Racism on Pricescope

[kenny]

... Overall I imagine moderating this forum would be difficult. Most of us have very strong opinions on, well, everything. I am grateful we have a moderator that welcomes concerns and feedback.

+1

Kudos to Ella and Andrey.
They really do a great job, especially given the playground of spoiled brats we can be.

 

[Missy]

Well my name has been brought up several times so I feel compelled to comment. *I know we all form impressions of each other based on what is posted.* That's only natural. However there are definite patterns that are difficult to ignore. We all have different world views and while that can provoke interesting conversation, I do think some posters take their personal world view as FACT. That can create some problems. I have personally cringed many times and sometimes struggle to "ignore" certain comments. I am not sure I would define that as insanity. I know I will not change anyone's personal views. Sometimes I just have to "say" it out loud for myself. It's hard to judge motives as mine have been misinterpreted before which led to *threats* by several posters. Luckily those were identified by Ella and told to stop. Overall I imagine moderating this forum would be difficult. Most of us have very strong opinions on, well, everything. I am grateful we have a moderator that welcomes concerns and feedback.

Tacori you are right. And I did not mean people who were/are compelled to respond to certain posters are exhibiting behavior that is insane. My apologies to you if that is how it sounded. I just mean for me it was insane because it was aggravating me and making me feel ill to keep replying to someone who was just not *hearing* what I was saying. I did not mean to make a comment on anyone else's behavior and I am sorry if it seemed that I was. For my well being and my sanity I just had to stop reading what some people were posting. But I also realize that silence can be interpreted as agreement sometimes and nothing could be further from the truth for many of us here who are ignoring certain posters. But thank you and the others who are taking the energy and time to respond and share despite the wall you are hitting.

Your second paragraph hits the nail of it, and is also some of what Deb, Matata, and others have been discussing--does it belong here? What of someone's right to be bigoted? What is the harm? Is this "policing" speech? Wonderful to see you, Missy. You are such an incredible part of this community.

Indylady thank you and right back at ya. (((Hugs))). I usually feel discussion and debate can be helpful and in fact more than once made me realize *I* was wrong about something (and I was quite grateful) so in general I feel it is helpful to be allowed to discuss most topics. However, I also feel in this case there are posters (and in this specific example one main poster), who keep taking things to a ridiculous new low. But some could say this is the price we pay for freedom. It is a tough call when you look at both sides of the issue.


And I agree with Kenny. I think Ella and Andrey are doing a fantastic and difficult job despite the challenges and thank you both.
Andrey and Ella-Most of us greatly appreciate you. This isn't easy.

 

[Tekate]

I want Ella's job..... who should I ban?...

me me!

(please don't!)

 

[psadmin]

PriceScope's vision is to make this a wonderful place to enjoy, learn and be helpful in all aspects of bling!

Most communities ban any political, religious, racist, etc discussions as it has shown it usually brings down the communities. Regardless, due to the election and requests by members we felt allowing political threads and related items with some leeway would be nice.

I truly believe that we have very smart and wonderful members here. I have seen many very thought out and intelligent posts even when they do not agree. It does gets heated in some conversations, but overall it has been nothing compared to other places I have seen.

Please remember that not all posts are written/read as they may have been intended too. I still occasionally misunderstand my darling wife when she speaks to me. So imagine when it comes to the written word from someone you never met.

We ask that everyone try and learn to play with each other so that it is not taken away.

As for moderation, not all posts or situations are truly black and white. There are many shades of grey. We accept all feedback and suggestions, but in the end we need to make the call. Please respect our judgement calls. We are trying to do our best.

Lets take a deep breath and enjoy the bling!

After all, it is the love of bling that has brought us all together.

 

[Tekate]

Yup, are you talking to me?.... yes, wife and I could have chosen the poverty route when she was pregnant (1986) with our first daughter, but we both were young and naive instead of going on welfare we chose to work and raise our kids. Had we chosen the welfare route what do you think the chances of my daughters graduating from college? the answer? ...slim and none!. We always keep in mind that as parents what we chose in our lives will have big influences on our kids.

To this day wife and I are very proud.. not to depend on welfare when we were young with a baby on its way.

So, yeah both of our daughters are now working full time and contributing to the treasury of the US (paying a lot of taxes) don't you liberals love to hear that?

My apologies to all the PSer liberals here....I'm sorry that we didn't choose the liberal way.

Just about as mhttp://www.pewsocialtrends.org/2012/12/18/a-bipartisan-nation-of-beneficiaries/any republicans/conservatives have used entitlement programs in the USA.

 

[december-fire]

I would never want the job of moderating this forum or any other! Life's too short!

People will always have different opinions, perspectives, etc. Its interesting to read those when they're expressed in a respectful and considered manner.

Ella and Andrey,

Thank you for doing a difficult and sometimes thankless job!

I've learned a lot from PS, laughed at the cute and funny stuff, and had the pleasure of 'on-line' meeting the lovely people here.

Thanks!

 

[AGBF]

Dear Andrey,

I cannot tell you how much I have enjoyed being able to discuss politics and religion on Pricescope, and I hope that, despite a few minor lapses, I have generally kept up my end by being courteous and adult in my postings. I believe that having this forum (or having a private room off Hangout) to discuss these issues in depth with people who would like to sink their teeth into the issues of the day and also the historical and philosophical issues that came to bring about the daily issues is sometimes the only thing that keeps me sane!

I really appreciate your extending us the space and Ella's time for our discussions. Please let me, personally, know (via e-mail) if there is anything I can do to help.

All the best,
Deb

 

[OreoRosies86]

Add me to the "Thank you admins" team. I know it's probably like herding cats sometimes.

 

[december-fire]

Add me to the "Thank you admins" team. I know it's probably like herding cats sometimes.

Yes! Herding cats who turn on you and scratch you!

 

[redwood66]

Thank you Andrey and Ella.

 

[Tacori E-ring]

Missy, I promise I was not upset with your comments. I think it is great that we all can figure out what feels right to us (ignoring vs responding). I know we are in the same page but some of the personal attacks/character assatinations make me very uncomfortable. Ruby herself has participated in "fighting dirty" many times. I try to disagree with the idea not the person. I also stand by what I said in the women's match thread. It's hard not to see someone who disagrees with everyone as someone who is struggling with something. Just seems an exhausting way to live. Overall this is a great message board and I feel so grateful to have found it so many years ago.

 

[minousbijoux]

I want to add that while I don't agree with the political views of some posters, I don't paint them all with the same brush and put them all on ignore. There is one in this thread (without naming names, who responded to the "cabal of 3" comment ) who expresses their views in a thoughtful, logical and responsive way. I welcome and read their posts (there is no condescension meant in what I wrote; I appreciate your posts, and want to give you props for voicing an opinion which here at least seems to be in the minority). Some here legitimately want to have a dialogue and build relationships, and some do not. I block those that don't, as it appears that their behavior is limited to attention seeking at best.

 

[YadaYadaYada]

You know I was thinking about the post from psadmin above. Granted not everyone is good at putting thoughts into words and sometimes things can be taken out of context but I don't see that with Ruby.

Her posts come across with a very mean-spirited tone and she is argumentative to an extreme. From my own personal experience even when I told her she offended me, there was still no effort on her part to make amends, instead she totally ignored me. While I admit that I don't read her threads generally, there is a theme to all of her posts and it is almost always negative. This all tells me that she is coming across exactly the way that she is, there is no mistake or taking what she posts out of context otherwise I'm sure she would be quick to point it out.

No, I'm not giving her a pass, she is mean to posters period. Perhaps it is possible that she didn't realize really how her posts come across, well then this is the wake-up call, the opportunity to turn it around.

I am not putting a lot of faith into that possibility though and that is not to be a mean girl, it's just being honest.

 

[kenny]

I want to add that while I don't agree with the political views of some posters, I don't paint them all with the same brush and put them all on ignore. There is one in this thread (without naming names, who responded to the "cabal of 3" comment ) who expresses their views in a thoughtful, logical and responsive way. I welcome and read their posts (there is no condescension meant in what I wrote; I appreciate your posts, and want to give you props for voicing an opinion which here at least seems to be in the minority). Some here legitimately want to have a dialogue and build relationships, and some do not. I block those that don't, as it appears that their behavior is limited to attention seeking at best.

This is very well put, and how I've come to feel.
I do not put every conservative on ignore.
I have put liberals on ignore.

It's hard to articulate my ignore criteria.
Didn't some senator say, "Pornography, I can't define it but I know when I see it."?
It's a gut feeling, or how a poster rubs me.
A lack of [what I'm going to call] intellectual and conversational honesty is a biggie, like when a poster will say ANYTHING ... ANYTHING, just to 'win' an argument or save face.
........, "Competitive talking, anyone?"
That, and if a vendor is subversive (argues against good cut) and has dishonest practices and conversational dishonesty.

 

[Missy]

Missy, I promise I was not upset with your comments. I think it is great that we all can figure out what feels right to us (ignoring vs responding). I know we are in the same page but some of the personal attacks/character assatinations make me very uncomfortable. Ruby herself has participated in "fighting dirty" many times. I try to disagree with the idea not the person. I also stand by what I said in the women's match thread. It's hard not to see someone who disagrees with everyone as someone who is struggling with something. Just seems an exhausting way to live. Overall this is a great message board and I feel so grateful to have found it so many years ago.

Thanks Tacori and I agree with what you wrote. Generally I try to be upset with the idea/the behavior and not the person. People are complex and it isn't right or fair to classify them as "good" or "bad" unless of course they keep showing us over and over and over "who" they are and it all sort of goes in one direction. And I agree with you with what you wrote about when someone is having a tough time in life it can affect your whole perception of things and cause you to react and behave differently. I think of my mom who is dealing with so many health issues and it affects her in more than just that way. Makes her more challenging just to talk to because she is in pain. For her the physical pain turns into a mental struggle as well. And I always remember the wise saying:
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle" and I take these words to heart.

But there are exceptions and I sort of feel more like StephanieLynn right now with regards to one or 2 posters. Some people just don't keep deserve the benefit of the doubt anymore IMO. Not after time and time and time again they show who they are and well it isn't a pleasant picture.

I don't care about their political affiliation. This has nothing to do with that. For me.

I agree with minousbijoux-

Some here legitimately want to have a dialogue and build relationships, and some do not. I block those that don't, as it appears that their behavior is limited to attention seeking at best.

+1

 

[Tacori E-ring]

Missy I agree. Threats and name calling are NEVER acceptable.

 

[Dancing Fire]

This is very well put, and how I've come to feel.
I do not put every conservative on ignore.
I have put liberals on ignore.

It's hard to articulate my ignore criteria.

For some unknown reasons my ignore function doesn't work on KENNY...

 

[kenny]

Did someone just say something?

 

[Matata]

Well my name has been brought up several times so I feel compelled to comment. *I know we all form impressions of each other based on what is posted.* That's only natural. However there are definite patterns that are difficult to ignore. We all have different world views and while that can provoke interesting conversation, I do think some posters take their personal world view as FACT. That can create some problems. I have personally cringed many times and sometimes struggle to "ignore" certain comments. I am not sure I would define that as insanity. I know I will not change anyone's personal views. Sometimes I just have to "say" it out loud for myself. It's hard to judge motives as mine have been misinterpreted before which led to *threats* by several posters. Luckily those were identified by Ella and told to stop. Overall I imagine moderating this forum would be difficult. Most of us have very strong opinions on, well, everything. I am grateful we have a moderator that welcomes concerns and feedback.

I hope I didn't make you feel uncomfortable. Your words about a particular poster affected me, made me evaluate my reasons for responding to her and how I did so. For me personally, I felt that responding could do harm and I did not want that on my conscience.

 

[AnnaH]

While I disagree with a poster's concern regarding the college recommendation, I also disagree with those who call her a racist. The outrage on both sides seems over the top to me. But most with strong opinions either climb on the wrong soap box or climb the right one and stay on it too long. It happens.
And some ragging on her have been as rude as anyone posting here. It appears that some have trouble seeing that if they generally agree with said persons or perhaps even know them irl.
Within the rules, people may post what they want and others can agree or disagree. To say that a few who aren't in lockstep with the crowd ruin HO for everyone seems spiteful.
Few here who actually post regularly will agree with me, but I'm accustomed to swimming upstream. To those who discuss without calling me every ist in the book (there are a few) I appreciate you.

 

[AGBF]

To those who discuss without calling me every ist in the book (there are a few) I appreciate you.

I have always found you to be a rational and civil poster, Anna. I do not know why anyone would have a problem with you other than an ideological one. (I have that and and I believe you have that with me, but civilized people can disagree.) That does not mean that I think everyone who posts on Hangout has good manners, because I do not!

Deb

 

[Trekkie]

I haven't been on PS much recently. This used to be one of my favourite online hangouts.

I don't mind the political posts. I'm not American, so I don't always understand who the main players are, but I find it informative to read these posts anyway, even when they disagree with my point of view. I have enough friends who share my views, it is enlightening to read the posts from those whose views differ from my own: I am not growing or learning anything new by living in an echo chamber.

Having said that, what deeply saddens me is the underlying racism of some of the recent threads. The fact that the offenders refuse to see what they are saying as racist is even more upsetting. Keep in mind, I was born in South Africa under Apartheid to a coloured South African mother and a white English father. If they'd been caught my mother would have been imprisoned and my father deported. Like Trevor Noah, my very existence was evidence of a crime. With this as my background, you can imagine that it takes quite a bit to wind me up. Ruby59 did, which is partly why I stopped coming here.

Not because Ruby59 conservative - so is DancingFire, and I enjoy many of his posts, even though I disagree with him on a number of points. He is an immigrant, as my father was, and just like my father he had a choice to rest on his laurels and live off welfare or work hard to build a better future for his family. He, like my father, chose the latter option, and I find that greatly admirable. There are several other posters who, over the years, have made comments that I have side-eyed, but I would like to believe that just as I learn from them, my presence here (albeit infrequent) has given them the opportunity to learn something new.

One incident that stands out is how, in the midst of the Ebola crisis, a member (whom I have always admired and won't mention by name) made a throwaway comment about a country at the epicentre of the outbreak being jungle. I reacted in a way that I am not proud of, but after a short discourse we were both able to see the other person's side, and I would like to believe that we both emerged better off.

I don't quite know why the forum is entertaining Ruby59 quite as much as they/we are. She's been here for 13 years and in that time has created three jewellery related threads (I could be mistaken but when I tried to check, her profile had disappeared). The rest of her posts have overwhelmingly been political, and of a shit stirring nature. She is not coming here for jewellery. She is not coming here to learn. We are not learning anything new by engaging with her, so why are we entertaining her?

 

[azstonie]

Completely agree.

 

[Dancing Fire]

I don't quite know why the forum is entertaining Ruby59 quite as much as they/we are. She's been here for 13 years and in that time has created three jewellery related threads (I could be mistaken but when I tried to check, her profile had disappeared). The rest of her posts have overwhelmingly been political, and of a shit stirring nature. She is not coming here for jewellery. She is not coming here to learn. We are not learning anything new by engaging with her, so why are we entertaining her?

b/c she is one of the 3 conservative left to pick on?......Humm, I think she is gone now.

 

[arkieb1]

Add me to the "Thank you admins" team. I know it's probably like herding cats sometimes.

+ 1 and just like a room full of cats sometimes they get along, sometimes they want to spray and mark their own turf and other times they want to shred each other. Bravo for putting up with that.

 

[House Cat]

b/c she is one of the 3 conservative left to pick on?......Humm, I think she is gone now.

No one is forced to come here. The conservatives that are supposedly being "picked on" make a conscious choice to come to this forum each day. They have been coming here for a long time now. They know the deal. They are the minority opinion. There will most likely be a large amount of push back when they share their opinions. This isn't because everyone is "picking on them," but because there are so many more Liberals on this forum. It is strictly a numbers game.

As far as ruby goes, I hope she finds a forum that is a better fit for her. If I am being totally honest, I hope she gets some help too.

 

[redwood66]

No one is forced to come here. The conservatives that are supposedly being "picked on" make a conscious choice to come to this forum each day. They have been coming here for a long time now. They know the deal. They are the minority opinion. There will most likely be a large amount of push back when they share their opinions. This isn't because everyone is "picking on them," but because there are so many more Liberals on this forum. It is strictly a numbers game.

As far as ruby goes, I hope she finds a forum that is a better fit for her. If I am being totally honest, I hope she gets some help too.

And yet some persist despite the numbers.

PS is definitely not a microcosm of the US and people should not be fooled into believing it is. Maybe a microcosm of New York or San Francisco.

Edit - I should correct myself and say that of the people who post PS is not a microcosm. There may very well be quite a gathering of conservatives out there but many of you scare them into keeping quiet.

 

[Missy]

And yet some persist despite the numbers.

PS is definitely not a microcosm of the US and people should not be fooled into believing it is. Maybe a microcosm of New York or San Francisco.

Yes that is quite painfully true. That's how someone like Trump got elected.

 

[redwood66]

Yes that is quite painfully true. That's how someone like Trump got elected.

And sadly so is this kind of comment.

 

[Arcadian]

Trump got elected because people in enough states that had the most electoral college votes didn't want a President Hillary. That transcends Party or Race! While the DNC put forth someone with experience, the candidate had an incredible amount of issues! My honest opinion is it would not have mattered about the interference. She was not well liked and MANY on both sides (lets not even talk about the minor third party folks!) and didn't feel she was the right choice.

I felt she didn't do as well as the polls said she did at the debates, even the one where she was fed the questions. She and the party should own where they messed up. And lets add to that that plenty of registered democrats didn't even bother to vote! That right there is where folks should be mad.

I'm not saying that Trump wasn't problematic, he was and IS, what I'm saying is that he ignited an anger in this country thats been on simmer for a while. Its not black and white as some would presume, there's lots of grey shades going on there. Basically, don't presume a POC, or of a different religion didn't vote for that man. He got in because He Wasn't Hillary.