Some kind of hiatus

[bee*]

Yay-Im so proud of you!

. Things will get better and better for you and Im so happy that Duncan is doing well

 

[Mannequin]

I am so very happy to hear that you are doing well, Sparkles. I''ve been thinking about you a lot. I can''t wait to see pics of your new pal Duncan all spruced up, though his "five o clock shadow" pics are adorable too! Have a good holiday weekend, sweetheart.

 

[SeattleSparkle]

Oh Sparkles!! I should have checked in sooner!!! I just read through the thread and it breaks my heart. There was a boy once that I thought I was going to spend the rest of my life with and then religion got in the way, and justifiably so. I wasn''t going to compromise what I believe in for the rest of my life. It just isn''t worth it. So, I''m not terribly worldly and I''m not going to give you any advise. I am going to tell you that "Let go and let God" was a phrase that has really helped me through times like the one your going through. I''m also going to tell you that I am going to keep you in my prayers and that God would cover this situation. I pray for discernment and patience, healing and grace.

I hope that you are doing well and let me know how I can be there for you.

 

[firebirdgold]

Duncan = yes
K = no


so sorry things have been so bad for you!

*HUGS*
*HUGS*
*HUGS*
*HUGS*

 

[ilovesparkles]

Thank you Bee, Equ, Seattle SParkler, and Indie! SeattleS, I am almost inclined to tell you to go down to Renton and knowck some sense into him.

Last night was a really bad night, I was over come with grief and just cried and cried. It was weird because I thought I was doing really really well moving on. I had a pretty bad weekend too. Not because of K, but I think I am unconsciously being affected. Sat I was to babysit and I got a phone call an hour after i was supposed to be there. aforetunately they are loving and forgiving and it was all fine. Then Sun. night I was supposed to meet a friend for dinner, she juist got back from her honey moon, totally forgot until 2 hours later and had to apologize profusely. She forgave me but was disappointed, I mean I stood her up basically.

Duncan Is showing his true colors and I can see why someone may have purposefully lost him. But I am doing no such thing! I love him despite his behavior and we will just have to work on it. I keep meaning to start a thread but I''m so darned lazy. Sheesh how pathetic is that! I have a video now of him fighting his own bed! He chews anything he sees if it looks like something cool. Paper, toilet paper rolls, paper towels, jewelry boxes, lotion boittle, his toys when he feels like it. He barks at me when he gets rowdy and starts doing laps around the house at 2am. He is absolutely crazy! Here is his "upgrade" picture. He looks alot like my old dog and I find myself almost calling him Stanley sometimes. Its silly! Well I am going to finish my pedicure and take this wild thing for a walk because he needs it!

Thanks again for all the support! I appreciate it!

 

[ilovesparkles]

And Happy Fourth everyone!

 

[galeteia]

Sparkles! ((hugs)) It''s so good to hear from you, even if it is to hear that you''re having a tough time. I think obedience school is definitely a good investment for wee Duncan...

As much as moving on is a necessary thing, it takes forever to do. That relationship I mentioned, the one that yours reminded me of, took me at least as twice as long as any other to get over. I don''t know what it is about those painful up-and-down relationships, but they linger in a most distressing way. With the relationship and the breakup period added together, I think I spent at least 14 months crying on a regular basis. Brutal. Even now, years later, I still get a twinge of sadness now and then, when I am reminded of how badly he treated me, without ever really understanding what he was doing.

It makes me all the more grateful for the amazing man I am planning to marry, and I tell him as much all the time. I found him after I stopped looking, and that often seems the way of it... Sparkles, you are an intelligent, vivacious, pretty woman with a sea full of fish out there. I hope you find the right guy for you. ((hugs again!))

 

[Blenheim]

Sparkles -- I''ve been following this thread, and I''m sorry I didn''t respond sooner. Happy Fourth!

Grieving can be such an up-and-down process. It will get better, but it''s completely normal to have some rough patches on the way.

Duncan is a dashing little cutie, but I agree that training is in order. When we got Dylan, he wasn''t housebroken and he chewed everything that he could get his little mouth on. It''s been almost a month now, and through a lot of diligence and work he''s gotten so much better. I''ve been following him around taking things out of his mouth and giving him a bone or chew toy, and it really helped when he finally got that there are some things that we like him to chew on and there are some things that we really don''t like him to chew on. Also, walking him sounds like a great idea. Hopefully it will get some of that energy out. Have you heard of the book, "Cesar''s Way," by Cesar Milan? Our breeder recommended it, and I recently saw it recommended in the current Help with terrier thread (that includes ways of establishing good doggie behavior -- in that case, barking). It''s an interesting read. And, as an added perk, I often find that getting really immmersed in a book takes my mind off of things sometime.

Anyway, we''re here for you if you need us. {{hugs}}

 

[diamondfan]

Sparkles, I just did a bit of research (very little) but I hope you are hanging in there. To me, if you feel you dealt with the religion angle before, it seems that though you feel it was resolved, clearly to him it was not. Okay, I can accept someone revisiting something that important. I do not know much else about him other than the bit I read and looked up to get a sense of your story. I just have to say, again, not knowing all the details, I would have issues with some of things that have occured. Even if out of the original site you two hooked up, I just have some concerns and think you might be really aware deep down about what is right and what is not. I hope it all turns out well for you. I am not judging how you met or anything like that, just that overall he does not seem to be on you par in so many ways. It is okay to admit that and make some life decisions. Good luck and keep us posted!

 

[Mara]

duncan looks like a little devil but a cute one!!! i definitely think doing some training classes with him will help train both of you to get the most out of the relationship!!! if only men were so easy!

 

[bee*]

I think Duncan definitely needs some hours at the training school. It will take time for you to get over things and I think you should give yourself all the time you need. It will get better for you, right now just take care of yourself

 

[fisherofmengirly]

Hi Sparkles! I hope you''re feeling better today, and as time goes, it will be better and better, and easier and easier. My first relationship took me a year to heal from, just because I was so niave and completely unsure of what I wanted in life, what qualities I wanted in future husband, that sort of thing. I grieved for what seemed like forever, but that''s part of the process.

You will be in my thoughts as you heal and deal, Sparkles.

Duncan is a cutie. Good luck with the training; Flip could use some herself. Hyper thing she is!!

 

[akw94]

Sparkles,
Sorry to hear that you''re having a hard time. I am glad that you are taking some time for yourself and that he is doing the same. It is very understandable that some days will be easy and others will be hard. Just keep in mind that the good days will come back. It is normal for you to be sad at times about your relationship. Although it doesn''t sound like you''re saying it''s completely over, you also aren''t really together, so it''s probably even harder than a true break-up. Being in a middle stage somewhere can be agonizing b/c you really don''t have anything to hold on to, whether it be the two of you back together or the two of you apart and you adjusting to being single again. Do you have some sort of timeframe that you''re willing to work on things w/him or do you consider yourselves broken up w/o the thought of getting back together?
I hope that things continue to progress for you. You deserve only the best and much more than what you''ve gotten (imo).

Take care!

 

[Tigerbear]

Sparkles,

I wish I could be there to give you a great big ((((hug))). I know how painful break-ups can be, especially if it is with the person you expected to spend the rest of your life with. I think you need to give yourself some time to grieve - for the relationship that you had and for the relationship that you wanted to have.

I went through a horribly painful break-up several years ago. One thing that helped me tremendously was a book by Dr. Gray of Mars and Venus fame. It is called Mars and Venus Starting Over: A Practical Guide for Finding Love Again after a Painful Break-up.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0060930276/sr=8-1/qid=1152122424/ref=pd_bbs_1/102-3629503-8301724?ie=UTF8

Many people do not like this book because he believes in some blatant gender stereotypes. To discount the rest of the book because of this issue is short-sighted in my opinion. The book contains many useful exercises that allowed me to identify and express my anger and to effectively mourn my loss. I have recommended it before and the person who read it found it very helpful (a male friend of mine who had had a broken engagement).

I wish you the best.

 

[TravelingGal]

oops, posted in wrong thread!

 

[fisherofmengirly]

Hope your doing well, Miss Sparkles.

 

[ilovesparkles]

Thanks everyone! I don''t even know how I have been. I love this little Duncan, but man he makes me mad sometimes! I have been too tired/lazy to call anything for him. But I am reading a book called Cesar''s Way which I think someone heere also mentioned. It is really good, and I am trying to think of it when I get frustrated with Duncan.

Early this week I sent out a mass email to family and friends and K was still on my favorites list so he got it too. So he replied to that and it has been really bothering me. This was his email

"He’s very cute. I hope things are going well. I’m doing okay, I guess…just trying to take things day by day and hoping that at some point things start to make sense. I’ve tried to bring myself to pick up the phone and call, but for some reason it hasn’t happened yet. I guess I’m not sure what to say, talk about, etc. I do miss you, though…a lot. Anyway, give yourself a big hug for me…"

I replied that I accidently sent it to him (he already knew about Duncan). And that I think about him everyday and he is welcome to call me. THere are lots of things we can talk about and I have a million questions. But he is the one that needs to be responsible in making decisions and he needs to be the one to communicate with me.

I haven''t heard from him since and it just hurts so much. Its like it got way better and then everything took a nose dive. I am not functioning very well outside of work. I think I mentioned last weekend all the troubles I had. All I do is sleep or play games on the computer. And takes care of Duncan of course. I have been sleeping with K''s tshirt this week like a teddy bear and when I think about him or look at pictures I just bawl. But it seems like I need to do this. It doesn''t make a whole lot of sense to me. And I don''t know what to do to help myself out of this funk I have gotten in. I know its normal to have to grieve over this and all of you have been wonderful in supporting tat, but I just want it done with.

At what point is it fair for me to call him and say "I haven''t heard form you, I need to know what you have been doing and where things stand between us. I need closure, and I need to move on."? And I know most of you say move on without it, don''t wait around with the hope he can fix things, work on himself, and we can try to build a future together again. But I have this dream still that we were meant to be. And with all the love we shared I guess I can''t get over that. I saw the movie Prime and I hated it. And I can''t come to terms with perhaps that is how this relationship with K is too. That we can love eachother but things for us just can''t work for whatever reasons.

Ugh I don''t even know what I am saying anymore. So thank you everyone. I wish I could be here more, but its just too hard most of the time.

 

[Mara]

sparkles..it''s times like this that you really find out just how strong of a person you are. and you realize that no matter how strong you are, you can always be stronger. you have to look out for yourself, because no one else but you will in a situation like this.

as for moving on or a timeline or whatever, i think that one day you will just know if you are content to wait around for this guy to figure out his life so that you can move on with yours, or not. i think that if you take one day at a time, one day things will just be different...it will be a gradual slow thing but you will realize it one day.

it''s so unfortunate when in a relationship one person has that ''ding ding'' moment that they are unhappy with themselves, their life etc and decide to change it...because often times the other partner is left in limbo and that isn''t good enough. he is doing the right thing for himself. you continue to do the right thing for yourself. you should not be just working, taking care of duncan and sleeping. you should be going out with lots of girlfriends, distracting yourself and staying busy. doing nice things for yourself, having fun. you will realize that the ''fake'' smile or feeling that you have in the beginning will eventually become more real. you will really start to have fun. sleeping and working is not the answer.

hang in there and stay strong...remember, the bottom line is you deserve better than this.

 

[AmberWaves]

ILove, I'm so sorry this is still so hard for you. I know how that feels, and even though it ALWAYS seems like such crap to both hear and SAY, Things Will Get Easier. And believe me, I know how it is to deal with a hell-dog! As I type, I am currently playing goalie with my dachshund, trying to keep him from sticking his gross rawhide chewy under the couch (where he can't reach it, then barks non-stop until I can get it out for him- then I scratch my arm on some nail he's somehow unstuck).

Anyway, I was just watching a show on my idol, Lucille Ball last night. And something that was said broke my heart for her, and everyone this happens to: She loved Desi more than life. He loved HER more than life. So why did he cheat? Why did he drink? Why did they divorce after 20 years? It's so sad to know, that sometimes love really isn't enough. Sometimes you're NOT meant to be with someone, even if everything in your heart and head says you are. It breaks my heart to hear this, to think this. To KNOW this. I dated a guy for 3 years. I would have done anything for him. He was my life and soul. But we didn't go. We had better things to do, much more different paths to take. We had the saddest break-up, one that lasted for months. I couldn't let go. He couldn't let go. I thought that because our love was there, why didn't it work? Why couldn't love be enough? Eventually I realized that our hanging on was killing any chance of future happiness for either of us. I let go, cold turkey. After 3 years of talking EVERY night, it stopped. I shook, trying not to answer the phone, not to pick it up myself. Now, I'm engaged to someone else, someone I met when our relationship was ending, and my fiance is WHY I let go. Sparkles, it is SO hard. I know, SO hard. There is not a time that goes by that a song or a shirt, or necklace I own reminds me of HIM. But after awhile, it was all about memories of what we had, where we had gone. Not so much wanting it back, or wishing my fiance is him. He was not meant to be for me, nor I him.

It really is sad, I know. You'll get through it, just try to think about YOU. And your hell-dog.

I wish you so much luck.

 

[ilovesparkles]

Thanks Mara, I need to keep hearing that broken record. I''m sorry if its totally annoying. I am sure a lot of girls have gotten sick of hearing me over and over. So to all those that have stuck by I thank you!

AMberwaves, that means a lot to me thank you. I have been so good about not calling him after the first time. It is so hard. But emotionally I am still hanging on like he''s the last man alive. I wish it was simple, like I could take a pair of scissors and just snip it all away. But thats not how life is. A lot of times of think about Blueroses and wonder how she is doing. And how much harder this is for her. And I tell myself if she can do it after 10 years, I can certainly do it after just over 7.

 

[FireGoddess]

ILS, the best way is to treat this thing like a bandaid...if you pull it off quick and don''t drag things out, you will be better off in the long run. It might sting a lot at first but in the end you will get over the relationship quicker and be able to get on with your life. If you pull the bandaid off slowly (ie. keep in contact with him, hoping he''ll come around) it will be more damaging and hurtful to you for a longer period of time. You don''t want or need that.

At first of course you want to know what he''s doing, what he''s feeling...at times like this I just tell myself the worst so I can get mad and just get over it quicker. I tell myself he''s a dunce and probably so clueless he''s not thinking about me or the breakup, and he''s going to wake up one day and regret it, and it will be just TOO late and TOO damn bad for him.

 

[decodelighted]

I don''t have much to add, but wanted to say I''m thinking of you. Wishing you strength & support & distractions & more & more & more moments of feeling "kinda normal" even happy!

I agree with the band-aid comparison too. If it''s meant to be, things will work out even if you move on & date others & he does the same. Something will pull you back together later. That''s the way to hold onto the hope that''s too painful to part with -- AND -- allow you to move on & start proving to yourself that there ARE other, maybe better guys for you, close by, that can go to movies & will be eager to see you and talk to you and not so tortured with old baggage or personality issues.

IMO - talking to him now, asking something from him is pointless. He''s not gonna magically come up with answers. Realistically - you could still be waiting for "the verdict" long after he''s started dating local gals. I think a lot of us have lived through similar scenarios and it is SHOCKING and possibly even more painful than the initial breakup. Less so if you get there first.

Sometimes you don''t really totally 100% get over someone, until you meet someone else ...

 

[AChiOAlumna]

Date: 7/9/2006 10:12:41 PM
Author: ilovesparkles
At what point is it fair for me to call him and say 'I haven't heard form you, I need to know what you have been doing and where things stand between us. I need closure, and I need to move on.'? And I know most of you say move on without it, don't wait around with the hope he can fix things, work on himself, and we can try to build a future together again. But I have this dream still that we were meant to be. And with all the love we shared I guess I can't get over that. I saw the movie Prime and I hated it. And I can't come to terms with perhaps that is how this relationship with K is too. That we can love eachother but things for us just can't work for whatever reasons.

Sparkles...first of all, I've been following your thread and I'm so sorry you are going through this. Please take care of yourself and do what you need to do for you. That being said...

I also had a broken engagement years ago. My then-FI decided the week of my college graduation that "I'm not ready to get married" and "I'm not ready to live together" (we were in a LD relationship and I was going to move in with him to make plans together and get my life established in his city before the wedding). But he wasn't ready to break it off with me...so we played this "game" of still seeing each other but not being officially together. One day, I called him. He had suddenly changed his phone number without any notice. I left a message with his parents in a panic hoping he was okay. He called and left a message for me, "I got your message. Don't try to contact me and don't call my parents. I am sending you a letter explaining what is going on." Can I tell you that if I held my breath for that letter, I would be blue in the face for 13 years!!! (Hence I never got that letter!)

In hindsight, it was the kindest thing he could've done for me. He cut it off, allowing me to focus on getting my life together (I can appreciate all the tears you've shed....honestly!) and trying to move on. I also had the dream that we were meant to be, but obviously there were other plans and paths of life that I needed to take before ever considering getting married. Eight months later I met my husband....we've been married for 11 years this month...

I wish the best for you with whatever happens, but please take care of yourself and do what you need to do to help yourself through this. If K returns to you, then it was meant to be....

 

[jesterjigger]

I haven''t posted much since I got engaged, since I was moving to Korea and things are hectic here, but I''ve been reading this post and needed to comment. Sparkles, I feel for you, I really, really, really feel for you. My last relationship, before DF was somewhat similarto yours. My bf of a year and a half just decided two weeks before his college graduation that he didn''t want to be in a relationship right now, he wanted to be on his own. Oh, but he still wanted to talk and see each other. I shut him out of my life for a month, and then he called and we arranged to visit each other again. It was better than dating, his was caring, considerate, kind, willing to do whatever I wanted. I thought if I was perfect for a whole month he would change his mind and want to be with me again. But he didn''t. So I went away for a two month school with the Air Force and told him before I left that I never wanted to hear from him again. And while I was gone I didn''t talk to him for a month. A little over a month even. But I started to feel lost in myself because I had changed from the uncertain girl that didn''t socialize very much to a girl that went out with friends all the time, especially dancing and drinking. I felt like I was just putting on a show, not being myself, and that no one at the school knew who I was. Then I started calling him again. We talked, and saw each other some when I got back to NJ. For two months. And he still didn''t change his mind. Then one night DF and I were drinking together and discovered that we had both been interested in each other for quite some time, but never made a move because he was in a similar situation with his ex-gf at the same time and he wasn''t sure where things stood with my ex. But that was enough for me. I told my ex I wasn''t going to see him anymore and haven''t looked back since.

Anyway, my point, in all this rambling, is sometimes you never get closure. And it''s better to just break off contact with the guy rather than trying to get that closure, or assuming, that because there is no closure, that things could still be fixed. I hope that you are stronger than I was...I think that you''re doing the right thing...but I wouldn''t talk to him. He made the decision that you aren''t what he wants. He doesn''t deserve to have your friendship. That was his decision, and you''ll only get hurt in the long run. Guys will say one thing to your face, but their actions will betray their words and it''s not worth lessening but prolonging the pain to get slapped in the face when he suddenly starts dating again. I know others have said it, but please, please, please just break all ties with him. It will hurt like hell at first. But in the long run you''ll be happier for it. And your FH may very well be the next guy to come along, and you''ll miss him because you''re still emotionally attached to your ex. If I hadn''t already known DF for over a year when discovering the interest was mutual I don''t know if I ever would have given up on my ex, at least until I moved this year...not wanting to get involved with someone else just in case my ex changed his mind. I did meet a guy, during the first month, went on two dates, discovered he was nearly perfect for me, but just didn''t go out with him anymore after I started communicating with my ex...if I''d kept dating that guy, maybe we would be married by now...who knows...so it worked for me, but it really screwed up my mind, and made the beginning of my relationship with DF harder, because I didn''t love as freely, I was always holding back, just in case he decided that he just didn''t want to be with me anymore, and it almost completely ruined things. But then we were finally honest about our feelings towards each other, and our hopes for the relationship, and it was full steam ahead from there. But he pointed out in April...if we''d been honest from the beginning we probably would have gotten engaged in January, not May.

So Sparkles, please, learn from my mistakes. Put him squarely behind you and don''t look back. You''ll heal and move on much faster.

And good luck with your new dog...he''s adorable, everytime I see his picture it cheers me up, I hope he''s still doing the same for you.

 

[Blenheim]

Oh, Sparkles, I just want to give you the biggest hug. The other girls have given you so much good advice, and I''m not really sure that I can add much. I just had a couple of thoughts. You mentioned standing up one of your girlfriends earlier. I''m sure that she understands that you''re really feeling down and won''t hold it against you. Call up one or two understanding girlfriends, make a date to go out, and ask them to come pick you up -- that way you can''t forget. And if you really really don''t want to go out when they get there, you can all watch a movie together or something. Just try to be around people who care about you. I''m also wondering if it might help to surrender K''s things, for a while at least. You could ask your mom to hold onto the pics for you, so that you''ll always have memories of your first love but that you don''t have to actually look at them when you''re feeling vulnerable.

 

[fisherofmengirly]

I totally agree with Blenheim''s idea to have Mom hold the pics while you''re feeling like you are now. And then later, when you''re at the point of being angry and arghy *which is a completely healthy place to be, because it means you''re grieving and moving on,* you can take some of those pictures and shred them. By hand. I did that with my past boyfriend, and I did save a *few* just to remind me who I was then and the values of going through that in who I am now. Shredding them up into tiny pieces was very therapeutic for me. A friend at work suggested it and I felt like a moron at first, but it really does help create real closure, real expression of anger toward the person for what happened, feelings that were hurt, etc. I know you''re not at that stage yet, but when you are, it really might help. A lot.

Keep on keeping on. I''m proud of you for not falling back into accepting less than what you need and deserve.

 

[IrishAngel7982]

Sparkles~
I had the same thought reading your post. You need to get rid of K''s things. I feel like you''re clinging to something that doesn''t sound like it''s ready to come back right now. Put his shirt, the pictures, and everything else in a box and have your mom put it away. I''m so sorry sweetie! I can completely understand the way you''re feeling. I won''t give you another story, but I was with someone for a year and a half with plans to get engaged upon our college graduation. I thought he was the one for me, and when he suddenly wasn''t sure what he wanted I went along with it because he "still loved me more than ever and wanted me in his life." It was only about a week or so later that I figured out there was someone else. He never cheated, but it hurt like hell, and about 3 weeks later I told myself I would not allow him to drag me around anymore. I called him (we still talked every day) and came right out and said, "I won''t do this anymore. Tell me what''s going on right now, or I''m done." He instantly said, "I just don''t want it anymore" with no reservation. I then realized he was never unsure about me, he was unsure how to break us up without coming right out and saying it because he didn''t have the balls to hurt me.

I''m not saying the same thing is happening here, but I am saying that all of these ladies are right. As hard as it is, you need to let go. Delete his email from your address book, delete his phone number from your cell. You may still remember them, but it takes more thought and effort to actually dial a number than to speed dial. Hopefully you''ll be able to stop yourself. I did the same thing...and trust me I questioned my decision almost every day and thought about calling or sending an email. When I started, I couldn''t bring myself to dial the first number or type his email address. After a while, I forgot his cell number and email address, and knew calling his home number wouldn''t do much good either. You need to start moving on now, Amanda. The sooner you move on, the sooner you''ll heal, and the sooner you''ll realize that maybe K wasn''t meant to be your husband, but his purpose in your life was to be an invaluable life learning experience. It takes a while, but when you find the person who is truly meant for you, you''ll realize it. You''ll also realize that K was not the one for you. In my experience, I was very sad at first, but now I realize it was the best thing. I wouldn''t have been happy with him in the long run...there were so many things that drove me nuts about him and I soon realized it never would have worked. I became very picky with whom I chose to date, found many frogs, but two years later I found my M and couldn''t be happier.

Oh, and as many others have said you absolutely NEED to read the book "He''s Just Not That Into You." It''s so good, quite entertaining, a quick read, and helps you to realize how special you are and what you should not settle for. Good luck and keep us posted sweetie, we love you!
~Megan

 

[sumbride]

I absolutely agree with Irish Angel. He did have a purpose in your life, but it wasn''t ever to be your husband. You need to let go completely.

When I went through that, I found burning to be very therapeutic... but paper only, please! I tore photos into shreds, I gave stuff away, and I just purged him from my life. It was mostly out of anger at the time, but the purge was crucial to my rebuilding. I look back on him not as a mistake, but as a building block. He taught me that I should expect more from someone that loves me, and that I love, and that I could find that. I did. And I thank him for it, but since I don''t have his email address, address, or phone number anymore, it''s only in my head that I say "Thank you" to him for letting me go. I''m so glad he did because it gave me a chance to meet the right person.

 

[Mandarine]

Ditto what the others said!...

I never been one to trash pictures of last relationships although with my last ex I did have some fun drawing a devil in his face and sending it off to all my girlfriends...hehe...I know, pretty immature but it felt good

M~

 

[blueroses]

I just typed a whole reply and lost it. (I HATE how my wireless is right now.) Net of it: HUGS. BIG HUGS!!!!!