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So is a Culet a GOOD thing?! HELP please

Janae335i

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 12, 2011
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83
:confused:
Hello, so I am assuming is is probably a personal preference thing. But is a culet good or bad? And what is the point of them????
When I first looked at my diamond online, I thought the report said no culet, but maybe I wasnt paying attention (no biggie). When I got my diamond I noticed it, then my Uncle/jeweler mentioned that it did had a culet, not big in comparison to the diamond. But ever since he mentioned it, it kind of bothers me that I can see right through my diamond.
Any thoughts about culets and do you like yours?!
I do understand they did this in vintage cuts, but why??

Thanks!!
 

LGK

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Nov 27, 2007
Messages
2,975
I have an antique cut diamond, 3.39 ct Old European Cut, that has a large open culet. Actually it's really only noticeably if I stick my stone right up in my face or loupe it. Which is to say, not that often during day to day wear. And usually you don't look straight smack dab down into your diamond- you see it at some sort of angle most of the time- so in that case, it just reflects light like any other facet. So, it doesn't bother me at all- in fact I personally like the look- but it is pretty subtle IMO even in a large diamond with a large open culet.

Some people hate the look however. If you're one of those, there's no reason to try to make yourself like it. It's simply personal taste, and if it's your taste to prefer a closed culet, then that's fine of course. I would see if you can spend some time actually wearing it (is it set?) in real life conditions and see if you even really notice it. (Like I said, even though I have really good close up vision and a fairly large open culet, I don't see it much myself.)

Culets were lopped off to keep the stone from chipping, at least that's what I've always heard as the explaination. I do question that logic a little, since cutters during the same time period purposefully created utterly razor thin girdles that really were a huge chipping risk. Whereas a pointy little culet really isn't a huge risk of chipping compared to that. Who knows... maybe it was simply done because that's what everyone did, y'know? No huge reason why maybe.

ETA: I just checked :tongue: and I can't really see the culet in my diamond at a distance of more than 6 inches. It's right around that distance that it becomes visible. Out past 8 inches, you really can't pick it out from the rest of the pattering and scintillation going on at all. And even so you need to tip it around a bit to see it even up close. And, remember, this is a culet that's pretty large and the diamond is also relatively large too.
 

Stone-cold11

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Sep 9, 2008
Messages
14,069
personal preference. some like the effect and the resultant patterning from the reflections.

Culet, probably to minimize weight loss in polishing of the rough.
 

Janae335i

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 12, 2011
Messages
83
Thanks for the info.
I don't think it's going to really bother me. I kind of think it's a bit unique to the antique stone. I can see it when I look at the diamond, but I only see through it when I am holding the loose diamond up in the air. And then I can see through it like a tiny little pin hole. But when I hold it above my finger it kind of blends in.

I'm more courious is the point (or lack there of - ha ha) in a culet.
 

diagem

Ideal_Rock
Trade
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Oct 21, 2004
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4,893
When the sawing machines were invented it changed the cutting world on many aspects.
One of them was taking a (larger sized) Octahedron shape crystal and sawing all 6 points off thus creating six more potential stones where before the invention these were cut off on the polishing wheel.
The resulting larger stone (after sawing) had a ready cut table facet, four cut off corner breaks and a open culet which brought the rough shape closer to it's potential polished outcome.

Open culets have a few reasons...

Design
Safety
Cut quality stamp, the culet shape and proportion reveals a lot about the craftsmanship of the cutter on the specific stone at subject.

Back in the days, it was also believed it was an entry point for light.

Hope this helps..., a bit.
 

CharmyPoo

Ideal_Rock
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Dec 10, 2004
Messages
7,007
Honestly, once you set your stone ... the culet is going to disappear!!
 

John Pollard

Ideal_Rock
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May 1, 2008
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DiaGem|1302336593|2891801 said:
When the sawing machines were invented it changed the cutting world on many aspects. One of them was taking a (larger sized) Octahedron shape crystal and sawing all 6 points off thus creating six more potential stones where before the invention these were cut off on the polishing wheel.
Exactly. I recall learning that when the rotary saw came into popular use in the late 1800s diamond cutters essentially started getting two-for-ones, causing DeBeers to react with one of the largest price-hikes in history. The more things change...

As explained above, for many years all diamonds had a culet facet added to protect the tip of the pavilion from being chipped or damaged. Why? Because they used to be exposed: Diamonds used to be set very low in jewelry and often the pavilion actually contacted the skin of the wearer’s finger, thus greater risk of damage to the exposed tip. Modern jewelry styles raise the pavilion of the diamond and the setting itself usually provides sufficient protection for the pavilion from impact and wear...no need to add a culet.

We also know, now, that a culet of medium size or larger can adversely influence light return...but a larger culet is still a part of the contrast and charm of earlier styles.

LGK|1302308249|2891594 said:
Some people hate the look however. If you're one of those, there's no reason to try to make yourself like it. It's simply personal taste, and if it's your taste to prefer a closed culet, then that's fine of course. I would see if you can spend some time actually wearing it (is it set?) in real life conditions and see if you even really notice it. (Like I said, even though I have really good close up vision and a fairly large open culet, I don't see it much myself.)
Great advice.
 

diagem

Ideal_Rock
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John Pollard|1302362337|2891952 said:
DiaGem|1302336593|2891801 said:
When the sawing machines were invented it changed the cutting world on many aspects. One of them was taking a (larger sized) Octahedron shape crystal and sawing all 6 points off thus creating six more potential stones where before the invention these were cut off on the polishing wheel.
Exactly. I recall learning that when the rotary saw came into popular use in the late 1800s diamond cutters essentially started getting two-for-ones, causing DeBeers to react with one of the largest price-hikes in history. The more things change...

As explained above, for many years all diamonds had a culet facet added to protect the tip of the pavilion from being chipped or damaged. Why? Because they used to be exposed: Diamonds used to be set very low in jewelry and often the pavilion actually contacted the skin of the wearer’s finger, thus greater risk of damage to the exposed tip. Modern jewelry styles raise the pavilion of the diamond and the setting itself usually provides sufficient protection for the pavilion from impact and wear...no need to add a culet.

We also know, now, that a culet of medium size or larger can adversely influence light return...but a larger culet is still a part of the contrast and charm of earlier styles.

LGK|1302308249|2891594 said:
Some people hate the look however. If you're one of those, there's no reason to try to make yourself like it. It's simply personal taste, and if it's your taste to prefer a closed culet, then that's fine of course. I would see if you can spend some time actually wearing it (is it set?) in real life conditions and see if you even really notice it. (Like I said, even though I have really good close up vision and a fairly large open culet, I don't see it much myself.)
Great advice.
Yes it can adversely influence LR when every sq mm of the face up is measured but can also return (reflect)light in certain ultra-flat Brilliants when tilted and/or in motion, in the later case its preferable to have a > large culet size as it would contrast with the shallow pavilion facet.

ETA: reflect might be a better terminology?
 

Haven

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Feb 15, 2007
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DiaGem|1302336593|2891801 said:
[ . . . ] Cut quality stamp, the culet shape and proportion reveals a lot about the craftsmanship of the cutter on the specific stone at subject. [ . . . ]
Your post was very informative, DiaGem. Would you mind expanding on the above statement? I'm really interested in this particular point, as I've never heard it before.
 

diagem

Ideal_Rock
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Haven|1302370116|2892022 said:
DiaGem|1302336593|2891801 said:
[ . . . ] Cut quality stamp, the culet shape and proportion reveals a lot about the craftsmanship of the cutter on the specific stone at subject. [ . . . ]
Your post was very informative, DiaGem. Would you mind expanding on the above statement? I'm really interested in this particular point, as I've never heard it before.
When a Diamond is well balanced in the cutting process the symmetry accumulates at the point where all the main pavilion facets meet up. When a small culet is polished parallel to the girdle and table, the way the culet opens is a micro view of the craftsmanship showing how and if the cut is well balanced. Kinda like the table but in micro (easier to see the faults).

I hope I am clear.
 

Haven

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Feb 15, 2007
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DiaGem|1302370986|2892031 said:
Haven|1302370116|2892022 said:
DiaGem|1302336593|2891801 said:
[ . . . ] Cut quality stamp, the culet shape and proportion reveals a lot about the craftsmanship of the cutter on the specific stone at subject. [ . . . ]
Your post was very informative, DiaGem. Would you mind expanding on the above statement? I'm really interested in this particular point, as I've never heard it before.
When a Diamond is well balanced in the cutting process the symmetry accumulates at the point where all the main pavilion facets meet up. When a small culet is polished parallel to the girdle and table, the way the culet opens is a micro view of the craftsmanship showing how and if the cut is well balanced. Kinda like the table but in micro (easier to see the faults).

I hope I am clear.
Very clear, and exactly the information I was looking for. Thank you!

My OMB has a culet, I'm going to go see how the culet lines up with the table . . .
 

Haven

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Feb 15, 2007
Messages
13,166
Janae--I LOVE culets on old stones, and I think yours looks wonderful on your stone. Mine has a large culet, but I can barely see it now that the stone is set. (Sorry I didn't respond to your original question at first, I was so interested in DIaGem's comment that I forgot my manners.)
 

Unicorn64

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 9, 2011
Messages
83
It's a matter of personal preference. Personally, I love a very large open culet especially on antique diamonds. I believe they also allow for the kozibe affect---when you see the culet in the crown facets in the face-up position of a diamond. I love that also...photo is courtesy of JBEG.

kozibe.jpg
 
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