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Nervous about SI2 diamond&shoukd I get a H&A RB?

swtmelissa

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 10, 2016
Messages
37
Hi all,

I'm in the market for an ering and while I love my fiancee to death, he is absolutely no help when it comes to shopping for the diamond. And I have to tell you - I'm so anxious and nervous about making a poor choice that I can't sleep at night!

Right now I have this diamond on reserve:
http://www.goodoldgold.com/ecommerce/1.08ct-h-si2-platinum-select-round-ideal-cut-diamond.html

I have several concerns:

To begin with I am scared to death to purchase a SI2 diamond. I'm told that it's eye clean (i realize I need to clarify what that means at GOG) but what if it's not - what if I miss an inclusion or something while looking at in the store? Realistically I can't sit in the store and stare/inspect it the way I would at home when it's on my finger or out in the "real world." Plus I'm nervous and it's difficult to take your time and stare at a diamond with a salesperson standing in front of you (no one pressured me, it's just awkward for me). I only looked at it once, I plan to go back this week to take another look (look at it from the side, turn it from side to side, etc.) but there is part of me that just wants to play it safe and get a VS2 for peace of mind but my fiancee isn't thrilled about paying $2000 more (on average) for something he can't see (and I understand his thought on that point). Has anyone else had this fear and if so how did they deal with it?

Another concern is whether or not I'm getting the best RB possible. I keep hearing about hearts and arrows....is that a recommended cut? Is that something I should be looking at in order to have a beautiful RB? As you will see when you click on the link there is a picture of the hearts, but nothing about arrows. And I'm not quite sure what that means.....does that mean it has no arrows?

Is it worth getting a cheaper setting so I can pay more for a better clarity on my diamond? And should I be looking at a hearts and arrows or any other type of optimal cut? Any thoughts and advice would be greatly appreciated!

And what about the inclusions? Are any of them or their placement "red flags?"

Edit: Sorry about the lengthy post, I'm just so worried about making the right choice....and I would love to be able to sleep again at night, lol!
 

flyingpig

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Nov 7, 2015
Messages
2,175
First regarding cut.
GOG labels stones with the highest optimal performance,and most "ideal" proportions Ascendancy H&As.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RPpLlElW9LY
Stones with high optical performance that barely miss requirements for Ascendancy are Platinum Selects
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=msq4FAF4jNc

Both are beautiful diamonds. In your diamond's case, the optimal performance is not the absolute best because of the green area around the edge of the diamond. It represents light leakage; thus Platinum Select. In Ascendancy H&A, the green area around the edge would be smaller. Regardless, your diamond is still beautiful.
Here is 1.01ct H SI2 Ascendancy H&A. See the difference in ASET.
http://www.goodoldgold.com/ecommerce/1-01ct-h-si2-superior-round-hearts-and-arrows-diamond.html
Question is "will you be able to see the little difference in person??"
When you go back, ask for Ascendancy H&A to compare with your stone.

Eye-cleanliness and clarity: This is to be clarified with GOG directly
https://www.pricescope.com/journal/what_eye_clean_diamond
"Good Old Gold
Half an arm’s length in distance or roughly 15” using diffuse/ambient/office lighting and direct/spot lighting and 20/20 vision.
We listen to our clients to learn what they want in clarity. We explain that diamonds which are considered “eye clean” by the trade may not necessarily be “eye clean” to them. Some people want “eye clean” when observing the diamond from the bottom as well.
If SI2 annoys you despite the fact that GOG claims the diamond is eye-clean, then you should go for VS clarity. This is personal preference.

Overall, I think the total package is very reasonable from GOG. 1.08c H SI2 with ideal proportions. Dual Graded by GIA/AGS !!!. Good upgrade policy. Additional light performance and clarity images. Everything at 5.5k.

So you are concerned about both Cut and Clarity. This is how I would tackle it when you go back. Ask them for
1. your diamond (Platinum Select with SI2 clarity)
2. Platinum Select with VS2/VS1 clarity
3. Ascendancy H&M with SI2 clarity
4. Ascendancy H&M with VS2/VS1 clarity.

And see what's the most important to you and if you are willing to pay $$$ for any cut/clarity upgrade. Meanwhile, go to their website and see what they have.

Also ask for I color diamond and possible J color. These can be equally beautiful at a bargain.

Don't feel pressured or awkward. Enjoy the experience.
 

ADN

Shiny_Rock
Trade
Joined
Nov 24, 2015
Messages
311
swtmelissa|1452576077|3974597 said:
I only looked at it once, I plan to go back this week to take another look (look at it from the side, turn it from side to side, etc.)
Hi - I can't/won't comment about the stone specifically, but here is one suggestion to ease your mind about inclusions.
Since you have the advantage of seeing stones in person, ask the vendor to sit with you and point out each inclusion and it's location using magnification (and as compared to the grading report plot if that helps you to locate them) -- then put the loupe down, hold the stone out at a normal viewing distance, and have another look - - it will then be up to you to determine if it's eye-clean to you or not. If you then can't see anything without magnification (and knowing exactly where to look)...I'd say you don't have to worry about it. :)
Also consider the position of any inclusions - even if you can see them in the loose stone, can they be hidden under a claw once it's set?
Also, don't get too caught up in viewing from the side/underneath...unless you're planning to have it set upside down :D , concentrate on what you can/can't see through the crown while looking down on it like you would when it will be set in a ring.
Hope this helps
 

PintoBean

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jul 27, 2011
Messages
6,379
take advantage of GOG being in an outdoor shopping center, so if you need to take a break to think things through, step out and do so. The pizza place is awesome - I love the buffalo chicken slice!

Maybe, look at diamonds, go have a bite to eat, or walk around a store with your fi and talk things through, then pop in and look again.
 

gm89uk

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
May 26, 2015
Messages
1,449
Looks like a great stone! AGS 0 in all categories across the board.
 

swtmelissa

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 10, 2016
Messages
37
Thank you all for your advice and thoughts!

Flyingpig, thank you for the thoughts on how to go back and address comparing a H&A and Platinum Select. I believe I will do this.
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 11, 2006
Messages
55,631
Green on the ASET is not leakage. It is just not as strong light return as red is. White is leakage and that stone only has leakage where it is supposed to be! Nothing wrong with that diamond, but there is no way I'd buy it if SI2 is not mind-clean for you. I'd drop to I color or to .90 and get higher clarity if that was the case (and it would be for me). But if you see the inclusions with a loupe and then see that you absolutely cannot see them with your eyes and are okay with that, then it's a great choice!

Never feel uneasy about exploring clarity at GOG. I would tell them first thing when you visit that you are uncertain about the clarity and want to see the stone magnified. They have a variety of stones for a reason; different people want different things!
 

swtmelissa

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 10, 2016
Messages
37
diamondseeker2006|1452610415|3974735 said:
Green on the ASET is not leakage. It is just not as strong light return as red is. White is leakage and that stone only has leakage where it is supposed to be! Nothing wrong with that diamond, but there is no way I'd buy it if SI2 is not mind-clean for you. I'd drop to I color or to .90 and get higher clarity if that was the case (and it would be for me). But if you see the inclusions with a loupe and then see that you absolutely cannot see them with your eyes and are okay with that, then it's a great choice!

Never feel uneasy about exploring clarity at GOG. I would tell them first thing when you visit that you are uncertain about the clarity and want to see the stone magnified. They have a variety of stones for a reason; different people want different things!
Thank you diamondseeker2006 :D
 

swtmelissa

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 10, 2016
Messages
37
So I just wanted to update you all. I went back to the jeweler today and took another look at the SI2 as well as one of better clarity. As it turns out I was able to see a small inclusion on the SI2 - it looks like a tiny black pin point. However, it can be covered with a prong so I am happy with it. It is not eye clean from the side so now I have to figure out what to do with that. Thoughts?

I also compared the diamond to a H&A and I could not visibly see a difference between their brilliance/sparkle.

Thanks to you all for your advice/guidance!
 

cinnamonstick

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jun 14, 2009
Messages
569
Little SI2 feedback?
Just purchased a beautiful sparkle baby SI2. H. Something had to give. I couldn't have it all and size was important. With such fantastic cut proportions- she is a disko ball! The sparkle.....blinds. AKA "hides" :).

There is a tiny black pinpoint in mine also......the screaming rainbow colors hide it. I noticed the dot more in the diamond when it was unmounted. Glad to hear you can cover yours with a prong at the top. Top view is most important IMHO.

I have an open profile on my center stone on two sides.Trellis. My dot was not on the edge. Cant see it. Weird. I guess my point is you might be surprised how much the little spot is camouflaged once it is in the setting.

With that said, I guess we could start a debate if 6 prongs would be good to hide the side, a basket, and so on. Low profile would help if that is in her taste. Im thinking it may depend on how big that little spot is (oxymoron) and how noticeable it may be once set. My actually I'm surprised I cannot see mine set bc Im a "studier". Trust me. I've been looking at my diamond from the side profile more than I've been looking at the road when driving. :oops:

Congratulations on your selection!
 

cinnamonstick

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jun 14, 2009
Messages
569
Ps. I guess what I'm trying to say, in short is, the pinpoint might not be as noticeable from the side once set...no matter what setting you choose. It would depend on the diamond and the inclusion. Hopefully more experts will chime in. :)

Have a pic of the profile?
 

AdaBeta27

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Sep 7, 2004
Messages
906
swtmelissa|1452642080|3975026 said:
So I just wanted to update you all. I went back to the jeweler today and took another look at the SI2 as well as one of better clarity. As it turns out I was able to see a small inclusion on the SI2 - it looks like a tiny black pin point. However, it can be covered with a prong so I am happy with it. It is not eye clean from the side so now I have to figure out what to do with that. Thoughts?

I also compared the diamond to a H&A and I could not visibly see a difference between their brilliance/sparkle.

Thanks to you all for your advice/guidance!
I would have been more concerned about the inclusion near the edge of the table (which apparently is clear and does not show), and not about the one out toward the perimeter (which apparently does show?) How are you planning to set it? Does the inclusion from the side issue mean you can't set it in the mounting you wanted? Honestly, this clarity thing is going to mainly is is clean enough for you. After the initial show-me-the-ring occasions, you will be the only one who can give it a close inspection. Eye-clean at 15" means that all other people will see is size, performance, color, and the setting. And after you wear the ring a while, you'll find that you can't ever keep a diamond completely clean. This is mainly why I decided completely 100% eyeclean at close range 100% of the time is not necessary, haha.

So, it's a prioritization issue. What is more important to you? Some people think the setting is just as important as the center stone, or even more important. Some people can't accept less than a completely "mind clean" diamond, and I can tell you that I am NOT one of them. I've owned VVS1 down to I1, and after a while, size, color, performance, and VALUE for my dollar became far more important to me than having a completely eye-clean diamonds. "Discrete inclusions" are okay with me, provided they hide well. And I'd much rather see a pinpoint dark or black speck than have any inclusions that affect transparency or brilliance.

I don't think my mother cares about clarity, either. Both of us are practical and we make trade-offs someplace to get size and performance at lower cost.
 

swtmelissa

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 10, 2016
Messages
37
cinnamonstick|1452645546|3975060 said:
Ps. I guess what I'm trying to say, in short is, the pinpoint might not be as noticeable from the side once set...no matter what setting you choose. It would depend on the diamond and the inclusion. Hopefully more experts will chime in. :)

Have a pic of the profile?
Thanks for your thoughts! Part of the problem is that I haven't chosen my setting as of yet....I guess I need to nail that down before I can make my final decision. I will keep you updated.
 

cinnamonstick

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jun 14, 2009
Messages
569
Ohhh the choices you will have :). Google, pinterest...Show Me the Bling :). Start lookin!
Pavé shak? Side stones? Halo (this may hide a profile), plain shank solitary? Has she commented on what she would desire? That's important to know :) VERY exciting!

Have a budget for the setting?
 

swtmelissa

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 10, 2016
Messages
37
cinnamonstick|1452647335|3975088 said:
Ohhh the choices you will have :). Google, pinterest...Show Me the Bling :). Start lookin!
Pavé shak? Side stones? Halo (this may hide a profile), plain shank solitary? Has she commented on what she would desire? That's important to know :) VERY exciting!

Have a budget for the setting?
I'm female, lol...and no, I have no idea what I desire but I'm whittling it down :) After a terrible ring experience (my lovely husband to be purchased me a ring from Jared (yikes, I know!) I ended up returning it as the quality and craftsmanship was abysmal (not to mention the terrible customer service :mad: ) He did the best he could and while I love him for trying, the task of finding the perfect ring has fallen on me (not a complaint, I image there are many brides out there that wish they could have a say on their engagement ring).

I'm choosing between two styles at this point - a 3 stone and a channel setting. It is exciting but it's also a bit frustrating to be honest as i just haven't found "the one" yet, but I'm still looking. Some of my frustration is related to my fears of 1. not finding "the one" or even worse, # 2. making a choice and then hating it when it is all said and done.

My setting budget is around $1,700.....to be honest I'm toying with choosing a simple plain solitaire so I can spend the money on a better clarity diamond. The only problem is that i find a plain shank to be, well, too plain for me, lol!
 

swtmelissa

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 10, 2016
Messages
37
AdaBeta27|1452646226|3975072 said:
swtmelissa|1452642080|3975026 said:
So I just wanted to update you all. I went back to the jeweler today and took another look at the SI2 as well as one of better clarity. As it turns out I was able to see a small inclusion on the SI2 - it looks like a tiny black pin point. However, it can be covered with a prong so I am happy with it. It is not eye clean from the side so now I have to figure out what to do with that. Thoughts?

I also compared the diamond to a H&A and I could not visibly see a difference between their brilliance/sparkle.

Thanks to you all for your advice/guidance!
I would have been more concerned about the inclusion near the edge of the table (which apparently is clear and does not show), and not about the one out toward the perimeter (which apparently does show?) How are you planning to set it? Does the inclusion from the side issue mean you can't set it in the mounting you wanted? Honestly, this clarity thing is going to mainly is is clean enough for you. After the initial show-me-the-ring occasions, you will be the only one who can give it a close inspection. Eye-clean at 15" means that all other people will see is size, performance, color, and the setting. And after you wear the ring a while, you'll find that you can't ever keep a diamond completely clean. This is mainly why I decided completely 100% eyeclean at close range 100% of the time is not necessary, haha.

So, it's a prioritization issue. What is more important to you? Some people think the setting is just as important as the center stone, or even more important. Some people can't accept less than a completely "mind clean" diamond, and I can tell you that I am NOT one of them. I've owned VVS1 down to I1, and after a while, size, color, performance, and VALUE for my dollar became far more important to me than having a completely eye-clean diamonds. "Discrete inclusions" are okay with me, provided they hide well. And I'd much rather see a pinpoint dark or black speck than have any inclusions that affect transparency or brilliance.

I don't think my mother cares about clarity, either. Both of us are practical and we make trade-offs someplace to get size and performance at lower cost.

I did not see anything towards the edge of the table....it is a platinum select cut from GOG so it could be that it is well hidden by the sparkle.
 

cinnamonstick

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jun 14, 2009
Messages
569
LMAO! Why do I run with male? Shoot! Sorry......
Screaming kids, dinner.......

My hubby and I bought a setting from Ulta first time around and I felt I won the lottery. No judgement. Lesson learned. Oh, was it learned.

Three stone and a channel. Different, but both beautiful. Channel, would it be square diamonds or round?
 

swtmelissa

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 10, 2016
Messages
37
cinnamonstick|1452655454|3975192 said:
LMAO! Why do I run with male? Shoot! Sorry......
Screaming kids, dinner.......

My hubby and I bought a setting from Ulta first time around and I felt I won the lottery. No judgement. Lesson learned. Oh, was it learned.

Three stone and a channel. Different, but both beautiful. Channel, would it be square diamonds or round?
lol, no worries about the male thing :D

I like princess cut diamonds in the channel with a round stone (not the norm I'm being told but too bad, it's what I like, lol!)
In regards to the three stone I'm liking the trellis look.
 
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