Please help me design a perfect tsavorite e-ring!

[giff1023]

Hi, I’ve been lurking here for a few months now as I work up the courage to get started on designing an engagement ring for my girlfriend. I’m planning on doing this with no input from her as we both like the element of surprise in an engagement. I do know that a diamond is not her thing and that her favorite color is green, so I love the idea of a tsavorite e-ring and have been inspired by some gorgeous rings I’ve found on this site (Pandora and Pokey’s especially).

I’d like to find a cushion cut stone somewhere between 1.5 and 2 carats. Color and brilliance are the two most important factors to me, and I love the tones of the pricescoper rings I’ve linked below. What I’m having the most trouble with is finding “the” stone. I’ve learned here that green is a very difficult color to photograph, and I’m just not experienced enough to evaluate windows, photoshopped images, and cut quality.

I’d love for suggestions on finding the perfect stone. Below are a couple that have caught my eye, but would I be better off trying to work through a cutter? My total budget is around 3-5k including setting (which is an entirely new ballgame that I know nothing about yet), and I think I would prefer to sacrifice on the setting to find the perfect stone.

My inspiration (I hope you don't mind me showing off your rings):
Pandora’s phenomenal ring: https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/finally-my-tsavorite-e-ring.75458/
Pokey’s spectacular ring: https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/leon-mege-daniel-k-tsavorite-pictures-inside.46513/

Stones:
http://www.gemfix.com/garnet_tsavorite.html (1.55 ct on the 3rd row)
http://www.swalagemtraders.com/sear...atch=&indicate=&reserve_type=&pagefrom=search

Wow. It’s a little intimidating putting this all on the record. That means it’s really happening – yikes!

Thank you for all your help!

 

[chrono]

Gemfix: the 1.38 ct rectangular cushion (1st row) has better saturation, yet the same tone you are looking for.
Swala: looks really nice with a touch of blue but is the picture accurate (due to the notation in caps on the webpage)? It looks to be well saturated but of medium light to medium tone rather than medium dark tone. Have you emailed Eric to inquire about the stone?

Also, please have both vendors HOLD the stones ASAP while both are under consideration so that lurkers will not snatch them from under you while you are asking for opinions here.

 

[giff1023]

Thank you, Chrono! I did look at the 1st row Gemfix tsav, and I agree that I like the tone and saturation a little better than the one I picked. My hesitation with that one is the stone is a little more elongated rather than closer to squarish.

I will ask Eric for additional pics of the Swala stone so I can get a better read on the color. Honestly, I'm pretty happy that you didn't tell me they had horrible windows or bad cuts... I'm glad my eyes aren't completely hopeless!

Great tip on asking for the vendors to hold. That honestly never would have occurred to me even though I'm drawing attention to them through this board. Thanks!

 

[T L]

I personally like tsavorites that are very slightly bluish green. Green is midway between blue and yellow on the color wheel. It can veer towards blue or yellow. I find that the more bluish green stones to be more vibrant and saturated in hue. The more yellow ones are not as saturated in my experience.

The gemfix stone looks to be more yellow than blue, and the Swala one looks to be more blue than yellow. I would ask Swala for a "hand shot" and I would personally rule out the gemfix stone because the color doesn't appear very saturated. If you like yellowish green, then that's fine, but one should pay more for a bluish green stone as they are a rarer color in tsavorite and tend to be more expensive.

I don't know if you ever saw Chrono's tsavorite, but it veers more towards the bluish green end of the spectrum.

I like the tone on the Swala gem as well, but that's my personal preference. It appears to be a medium tone.

 

[LD]

I have the twin from Swala and in fact, in Eric's wording with my Tsav, it was exactly the same as the one you've linked to so I would think they've come from the same parcel. IRL my Tsav is darker than Eric's photos (see below). However, it is a gorgeous stone and very sparkly!

Here are a few photos but I would caution that my camera hates the colour green so these photos are as good as I could get!

 

[minousbijoux]

LD - would you say there is a bluish modifier to your stone? Its hard to see from the photos...

 

[Pandora II]

Thank you for the amazing compliment! I hope your future wife will enjoy wearing her ring as much as I enjoy mine.

My stone is a medium-dark and very blue toned despite some of the pics showing a bit of yellow. It's very like the colour of fine emerald in person, but obviously doesn't perform the way an emerald does - tsavs sparkle rather than glow.

Looking at the two you have linked, I prefer the gemfix stone. I have a feeling that the Swala stone is going to be more of a medium green.

My stone came from Palagems, and I would suggest getting a jeweller to call them up and see if they have anything in stock - I've checked the website and there are some fab ovals, but nothing that I would recommend in terms of cushions but they often have stock that isn't listed on the site.

Have you seen any tsavorites in person? If not, it might be worth trying to find some. I love the medium-darks which do tend to carry a premium, but a lot of people prefer the more venomous green of the mediums.

If I see anything in my usual haunts I'll post it up.

Good luck with the search and I look forward to seeing what you come up with.

ETA: Just want to check that you know about the limitations of tsavorite e-rings... they're not for 24/7 wear.

 

[LD]

LD - would you say there is a bluish modifier to your stone? Its hard to see from the photos...

No. I wanted it to but it doesn't. It's just green! I like lighter Tsavs and the ones that look quite neon and this one is just medium and doesn't really have the punch that I wanted (or the blue)! Having said that, it's a very pretty stone and I'm hoping to set it in a Legacyesque bezel setting.

 

[giff1023]

Wow, this is all very helpful. It looks like I will have this weekend to myself (a rare occurrence), so I'm trying to see some tsavorite in person. So far I've been to two local (Boston/Cambridge) jewelers and both looked at me like I was crazy - never heard of it before. Does anyone know somewhere in the greater Boston area that might carry tsavs?

LD, that first hand shot looks very much like what I was hoping for - quite a bit darker than the swala website, and a great shade of pure green! I don't personally see either yellow or blue secondary hues, but my eyes are not as experienced as the rest of you at pricescope. Do you think it tends to look more like the first or second hand shot in person? To me, the second picture seems a bit lighter and mintier.

I'm waiting on Swala for more pictures (and asked them to describe the color as best as they can) and will post that as soon as I get them.

Pandora, I've read through a bunch of the tsavorite ring threads that you contributed to. That's actually what convinced me to change my original plan of an emerald ring (her birthstone) due to concerns about durability. I will have to explain all of your advice regarding how to wear and care for tsavorite, but I don't think it will be an issue to not wear the ring 24/7.

In general, I'm having quite the time trying to judge pictures of tsavorite between different vendors. Each seems to have a different style of photography with different backgrounds, lighting, etc. And that's before any photoshopping...

 

[athenaworth]

You should contact Gene at Precision Gems. I believe he has a PERFECT 2.1 ct tsav that is green with blue. Trust me on this, it's perfect.

 

[justginger]

My tsav is from Swala as well, and looked very much like the one you've linked and LD's - perhaps they're triplets? The original photo was much lighter, and more 'glowy,' than the stone appears in real life. IRL it's this rich, velvety green. I love it. I am terrible about seeing modifiers, so don't think it has one, blue or yellow. Anyway, here it is in real life - though the picture shows it a bit dark, in low lighting, though I do think it is a touch darker than LD's. In normal lighting it also doesn't have that half/half extinction thing going on.

 

[T L]

This is Chrono's tsavorite from Swala which I think was taken in indirect sunlight. Lighting might be a bit different than the other photos, but I think this particular photos shows off the blue in the gem well, and the perfect medium tone.

Everyone has such lovely stones!!

 

[T L]

You should contact Gene at Precision Gems. I believe he has a PERFECT 2.1 ct tsav that is green with blue. Trust me on this, it's perfect.

Yes, Yingh has a 2.33 carat tsavorite from Gene I believe, which was set in a custom Whiteflash mount. Gorgeous!!

 

[Pandora II]

Here's some pics of a ring I helped a friend out with.

Her tsavorite is a smidge more yellow green than mine, but otherwise they are fairly similar.

First - the image from Palagems:

 

[Pandora II]

Finished ring:

 

[giff1023]

Wow, more beautiful stones! I really like Chrono's - it looks like it's glowing with blueish/green fire...

Quick update - 0 for 4 for jewelers in greater boston with tsavorite. I think I may need to start an education campaign! Unfortunately, Gene had already sold his 2.1 ct, but he is going to look through some of the rough he has to see if there might be something appropriate.

 

[pregcurious]

In the Boston area, the only vendor for colored stones that I've seen mentioned on here is All That Glitters. Here is there Tsavorite page:
http://www.atggems.com/Photos_Tsavorite.htm

I like the 1.65 carat cushion, but don't know much about tsavs. If someone can comment on the pictures, that would be great. You may also want to look at their emeralds. Have you thought of a protective setting for the tsav since it's a softer stone for wearing every day (same for emeralds)?

 

[Pandora II]

Really like that 1.65ct stone!

I would go for tsavorite over emerald as it's far less brittle - garnets are pretty tough (except demantoids). You can also shove in through an ultrasonic - not so with emeralds, plus you don't have to deal with the whole treatment thing like you do with emeralds.

 

[T L]

Really like that 1.65ct stone!

I would go for tsavorite over emerald as it's far less brittle - garnets are pretty tough (except demantoids). You can also shove in through an ultrasonic - not so with emeralds, plus you don't have to deal with the whole treatment thing like you do with emeralds.

Yes, emeralds are also more glowy, and have a satiny like appearance, whereas tsavorites sparkle and are more brilliant (when well cut and clean). It depends on what you like better. I love my emeralds, but they are definitely different than tsavorites by a huge margin IMO. I think the only thing they have in common is that they're both green, but the finest emeralds exhibit a very slightly bluish green hue like nothing I've ever seen in any other gemstone. They are uber expensive though.

 

[giff1023]

Thanks for all the advice. I think I am set on getting a tsavorite vs emerald (despite still not having seen one in person!)

Unfortunately, I did hear back from Eric and the Swala stone is long gone, though he does have another that he has in mind for me that isn't on the website (I should be able to share pictures soon). The only issue is that it is a whopping 2.8ct (7.9x7.5x5.75) which is bigger than I had originally thought. Is this too big for an engagement ring? I don't want the ring to be too blingey. I'll have to steal one of my gf's rings to measure to figure out a ring size since that will help determine how big is too big (I want to say that her hand size is "medium", but I realize that's probably less than helpful )

I do love the look of the 1.65ct All That Glitters Tsav, and am trying to arrange to see it in person. The negative there is that it is significantly pricier than the other tsavorites I've seen ($1750/ct). Does that seem reasonable for a good quality, well cut tsavorite, or should I expect more in the Swala and Gemfix range (~$750-1000/ct)?

 

[athenaworth]

Did you contact Precision Gem? Please do that. I know you'll love the one I'm thinking of.

 

[T L]

Thanks for all the advice. I think I am set on getting a tsavorite vs emerald (despite still not having seen one in person!)

Unfortunately, I did hear back from Eric and the Swala stone is long gone, though he does have another that he has in mind for me that isn't on the website (I should be able to share pictures soon). The only issue is that it is a whopping 2.8ct (7.9x7.5x5.75) which is bigger than I had originally thought. Is this too big for an engagement ring? I don't want the ring to be too blingey. I'll have to steal one of my gf's rings to measure to figure out a ring size since that will help determine how big is too big (I want to say that her hand size is "medium", but I realize that's probably less than helpful )

I do love the look of the 1.65ct All That Glitters Tsav, and am trying to arrange to see it in person. The negative there is that it is significantly pricier than the other tsavorites I've seen ($1750/ct). Does that seem reasonable for a good quality, well cut tsavorite, or should I expect more in the Swala and Gemfix range (~$750-1000/ct)?

Tsavorite pricing depends on a few things, which exponentially makes the price jump

1) Being larger than 2 carats (tsavorites tend to run smaller)

2) Being eye clean and loupe clean (they are often visually included)

3) Saturation of color (this is a bit tricky as some sellers will think their stone is very saturated, but it isn't).

The first two criteria are pretty straightforward to anyone, including a novice, but saturation is not. You really need to see a lot of stones in person to determine the true strength of saturation, especially on a high priced gem. If the stone veers towards yellow, or even away from blue, on the green end of the spectrum, I think it should be less valuable, and that's how I've seen dealers price these stones.

That being said, I do think $1750 PER CARAT for a stone less than 2 carats in size is a bit pricy.

 

[justginger]

Eric actually being on the ground in Africa must help his prices, because during my search I couldn't find prices to beat his. It doesn't surprise me that ATG comes in higher/carat for a smaller stone - perhaps it's because of it's American cutting? Regardless, I would be keen to see the larger stone from Eric. I have an 8 mm garnet and find it is just perfect for a 'larger' ring, and I have small hands (size 3.25). Stones also tend to look smaller over time, as you get used to them, so I reckon it's actually close to perfect sized.

 

[PrincessCath]

Giff, for one thing, a tsav e-ring is a great idea. If your GF likes green stones, she will love it.

I would try to find out what shade of green would be her favorite. I love the light blue-green, eye-clean emeralds you find in antique jewelry even though that's not the premium color, and they don't have any "gardens". I also find the lighter tsavs very attractive, and you many be able to get a larger stone within your budget. It's all a matter of taste...

 

[colorluvr]

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/tsavorite-pear-w-pear-diamond-sides-in-18k-yg.171287/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/tsavorite-pear-w-pear-diamond-sides-in-18k-yg.171287/[/URL]

This is the thread on my Tsavorite that I got from Prima Gems. I don't know your timetable, but Jaimeen is going to Arusha at the end of March (I think). You could email him and see what he has now or let him know what you are looking for. Be sure to let him know you are a PSer.

I'm more than pleased with mine. It has a needle inclusion that can be seen in some lighting, but that kept the price down which was fine with me. I really like this stone because it just sparkles like crazy.

 

[giff1023]

First update of several (I hope) today:

Athena, I did contact Gene at Precision Gem and unfortunately he had already sold the 2.1 ct stone that you were thinking of. He offered to look through his rough for me to see if he might have something suitable.

I've also contacted Jaimeen at Prima Gems and hope to have a few possibilities to show off later today. As an aside, Jaimeen mentioned that he usually sees tsavorites in the 1-2ct size in the $500-1000/ct range depending on color, cut, etc. Thanks for the recommendation! He seems like a pleasure to work with.

Finally, here is the Swala stone recut. It lost about half a ct with the recut. Now clocking in at 7.65 x 7 x 5.45 (2.28 ct). I would appreciate opinions on this one, especially since it's priced at the very high end of my budget if I'm going to be able to afford to set it. I'm not sure if my eyes/the angle are deceiving me or if there is something a little funky about the top face. I will see if Eric can get me a couple additional pictures in different lighting conditions.

 

[T L]

Eric actually being on the ground in Africa must help his prices, because during my search I couldn't find prices to beat his. It doesn't surprise me that ATG comes in higher/carat for a smaller stone - perhaps it's because of it's American cutting? Regardless, I would be keen to see the larger stone from Eric. I have an 8 mm garnet and find it is just perfect for a 'larger' ring, and I have small hands (size 3.25). Stones also tend to look smaller over time, as you get used to them, so I reckon it's actually close to perfect sized.

My guess is more middlemen. The more times a stone changes hands, the more the price jumps.

To the OP,
It's a bit too early to comment on the Swala stone without additional photos, but that photo isn't really knocking my socks off. It may be more beautiful in person though. Chrono's stone is from Swala, and her photo knocks my socks off, as did Swala's of that gem as well. I was at Primagems booth about a year ago, and he had some gorgeous tsavorites, but only one with the saturation of Chrono's, and he knew it was special too (he said it was top color). If you want top of the line color, it is very rare, and prices are still rising.

 

[T L]

I also wanted to state that although some tsavorites are eye clean, some also have a sleepy appearance from tiny inclusions, rendering them less crystal than other tsavorites (see Yingh's 'sparkler' above). I am not a fan of "sleepy tsavorites" as they always look like they need to be cleaned, and they don't glow like other types of sleepy gems. I get the impression that the Swala gem you just posted is a tad bit sleepy, but I don't know for sure without confirmation from Eric and other photos.

 

[giff1023]

I agree that the Swala picture didn't wow me at all (despite a higher per carat price than their other tsavs). Eric is traveling, so it may be a few days before I can post some better pictures. Chrono (if you're reading this), do you still have the Swala ref# for your tsav? I'd love to be able to send that to Eric to give him an idea of what I'm looking for.

Prima did have a number of cushion tsavs, but I'm only a fan of one of the stones (below) which I think is lovely (though I wouldn't mind a little bluish tint). It is a bit smaller than I was hoping for at 1.2 ct, though. Jaimeen did mention that he will have a new parcel in next week, so I'm hoping that something comes out of that.

 

[Pandora II]

If you want an idea of size on hand, my stone is 1.42ct, 7.25 x 5.75 and I wear a size 6 1/4.

It is hard to choose!

On the ATG stone, I'd be suprised if it's middle men putting the price up with them as they go to source in general - IIRC, they were the first people to sell Malaya garnets?

It's still the nicest stone I've seen in a long time - I suggest emailing them to see why they have the premium.

Have you tried going to Bruce Bridges at Tsavorite USA Inc? His father discovered Tsavorite, and he may well have something good!