Soothe my brow and tell me all will be OK with my diamond

[Punks-Tricks]

Hi All,

I've been avidly reading the topics since I found you a few days ago. I've bought a diamond but wish I'd found you before I purchased!

This is the stone I've bought http://www.gia.edu/cs/Satellite?reportno=3165949030&childpagename=GIA%2FPage%2FReportCheck&pagename=GIA%2FDispatcher&c=Page&cid=1355954554547

Now for the back story. My Mum was working class and always wanted a 1ct diamond ring. After being self employed for most of her life she would have afforded a decent ring but chose not to splurge. Three years ago Mum passed away and my Dad earlier this year. I decided to buy a diamond to wear everyday and enjoy from the inheritance I received from my parents. Several jewellers local to me scoffed at my $16k budget for stone and setting. I gave myself a headache looking as it was such an emotional purchase, in the end I let my husband chose. I ordered the diamond on my Mum's birthday and it arrived in the UK ( from New York) on my wedding anniversary. I haven't seen it but the jewellers has said I won't be disappointed. Fingers crossed I won't be. Anyway in the next few years I intend to buy a pendant,bracelet and ring for my right hand. No doubt I will be asking a million and one questions.

 

[MarionC]

Re: Soothe my brow and tell me all will be OK with my diamon

Hi.

Are you looking for comments on the stone or just saying you are getting it??

 

[Punks-Tricks]

Re: Soothe my brow and tell me all will be OK with my diamon

I have bought it but comments most welcome. I have broad shoulders.

 

[heididdl]

Re: Soothe my brow and tell me all will be OK with my diamon

On paper it looks terrific Way (although over kill for the money....E and VVVS ) however that being said hearing your story.....I think you got exactly what you deserve....I hope it is as beautiful in person as it looks on paper. Enjoy ....

 

[MarionC]

Re: Soothe my brow and tell me all will be OK with my diamon

I too learned about diamonds by buying diamonds and studying them and asking questions on this forum.
Since you mentioned you are going to buy more, this is a great forum with great, knowledgeable folks.

For one thing - - - a tool that can be useful is the HCA [Holloway Cut Advisor] listed under tools at the top of the page.
You can plug in the numbers for a diamond and find out more light performance for a stone. It is advised to pick below 2.0 for maximum performance, but diamonds outside that range can be beautiful also.

It sounds as though you've picked a pretty stone. Great color & clarity. You could go to F or G /VS, but in certain cases it's nice to have what you picked. That's what I did for my daughter for sentimental reasons : )
I'm sure old-timers with more experience will chime in.
When do you get it? Let us know what you think when you see it! and post some photos.
S

 

[Gypsy]

Re: Soothe my brow and tell me all will be OK with my diamon

Hmm. Do you want honesty or just a 'there, there?"
If you want a there, there... read the posts above mine and skip this one.
If you want honesty: You really didn't need to get an E VVS. It will be indistinguishable from an eyeclean F VS2. And you really, well, wasted money there.

I am concerned about the pavillion angle though. I don't think the angles are complimentary.

Honestly, if you have a return policy... well, you may want to consider getting more educated on diamonds and instead of putting your money in places you don't need it (E VVS) putting it in places that you do (better cut).

 

[Gypsy]

Re: Soothe my brow and tell me all will be OK with my diamon

ON CUT for ROUND BRILLIANT DIAMONDS:
The entire purpose of faceting a diamond is to reflect light.
How well or how poorly a diamond does this determines how beautiful it is.
How well a diamond performs is determined by the angles and cutting. This is why we say cut is king.
No other factor: not color, not clarity has as much of an impact on the appearance of a diamond as its cut. An ideal H will out white a poorly cut F. And GIA Ex is not enough. And you must stick to GIA and AGS only. EGL is a bad option: [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/egl-certification-are-any-of-them-ok.142863/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/egl-certification-are-any-of-them-ok.142863/[/URL]
So how to we ensure that we have the right angles and cutting to get the light performance we want?
http://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/diamond-cut
Well one method is to start with a GIA Ex, and then apply the HCA to it. YOU DO NOT USE HCA for AGS0 stones.
http://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/holloway-cut-advisor
The HCA is a rejection tool. Not a selection tool. It uses 4 data points to make a rudimentary call on how the diamond may perform.
If the diamond passes then you know that you are in the right zone in terms of angles for light performance. Under 2 is a pass. Under 2.5-2.1 is a maybe. 2.6 and over is a no. No score 2 and under is better than any other.
Is that enough? Not really.
So what you need is a way to check actual light performance of your actual stone.
That's what an idealscope image does. http://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/firescope-idealscope
It shows you how and wear your diamond is reflecting light, how well it is going at it, and where you are losing light return. That is why you won't see us recommending Blue Nile, as they do not provide idealscope images for their diamonds. BGD, James Allen, GOG, HPD, ERD and WF do.

The Idealscope is the 'selection tool'. Not the HCA.
So yes, with a GIA stone you need the idealscope images. Or you can buy an idealscope yourself and take it in to the jeweler you are working with to check the stones yourself. Or if you have a good return policy (full refund minimum 7 days) then you can buy the idealscope, buy the stone, and do it at home.


Now if you want to skip all that... stick to AGS0 stones and then all you have to do is pick color and clarity and you know you have a great performing diamond. Because AGS has already done the checking for you. That's why they trade at a premium.

ON COLOR:

It is important to remember is that color is graded FACE DOWN. Where there is NO light return. Not face up where there is light return and refraction. You wear diamonds set. FACE UP.

Within one color grade, even the labs can't agree on the color grades of stones and something could be a "high" H or a "low" E. So... no. Not really. Within 2 color grades it is hard. Not impossible. But very hard. And it gets harder once set. If you are talking ideal rounds, or any stone with ideal light return and no sharp corners it gets harder still because the ideal light return masks body color.

Generally we say to be conservative stay above H in a round. But MANY people have happily bought white I or even J diamonds when trying to eek out a little more size. I personally would go down to I without a second thought.



This is how I think of it.

Ever gotten one of those HUGE paint fan decks? Where there are literally 100s of colors of whites? And when they are RIGHT next to each other you can TOTALLY tell that one is bluer/colder and one is a bit warmer and which one is one is TOTALLY warmer. One there's one that's slightly greener. One that's slightly pinker? But really. They are all white?

Then you pick one after agonizing over this white or that white and when it's on the walls and people are like: Oh. You painted again. And it's STILL white. Great.

And you're all... BUT it's BLUE white. Or it's a WARM white now. It used to be ____ white. It's TOTALLY different.

It's like that. You are talking about shades of white. D is colder... J is warmer. But it's all white.

YES. If you have an accurately graded F and an H THAT HAVE THE SAME PERFORMANCE you are going to be able to tell them apart when you compare them. Just like you would be able to tell if you painted your walls a warm white, but painted the crown molding a cold/straight white. But both are STILL white.


I want you notice all the qualifiers thought. I'm talking about stones with the SAME performance. An ideal H will out white an F that has compromised light performance from a poor cut.

NOTHING impacts the appearance of a diamond as much as cut. CUT is king.

You want the shinest whitest and brightest diamond out there: Cut is King. No other factor, not color or clarity or anything else impacts how white bright an shiny a stone is.

ON CLARITY:
http://www.goodoldgold.com/4Cs/Clarity/SI/ and http://www.goodoldgold.com/4Cs/Clarity/VS/ Generally we say that eyeclean SI1 and VS2 are as high as you need to go with round brilliants. But that assumes that you are talking GIA or AGS stones that are accurately graded.

 

[gregchang35]

Re: Soothe my brow and tell me all will be OK with my diamon

Fantastic post gypsy! Very informative- I am still learning about these rounds...
I do hope that punk tricks gets a lot out of it. Perhaps she can use this forum to help her find something beautiful.

Punk tricks- ppl in here are great at finding beautiful diamonds if you post your budget and some specifications that are important to you. Maybe E colour is important or the vvs is important, though as gypsy has pointed out there are other specs that will measure up nicely.

Have fun with the process- ladies and some gents are great at helping ppl out finding your diamond...

 

[Dreamer_D]

Re: Soothe my brow and tell me all will be OK with my diamon

I think for someone buying "blind" without the help of a forum like this, you did great!

You bought a GIA graded stone. Not everyone is saavy enough to do that and by selecting a diamond with a reliable report you can be sure that you can appropriately judge the market value.

You also selected a GIA Excellent cut stone. While its true that many here on PS prefer to select further within the Excellent cut grade to ensure a particular look to the diamond, the Ex cut grade in general means you have chosen a stone that is better cut than 99% of the market. Well done on that. Again, most consumers do not make that choice.

It is true that you did not "need" to buy a stone that was E color of VVS clarity. You can save money by getting a stone that is F or even G color and VS2 or even SI1 clarity and to many such a stone would be indistinguishable from your E VVS stone. That said, there is nothing inherently wrong with such a color and clarity combination. I certainly would not chide you for that selection, and many people prefer stones of such pure specs.

Overall, I think you did very well when we consider the whole picture of diamond purchases. A lot of people like you pop in with a EGL or IGI graded stone of "good" proportions. You did much better than that!

I am eager to see photos!

 

[TC1987]

Re: Soothe my brow and tell me all will be OK with my diamon

What a lovely remembrance of your parents.

Your jeweler has said it's a good-looking diamond. Don't borrow trouble. Wait until you see it yourself before worrying. GIA rounds the numbers, and I don't pretend to know how far they round. But it you tweak the values by only .1 in the Holloway Cut Adviser, the scores really change. So I'd call the HCA not very useful in this case, and you should go by the appearance. If you have any doubts, then just return it and pick a different diamond. There's no shame in that. We recommend getting an ASET image on a GIA excellent cut, because their excellent grade i more variable and lenient that the AGS 000 grade.
As for color and clarity, I don't think it's right to go around telling buyers "you didn't / don't need that," because only the buyer can determine what the buyer needs. Personally, I can tell the difference between a D and an E or F, and I certainly see tint in my AGS 000 F diamond. But it doesn't bother me. I also own an M, and one J, and maybe one that's a K. Seeing tint and being bothered by it are two different things. But since it's a purchase to remember your parents by, I can see why you'd want to aim for high color and clarity.

 

[MarionC]

Re: Soothe my brow and tell me all will be OK with my diamon

What a lovely remembrance of your parents.

Your jeweler has said it's a good-looking diamond. Don't borrow trouble. Wait until you see it yourself before worrying. GIA rounds the numbers, and I don't pretend to know how far they round. But it you tweak the values bu only .1 in the Holloway Cut Adviser, the scores are affected drastically. So I'd call the HCA not very useful in this case, and you should go by the appearance. If you have any doubts, then just return it and pick a different one. There's no shame in that. We recommend getting an ASET image on a GIA excellent cut, because their excellent grade i more variable and lenient that the AGS 000 grade.
As for color and clarity, I don't think it's right to go around telling buyers "you didn't / don't need that," because only the buyer can determine what the buyer needs. Personally, I can tell the difference between a D and an E or F, and I certainly see tint in my AGS 000 F diamond. But it doesn't bother me. I also own an M, and one J, and maybe one that's a K. Seeing tint and being bothered by it are two different things. But since it's a purchase to remember your parents by, I can see why you'd want to aim for high color and clarity.

Great advice. Maybe I shouldn't have mentioned the HCA

Anyway - perhaps a bit of a hijack - - -
I can see a bit of warmth in my AGS000 F and almost started a thread to talk about it because it didn't seem possible that I could actually see any color in an F...so this is good to hear [I love my diamond, but of course must obsess over every aspect]
I also have a K that I'm over-the-moon about.
I love 'em all.

 

[Punks-Tricks]

Re: Soothe my brow and tell me all will be OK with my diamon

Thanks for all your advice and opinions theres a lot of information there to look at and digest. Off for a look now.

 

[LLJsmom]

Re: Soothe my brow and tell me all will be OK with my diamon

What a lovely remembrance of your parents.

As for color and clarity, I don't think it's right to go around telling buyers "you didn't / don't need that," because only the buyer can determine what the buyer needs. Personally, I can tell the difference between a D and an E or F, and I certainly see tint in my AGS 000 F diamond. But it doesn't bother me. I also own an M, and one J, and maybe one that's a K. Seeing tint and being bothered by it are two different things. But since it's a purchase to remember your parents by, I can see why you'd want to aim for high color and clarity.

Agree wholeheartedly. "Need" depends on the person. I think your stone will be beautifully white and super mind-clean, cause you sure as heck won't be able to find anything in that rock without a microscope. (sorry if I'm exaggerating...)

Crossing my fingers for you that your rock will be super sparkly and that you will love it. Congratulations and enjoy every minute with it.

 

[Lorelei]

Re: Soothe my brow and tell me all will be OK with my diamon

I think for someone buying "blind" without the help of a forum like this, you did great!

You bought a GIA graded stone. Not everyone is saavy enough to do that and by selecting a diamond with a reliable report you can be sure that you can appropriately judge the market value.

You also selected a GIA Excellent cut stone. While its true that many here on PS prefer to select further within the Excellent cut grade to ensure a particular look to the diamond, the Ex cut grade in general means you have chosen a stone that is better cut than 99% of the market. Well done on that. Again, most consumers do not make that choice.

It is true that you did not "need" to buy a stone that was E color of VVS clarity. You can save money by getting a stone that is F or even G color and VS2 or even SI1 clarity and to many such a stone would be indistinguishable from your E VVS stone. That said, there is nothing inherently wrong with such a color and clarity combination. I certainly would not chide you for that selection, and many people prefer stones of such pure specs.

Overall, I think you did very well when we consider the whole picture of diamond purchases. A lot of people like you pop in with a EGL or IGI graded stone of "good" proportions. You did much better than that!

I am eager to see photos!

What a fantastic post Dreamer and welcome Punks!

I can only reiterate Dreamer's wise words, you did extremely well as far as can be told, I could mention the pavilion angle might be preferable around the 40.8 region with that crown angle, but it's not a terrible angle by any means, if the overall cut precision is good, the diamond could still rock and E colour means no risk of it holding unwanted tint even if the pavilion angle average is a touch wide. Colour and clarity is such an individual thing, you could have gone lower on the colour and clarity scale but not everyone wants to do that. Some prefer colourless and very high clarity for purity and or cultural reasons, nothing wrong with that at all.

I hope this helps a bit, see what you think when you see it. I am very sorry for your losses, I hope the diamond is a worthy one that is a beautiful memorial of your parents when it arrives.

 

[Punks-Tricks]

Re: Soothe my brow and tell me all will be OK with my diamon

Thanks for all your advice. I have to say after finding this forum after ordering the diamond I was bricking it!!! I have very personal reasons for choosing the colour and clarity that I did and would not have been talked out of those choices. I do think that in the UK diamond buying to the majority of the population is going to a high street jewellers and picking one "off the shelf". When I got engaged fifteen years ago it was an impulse purchase that took less than half an hour and I have no clue on the specifics just that it's 0.67 carat. Anyway enough of the waffle and the diamond is a keeper. Its been set and I've been wearing it for the last 24 hours. The only regret is that my Mum didn't get to own a diamond like it. I will post a few photo's later on. If I had found PS a few weeks earlier then I may have chosen differently but all in all I'm happy.