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Shared Prong Melee Strength?

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lehcarm

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Oct 23, 2006
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242
Hello!

After reading the long thread about ultra sonic cleaners, I have a question.

Are shared prong melee diamonds less likely to dislodge from a setting than pave?
 

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HooCares

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jun 2, 2004
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199
I don''t know about the comparison between shared prong and pave. I would *guess* that pave might be more likely to dislodge. However, I did recently have a melee stone from my shared prong hoop earrings fall out during cleaning in the ultrasonic. Luckily, I found the stone and took a closer look at the earrings and my shared prong eternity band. Both had loose stones in them. I have read other threads about this and it sounds like most people think that the ultrasonic won''t cause a stone to fall out unless it is already loose. But now I am scared to put my shared prong melee jewelry in the ultrasonic.
 

mrssalvo

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 3, 2005
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19,132
I would say shared prong is safer than pave but 4 prong would be even safer.
 

Londonchris

Rough_Rock
Joined
Nov 29, 2006
Messages
96
My opinion would be that pave setting is the more secure.
It does however depend on the condition of the ring ect.
 

mrssalvo

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Jan 3, 2005
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19,132
Date: 12/8/2006 12:56:28 AM
Author: Londonchris
My opinion would be that pave setting is the more secure.

It does however depend on the condition of the ring ect.
can you explain this further? This is the first time I''ve heard anyone say that a pave setting would be more secure. There have been many discussions here questioning whether or not to even put a pave ring in an ultrasonic cleaner at all. Some say go for it, b/c if a stone is loose it will fall out there and others say no way.
 

Kaleigh

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Nov 18, 2004
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29,570
Date: 12/7/2006 5:12:54 PM
Author: mrssalvo
I would say shared prong is safer than pave but 4 prong would be even safer.
Ditto. I put my shared prongs in the US and haven''t had any problems.
 

Rosebud8506

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jul 10, 2006
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665
Date: 12/8/2006 10:00:50 AM
Author: Kaleigh

Date: 12/7/2006 5:12:54 PM
Author: mrssalvo
I would say shared prong is safer than pave but 4 prong would be even safer.
Ditto. I put my shared prongs in the US and haven''t had any problems.
curious as well....
 

oldminer

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Sep 3, 2000
Messages
6,318
Properly set stones that are in good condition jewelry will simply not be affected by ultrasonic cleaning. Diamonds set in worn out jewelry, diamonds that are already loose and jiggling, and diamonds which were never correctly set are all subject to falling out in an ultrasonic or anytime one cleans them.

Good setting work precludes stone loss as it is a craft dedicated to holding the stone securely regardless of the style. A lot of today''s "setting" work is less than good craftsmanship. THat''s a big problem.

Ultrasonic cleaners only knock out diamonds from pieces with pre-existing problems. Ultrasonics don''t create the initial reason for stone loss. However, a diamond which falls out in the ultrasonic is still recoverable. It is in the cleaning pot. A diamond which falls out while you are wearing the jewelry is often lost forever. I prefer to find lost stones and get them reset than permanently loosing them. So, I suppose using an ultrasonic may be a good way to be sure stones are secure AND the jewelry is clean with little risk.
 

lehcarm

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Oct 23, 2006
Messages
242
Date: 12/8/2006 12:23:39 PM
Author: oldminer
So, I suppose using an ultrasonic may be a good way to be sure stones are secure AND the jewelry is clean with little risk.
Thanks for you input David!
 

Londonchris

Rough_Rock
Joined
Nov 29, 2006
Messages
96
Date: 12/8/2006 8:37:05 AM
Author: mrssalvo

Date: 12/8/2006 12:56:28 AM
Author: Londonchris
My opinion would be that pave setting is the more secure.

It does however depend on the condition of the ring ect.
can you explain this further?
Quite simple really.
Pave set stones are set slightly below the metal surface so only the top is visible ,then secured by 2,3 or 4 grains/beads.
Prongs are basically bits of metal sticking up securing the stone,with alot more visible stone.
Which one sounds safer now?
Generally,both done well are good for years,but forgetting the odd exception i am in no doubt of my claim. (more explanations if required)
 

ljmorgan

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Mar 5, 2006
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1,037
Quest told me that the US cleaners are fine for my shared prong rings that they have made. Quest checks the rings every 6 months for loose stones, but they say if a stone comes out in the US, that''s a good thing, because the diamond is safe and can be brought in to reset. They said better to have a loose stone forced out in the US cleaner, than lost somewhere. I definitely agree!
 

JohnQuixote

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Sep 9, 2004
Messages
5,212
We strongly agree that craftsmanship & setting conditions must be first-rate; the company making the ring should be willing to back it up with guarantees. We also recognize that manufacture is only the beginning of the piece’s journey. An automobile can be manufactured to perfection, but once driven off the lot there are differences in the way they're cared for. Two cars, identical on the showroom floor, may look much different after 50,000 miles. Similarly, one person might wear a ring for 100 years which remains flawless, but someone with a different lifestyle could have a different experience with the same ring, no matter how well made. We’ve seen rings we produced long ago looking brand new and others which were exposed to considerable trauma.

What can a jewelry lover do to help? Keep your diamonds and your settings clean. Make sure the prongs are checked every six months or so. Also, become aware of your personal habits with your hands and your jewelry.


Diamonds and settings...There are 3 primary reasons that diamonds, particularly small diamonds, may come loose.

1. The diamond wasn’t set properly: Among top manufacturers this is uncommon, but is still a possibility.

2. Residue: When the setter is drilling holes, burring, filing, etc. there is microscopic residue; metal filings, polishing rouge, etc. When a tiny diamond is set there is a possibility for microscopic particles to exist between the diamond and the setting. This is the reason some professionals do not recommend ultrasonic cleaners for melee: Concentrated vibrations can affect the most microscopic residue, causing it to be lost. In rare cases this might cause the diamond to move or fall out. Fortunately, when this happens in an ultrasonic cleaner, the diamond is easily found.

3. Wear and tear: It's an unpredictable part of life. Some people are heavier on their rings than others. As a ring gets knocked or bumped, metal may be worn away or become loose and a diamond may move in its setting. If a person's diamond rings are scuffed or dented he/she may want to consider designs and materials appropriate to his/her lifestyle when making a purchase. Depending on how rough someone is it may be preferable for him/her to have white gold rather than platinum for the body of the piece. Clients who request very thin bands or thin prongs are often advised that the piece is delicate, but the designer cannot know how hard someone will be on the ring. We will not make diamond bands/prongs under a certain thinness for this reason. Plain settings with large diamonds are less vulnerable to damage than thin shafts/prongs or delicate craftsmanship with melee and pave. Some of it also depends on the relationship of the size of the diamonds to the size of the metal holding them.

When a diamond comes loose or falls out each case must be considered separately. It may be the responsibility of the manufacturer, or it may be due to something the wearer did. There are telltale signs when it's the wearer's responsibility, such as scratch and scuff marks, a ring that is out of round or dings and dents. However, if there is minimal wear and tear then something didn't allow the stone to sit correctly, and it is the manufacturer's responsibility. To a large degree 'responsibility' is about how much the company that made the ring is willing to back it up. Policies vary. For our part, if something happens due to improper setting or residue we restore the ring as part of the lifetime warranty. If it was due to wear and tear it's the responsibility of the wearer. In some cases we may choose to warrant it anyway, after a cautionary discussion with the client. There is no such thing as an invulnerable ring and every person is different but all of the top manufacturers we know craft each piece hoping that it will last a lifetime.
 

strmrdr

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Nov 1, 2003
Messages
23,295
The way pave is done today there is no question to me that shared prong is stronger when both are done to the same skill level.

In the old days where a lot of metal was moved over the stone it might be a contest but not today.

Ask a good metalsmith who does repairs on a wide variety of rings which he sees more of in for repairs and it will be pave hands down.
How do I know....
I asked one :}
 

strmrdr

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Nov 1, 2003
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23,295
Date: 12/8/2006 5:10:24 PM
Author: JohnQuixote

There is no such thing as an invulnerable ring and every person is different
true that :}
 

Londonchris

Rough_Rock
Joined
Nov 29, 2006
Messages
96
Date: 12/8/2006 5:37:37 PM
Author: strmrdr
The way pave is done today there is no question to me that shared prong is stronger when both are done to the same skill level.
High street trash level then quite possible.
 
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