some PSers spell COLOR and others spell COLOUR...

[oddoneout]

Date: 4/18/2010 9:47:27 PM
Author: kenny
Both.


Various countries use various spellings.

Kenny is right.

 

[dragonfly411]

Date: 4/19/2010 10:39:02 AM
Author: elrohwen
Correction to my above explaination -


Johnson created his British dictionary with the -our spelling slightly before Webster''s dictionary using the -or spelling. So perhaps Webster choose -or in reaction to the British, rather than the other way around. Regardless, before these dictionaries both spellings were legit (depending on the word and who was spelling, though the -our ending was generally more popular considering the French occupation) and the dictionaries were published about 50 years apart.


Since color/colour comes from Latin, it can be argued that ''color'' is actually the etymologically correct spelling.

Thanks for both explanations! Makes a bit more sense to me. I really want to take a class on the history of the english language.

 

[elrohwen]

Date: 4/19/2010 11:57:16 AM
Author: dragonfly411

Date: 4/19/2010 10:39:02 AM
Author: elrohwen
Correction to my above explaination -


Johnson created his British dictionary with the -our spelling slightly before Webster''s dictionary using the -or spelling. So perhaps Webster choose -or in reaction to the British, rather than the other way around. Regardless, before these dictionaries both spellings were legit (depending on the word and who was spelling, though the -our ending was generally more popular considering the French occupation) and the dictionaries were published about 50 years apart.


Since color/colour comes from Latin, it can be argued that ''color'' is actually the etymologically correct spelling.

Thanks for both explanations! Makes a bit more sense to me. I really want to take a class on the history of the english language.

In college I took the history of the English language up to 1300, so that''s really where I have more understanding. For this issue, I did a lot of Googling and it may not be 100% correct

I wish I had had the time in my college schedule to take the 1300 to present class! I love linguistics.

 

[Madam Bijoux]

Things have come to a pretty pass
Our romance is growing flat,
For you like this and the other
While I go for this and that,
Goodness knows what the end will be
Oh I don''t know where I''m at
It looks as if we two will never be one
Something must be done:
You say either and I say either, You say neither and I say neither
Either, either Neither, neither, Let''s call the whole thing off.
You like potato and I like potahto, You like tomato and I like tomahto
Potato, potahto, Tomato, tomahto, Let''s call the whole thing off
But oh, if we call the whole thing off Then we must part
And oh, if we ever part, then that might break my heart
So if you like pyjamas and I like pyjahmas, I''ll wear pyjamas and give up
pyajahmas
For we know we need each other so we , Better call the whole off off
Let''s call the whole thing off.

You say laughter and I say larfter, You say after and I say arfter
Laughter, larfter after arfter, Let''s call the whole thing off,
You like vanilla and I like vanella, You saspiralla, and I saspirella
Vanilla vanella chocolate strawberry, Let''s call the whole thing off
But oh if we call the whole thing of then we must part
And oh, if we ever part, then that might break my heart
So if you go for oysters and I go for ersters, I''ll order oysters and cancel
the ersters
For we know we need each other so we, Better call the calling off off,
Let''s call the whole thing off.

I say father, and you say pater, I saw mother and you say mater
Pater, mater Uncle, auntie, let''s call the whole thing off.
I like bananas and you like banahnahs, I say Havana and I get Havahnah
Bananas, banahnahs Havana, Havahnah, Go your way, I''ll go mine
So if I go for scallops and you go for lobsters, So all right no contest we''ll
order lobseter
For we know we need each other so we, Better call the calling off off,
Let''s call the whole thing off.

 

[dragonfly411]

Oh bijoux I love that! Where did you find it? That is beautiful, funny, and eloquent all at the same time!

 

[elrohwen]

Date: 4/19/2010 12:44:37 PM
Author: dragonfly411
Oh bijoux I love that! Where did you find it? That is beautiful, funny, and eloquent all at the same time!

They''re song lyrics.

 

[dragonfly411]

I love that!

 

[Steel]

Ok,

So now that we have sorted out where we stand on that one, what about these:

arbour arbor
ardour ardor
armour armor
armoury armory
behaviour behavior
behavioural behavioral
behaviourism behaviorism
belabour belabor
candour candor
clamour clamor
colour color
coloration (OR colouration) coloration
demeanour demeanor
dolourous dolorous
enamour enamor
endeavour endeavor
favour favor
favourable favorable
favourite favorite
favouritism favoritism
fervour fervor
flavour flavor
glamour glamour (OR glamor) ''glamour'' is preferred
harbour harbor in US English
honour honor
honourable honorable ''glamorous'', ''honorific''
humour humor ''honorary'' and ''humorous'' in
labour labor British and American English!
misdemeanour misdemeanor
neighbour neighbor
odour odor
parlour parlor
rancour rancor
rigour rigor ''rigorous''!
rumour rumor
saviour savior
savour savor
splendour splendor
succour succor
tumour tumor
tambourine tamborine ?
valour valor
vapour vapor
vigour vigor


aaaagh

 

[Hudson_Hawk]

They''re both correct, one is American English and one is the Queen''s English. The Brits also use "s" instead of "z" in words like specialization.

 

[Hudson_Hawk]

Date: 4/19/2010 12:44:37 PM
Author: dragonfly411
Oh bijoux I love that! Where did you find it? That is beautiful, funny, and eloquent all at the same time!

really? You''ve never heard that song before?

 

[elrohwen]

Date: 4/19/2010 12:49:12 PM
Author: Steal
Ok,

So now that we have sorted out where we stand on that one, what about these:

arbour arbor
ardour ardor
armour armor
armoury armory
behaviour behavior
behavioural behavioral
behaviourism behaviorism
belabour belabor
candour candor
clamour clamor
colour color
coloration (OR colouration) coloration
demeanour demeanor
dolourous dolorous
enamour enamor
endeavour endeavor
favour favor
favourable favorable
favourite favorite
favouritism favoritism
fervour fervor
flavour flavor
glamour glamour (OR glamor) ''glamour'' is preferred
harbour harbor in US English
honour honor
honourable honorable ''glamorous'', ''honorific''
humour humor ''honorary'' and ''humorous'' in
labour labor British and American English!
misdemeanour misdemeanor
neighbour neighbor
odour odor
parlour parlor
rancour rancor
rigour rigor ''rigorous''!
rumour rumor
saviour savior
savour savor
splendour splendor
succour succor
tumour tumor
tambourine tamborine ?
valour valor
vapour vapor
vigour vigor


aaaagh

Hahaha. Blame it all on Johnson and Webster!

 

[dragonfly411]

Date: 4/19/2010 12:50:00 PM
Author: Hudson_Hawk

Date: 4/19/2010 12:44:37 PM

Author: dragonfly411

Oh bijoux I love that! Where did you find it? That is beautiful, funny, and eloquent all at the same time!

really? You''ve never heard that song before?

no ma''am sure haven''t. What''s the song please?

 

[elrohwen]

Date: 4/19/2010 12:52:12 PM
Author: dragonfly411

Date: 4/19/2010 12:50:00 PM
Author: Hudson_Hawk

Date: 4/19/2010 12:44:37 PM

Author: dragonfly411

Oh bijoux I love that! Where did you find it? That is beautiful, funny, and eloquent all at the same time!

really? You''ve never heard that song before?

no ma''am sure haven''t. What''s the song please?

"Let''s Call the Whole Thing Off". It''s been done by a million different artists so it''s easy to find.

I also can''t believe you''ve never heard it before!

 

[elrohwen]

Here, DF: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJz7bIl0kRw

 

[Hudson_Hawk]

"Let''s Call the Whole Thing Off" is a song written by George Gershwin and Ira Gershwin for the 1937 film Shall We Dance.

 

[Hudson_Hawk]

Sorry, not meaning to be a know it all, I love Gershwin.

 

[Po10472]

I also find it fascinating the difference in pronunciation between the British and American dialect. For instance route. The word route in the UK is pronounced "root" whereas in the States its pronounced "rowt" - but in the song Route 66, its "root", why is that?

I remember visiting my then fiances family who lived in LA and they couldn''t understand what I was saying when I said the word girl. Cos I''m from Scotland I roll my r''s so girl sounds like ''girrull" whereas you don''t hear the letter r in the american twang.

People think I''m Irish anyway for some reason cos I''m from the west coast of Scotland.

 

[elrohwen]

Date: 4/19/2010 1:19:32 PM
Author: Po10472
I also find it fascinating the difference in pronunciation between the British and American dialect. For instance route. The word route in the UK is pronounced 'root' whereas in the States its pronounced 'rowt' - but in the song Route 66, its 'root', why is that?

I remember visiting my then fiances family who lived in LA and they couldn't understand what I was saying when I said the word girl. Cos I'm from Scotland I roll my r's so girl sounds like 'girrull' whereas you don't hear the letter r in the american twang.

People think I'm Irish anyway for some reason cos I'm from the west coast of Scotland.

Po, in America we actually use both "root" and "rowt". Sometimes it's based on location and dialect, but I, for example, use both in different situations. I say "I'm going to take 'root' 9 into the city." But I will say "I'm planning my 'rowt' to get to New York". I don't think everyone uses them the same way I do though. But that kind of explains why it's "root" 66 because "root" is generally used for road names (though I know many people who would say "rowt" in that case too). There are a lot of words that we say either way depending on where we grew up.

My DH always yells at me because I say apricot wrong

I think he says it wrong!

 

[elle_chris]

Date: 4/19/2010 1:22:45 PM
Author: elrohwen

Date: 4/19/2010 1:19:32 PM
Author: Po10472
I also find it fascinating the difference in pronunciation between the British and American dialect. For instance route. The word route in the UK is pronounced ''root'' whereas in the States its pronounced ''rowt'' - but in the song Route 66, its ''root'', why is that?

I remember visiting my then fiances family who lived in LA and they couldn''t understand what I was saying when I said the word girl. Cos I''m from Scotland I roll my r''s so girl sounds like ''girrull'' whereas you don''t hear the letter r in the american twang.

People think I''m Irish anyway for some reason cos I''m from the west coast of Scotland.

Po, in America we actually use both ''root'' and ''rowt''. Sometimes it''s based on location and dialect, but I, for example, use both in different situations. I say ''I''m going to take ''root'' 9 into the city.'' But I will say ''I''m planning my ''rowt'' to get to New York''. I don''t think everyone uses them the same way I do though. But that kind of explains why it''s ''root'' 66 because ''root'' is generally used for road names (though I know many people who would say ''rowt'' in that case too). There are a lot of words that we say either way depending on where we grew up.

My DH always yells at me because I say apricot wrong

I think he says it wrong!

Same. Pretty sure everyone I know uses both as well depending on your example. Maybe it''s a regional thing.

 

[elrohwen]

Date: 4/19/2010 1:29:44 PM
Author: elle_chris

Date: 4/19/2010 1:22:45 PM
Author: elrohwen

Date: 4/19/2010 1:19:32 PM
Author: Po10472
I also find it fascinating the difference in pronunciation between the British and American dialect. For instance route. The word route in the UK is pronounced ''root'' whereas in the States its pronounced ''rowt'' - but in the song Route 66, its ''root'', why is that?

I remember visiting my then fiances family who lived in LA and they couldn''t understand what I was saying when I said the word girl. Cos I''m from Scotland I roll my r''s so girl sounds like ''girrull'' whereas you don''t hear the letter r in the american twang.

People think I''m Irish anyway for some reason cos I''m from the west coast of Scotland.

Po, in America we actually use both ''root'' and ''rowt''. Sometimes it''s based on location and dialect, but I, for example, use both in different situations. I say ''I''m going to take ''root'' 9 into the city.'' But I will say ''I''m planning my ''rowt'' to get to New York''. I don''t think everyone uses them the same way I do though. But that kind of explains why it''s ''root'' 66 because ''root'' is generally used for road names (though I know many people who would say ''rowt'' in that case too). There are a lot of words that we say either way depending on where we grew up.

My DH always yells at me because I say apricot wrong

I think he says it wrong!

Same. Pretty sure everyone I know uses both as well depending on your example. Maybe it''s a regional thing.

I do know people who will use only one or the other, but I can''t think of who or where they''re from. Though growing up in Pittsburgh I think people used "rowt" a lot more than "root".

 

[Hudson_Hawk]

Similar to the different dialects of the UK, we have our own as well. The "root/rowt" pronunciation is a great example of this. We also pronounce the word Aunt differently. In some places it''s pronounced "ant" like the insect and in others it''s pronounced "ahnt." Personally I''m a root/ahnt pronunciator.

 

[yssie]

I''ve lived in the US for a decade, I still spell (and mostly speak) the way I learnt as a child, in NZ. Frankly I don''t think I''ll ever get totally used to American spelling - it still just looks like there are letters missing

 

[mrscushion]

Date: 4/19/2010 6:45:27 AM
Author: Garry H (Cut Nut)

Date: 4/19/2010 6:31:06 AM

But I can never understand why entree is not an entree (as in french for first or starter)?
D'oh?
Or you call napolitana sauce 'marinara' when it does not have any food from the sea (marine).
D'oh!

I'd also be interested in learning how these terms came to mean what they do in America.

 

[Hudson_Hawk]

I think for the most part either spelling is OK in the US. A big reason why is our neighbor to the North. I believe most of Canada follows Brit spelling, vs American.

 

[elrohwen]

Date: 4/19/2010 1:47:39 PM
Author: mscushion

Date: 4/19/2010 6:45:27 AM
Author: Garry H (Cut Nut)

Date: 4/19/2010 6:31:06 AM

But I can never understand why entree is not an entree (as in french for first or starter)?
D''oh?
Or you call napolitana sauce ''marinara'' when it does not have any food from the sea (marine).
D''oh!

I''d also be interested in learning how these terms came to mean what they do in America.

Marinara means "sailor''s style", so you''re right that it does have to do with maritime. I''m guessing (my own personal guess) the name came from it being common among Italian/American sailors on the east coast. It is a new word from about 1945.

Entree was initially used for the intro to the main course, but I can''t find when the term shifted to mean the main course itself.

 

[princesss]

Date: 4/19/2010 10:29:49 AM
Author: dragonfly411

Date: 4/19/2010 10:06:17 AM
Author: elrohwen
*Warning, extremely nerdy linguistic explanation below.*


I posted about this issue a while back in a thread in FHH. Basically, the British adopted the -our mostly as a way to make their language seem more French during the Norman invasion period. Some words, which actually come from French, legitimately have the -our ending (honour is a good example). Other words were originally English or from other languages (Latin, Greek) and would''ve had an -or ending originally. Both endings were used into the 1800s at least.


During the early days of the US, both -or and -our were common spellings for many words. When Webster created his dictionary he standardized the spellings of many many words in order to give the new Americans a language and spelling that was consistent and make them feel like a unified people with a common language. He decided it was easier to make everything -or, so that''s what he did.


In Britain, they also used a combination of -or and -our, but it seems that after Webster''s change in the US, the British decided to go the other direction and use the -our ending as a way to make their spelling unified and differentiated from American English.


For what it''s worth, ''color'' comes from the Old French and was originally spelled ''colur'', but originally comes from the Old Latin word ''colos''. So neither spelling is right!

THAT was fascinating!
I wonder though why it is that Webster chose to give the Americans a consistent language that deviated (even if slight) from the original English Language. Any other language and this probably wouldn''t fly. You can''t just decide to spell tambien as tamben, or cantante as cantant, so how is it that you can change colour to color?

I might get yelled at for this.... but it makes him seem a bit arrogant.

Not the same thing. To change "tambien" to "tamben" you change the pronunciation. The "u" in "colour" is silent, so colour/color is pronounced exactly the same. You could technically do it in any language that includes silent letters, just as if you had a word that had a double letter you could technically remove the second letter (the second "t" in "letter" for instance) and have it sound exactly the same. At the end of the day, the written word only exists to express the spoken word, so it should take its cues from the way a word sounds.


Personally, my spelling is all messed up. I blame it on growing up around both spellings and being able to pick and choose which words I like - I use a "u" but spell "jail" like an American, for instance. "Color" looks too much like "colon" to me!

 

[elrohwen]

Date: 4/19/2010 2:00:00 PM
Author: princesss
Not the same thing. To change ''tambien'' to ''tamben'' you change the pronunciation. The ''u'' in ''colour'' is silent, so colour/color is pronounced exactly the same. You could technically do it in any language that includes silent letters, just as if you had a word that had a double letter you could technically remove the second letter (the second ''t'' in ''letter'' for instance) and have it sound exactly the same. At the end of the day, the written word only exists to express the spoken word, so it should take its cues from the way a word sounds.


Personally, my spelling is all messed up. I blame it on growing up around both spellings and being able to pick and choose which words I like - I use a ''u'' but spell ''jail'' like an American, for instance. ''Color'' looks too much like ''colon'' to me!

But then it would be a "lee-ter".

 

[princesss]

Date: 4/19/2010 2:01:24 PM
Author: elrohwen

Date: 4/19/2010 2:00:00 PM
Author: princesss
Not the same thing. To change ''tambien'' to ''tamben'' you change the pronunciation. The ''u'' in ''colour'' is silent, so colour/color is pronounced exactly the same. You could technically do it in any language that includes silent letters, just as if you had a word that had a double letter you could technically remove the second letter (the second ''t'' in ''letter'' for instance) and have it sound exactly the same. At the end of the day, the written word only exists to express the spoken word, so it should take its cues from the way a word sounds.


Personally, my spelling is all messed up. I blame it on growing up around both spellings and being able to pick and choose which words I like - I use a ''u'' but spell ''jail'' like an American, for instance. ''Color'' looks too much like ''colon'' to me!

But then it would be a ''lee-ter''.

But think of how easy speling would be if we nedn''t wory about those pesky double leters!

 

[elrohwen]

Date: 4/19/2010 2:12:47 PM
Author: princesss

Date: 4/19/2010 2:01:24 PM
Author: elrohwen

Date: 4/19/2010 2:00:00 PM
Author: princesss
Not the same thing. To change ''tambien'' to ''tamben'' you change the pronunciation. The ''u'' in ''colour'' is silent, so colour/color is pronounced exactly the same. You could technically do it in any language that includes silent letters, just as if you had a word that had a double letter you could technically remove the second letter (the second ''t'' in ''letter'' for instance) and have it sound exactly the same. At the end of the day, the written word only exists to express the spoken word, so it should take its cues from the way a word sounds.


Personally, my spelling is all messed up. I blame it on growing up around both spellings and being able to pick and choose which words I like - I use a ''u'' but spell ''jail'' like an American, for instance. ''Color'' looks too much like ''colon'' to me!

But then it would be a ''lee-ter''.

But think of how easy speling would be if we nedn''t wory about those pesky double leters!

Haha, agreed! I can never get broccoli right because I always want to give it a double-L

 

[princesss]

This just in!

The European Union commissioners have announced that agreement has been reached to adopt English as the preferred language for European communications, rather than German, which was the other possibility. As part of the negotiations, Her Majesty's Government conceded that English spelling had some room for improvement and has accepted a five-year phased plan for what will be known as EuroEnglish (Euro for short).

In the first year, "s" will be used instead of the soft "c." Sertainly, sivil servants will resieve this news with joy. Also, the hard "c" will be replaced with "k". Not only will this klear up konfusion, but typewriters kan have one less letter.

There will be growing publik enthusiasm in the sekond year, when the troublesome "ph" will be replaced by "f". This will make words like fotograf" 20 persent shorter.

In the third year, publik akseptanse of the new spelling kan be expekted to reach the stage where more komplikated changes are possible. Governments will enkorage the removal of double letters, which have always ben a deterent to akurate speling. Also, al wil agre that the horible mes of silent "e"s in the languag is disgrasful, and they would go.

By the fourth year, peopl wil be reseptiv to steps such as replasing "th" by "z" and "w" by " v".

During ze fifz year, ze unesesary "o" kan be dropd from vords kontaining "ou", and similar changes vud of kors be aplid to ozer kombinations of leters.

After zis fifz yer, ve vil hav a reli sensibl riten styl. Zer vil be no mor trubls or difikultis and evrivun vil find it ezi tu understand ech ozer.

Ze drem vil finali kum tru.