Searching for an OEC. Am I doing it right?

[umbrella]

Hi folks,

Hoping you can bear with my noobness and steer me in the right direction if there's anything I've missed.

I'm currently searching for an OEC diamond to purchase. I have a limited budget of $1800 (the less the better) but I am willing to go up to about $2000 if the diamond is a showstopper.

I'm after an eye clean OEC, at least 5.7mm in diameter (preferably closer to 6mm) which is roughly 0.8ct and up, depending on depth etc. I love the larger chunky facets with a floral pattern, and a noticeable culet which is visible to the naked eye, so probably medium to large. I love warmer diamonds and am after something in the J-L/M range, flexible on color.

I am having the engagement ring custom made by David Klass. David has offered to find an OEC for me, however I am also keeping an eye out if I come across a beauty. Does anyone have any experience with David Klass sourcing diamonds? He did show me photos of one he found (too small for me), but the photos he sent through were unfortunately washed out with flash glare, therefore making it really hard for me to tell if it was a good OEC or not. I'm worried that future photos will be the same, making it difficult for me to choose a diamond.

In the mean time I am keeping my eye out on DiamondBistro and LoupeTroop, and today I have emailed Adam from Old World Diamonds with my OEC criteria, waiting excitedly to get a reply I know there is GOG however their prices seem quite high and I'm not a fan of AVRs either. I haven't emailed Love Affair Diamonds or Jewels By Grace yet, should I contact them or is my price to low?

I live in Australia so I'm very limited in seeing OECs in person, and I therefore heavily rely on accurate photographs via email, and the jewellers keen eye when selecting my future OEC.

So am I on the right track to finding the right diamond? Am I missing anything?

Thanks for your patience!

 

[Phanie]

ask Erica at loveaffairdiamonds.com
she is amazing just sourced one for me and about to source more!

 

[athenaworth]

I second contacting Erica. She has a ton of stones to choose from. I'm sure she'd have what you're looking for.

 

[MMtwo]

Also try jewelsbygrace.com

 

[umbrella]

Great, thank you all for your advice so far. I will definitely email Erica and Grace.

My next question is: With the small diamond size, will it be difficult to see the facet pattern well with the naked eye? Will I be able to be quite flexible and perhaps choose a diamond which doesn't necessarily have the "best looking" or even facets, but one that still throws lovely chunky pastel flashes?

 

[Gypsy]

One of my OECs is 5.5 mm and yes, the pattern is hard to see sometimes depending on lighting, etc. But it is definitely there.

 

[arkieb1]

Erica currently has a large stash of uncertified OECs that she wishes to sell so you might find something in that that is budget friendly and a nice cut if you email her.

The smaller the stone the less you will see the facet pattern, although you will still be able to notice that it is different to a RB on close inspection. I am in Australia as well

 

[Phanie]

Mine is an OMC 5x5.5mm in my ering and I can see the pattern well.
I wear glasses (or more like I should since I don't always wear them!) and I can the pattern well.
Mine has a huge culet which might help too.

 

[umbrella]

Thanks everyone for your input. I've emailed Erica and Grace, and now I just need to wait until I (hopefully) see some beautiful OECs that I might be possibly purchasing! This is very exciting for me.

I've been trying to look at as many OECs online as I can while I wait for the vendors to get back to me. Is there a thread dedicated to OEC diamonds/rings? I couldn't find one, but surely there is such a thread dedicated to the stunning old cuts!

I'm hoping to go to some antique jewellers today and see my very first OEC in person, yippee.

 

[athenaworth]

I have a little stash of .5ct OECs and I can see the pattern pretty well in them.

Congrats on your new adventure! You're gonna love it.

 

[the_mother_thing]

Others have covered the bases here that I know of, short of maybe posting a WTB listing in the preloved section. You never know when someone might have something they don't mind parting with to fund another project.

 

[the_mother_thing]

This one is a bit over your budget max at $2800, but is 5.5mm, Gia certed and has a nice kozibe effect going on, it seems. Others would have to chime in on the stats, but several people have bought from this seller and recommended her also.

https://www.etsy.com/listing/186981937/gia-certified-vintage-old-european-cut?ref=shop_home_active_1

 

[arkieb1]

I was going to ask where do you live (near any capital cities) so I could point you towards places to go and see some.

 

[caf]

Looks like she will not sell stone separately.

 

[the_mother_thing]

This one looks like a nice possible option from LAD! I really like the mounting and might be interested in that if Erica splits the stone & mounting.

http://www.loveaffairdiamonds.com/0-89ct-old-european-cut-diamond-ring-j-k-vs1/

 

[the_mother_thing]

Looks like she will not sell stone separately.

Oh crud. I didn't see that, but it was over budget anyway. The lad ring I just posted might be a good option. Even if lad won't separate stone from setting for sale, OP could resell it ... Rather easily, I imagine.

 

[umbrella]

hi Arkie, I'm in cold Melbourne. Know of any OEC vendors here?

JoCoJenn I'm a bit wary of Etsy, but that LAD looks like a lovely OEC. Hopefully it's a good price without the setting. Is it just me or does it appear to have a black spot in the table, and possibly a feather between two prongs on the bottom right?

Athena those are some stunning diamonds! Thanks for the eye candy.

Thanks all for your help so far! Definitely opening up loads of options for me

 

[arkieb1]

I am in Brisbane, there are a small number of members in Melbourne. If you want to go and look at OECs I know places to look and compare but they are expensive, having said that, I would suggest going and trying things on. Online vendors will be much cheaper I think for actual purchases, but going to dealers is a good way to work out what your eye prefers;

Rutherfords;

http://www.rutherford.com.au/catalogue.html

Alfredsons;

http://jamesalfredson.com/

Mary Titchener;

http://marytitchener.com.au/

There are deals here occasionally as well on Aussie ebay we have about 3 vendors here that sell antique jewellery online on ebay.

Other than that I recommend Adam of OWD, both Erica and Grace, GOG for their used diamonds and OECs, US ebay if you are brave and know what to look for.... watching the preloved sites is a great idea too, some wonderful things pop up on LT and DB.

 

[ringcat]

Umbrella I live in Melbourne.

A couple of years back, I was looking for an OEC and one prominent city jeweller told me he could get them in for me. He did get some in for me but they were incredibly overpriced.

I found another jeweler, www.imogene.com.au who got a really nice OEC for me to look at, and the price was more reasonable. Kathryn specialises in antique Jewelery and is a pleasure to deal with.

In addition to that I kept an eye on Leonard Joel jewellery auction catalogues. There was often some OEC on it but I did not come across one of warmer colour.

Www.helenbadge.com also has some nice jewelry. Maybe they can help.

Hope that helps. I would also take a walk down Little Collins St and just go in and ask jewelers. Some can source OECs. That's what I did. But I have to say the US prices were cheaper. So, I took a look at a few OECs but then preferred to buy from Adam or other PS vendors.

 

[arkieb1]

A lot of the local auction places and a few ebay sellers here have a number of pieces that are "deco style" or whatever era with the word "style" in them, these are cheap repo pieces made in China. I have seen a number of OECs and Antique cushions are not genuine Antiques they are newly cut old cuts at some of these places, and they are exceedingly shallow and are pretty ordinary to look at having been cut primarily for maximum spread/size and the visual impact of size rather than the quality of the cut.

 

[Agnasia]

I had almost exactly the same requirements! I bought my OEC from Jewels by Grace and had a fantastic experience, I also had to do it sight unseen as I'm from the UK but totally trusted Grace. The diamond is amazing and I am over the moon, so would definitely say going a less risky route is better if you are doing this from a distance.

I can definitely see the facet pattern and was actually surprised by how obvious it was in this size. Oh and sign up for both LAD and JBG emails, that's how I found mine from a sneak peek and also keep an eye on their FB pages as the goodies get snapped up quickly!! Wishing you luck on the hunt and when you know you know!!

 

[umbrella]

Wow thanks again to everybody for your incredibly helpful posts.

Arkie, I went to Rutherford today! All I can say is "wow, wow, wow!!". They had so many Art Deco originals and reproductions which were simply incredible. I tried on several pieces, each very different to one another and I loved them all. I was so surprised to try on rings that online or in store I wasn't appealed to at all, but once on my finger they looked beautiful. Makes it a bit tricky for me because I already have quoted a different design with David Klass, but not at CAD stage or anything yet. Perhaps I need to try on some more pieces before I make my final decision.

I was a little surprised to not notice a big difference between the old cuts and the modern cuts. I think the lighting in store didn't help too much with that though. The diamonds sparkled a tonne, but it was difficult to really get a close look of all the facets because of all the flashes of light! There was one diamond though which had delightfully chunky facets, I loved it.

I can't wait to see more!

 

[the_mother_thing]

JoCoJenn I'm a bit wary of Etsy, but that LAD looks like a lovely OEC. Hopefully it's a good price without the setting. Is it just me or does it appear to have a black spot in the table, and possibly a feather between two prongs on the bottom right?

I see that black spot in the picture but I didn't see it in the video. My guess is it was a reflection or something on the diamond vs in it. That feather looks to me to just be a fuzz. She has it listed as a VS1 so I don't think those would be visible inclusions with that level of clarity. Erica knows her diamonds pretty well, and I don't think she would misrepresent. Also, the report with it states it is eye clean, which leads me to think it was just a fuzz and reflection, spec of something, or "photographic anomaly" of some sort. Seriously, that OEC appears to fit your criteria to a T, and my GUESS is that it would be in your budget if sold separately. I would email her PDQ to see if she will sell the OEC solo, and ask her about the spot & fuzz.

I have watched her site closely, and lately, it seems things are being sold quite quickly. I have a mounting on hold/layaway with her myself that I am dying to get my hands on, but with multiple projects going on, I have to practice the painful art of patience to pay for them all.

 

[umbrella]

Ok I have an update!

So I took a big risk and placed a bid on a 3 stone OEC ring on ebay. I know as a newbie ebay wasn't really recommended and it is a pretty big risk to take, but there was something so thrilling about the auction! I read this thread by Dreamer_D from back in 2011: [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/risky-buy-paid-off-oec-goodness.167685/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/risky-buy-paid-off-oec-goodness.167685/[/URL]

That thread inspired me to search ebay for something that might fit my criteria. I took some of the mentioned advice for getting a good value diamond: crappy photos, good reputation, and good return policy. Well I found a 3 stone OEC ring, which definitely had crappy photos, but the centre diamond size was exactly in my range, .86ct measuring 5.7x5.8mm, depth unknown. It looks like it has a fairly high crown (I hope so anyway). The two side OECs are bonuses for me, perhaps I'll make them into earrings down the track. They are about 0.15ct each (tiny!) measuring 3.3x3.4mm. All three diamonds are not certified, but the seller was adamant they are eye clean with no carbon spots anywhere, and only small inclusions through the loupe. The centre OEC is quite warm, which I love. From what I can see in the photos, the facets might not be totally symmetrical or perfect, but that is part of the old cut charm. I think because of the diamond's small size I won't obviously notice the uneven facets anyway. It seems to have pretty awesome kozibe

So I sat nervously at my laptop this morning, staring at the price of the ring, hoping that nobody's bid will overtake mine. I know most auctions skyrocket in the last 30 seconds, and therefore my heart was racing for the last minute. To my surprise there was only 1 small bid made with 2 minutes to go, and none further! I won the auction almost $200 less than my highest bid, I was ecstatic and unbelievably surprised! Yes it's a bit of a gamble, but the seller has 100% feedback with lots of previous sales, and has a no questions asked returns policy, so if it does end up a dud, I can always return it.

I'm planning to have the ring sent to me in Aus so I can inspect the diamond, and if I'm happy with it I'll send it back to the States to David Klass and have him pop it in a 14kt unplated white gold, custom, art deco inspired halo. But I'll have a few weeks to wait before I receive the ring which will be a struggle for me! In the mean time I have the photos to ogle at, which I will share with you all. I'm hoping the diamond is okay and I haven't bought a terrible stone, because it was a really great price. Feedback will be great, even with the crappy photos.


I also wanted to quickly address your previous kind posts:

JoCoJenn - I watched the LAD video again and I could see the black spot there. I know it's probably minuscule, but I really don't want a carbon spot in my diamond, even if it's only noticeable really close up. I have emailed Erica about it and she thinks there might be a tiny tiny carbon spot, but she will confirm with me soon. The stone is available without the setting.

Agnasia - Thanks for the tip! I've signed up to LAD's and JBG's newsletters now. Glad to hear your diamond purchase with Grace was great.

Arkie - Just wanted to let you know how jealous I am of your Brisbane weather at the moment! Melb is so cold.

ringcat - Good advice from a fellow Melbournian! Perhaps I'll check out Collins St in the meantime to get my OEC fix and some more inspiration for my engagement ring setting.

Now onto the fun part, pictures!











Just wanted to thank you all so much again for your suggestions! I can't wait until I receive the ring so I can share some better pictures with you

 

[arkieb1]

Hi congrats on taking such a big leap, when you get it look at the centre stone carefully see if you can see if it has a dull ring just out from the centre area or not, if not then it's a winner and a keeper, if it is just all sparkles and you don't notice anything also a keeper, if it has a dull spot in the centre or a dull ring just out from the centre and you don't like it send it back for a refund. I don't want to scare you it is incredibly difficult to take decent photos of OECs they frequently look much nicer in person than in pics, their pics aren't very clear so it is difficult to tell if it is going to be really great or have a duller centre zone. It has a small table and is quite deep, so hopefully it will be a winner but you won't know for sure until it arrives.

 

[umbrella]

Good advice Arkie, thank you. I will definitely keep that in mind when I receive the ring. Hopefully it is bright and sparkly. I'm not sure if I'll bother getting it certified, but I'll certainly have a close look at it with my eyes and with the help of the macro setting on my camera. Do you happen to know if there's any GST if the total price including import tax equals less than $1000? This ring was quite under my budget, and I think I remember reading somewhere that GST is exempt for items worth less than $1000.

ETA - Glad to hear you think it has a small table and is deep! I really wanted a small table

 

[arkieb1]

Usually stones like that are firecrackers but you have to watch out there is no nailhead if they are too deep or dead spots in the centre area. I can't see it in your first pic, but the rest of the pics are too badly done to be able to tell.

There should be no tax, hassles or hold ups with customs if it is under $1000.00 AUD, that also makes it a lot easier if you have to return it as well.

 

[umbrella]

Alright great, fingers crossed it's a firecracker, but I won't get my hopes up as I know I've taken a big gamble. Sadly the pictures really aren't much help. Glad to hear that there shouldn't be any hassles with import or GST charges. I was keeping those charges in mind and therefore was planning to only buy the ring if it didn't have those fees, purely so return would be easier/cheaper if necessary. Thanks for your speedy replies Arkie

 

[misskittycat]

Good luck with your purchase!

If all else fails, Keshett on Little Collins Street or Kozminskys also stock a lot of beautiful original and repro pieces. Rutherfords is amazing but pricey - they are also the Australian distributor for Singlestone.

 

[ringcat]

Congrats on the purchase umbrella! Can't wait to see more pics of your ring. It's great that it's also under 1,000 so you won't have any GST or return hassles.

Keshett on Little Collins St is pretty good. I have been in their store and heard some great things about them too.

Misskittycat, I didn't know Rutherfords was an SS distributor. Do they have any SS pieces on display?