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Picking out an engagement ring stone, was told to come here.

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Nid

Rough_Rock
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This was from another forum I frequent:

Seriously, just copy and paste your whole post over on the pricescope.com forums. Those people know everything there ever was to know about diamonds, and they do nothing but think about this shit all day long.
This is what I posted:

I''m starting to shop around for a ridiculously overpriced little piece of shiny stuff for my girlfriend and she doesn''t know yet. I came in to A/T and checked for a thread and found this so it looks like I should ask here.

School me on my diamond choices.


First off I''ve been to 3 local places so far with several more I want to check first, and have gotten a decent lesson on color/clarity and grading and all that jazz, so I think I know about the kind of stone I''m looking for.


The one that really caught my eye as being fantastic happened to be at Shane Co. Which, according to the OP, I should avoid due to cost, etc. Plus the fact Shane filed for Chapter 11, however according to the people who worked there they told me that it will not affect future establishment of the business. However forewarned is forearmed.


However, the one stone I reeeally liked down there was as follows: 0.53ct, color E, clarity I, brilliant round. Price was $1370 for the loose stone. I understand I is lower on the clarity grade, but I looked at it under the loupe and could only find one occlusion that was off to the side that wasn''t really noticeable by the naked eye. This diamond just exploded with light, and was extremely ''bright'' for lack of a better term.


The next stone I looked at was 0.44ct, color D, clarity SI-3, brilliant round. Cost was $1320 or something, it was close in price to the larger one. This one had a couple of tiny tiny bubbles in it according to the loupe, which were just barely noticeable with the naked eye due to location.


Either of these diamonds set in a white gold solitaire ring, combined with the wedding band that had 2 sapphires and 2 small diamonds that wraps around the solitaire engagement ring after tax came out to about $2200.


At another location there was a .56ct, color G, clarity SI-2, brilliant round already set in a ring for $2100, but that doesn''t include a wedding band.


Third location had a .47ct, color G, clarity SI-1, brilliant round loose stone for $1300, on sale for $1080.


I understand that once you get past a G it''s practically impossible to tell the color grading apart, especially if you don''t have the diamonds sitting next to eachother. However, after looking around at what I''ve seen so far I could definitely see the color difference between D/E and a G. I''d also like to be able to get a 0.50ct stone or larger. I know that you visually won''t really be able to tell the difference between a 0.48ct and a 0.52ct, but it''s kind of a personal pride thing to me to be able to say that it''s a half carat and mean it. Also, I wish I could go with a much larger stone, but realistically there''s a lot left to purchase so that''s why I want to get the biggest, brightest one that I can for within my budget.


My girlfriend has told me that she''s really inexpensive to impress but that''s not the point. I want to make sure I get the right stone.


All that aside, the reason I think we''re ready is for our 1 year anniversary I got her a very elegant white gold band with tiny little diamond chips in it, something sparkly because I thought it was pretty. She had it sized to her right ring finger but now all she does is wear it on her left. I asked about it one day to see why and she asked me if I was afraid of commitment, to which I replied no, I''d rather just get something appropriate if that''s where you want it. She laughed and reminded me to ask her dad first. To me, that''s kind of saying she''s interested.


What else should I be looking at? I kind of know the kind of stone I want to get, am I on the right track? I want at least 0.50ct, color F at the very lowest.
I''ve since had some questions answered and think I found a stone about what I like at another location, the info was:

It sounds like you''ve done lots of thinking about the stone, but do you actually know what type of setting she likes? For me, this would be as important if not more so than the stone choice. Some guys choose to get a very simple, cheap solitaire setting to present the rock with, then let the girl have a hand in choosing the "real" setting later. I personally think this is a great idea, but you know your girl best.
To which I replied:

Thanks for the other info, will do that but I figured I''d post a reply to this bit right here. I''ve seen all of the rest of her jewelry and all of it is white gold, some has sapphires, but all of it is very refined and elegant looking. Nothing huge or flashy, and I feel confident I''ll be able to pick something out to match.

I went to one other place yesterday that had probably the best looking stone yet. I kind of feel you need to pick the stone then pick a ring to match, based off of what I know about her jewelry I really want it to have some fire.


This stone I saw yesterday just exploded with white light. It looked like there were little silver and white needles all through the diamond, which the lady said had something to do with a narrower cut to the facets on the bottom part.


Info was .56ct, E, SI-2, GIA certified. Cost was $1512 for the stone which was a little more than I wanted to spend for just the rock, but really it was the best looking one I''ve seen yet, even compared to the larger .60+ct diamonds I was looking at. Looked at it under the glass and it looked near flawless (yes I understand flawless is a real grade, I''m just saying to an untrained eye it was fantastic).
Is there anything else you guys can help with or am I on the right track? Hopefully I followed all the rules, first time posting here.
 

Regular Guy

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Date: 3/20/2009 12:57:57 PM
Author:Nid

This was from another forum I frequent:


Seriously, just copy and paste your whole post over on the pricescope.com forums. Those people know everything there ever was to know about diamonds, and they do nothing but think about this shit all day long.




Sorry...I stopped reading there, but my links (below) or others comments may be helpful...
 

cara

Ideal_Rock
Joined
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Messages
2,202
OK, pricescope is a good place to start, but perhaps a shorter post is in order. That one was too long and complicated for most people to bother with!

Please state your budget and other requirements (size, color, clarity) as best you know them. And are you open to buying online, and does your budget include the setting or not?

Might also help for you to read up under the 'Knowledge' tab above so you know the lingo. You've probably gotten a start by going to the stores, but the tutorials here might help you firm up your requirements and understanding of what they mean.
 

newbieD

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Date: 3/20/2009 12:57:57 PM
Author:Nid
This was from another forum I frequent:


Seriously, just copy and paste your whole post over on the pricescope.com forums. Those people know everything there ever was to know about diamonds, and they do nothing but think about this shit all day long.
Nid- I know you are repeating something someone else has told you. But if you've come here to seek advice from others, then perhaps you should reconsider starting your post out with that direct quote. I think you'll find some people will be put off by that comment. This is a forum (which I recently discovered as well) through which you can educate yourself and seek help/opinions of others and there are many people here who are extremely well-informed and well-educated about diamonds. And people here are more than happy to share their wealth of knowledge and experience. But, please remember to go about it with some tact and simple etiquette.

Personally, I found this forum extremely helpful in my own search for my engagement ring. Many people here gave me lots of insight, knowledge, and support throughout the process. And I am extremely grateful.

Just some things to keep in mind. Good luck.
 

Lorelei

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Hi Nid and welcome!

Ok as one of those who your opening quote probably applies to
, lets see what we can do to help!

Firstly are you open to buying online, or would you prefer to buy from a brick and mortar jeweller? You mention SI3 clarity grade above, just to let you know this is an EGL created and used term only, if the top two labs GIA or AGS were to grade the same diamond, it would probably come back as I1 or SI2 on occasion, I1 probably. EGL are considered by some to be soft on grading so it is often suggested to stick to GIA or AGS lab graded diamonds.

It is cut which gives a diamond its beauty so very important to concentrate on that. If you like and you are open to shopping online, if you give us your budget for the diamond, carat, colour and clarity requirements then maybe we could suggest some diamonds which might suit you?

If you prefer to shop at a store, then note down the details of the diamonds you like -

lab report type
depth %
table %
crown angle
pavilion angle
girdle thickness
diameter measurement
polish and symmetry grades

All of the above info will be on the report. Then we can help you determine which are the best cut going by the proportions and your personal taste when viewing the diamonds.
 

Lorelei

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2Artists

Brilliant_Rock
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Well you came to the right place there are many pros here as well as other kind hearted experts. I suppose there are some here who think about this "stuff all day long" but that would be because they run a related business or love this art and science as a hobby. When you run a business it occupies much of your thoughts and the best professionals love what they do.

That said do a search here on Shane Company and you will find both very happy and and very unhappy customers.

Even though lots of people think of this stuff as silly in actuality this is both a science and art. While even a cruddy diamond can sparkle in some lights (a little bit at least) if you get a quality one with a great cut you will be blown away by its performance. The difference between a poorly cut frozen spit type diamond and a well cut quality diamond are dramatic. A saying that you often hear on Pricescope is that "cut is king". List what your budget is and what you are looking for and people will be able to help with more accuracy.


Mrs.2Artists
 

Stone-cold11

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Date: 3/20/2009 1:47:36 PM
Author: Lorelei
SC, he says he wants F colour at the lowest and is colour sensitive.
Didn''t see that part. :razz: But anyway, figured if he is only looking at EGL stones, maybe he is not as color sensitive as he thinks.
 

Lorelei

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Date: 3/20/2009 1:58:52 PM
Author: Stone-cold11

Date: 3/20/2009 1:47:36 PM
Author: Lorelei
SC, he says he wants F colour at the lowest and is colour sensitive.
Didn''t see that part. :razz: But anyway, figured if he is only looking at EGL stones, maybe he is not as color sensitive as he thinks.
He says he viewed a GIA E colour so maybe he is one of those folk who can spot the differences!
 

Lorelei

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Date: 3/20/2009 1:55:06 PM
Author: 2Artists
Well you came to the right place there are many pros here as well as other kind hearted experts. I suppose there are some here who think about this ''stuff all day long'' but that would be because they run a related business or love this art and science as a hobby. When you run a business it occupies much of your thoughts and the best professionals love what they do.

That said do a search here on Shane Company and you will find both very happy and and very unhappy customers.

Even though lots of people think of this stuff as silly in actuality this is both a science and art. While even a cruddy diamond can sparkle in some lights (a little bit at least) if you get a quality one with a great cut you will be blown away by its performance. The difference between a poorly cut frozen spit type diamond and a well cut quality diamond are dramatic. A saying that you often hear on Pricescope is that ''cut is king''. List what your budget is and what you are looking for and people will be able to help with more accuracy.


Mrs.2Artists
This is so true and how I see it as a consumer enthusiast!
 

icekid

Ideal_Rock
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Messages
7,470

Date: 3/20/2009 1:16:36 PM
Author: Regular Guy

Date: 3/20/2009 12:57:57 PM
Author:Nid


This was from another forum I frequent:



Seriously, just copy and paste your whole post over on the pricescope.com forums. Those people know everything there ever was to know about diamonds, and they do nothing but think about this shit all day long.




Sorry...I stopped reading there, but my links (below) or others comments may be helpful...
omg.. that is the funniest thing I''ve read all day. I take it as a compliment (not off-putting to me, in the least). Love it
and you''ve definitely come to the right place.

Lorelei has started you off with some fantastic advice. Let us know what else we can do to help.
 

Regular Guy

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jul 6, 2004
Messages
5,951

Ok, I read through your text.


Really...do read the links below my signature!


Then, look at this info base, to help you get some quality.


There''s a dozen you''ll easily want to consider.


This one''s an easy stand out, too.


Regards,
 

Nid

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 20, 2009
Messages
9
For those of you taking offence to the opening quote, it was actually meant in good humor. The website I came from is, shall I say, a little rough around the edges when it comes to putting things. All the other person meant was that you were knowledgeble and a good resource as this is a primary focus of the website, my apologies if anyone took it differently.

Ok, I''ve just glanced over this thread and I will try to answer the information I left out the first time around, I was throwing it up before running out the door to work so that I''d hopefully have some replies when I get back.

Price range: $1000-1,600 for the stone itself, I could go slightly higher but I don''t have a huge income and my girlfriend specified that she wasn''t expensive or extravagent, so I figured I''d find the perfect stone and then worry about making a ring around that.

Cut: we both love brilliant rounds.

Color: I admit that I haven''t had a huge amount of experience with this, but just from what I''ve been looking at I can definitely notice that anything that''s been shown me to be rated G, either by certificate or store, has been noticeably not the right hue I''m looking for. I would rather get a smaller stone that is F or higher than one of a lower color range, because it just doesn''t look right to me. The GIA E had so much more white light exploding from inside it than anything else, which I also understand is affected by the cut depth and clarity.

I was able to pick out occlusions with a naked eye at SI-2 range (various store rated, the GIA certified one I had to rely on the eye glass). However, seeing how dramatically a single clarity grade affects anything at the F or higher range, this is one of the reasons I''m trying to limit my price.

Size: For personal reasons I do not want to go under .50ct because I feel anything smaller reflects on me. Silly, I know, if the girl loves you and the stone is right, but I hope you people understand what I mean.

Sorry for the trial by fire introduction, but I meant well and I''m about to start reading through the links posted in signatures and reccomended to me. Thank you and is there anything else I can answer?
 

mercoledi

Ideal_Rock
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Messages
2,822
Well... this stone is promising but it''s an H. Was the GIA E stone that you saw the only GIA that you played with? An ideal cut stone will look whiter than a non-ideal cut any day (I''ve seen this in person, and it''s quite striking).

Alternately, maybe try this one.
 

Nid

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 20, 2009
Messages
9
So far the E was the only stone that they specifically mentioned GIA certification, some others mentioned that they were 'certified' but I neglected to ask which process as I've now just discovered various processes can grade the same diamond at different ratings.

I'm going to go out and visit a few more stores to see what I like in person, I'm hesitant to purchase online as I can't actually witness the stone and make a decision, because I saw 2 .53ct and a .56ct both rated G and the smaller stone had way more fire than the larger, guess it was just 'right.' Likewise, I'm hesitant to go with an H purely off of my limited visual experience. I like the website you linked to, its very nice to play around with and could help narrow my search.

Edit: Like for example I feel I'd be happier with going with a stone like this http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/E-VS1-Good-Cut-Round-Diamond-1219174.asp it's smaller but I'm looking at the light pattern in the blown up picture and feel in person it would probably refract better.
 

LaurenThePartier

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Mar 2, 2004
Messages
10,100
Date: 3/20/2009 5:44:22 PM
Author: Nid
So far the E was the only stone that they specifically mentioned GIA certification, some others mentioned that they were 'certified' but I neglected to ask which process as I've now just discovered various processes can grade the same diamond at different ratings.

I'm going to go out and visit a few more stores to see what I like in person, I'm hesitant to purchase online as I can't actually witness the stone and make a decision, because I saw 2 .53ct and a .56ct both rated G and the smaller stone had way more fire than the larger, guess it was just 'right.' Likewise, I'm hesitant to go with an H purely off of my limited visual experience. I like the website you linked to, its very nice to play around with and could help narrow my search.

Edit: Like for example I feel I'd be happier with going with a stone like this http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/E-VS1-Good-Cut-Round-Diamond-1219174.asp it's smaller but I'm looking at the light pattern in the blown up picture and feel in person it would probably refract better.
I understand you're skeptical about buying online - I was too the first time, and I'm sure my husband nearly had a coronary waiting for my engagement ring to arrive. I would definitely do more reading, and some more in person shopping so you can get an accurate picture of what accurately graded AGS and GIA diamonds look like. Tiffany or Bailey Banks & Biddle may be a great place to start.

Once you have actually seen AGS and GIA graded diamonds in person, you may realize that this whole online purchasing thing is less troublesome than you think. Clarity in the SI arena is actually cleaner than those who haven't been through this all before would imagine, and lower colours perform much better in ideal cut diamonds.

I would just suggest that, wherever you go, make sure it's someplace with a great return policy, and good customer service.

I just looked around on PS for some diamonds and came up with these - in the higher colour, SI clarity realm.

http://www.whiteflash.com/hearts_arrows/Whiteflash-ACA-cut-diamond-912933.htm

http://www.whiteflash.com/hearts_arrows/Whiteflash-ACA-cut-diamond-151542.htm
 

LaurenThePartier

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Messages
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Date: 3/20/2009 5:44:22 PM
Author: Nid
So far the E was the only stone that they specifically mentioned GIA certification, some others mentioned that they were 'certified' but I neglected to ask which process as I've now just discovered various processes can grade the same diamond at different ratings.

I'm going to go out and visit a few more stores to see what I like in person, I'm hesitant to purchase online as I can't actually witness the stone and make a decision, because I saw 2 .53ct and a .56ct both rated G and the smaller stone had way more fire than the larger, guess it was just 'right.' Likewise, I'm hesitant to go with an H purely off of my limited visual experience. I like the website you linked to, its very nice to play around with and could help narrow my search.

Edit: Like for example I feel I'd be happier with going with a stone like this http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/E-VS1-Good-Cut-Round-Diamond-1219174.asp it's smaller but I'm looking at the light pattern in the blown up picture and feel in person it would probably refract better.
Also, I ran the James Allen diamond through the HCA (Holloway Cut Advisor), and came up with a 2.9 with a VG for Light Return, only a Good for Fire and Scintilation, and an Excellent for spread. It also appears to be just at the edge of the "fisheye zone".

https://www.pricescope.com/cutadviser.asp
 

LaurenThePartier

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
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Messages
10,100
Date: 3/20/2009 6:28:27 PM
Author: RBsearch
How about this one: http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/F-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1201115.asp

.62 ct
F color
SI1 clarity
Most importantly, it looks really well cut and is just under your budget ($1590 with the pricescope discount)
I like that one. I''d have JA verify that the inclusion under the table wasn''t eye visible, but that diamond scores a 1.1 on the HCA and FOUR Excellents! You don''t see that too often!
 

Nid

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 20, 2009
Messages
9
I''ve bookmarked that one for comparisons and to see if it''s still available when I have the funds for it. I''m doing the preliminary groundwork right now for everything, but that appears to fit my criteria!
 

jstarfireb

Ideal_Rock
Joined
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Messages
6,231
Then put it on hold right away! Don''t let somebody steal it out from under your nose.
 

Haven

Super_Ideal_Rock
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13,166
Date: 3/20/2009 12:57:57 PM
Author:Nid
This was from another forum I frequent:
Seriously, just copy and paste your whole post over on the pricescope.com forums. Those people know everything there ever was to know about diamonds, and they do nothing but think about this shit all day long.
You''re getting much better advice from everyone else than I can give, but I just had to respond because I love this quote. LOVE IT.

If we have a Best Of ''09 thread, it totally belongs there.

And welcome, Nid, you''ve come to the right place.
 

icekid

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Messages
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Date: 3/20/2009 8:41:21 PM
Author: Haven

Date: 3/20/2009 12:57:57 PM
Author:Nid

This was from another forum I frequent:

Seriously, just copy and paste your whole post over on the pricescope.com forums. Those people know everything there ever was to know about diamonds, and they do nothing but think about this shit all day long.
You''re getting much better advice from everyone else than I can give, but I just had to respond because I love this quote. LOVE IT.

If we have a Best Of ''09 thread, it totally belongs there.

And welcome, Nid, you''ve come to the right place.
I agree- one of my favorite recent posts! Made me smile because it''s TRUE.
 

LaraOnline

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Messages
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Date: 3/20/2009 1:43:41 PM
Author: Lorelei
Hi Nid and welcome!


Ok as one of those who your opening quote probably applies to
, lets see what we can do to help!
Lorelei, you are so gracious!
 

Lorelei

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Date: 3/20/2009 9:26:09 PM
Author: LaraOnline

Date: 3/20/2009 1:43:41 PM
Author: Lorelei
Hi Nid and welcome!


Ok as one of those who your opening quote probably applies to
, lets see what we can do to help!
Lorelei, you are so gracious!
You are too kind Lara, I try!
 

Lorelei

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Date: 3/20/2009 6:59:10 PM
Author: Nid
I''ve bookmarked that one for comparisons and to see if it''s still available when I have the funds for it. I''m doing the preliminary groundwork right now for everything, but that appears to fit my criteria!
Ditto thats a good contender and if you are seriously interested please put it on hold to prevent lurker poaching!
 

Nid

Rough_Rock
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9
After a completely spontaneous and amazing night apparently I am now shopping for a ring WITH my girlfriend!
 

Gayletmom

Brilliant_Rock
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What fun, Nid! And welcome to Pricescope.

I can''t help with the technical aspects of evaluating a stone but luckily, for both of us, there are plenty of experts here who generously offer their very knowledgeable advice and input. What I can tell you is that when I first came her six months ago I thought buying online was a crazy idea. After spending several months and an inordinate amount of time (ask dh!) on this site researching diamonds, settings, etc. I have done a complete aboutface. Now when I go into a local B&M store I am cautious and suspicious.

What I have learned is that there are several online vendors mentioned regularly on this site who do an amazing job selling diamonds and are known for their trustworthiness, expertise, customer service and return and upgrade policies. As a general rule, I have found that it''s pretty tough to get this kind of service from a local store -much less the same level of quality and any kind of return/upgrade policy. The upgrade policies (and hearing about the people here who have used them), particularly, tell me that these folks really stand by their products. There are lots of vendors with excellent reputations here including Good Old Gold, White Flash, Engagement Rings Direct, James Allen, Pearlman''s and many others. One useful tool here is the search box at the top of all of the forums, you''ll get lots of valuable info that way.

Good luck to you in your search. You have come to the right place!
 

Lorelei

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Date: 3/21/2009 9:54:37 AM
Author: Nid
After a completely spontaneous and amazing night apparently I am now shopping for a ring WITH my girlfriend!
Well thats great, and if you prefer to stick with brick and mortar stores and you are unsure, you can always post the details of the diamond here and we can take a look for you.
 
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