Questions about buying online vs. retail store

[bmfang]

From what I've heard about Robbins Brothers and Kays (they have similar equivalents here in Australia), their workmanship is sub-par. And most reputable jewellers (small or large) would usually give you those things you are talking about re: cleaning and polishing.

 

[WinkHPD]

Thank you for your courtesy in responding.

I was concerned that it might be a good distance from you, but it has been more than forty years since I lived in the LA area so I was not sure. When I lived there it was not at all unusual to jump on a freeway and drive 50 or more miles miles for dinner.

When my wife was pregnant with our son, she would hear about a restaurant with excellent cheesecake and off we would go. One hour to and one hour back, just for dessert. Hey, I learned early not to argue with a pregnant lady with a craving. Especially if it is the lady you love.

When I brought her back to Boise with me I introduced her to one of my favorite restaurants, The Eastside, a great Chinese restaurant that I had learned to love when I went hunting with my dad on the border of Idaho and Oregon. It was about sixty miles away from our house. She loved it and for years we would invite our friends to join us for dinner there. A few times I even flew us over in a Cessna 170 with another couple or with our children, as the night time flight back into Boise was spectacular viewing.

Sadly the quality went down, then the restaurant burned down and now we rarely travel more than five to ten miles for a meal. Of course, with the quality of restaurants in Boise, that is not a hardship. We Idahoans love a good meal and there are many places to make one for us. Even Paul Slegers, on one of his infrequent visits, told me that Barbacoa was the finest stateside restaurant he had ever eaten in.

I shared that the next visit with the owner who was genuinely pleased. It's not even our favorite restaurant, but please never share that with the owner...

Wink

P.S. When I visit my daughter in L.A., I can tell you that with today's traffic my wife would have missed most of those cheesecake trips!

 

[JTK]

From what I've heard about Robbins Brothers and Kays (they have similar equivalents here in Australia), their workmanship is sub-par. And most reputable jewellers (small or large) would usually give you those things you are talking about re: cleaning and polishing.

I suspect you are probably right about Kay and Robbins. I'd much rather go with a jeweler with greater skill. It's just very difficult to know who to trust. I take my diamond in to get it set.... how do I know the diamond I see when I come back in 4 weeks is the one I gave them? Ok, I take the ring to some other store to have them see if the diamond in it matches the certificate. Now I take the ring back to the smaller (unknown) jeweler for a resize or a polish. Again, how do I know they haven't pulled a switcharoo?

I'm struggling with the idea that I'm basically buying a small car to put on my girlfriend's finger, and I just don't know who I can trust to do the work on it. I don't want to go with Kay or Robbins, but at least in those cases they have a large chain behind them and it seems less likely they'd pull something shady and risk damaging the value of the entire brand/chain.

 

[WinkHPD]

I suspect you are probably right about Kay and Robbins. I'd much rather go with a jeweler with greater skill. It's just very difficult to know who to trust. I take my diamond in to get it set.... how do I know the diamond I see when I come back in 4 weeks is the one I gave them? Ok, I take the ring to some other store to have them see if the diamond in it matches the certificate. Now I take the ring back to the smaller (unknown) jeweler for a resize or a polish. Again, how do I know they haven't pulled a switcharoo?

I'm struggling with the idea that I'm basically buying a small car to put on my girlfriend's finger, and I just don't know who I can trust to do the work on it. I don't want to go with Kay or Robbins, but at least in those cases they have a large chain behind them and it seems less likely they'd pull something shady and risk damaging the value of the entire brand/chain.

Your fear is very common and it almost never happens. Actually a small jeweler has more to lose, as the jeweler will lose not only your business, but the whole community's business and then be out of business.

I once testified as an expert witness in a small Oregon town against a small jeweler who had been in the community for many years. He bought a ring from a client's son who told the jeweler he had found it on the football field. The jeweler offered $50, saying it was worth about $100. Problem was the client had just a few weeks earlier paid him a lot more than that to repair the ring.

When she came in to get the ring back he claimed he had already melted it down and there was no way to prove it was her ring. A very short time later she was back with the sheriff and a warrant and voila, there it was in a box full of other rings on a shelf in the back room.

I was asked to appraise it and testify as to the value of the ring. I appraised it at market value, wholesale and also quick cash value. Under Oregon law, it is a felony to misrepresent the value of an item by more than $200 with the intention of taking advantage of your expertise.

He lost and left town and opened up elsewhere, but I do not think he ever did as well as he had been doing for so many years. He literally lost everything in an effort to make a few extra dollars unethically. Sorry, off topic. Back to your issue.

You can protect yourself. When you are dropping off a ring to get sized, ask to look at the diamond under the scope and make a diagram of what you see. That way you can for one, ascertain that the diamond is not damaged before you drop it off, as well as see what it looks like under the scope. No microscope, no problem, find another jeweler.

When you pick it up, look at it under the scope again. You will know instantly if it is not the right diamond. You will also have the AGS or GIA report with the diamond, so after you have made your diagram, also look at the diagram on your report, BEFORE you leave it with anyone.

If you are doing this, YOU are the expert on YOUR diamond. No one in their right mind is going to mess with it. However, if they do, they are busted!

Wink

 

[totallyfree]

If you are worried about the process of handing a ring over for cleaning, repairs etc you also have the option of paying of this from an in-house jeweller when you require the service. I feel much more comfortable taking my ring to a local jeweller (an actual jeweller, not a just a shop front) and accepting I need to pay $50 or whatever for same-day service, than handing it over for a week and wonder who the jeweller is, where they work out of etc.

The jewellery store I worked at had all sorts of issues with jewellery in transit between the shop and the jeweller, and resulted in many a quick trip out to his house to pick up pieces for customers. While I hope that isn't the norm elsewhere it opened my eyes to some of the good and not-so-good practices that go on!

If your ring needs regular work then yes, the costs will add up. But it's an option you have open to you.

 

[JTK]

In my opinion, that 2.4 marquise will perform (i.e., sparkle) very well, based on the 360 video and the ASET. I have not looked at any of the other stones suggested in this thread, or what is currently available on the online market. In my past experience, only about 1 in 10 of marquise or pear diamonds available online are worth a second look, so if you find a nicely cut one that meets your budget and specs, you should consider striking sooner rather than later. To be clear, this 2.4ct marquise is one of these rare good ones.

If you decide to go for it, do make use of the vendor's return period -- i.e., see for yourself if you're happy with the way it sparkles under various lighting conditions. Do be careful to keep the diamond clean while you're inspecting it though, as oil (e.g. fingerprints) can drastically worsen the appearance/performance of any diamond.

Good luck!

Haven't been on this thread for a bit because I'm traveling for work but I did want to update you guys - because of posts like this (and others) helping me out, just before I left for Europe I had James Allen bring the diamond in for their gemologist to look at - I asked about yellow tinges, sparkle, and brilliance vs. crushed ice. The good thing about this is that it put the diamond on reserve (the 2.4c marquise) for 3-5 days while they check it out for me. Once they get back to me, I can order it sent to me and I'll be home in time to pick it up.

I watched this video to understand brilliance vs. crushed ice looks. https://www.laurenbjewelry.com/videos/index/view/id/5517#prettyPhoto/0/

I'm hoping that the marquise doesn't veer TOO far into the crushed ice side of things, though I don't mind a bit of it. This video just makes the two brilliant cut cushions look so much shinier than the crushed ice modified cut. But I won't really know until I see this marquise in person!

I'll upload a pic and report back once I have at it so I can get your thoughts!

 

[JTK]

Thanks Wink for the good story , and also Totallyfree for the advice.

Yes - LA traffic is horrible now and that jewelry store in El Segundo mostly only open during business hours, otherwise I'd go up one evening!

I'll hunt around Orange County and see if I can find a good place to do a setting. And of course, it seems as if the online vendor (James Allen) can offer to finish rings in around 2 weeks or so, while every store I've talked to so far has been telling me that customizing a setting (for a marquise diamond and a size 4) is generally 6-8 weeks or maybe 4-5 if I'm lucky).

I don't want to rush this, but I'm actually considering a late July proposal strategy if I can make it work, so going with a pretty setting at James Allen doesn't sound like a horrible idea, if the craftsmanship is up to par.

Assuming I don't need anything super unique for setting, do people on these board generally feel good about JA's craftmanship for settings?

JTK

 

[totallyfree]

Can you call JA to order it, but ask they don't ship it for 48 hours? That should give you plenty of time to get home.

Can't help with recommending a specific jeweller, but I am sure there will be one in your area. I too struggled with the 'but I want to touch it!' (and try it on, and play with it). If you like the diamond then start another thread calling for input into the type of setting, and the experts will chime in

 

[rockysalamander]

Do not go to Kay or Robbins. Search around here and weddingbee and you see a lot of horror stories...including switched stones and setting that fall apart. I'd stick with independent jewellers from ps recommendations. Endorsement from Wink would make the drive totally worth it to me. David Klass makes great rings and would be another option that you could just mail the stone off for setting.

 

[PintoBean]

You could also propose with the diamond, and together pick out or design a setting.

 

[Austina]

I've just had a ring made with a marquise diamond. I literally looked at 100's online, selected 3 or 4 and asked the ring designer to look at them and let me know what she thought. I was really surprised she didn't pick the most expensive (and highest clarity). I couldn't see the diamond in person, just 360 video(different continent) so I put my trust in her. I'd found exactly the same diamond advertised on another vendors site (same GIA certified number) for $1000 more!

Anyway, the ring arrived last week, and when I opened the box, I was stunned. It's a fireball of sparkle and everything I could've hoped for.

I've had mine set in a halo and low profile to protect the stone

 

[drk14]

I'm hoping that the marquise doesn't veer TOO far into the crushed ice side of things, though I don't mind a bit of it. This video just makes the two brilliant cut cushions look so much shinier than the crushed ice modified cut. But I won't really know until I see this marquise in person!

JTK,
As far as I can tell, "your" 2.40ct marquise has very little crushed ice, and its light return (appearance) will be dominated by the larger, "crisp" facets characteristic of brilliant cuts. That being said, the appearance of "crushed ice" diamonds in videos and photos can be misleading, as cameras are unable to focus properly on virtual facets with very long ray paths (which are what you get in crushed ice diamonds). Thus, in my opinion, evaluation of crushed ice diamonds should be done in person.

I have no direct experience with JA workmanship for settings, but the sense I get from PS forums is that the opinion depends on what style of setting you are considering. Are there any of the settings suggested in this thread that you are leaning towards?

 

[JTK]

JTK,
As far as I can tell, "your" 2.40ct marquise has very little crushed ice, and its light return (appearance) will be dominated by the larger, "crisp" facets characteristic of brilliant cuts. That being said, the appearance of "crushed ice" diamonds in videos and photos can be misleading, as cameras are unable to focus properly on virtual facets with very long ray paths (which are what you get in crushed ice diamonds). Thus, in my opinion, evaluation of crushed ice diamonds should be done in person.

I have no direct experience with JA workmanship for settings, but the sense I get from PS forums is that the opinion depends on what style of setting you are considering. Are there any of the settings suggested in this thread that you are leaning towards?

Thanks everyone!

If I were going to have James Allen do the setting (and that's definitely an if at this point), I'd be looking at this one https://www.jamesallen.com/engageme...-channel-set-diamond-engagement-ring-item-506

Because she loves channel sets and because that "pinch" or "bowtie" shape looks so nice with the elongated marquise.

This one might get some consideration too. https://www.jamesallen.com/engageme...set-princess-shaped-engagement-ring-item-7078

But as you can see, channel sets in 18k white gold are my guidelines here. My thought is that the small diamond chips in the channel set are safer than others, which is great since my gf loves channel settings.

Thoughts (on going with online setting)?

 

[drk14]

Those settings are OK, but IMO, many of the channel settings from JA show too much metal, taking some emphasis away from the melee diamonds (i.e., what you've been calling "chips"). As I recall, the JA settings you linked were the same that I was initially considering for my wife's engagement ring, although I ultimately ended up with something very different.

There should be other online vendors who offer similar styles that are a little more delicate. Hopefully someone will offer you specific suggestions. To start, you could take a look at Whiteflash's Legato Sleek Line Pave setting, although I'm not sure how you feel about the cathedral shoulders (the way the shank curves up to meet the center diamond).

 

[ac117]

Did she pick those settings or did you? Only asking bc those are kind of manly and clunky (no offense). Did she specifically say channel set? Bead/bright set looks similar in that the diamond are surrounded by metal walls but it's another form of pave which IMO looks a lot nicer and more feminine. One of these for example would look exponentially better:
https://www.jamesallen.com/engageme...-gold-perfect-pave-engagement-ring-item-55361 (choose marquise under shape and look at the real life examples!)
https://www.jamesallen.com/engageme...-22mm-pave-diamond-engagement-ring-item-22640
https://www.jamesallen.com/engageme...ite-diamond-accent-engagement-ring-item-50124

 

[farrahlyn]

ditto ac117. That first one she posted would be my pick (i think i may have linked it earlier in this thread), it's BEAUTIFUL with a marquise, the head on it is nice and feminine and the band is just .

 

[Austina]

I hope you don't mind me saying, but I think 'V' tips on a marquise look less (for want of a better word) clunky than those on the JA setting.