Thoughts about this diamond


Feb 3, 2016
Hello All, first post.... I've been researching on here for a few days now and reading old posts, still there is so much information I can easily feel lost when trying to select the right stone. I found this setting at James Allen that I keep getting drawn to, so looking at different stones for that I have come up with this one also on James Allen's site:
This 0.83 Carat Round diamond H Color VS1 Clarity has Excellent proportions and a diamond grading report from GIA 

Shape:  Round 
carat weight:  0.83 
color:  H 
clarity:  VS1 
cut:  Excellent 
polish:  Excellent 
symmetry:  Excellent 
Fluorescence:  Strong 
l/w/d (mm):  5.98*5.96*3.73 
l/w ratio:  1.00 
depth %:  62.40 
girdle:  Slightly Thick 
table %:  58.00 
culet:  None 
certificate:  GIA 
crown ∠:  36.00 
crown %:  15.50 
pavilion ∠:  40.80 
pavilion %:  43.00
A. Is this a good quality stone, and B. It's listed for $3100, does that seem like fair pricing or should I be able to find this quality for a better deal?
I was originally trying to stay around the $3000 mark for the setting and stone but I'm realizing that may not be feasible unless I get poor quality. Any advice would be greatly appreciated!!


Dec 17, 2008

You can run stones through the HCA tool to see how they fare...look for something that scores 2 or under.

Edit -

I love that setting...let me look at JA for some stones and see what I can right back.


Feb 3, 2016
Thanks! I did run across that HCA tool, it scored a 3.8.... in my searching (at least staying in that price range) I didn't see any stones without going with something a lot smaller that would score a 2 or less. I did see that 2 or less is ideal, however I'm not sure I really understand all that info that is being inputted to that tool, therefore I'm not sure what the difference would be visually in person between this 3.8 and a 2.

Thanks, I just stumbled upon that setting on my first time looking on there and keep coming back to it over any others I've seen so far!


Feb 3, 2016
tyty333|1454511994|3986177 said:
How do you feel about dropping down to an "I"? I'm not finding anything all that great unless we go down in size or up in budget
(or down in color).

I'm so new to all of this I'm not sure that I'd be able to tell an I from H or not, how noticeable would a change like that be? Also how noticeable is going from SI1 to VS2/1? I'm really having a hard time determining what C to give a little on, I know Cut is the most important so I definitely want that to be right. I stopped by Jared on my lunch today as I was driving past it and they had a couple ones there that I checked out but they don't have the table/depth and angles written down... even the GSI report didn't have any real info on it. (
How does Jared rate compared to other retails here on PS? I just really kinda felt the real salesman vibe there and they were really pushing for me to buy right then. But I like the idea of being able to see and compare in person before shelling out my money.


Aug 8, 2005
Here you go:
Round Diamonds 101:

The entire purpose of faceting a diamond is to reflect light.
How well or how poorly a diamond does this determines how beautiful it is.
How well a diamond performs is determined by the angles and cutting. This is why we say cut is king.
No other factor: not color, not clarity has as much of an impact on the appearance of a diamond as its cut. An ideal H will out white a poorly cut F. With round diamonds even a GIA triple Excellent is not enough. And you must stick to GIA and AGS only (HPD in Europe is good as well). EGL is a bad option: [URL=''][/URL]
So how to we ensure that we have the right angles and cutting to get the light performance we want?
Well one method is to start with a GIA Ex, and then apply the HCA to it. YOU DO NOT USE HCA for AGS0 stones generally, though you can. In general, AGS0 trumps HCA though as one examines the actual stone and the other does not.
The HCA is a rejection tool. Not a selection tool. It uses 4 data points to make a rudimentary call on how the diamond may perform.
If the diamond passes then you know that you are in the right zone in terms of angles for light performance. Under 2 is a pass. Under 2.5-2.1 is a maybe. 2.6 and over is a no. No score 2 and under is better than any other.
Is that enough? Not really.

So what you need is a way to check actual light performance of your actual stone.
That's what an idealscope image does.
It shows you how and wear your diamond is reflecting light, how well it is going at it, and where you are losing light return. That is why you won't see us recommending Blue Nile, as they do not provide idealscope images for their diamonds. BGD,BE, James Allen, GOG, HPD, ERD and WF do.

The Idealscope is the 'selection tool'. Not the HCA.
So yes, with a GIA stone you need the idealscope images. Or you can buy an idealscope yourself and take it in to the jeweler you are working with to check the stones yourself. Or if you have a good return policy (full refund minimum 7 days) then you can buy the idealscope, buy the stone, and do it at home.

Now if you want to skip all that... stick to AGS0 stones and then all you have to do is pick color and clarity and you know you have a great performing diamond. Because AGS has already done the checking for you. That's why they trade at a premium. Some AGS0's are better than others though, so pay attention to any ASET or IS provided.

In general with rounds, you will want a table 60% or less. A depth between 59 and 62.4. Crown angle 33.5-36. Pavilion Angle: 40.6-41 (there is a little give on this). And the crown and pavilion angles must be complimentary which is what the HCA checks for you.


It is important to remember is that color is graded FACE DOWN. Where there is NO light return. Not face up where there is light return and refraction. You wear diamonds set. FACE UP.

Within one color grade, even the labs can't agree on the color grades of stones and something could be a "high" H or a "low" E. So... no. Not really. Within 2 color grades it is hard. Not impossible. But very hard. And it gets harder once set. If you are talking ideal rounds, or any stone with ideal light return and no sharp corners it gets harder still because the ideal light return masks body color.

Generally we say to be conservative stay above H in a round. But MANY people have happily bought white I or even J diamonds when trying to eek out a little more size.

This is how I think of it.

Ever gotten one of those HUGE paint fan decks? Where there are literally 100s of colors of whites? And when they are RIGHT next to each other you can TOTALLY tell that one is bluer/colder and one is a bit warmer and which one is one is TOTALLY warmer. One there's one that's slightly greener. One that's slightly pinker? But really. They are all white?

Then you pick one after agonizing over this white or that white and when it's on the walls and people are like: Oh. You painted again. And it's STILL white. Great.

And you're all... BUT it's BLUE white. Or it's a WARM white now. It used to be ____ white. It's TOTALLY different.

It's like that. You are talking about shades of white. D is colder... J is warmer. But it's all white.

YES. If you have an accurately graded F and an H THAT HAVE THE SAME PERFORMANCE you are going to be able to tell them apart when you compare them. Just like you would be able to tell if you painted your walls a warm white, but painted the crown molding a cold/straight white. But both are STILL white.

I want you notice all the qualifiers thought. I'm talking about stones with the SAME performance. An ideal H will out white an F that has compromised light performance from a poor cut.

NOTHING impacts the appearance of a diamond as much as cut. CUT is king.

You want the shinest whitest and brightest diamond out there: Cut is King. No other factor, not color or clarity or anything else impacts how white bright an shiny a stone is.

ON CLARITY: and Generally we say that eyeclean SI1 and VS2 are as high as you need to go with round brilliants, have your vendor check the diamond for this. VS1 will always be eyeclean, but they do cost more and an eyeclean SI1 and a VS1 will look the same to the unaided eye.


Feb 3, 2016
So reading more about it, and thanks to Gypsy for posting all that info! I looked at SI1 and bumped up the color some. I would like for it to be as white as possible (without paying for something that won't be visibly better). I found this SI1 F color that scored a .8 on the HCA Advisor:

SHAPE:	Round
CUT:	Excellent
POLISH:	Excellent
SYMMETRY:	Excellent
L/W/D (MM):	6.02*6.05*3.64
L/W RATIO:	1.00
DEPTH %:	60.30
GIRDLE:	Medium
TABLE %:	57.00
CROWN ∠:	32.00
CROWN %:	13.50
PAVILION ∠:	41.00
PAVILION %:	43.00

My concern is that it says it has a Twinning Wisp, Feather for the characteristics... You can see something on the bottom left quadrant of the diamond in the picture but I don't know if that's this or if it was just dirty in the picture. What are the thoughts about this one?
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