Sounds Like Operation Upgrade is About to Commence...

[sledge]

Worked late and came home. As we are eating dinner, my girl drops a bomb on me -- her diamond is yellow!

At first I thought she was joking as she knows I'm pretty obsessive over her stone, cleaning it, etc. Nope, she wasn't joking. She describes it as pastel yellow but much, much more faint.

For those that are curious...

BGD Blue 0.867ct H VS2
https://www.briangavindiamonds.com/...0.867-h-vs2-round-diamond-ags-bl-104098623002

I'm not really sure when my inspection/return period kicked in as I bought the stone and it sat in BGD's safe for at least a month prior to shipping to DK for final mounting. DK then had the stone about a week. I finally had in my hands around 6/29 and if I am reading correctly, I only had 15 days to inspect & return so I think my time would have ran out around 7/14.


Really wish she had said something earlier, although in her defense she wasn't trying to be rude and she just assumed it was her as no one else ever said anything to her. Apparently she is more color sensitive than I originally thought.

Assuming I'm out of the return period, I am guessing my only other option is an upgrade. I started looking tonight but didn't find anything of similar size and budget ($4700+) that got me excited.

Any other thoughts? Also, now I'm on the fence about a G. Almost thinking F+ and maybe E+ to be safe. Most likely I will just get her involved so she can see the difference and tell me where it does and doesn't make a difference.

 

[TreeScientist]

As I recall, you said she would've been happy with a smaller diamond, correct? (I think you mentioned in the ring design thread that she wanted something like a .5 carat originally).

I know that with BGD you need to upgrade 2 of the 3 Cs, but upgrading carat would most likely mean .9 carat. And a .9 carat in the colorless range is going to be quite a significant price jump from a SuperIdeal vendor.

What about upgrading color and clarity and going down a bit in carat? She might be happy with the smaller diamond anyway.

I see that there's a recently-added .7 carat black that is a D/VS1 at $4800 wire.
https://www.briangavindiamonds.com/.../0.710-d-vs1-round-diamond-bkags-104101026065

Looks like there selection is pretty limited in the colorless range right now below 1 carat. Don't really see any other good options...

I totally get the color-sensitivity though. But if she is extremely color sensitive, then you cannot get whiter than a D...

 

[OoohShiny]

I think you need to have the conversation about trade-offs between size and colour! lol

 

[TreeScientist]

On second thought, maybe the D color wouldn’t be the best idea. I’m not sure what color melee DK used in your ring, but I’m assuming it’s probably F-G or G-H to match the original diamond. I know the melee color doesn’t matter quite as much (since small diamonds appear whiter) but I feel like a D center stone might clash with near-colorless melee. The .7 may also be a bit too small to fit with the design of the current ring. I’m afraid that with that much of a diameter change (close to .5mm) there would be a gap between the edge of the diamond and the swirl when viewing from the face-up position.

For that reason, I think it may be best to stick with an F color as a nice “middle-ground” between a D (which is the whitest possible) and your current H, and .8+ carat (or .2mm or less size difference).

If she can live with the current diamond for a while, it might be worth holding out for a .8 carat F/VS1 or a .9 carat F VS2/SI1 (providing an SI1 is “mind-clean” enough for her). I would contact BG and let them know what you’re looking for. Then they can keep an eye out over the coming months for something that fits the bill, or can specifically search for appropriate rough for a custom cut. Just keep in mind that such a diamond would probably be in in the $7.5K range for a .9 carat with BG...

I’ve noticed that, in general, the selection of well-cut diamonds with high color and clarity is extremely limited in the .9 carat range. I’m guess this is due to the fact that, with such rare and desirable rough, it makes more sense economically to try and squeeze a 1 carat out of it as a borderline GIA excellent if at all possible, rather than cut it to Ideal proportions as a .9X carat. Even WF, who usually has the largest selection of the SuperIdeal vendors, only has one diamond in the F+, SI1+, and .85+ carat range available now.

 

[sledge]

Yes, melee was designed and built to match the center stone perfectly. DK even upgraded their stones to a better cut quality. I guess I should check with them to see what center stone I can add without creating a problem.

I didn't see the BGD Black you posted, but then again I searched for more carat weight. That particular stone is only 5.73x5.74. That's too much of a size difference IMO.

Keep in mind, she has a larger table so spread is better. 6.18x6.21 so it will rival most stones in the lower 0.90ct range.

And yes, due to the setting being custom designed, I need dimensions that are similar.

I saw some WF options too. This is where I'm kind of kicking myself as I didn't see a future "upgrade" coming so soon and WF is a vendor that currently has about 9 choices in the 0.856 - 0.930ct range, F+ color, $6,700 or less. But only one for the same dollars, although I could probably add a little scratch to the mix to get what we need. I'd just prefer to use that cash for the wedding.

HPD has two options as well if I increase my dollars.

I suspect you are correct about the rough going at a premium; therefore, the steep & deep vendors are snapping it up and cranking out 1+ carat stones. Ass clowns making my life difficult and not even realizing it.

 

[sledge]

Oh yeah, look at the VS2 cert on the original. It was fairly clean. One of the reasons I loved that stone. Honestly, I probably struggle more with the mind clean thing than she does.

And don't take me wrong, my girl isn't pitching a fit by any stretch. She still loves her ring and is happy with it. I can just tell she wishes it didn't have the tint she can see and I want her to be ecstatic, if possible.

 

[TreeScientist]

I suspect you are correct about the rough going at a premium; therefore, the steep & deep vendors are snapping it up and cranking out 1+ carat stones. Ass clowns making my life difficult and not even realizing it.

I mean, if you can get $8K+ for this (a diamond with a thick pavilion and huge table) just because it's a 1 carat with high color/clarity, then what's the incentive to cut them well at .9X carat and only get in the $6-7k range?
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...f-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-5084166

Oh yeah, look at the VS2 cert on the original. It was fairly clean. One of the reasons I loved that stone. Honestly, I probably struggle more with the mind clean thing than she does.

And don't take me wrong, my girl isn't pitching a fit by any stretch. She still loves her ring and is happy with it. I can just tell she wishes it didn't have the tint she can see and I want her to be ecstatic, if possible.

I'll fully admit that the VS was a mind-clean thing for me too. The original stone I got was a VS1 and I couldn't see a dang thing in it. The new diamond is a VS2 and... I still can't see a thing. I've realized that clarity is probably the thing that makes the least impact on the diamond appearance as long as there's not inclusions that impact light return (like clouds and twinning wisps). This is especially true in diamonds less than 1 carat... The inclusions are so darn tiny!

I know that I could've easily found a SI1 stone in the <1 carat range that would still be completely eye-clean, but again, I fully admit that I like seeing the "VS" on the certificate.

I'm sure your girl is being more than understanding. I imagine that us guys are probably the ones who stress out about this stuff more than our significant others, especially if our SOs are not on PriceScope. So if she's willing to wait, I'm sure you'll be able to eventually find something that fits the bill within BG's inventory.

 

[coda72]

I’m surprised your fiancée can see that much color in a super ideal H. You’re right, she is very color sensitive. I personally can see color quite well, but I chose to ignore it in order to get the size diamond I wanted! If I were you, I’d wait until BG has an F colored diamond in the size you want, and upgrade at that time. I agree with you that going up to a G might not be enough. I have an F colored diamond that looks very white to me. I’ve never seen a D in person; I’m sure it looks pretty amazing, but won’t match the diamonds in your setting.

 

[the_mother_thing]

Is the color she is seeing possibly attributable to the environment (e.g. surrounding colors of walls) and/or lighting where she is/lives/goes/works? Because if so - and others with high color diamonds can chime in here to confirm - I’m not sure how much ‘improvement’ she may see unless those factors change as well.

And please know that I’m not trying to rain on your shopping parade at all. Just thinking through the possibilities as you embark on possibly upgrading the stone with BGD’s requirements and finding a similarly sized diamond to fit that gorgeous setting. This gang will for sure help if that’s what is needed.

 

[Acinom]

Has she looked at the diamond in various surroundings? Seeing tint in an H is rather remarkable. I remember a PSer who thought her diamond was too yellow and it turned out to be the reflection of a wooden wall and ceiling if I remember correctly.
First thing you should do is to check with Amy what dimensions are possible in the setting. And I would explain the situation to BGD to see what they can do for you. They might be lenient as the stone has been sitting in vaults mostly?

 

[TreeScientist]

Is the color she is seeing possibly attributable to the environment (e.g. surrounding colors of walls) and/or lighting where she is/lives/goes/works? Because if so - and others with high color diamonds can chime in here to confirm - I’m not sure how much ‘improvement’ she may see unless those factors change as well.

And please know that I’m not trying to rain on your shopping parade at all. Just thinking through the possibilities as you embark on possibly upgrading the stone with BGD’s requirements and finding a similarly sized diamond to fit that gorgeous setting. This gang will for sure help if that’s what is needed.

I may be able to give a little bit of commentary on this, as I thought the same thing. When I saw color in the G I purchased, I originally though "Oh, it must be the environment/lighting/time of day/etc" because that is what everyone else on here had said about seeing color in near-colorless diamonds. And I also thought I was going a bit crazy exchanging a G for a higher color.

But after getting a D color, I can tell you that the color I was seeing in the G was 100% not environmentally derived. The D color diamond shows absolutely no tint in any type of lighting. It looks bright white practically everywhere.

Yes, you can still see environment/background colors ever so slightly in a colorless diamond. For instance, if you're wearing a bright canary yellow shirt then there would be a bit of a yellow reflection coming off of the diamond. Ditto a pink reflection with a pink shirt. But the reflected environmental colors look totally different from the yellow I was seeing in the G diamond. Environmental colors appear to be coming from the surface of the stone (which makes sense, since it is a reflection after all) rather than from the inside of the diamond like what I was seeing in the G.

Yes, the lighting does certainly play a role, but I think it's the inverse of what most people seem to think on here. It is not that dimmer incandescent (home) lighting creates color in diamonds. It's that bright light with high concentrations of wavelengths in the blue spectrum (like sunlight and LED department/jewelry store lighting) hides color in near-colorless stones. When the high level of blue light is not present, as is the case with dim home or office lighting, then the diamond's body color comes through.

 

[the_mother_thing]

Thank you for the explanation @TreeScientist If I may further ask, does the fact that @sledge stone has MBF make a difference? I have read on here more times than I can recall that M/SBF can/may make diamonds face-up whiter.

@sledge does your fiancé see the tint face up, from the side, at an angle ... ? I would think - given the setting - it’s face up or at a slight angle, which seems to conflict with what I’ve read on here about the impact fluorescence has on some diamonds. And I am only asking to be CERTAIN - before you trudge down the path - that a stone swap will in fact yield the desired result.

 

[ringo865]

Perhaps it doesn't look as "white" as the heavily included ones she saw at jareds?

 

[sledge]

She didn't feel well last night and went to bed shortly after I came home so we didn't get to talk diamonds much.

I have many of the same questions and concerns and will share once she feels better and I can get more answers.

Stay tuned. Until then I'm looking but not pulling the trigger if I see something. Also i will be talking with Lesley and Amy today.

 

[ohsomethingshiny]

When I went to my husband’s office to pick up my H-VS ACA right after delivery, I was so excited! I opened the box and immediately felt sick to my stomach. It was yellow. It shouldn’t have been THAT yellow. How did I not know I was that color sensitive? I closed the box and didn’t put it on.

But then I looked around. The walls of my husband’s office are tan, and the overhead fluorescent lighting covers are aged and yellowed. I opened the box back up, put the ring on and walked around. Once out of that environment, I didn’t see yellow again from any angle.

All this to say, I hope that her color sensitivity is a similar situation to mine. Definitely find out when/where she sees it.

As for my J AVC, I see color 90% of the time. I wish I didn’t. But I’ve accepted it and know that it’s a beautiful stone with warmth and character.

 

[Wewechew]

Has she looked at the diamond in various surroundings? Seeing tint in an H is rather remarkable. I remember a PSer who thought her diamond was too yellow and it turned out to be the reflection of a wooden wall and ceiling if I remember correctly.
First thing you should do is to check with Amy what dimensions are possible in the setting. And I would explain the situation to BGD to see what they can do for you. They might be lenient as the stone has been sitting in vaults mostly?

Count me as one that can see tint in my H. It doesn't bother me because I know it adds some dimension to the diamond, but I can see it,

 

[Acinom]

Very wise that you thread carefully. Does she know that you are thinking about upgrading? Can she live with the yellow she sees?

If you have a Tiffany or other jeweller in your neigbourhood, I woud go there to compare in real life...

 

[SimoneDi]

She didn't feel well last night and went to bed shortly after I came home so we didn't get to talk diamonds much.

I have many of the same questions and concerns and will share once she feels better and I can get more answers.

Stay tuned. Until then I'm looking but not pulling the trigger if I see something. Also i will be talking with Lesley and Amy today.

FYI Lesley is on vacation today, but I am sure that someone else from their team can help you out today.

I would also advice that she tries to live with it for a bit before jumping into an upgrade and a setting modification.

 

[Crystal_Dreams]

I can see tint in my F . Having said that, it was a GIA XXX and not a super ideal. So perhaps the sparkle bomb factor was less?

I chose to ignore it as it didn’t really bother me much. But I most certainly did notice it. I had to go and double check the specs on my GIA cert a few times as I couldn’t believe I was seeing colour in a F... it wasn’t environmental either...

Have a chat about whether it bothers her or not... I think that’s probably what matters.

 

[mrs-b]

I'd ask her to live with it for a year, then possibly upgrade on both size and color. I know she mentioned a smaller diamond originally, but my experience is that diamond perception changes over time. When you have no diamond, a half ct seems just fine. Then you get a .87ct stone, and you realize that it's not at all too big! Who knew?! So then you start thinking...maybe a 1ct would be nice.....

So all that to say, I'd give her a month or two to work out if she'd like to go up in size also. If she does, it's probably something you'll have to push back a bit, but the upside is that it gets you some time where you don't have to do anything at all. And after all you went through with her ring, a break might be something you'd enjoy.

 

[Wewechew]

I can see tint in my F . Having said that, it was a GIA XXX and not a super ideal. So perhaps the sparkle bomb factor was less?

I chose to ignore it as it didn’t really bother me much. But I most certainly did notice it. I had to go and double check the specs on my GIA cert a few times as I couldn’t believe I was seeing colour in a F... it wasn’t environmental either...

Have a chat about whether it bothers her or not... I think that’s probably what matters.

Now that, is impressed!

 

[sledge]

Thanks everyone. I was talking to her this morning on my drive in. I mentioned a few things I'd like to do this weekend like get a good steam clean, look under different lighting and maybe compare to some other stones at a local store so we could gauge her sensitivity and know where her "colorless cutoff point" is so we don't fix it twice.

Also, I gathered she doesn't see color from the top, only the sides. I think this could be for a number of reasons. Her setting is higher than many of you prefer and consequently you see more of the diamond. Also, while she is white, she has a complimentary skin complexion that allows her to look tan year round and during the summer to look really nicely tanned.

My thoughts are with the ring setting up high & her skin color, then it's creating a tint. Is this possible? It never occurred to me about skin color playing into it.

More importantly, she did not appreciate me nit picking her ring and said maybe I should ask her what she wants. I did, and she said nothing. She loves the ring as it is and it need not be perfect as she understands no diamond is perfect.

While that is an awesome answer. My concern with accepting it is that she loves it because I gave it to her and she is choosing to accept the imperfections to avoid hurting me or appearing materialistic. I've tried to reassure her none of that is going on but she keeps saying, "really, it's fine". My experience is that is the biggest oxymoron I've ever heard when it rolls off a woman's lips.

Anyhow....side profile illustrating height and how I think it could be contributing. And as far as calling Lesley, I will wait until they are back from vacation. Any idea when?

 

[ac117]

I know you put so much thought and effort into this so I'm sure you were quite surprised! I really believe (and there have been multiple accounts here on PS) that AGS is ever so slightly softer on color so your AGS H might be closer to a GIA I and that's where people usually start to notice tint. I'm not starting a debate on this but just saying I tend to agree so I would advise if you DO go the upgrade route, that you wait for an F which might be more like a GIA G. Also agree with you on not going much lower in size - staying at or just above the 6mm mark if you want to stay at something comparable or of course a little larger wouldn't hurt either haha

Btw, I chucked to myself reading this....it's so true and I do it ALL the time

I've tried to reassure her none of that is going on but she keeps saying, "really, it's fine". My experience is that is the biggest oxymoron I've ever heard when it rolls off a woman's lips.

 

[mrsgreeneyes]

Thanks everyone. I was talking to her this morning on my drive in. I mentioned a few things I'd like to do this weekend like get a good steam clean, look under different lighting and maybe compare to some other stones at a local store so we could gauge her sensitivity and know where her "colorless cutoff point" is so we don't fix it twice.

Also, I gathered she doesn't see color from the top, only the sides. I think this could be for a number of reasons. Her setting is higher than many of you prefer and consequently you see more of the diamond. Also, while she is white, she has a complimentary skin complexion that allows her to look tan year round and during the summer to look really nicely tanned.

My thoughts are with the ring setting up high & her skin color, then it's creating a tint. Is this possible? It never occurred to me about skin color playing into it.

More importantly, she did not appreciate me nit picking her ring and said maybe I should ask her what she wants. I did, and she said nothing. She loves the ring as it is and it need not be perfect as she understands no diamond is perfect.

While that is an awesome answer. My concern with accepting it is that she loves it because I gave it to her and she is choosing to accept the imperfections to avoid hurting me or appearing materialistic. I've tried to reassure her none of that is going on but she keeps saying, "really, it's fine". My experience is that is the biggest oxymoron I've ever heard when it rolls off a woman's lips.

Anyhow....side profile illustrating height and how I think it could be contributing. And as far as calling Lesley, I will wait until they are back from vacation. Any idea when?

I can see the tint in these pictures, so it is unlikely that it is environmental or skin tone. Now whether it bothers her to the point she wants an upgrade, only the two of you can decide. It is truly a lovely stone.

 

[baby monster]

Does the tint bother her? Maybe she says that it's pastel yellow just as a descriptive fact and doesn't want to change anything. It's as if she's discovering some aspect of a tangible object she hasn't noticed before.

Conversations between a man and a woman quite often result in misunderstanding because the man will go off looking for a solution to a problem when the woman just wanted to talk about it.

 

[Wewechew]

Does the tint bother her? Maybe she says that it's pastel yellow just as a descriptive fact and doesn't want to change anything. It's as if she's discovering some aspect of a tangible object she hasn't noticed before.

Conversations between a man and a woman quite often result in misunderstanding because the man will go off looking for a solution to a problem when the woman just wanted to talk about it.

Truer words.

 

[ohsomethingshiny]

Truer words.

+1

 

[BlingDreams]

+1

+2

 

[mrsgreeneyes]

the man will go off looking for a solution to a problem when the woman just wanted to talk about it.

I need this billboard size in my house.

 

[Wewechew]

I need this billboard size in my house.

I don't even tell my husband half the things that go on at work because I can't mention them without him trying to fix them. I've given up and only talk about work with girl friends.