like to stir the pot.

 

[mike04456]

It's not Tiffany's per se--they've done nothing that the other high end jewelers, and indeed most other vendors of luxury goods have done--it's the (few) people who come to pricescope to preach the Gospel of The Blue Box, as if they have quality and value that can't be matched elsewhere, and anyone who disagrees is a Tiffany-hater and just jealous. I think if you review some of the old threads on the subject, you'll see what I mean.

 

[pad3006]

I know you all are knowledgeable about jewelry and I am not as much. However, I know that Tiffany's stands behind there products and will do a lot to help there cusromers who damage them years down the line so I think there is something to be said for there name brand and the fact that they stand behind it. A lot of these internet jewelers may not be around in a few years, but Tiffanys will. So I would not be so quick to just dismiss it as overpriced.

 

[sumi]

Oooh, I second F&I, Elsa should open her own shop.

About only wearing the original, on some level it's just pure laziness. I'd rather just walk in the shop and walk out 5 minutes later with my goodie than to take the time to find someone who could do it right.

More importantly, it's hard to get it just right. I'm a stickler for the details, and if something is off from the original design, it will just bug me. It would have to be a perfect duplication. A lot of what makes something beautiful to me is in the small nuances. After I saw how hard my husband works to come up with designs, I don't think I could just get something copied. A lot of work goes in to getting the design just right. I just wouldn't feel right with making a copy someone else's idea. (not like a huge corporation like Tiffany will miss my sale or that a super-designer like Elsa Perretti will miss much either. it's for my own piece of mind).

 

[hoorray]

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On 1/23/2004 6:53:00 PM LawGem wrote:


--it's the (few) people who come to pricescope to preach the Gospel of The Blue Box, as if they have quality and value that can't be matched elsewhere, and anyone who disagrees is a Tiffany-hater and just jealous. I think if you review some of the old threads on the subject, you'll see what I mean.

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ahhhhh... I leave for the day, and look what happens! Another Friday Tiffany's bashing! I have to put in my 2cents! They are a brand, and some brands are meaningful to some people -- that is why companies invest millions of $$ to create brand equity. Part of the brand equity they have built is around "quality" and "specialness". Debating the value of the brand is useless since it is "soft" value, unique to the individual.

They have some nice and unique designer pieces -- like many other high end stores -- that are not widely available. If you like and want one of them, you don't have lots of choices.

However, for those buyers who are just new to the process, explaining the $$ premium they will pay for this brand for a standard, quality diamond that can be bought from many sources is useful. Especially if they understand that they can get the same quality or better for less elsewhere, unless their intended puts value into that brand. Sometimes, when they are just getting started, they just don't know where else to go. Maul stores certainly don't solve the problem!

And lastly Lawgem, I agree. Some are just jealous....but probably not too many on this forum. They seem to all be pretty darn informed and opinionated!

 

[Mara]

I know F&I is jealous, because she wishes her 3c stone was D IF.