Find your diamond
Find your jewelry
shape
carat
color
clarity

Need help with purchasing a loose diamond for engagement

nutman

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 16, 2016
Messages
12
Hi guys,

Thanks for the site and all the awesome info. I need some help from you guys that know a lot more about diamonds than myself.

I am currently looking for an engagement ring, and came across this site. I live in Australia, and am looking at purchasing a loose diamond to put into a setting.

I have a budget of around 2500 usd. And I am looking for a princess cut diamond, and am obviously looking for a diamond that looks nice and sparkles to the naked eye. I am not worried about impurities at 10x magnification.

The properties I am looking at are:

Carat: 0.8 - 0.9
Colour: G/H, maybe I if I can get away with it.
Clarity: VS2
Cut: very good

I am happy to change these properties based upon someones informed advice.

Thanks a lot for the help.
 

solgen

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Apr 10, 2015
Messages
563
Do you have a preferred vendor? Do they all ship to Aus or is one better than the others. There are a number of Aussies looking online here so maybe they can recommend a vendor to start with.
 

ADN

Shiny_Rock
Trade
Joined
Nov 24, 2015
Messages
311
Hey mate - full disclosure I'm in the trade.
Not sure how much you do/don't know about princess cuts, but here is a little bit of info you might find helpful.
When I'm looking for stock in princess cut goods, I tend to look at 70-73% as the ideal depth (will accept 68-75% depending on the look of the stone) and a ratio of 1.0:1 – 1.15:1 (ex 8x7mm = 1.15:1)...but as a general rule of thumb, if you can keep it within 1/10th of a mm square, you shouldn't have any real noticeable issues with it looking a bit rectangle.
A VS2 is likely to be eye clean without too much worry/thought required (just try to stay away from heavy dark inclusions right under the table)...but if you're not overly fussed with inclusions, a nice eye clean SI1 (or with a bit of searching an SI2) might be the go rather than a higher VS clarity - this will also drop the price and you might be able to go a bit bigger in carat weight or better in colour. Just be aware of any inclusions that are on/under any of the corners, as they may pose a durability risk during setting (it's rare but it happens) - so make sure to confirm with whichever vendor you end up buying from if this will be an issue or not.
You'll see a range of makes (table size/crown height/etc) - since there is no real agreement as to what makes the 'ideal' cut in a princess, a lot of this is up to your individual aesthetic preference (I'm sure you'll get plenty of opinions from other PS members on what they think is the 'best' for princess cuts to help you decide).
If you end up buying from overseas, just a couple of things to make sure you factor into your budget so you don’t get caught out:
*The exchange rate – we’ve just taken a pounding in the last week and are sitting at around AUD0.68:1USD... :sick:
*You’ll want to check with customs about paying duty and gst to get the stone into the country (you don’t want to get a surprise call asking for more money before your stone will be released) – there are different associated costs for loose stones vs set and finished jewellery, so you may want to work out what fits your situation ahead of time as it may influence how you get the goods into the country.
*International bank wire fees or credit card fees (depending on your payment method) - your bank/card issuer will be able to tell you.
*Bank or credit card exchange rate is usually a few points under the official exchange rate - - you might be able to negotiate a better rate with your bank on the day if you speak to them in advance (I know NAB is only offering a bit over .65 at the moment :doh: )
Regardless of whether you buy something from here or from overseas, with approx. AUD$3500 you should be able to get a pretty schmick stone.
Good luck – hope this helps
 

nutman

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 16, 2016
Messages
12
solgen|1453003550|3977095 said:
Do you have a preferred vendor? Do they all ship to Aus or is one better than the others. There are a number of Aussies looking online here so maybe they can recommend a vendor to start with.
I do not have a preferred vendor. I was hoping for some recommendations from people who have dealt with some of the vendors. I was looking at b2c and James Allen.
 

nutman

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 16, 2016
Messages
12
diamondseeker2006|1453004166|3977100 said:
Always stick to excellent/ideal cut only. It is definitely worth it in a smaller stone because you want that stone to stand out!

Here are some nice ones in your budget:

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/princess-cut/0.73-carat-h-color-vs2-clarity-sku-634363

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/princess-cut/0.71-carat-g-color-vs2-clarity-sku-417949
Thank you.

I noticed that they were ags and not gia. Should I be concerned about that?
 

nutman

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 16, 2016
Messages
12
Thanks for the help ADN.

I am not too concerned about the fx rate as I currently hold some USD and plan to use that in my purchase. But none the less thanks for the heads up.

Thanks for the great tips. I would imagine it would be quite difficult to determine the different types of imperfections from a certificate. Do you have any suggestions of some diamonds that you would recommend? just to get an idea. Like you said if I can get away with a diamond that is Si1 or 2 with no impurities to the naked eye then that'd be great and would save a couple dollars or allow me to go bigger.
 

telephone89

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Aug 29, 2014
Messages
3,847
nutman|1453144825|3977591 said:
diamondseeker2006|1453004166|3977100 said:
Always stick to excellent/ideal cut only. It is definitely worth it in a smaller stone because you want that stone to stand out!

Here are some nice ones in your budget:

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/princess-cut/0.73-carat-h-color-vs2-clarity-sku-634363

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/princess-cut/0.71-carat-g-color-vs2-clarity-sku-417949
Thank you.

I noticed that they were ags and not gia. Should I be concerned about that?
AGS will rate princess cut quality - GIA will not. So a great princess that is AGS0 is usually a safer bet as far as a wonderful cut goes.
 

nutman

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 16, 2016
Messages
12
telephone89|1453147991|3977614 said:
nutman|1453144825|3977591 said:
diamondseeker2006|1453004166|3977100 said:
Always stick to excellent/ideal cut only. It is definitely worth it in a smaller stone because you want that stone to stand out!

Here are some nice ones in your budget:

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/princess-cut/0.73-carat-h-color-vs2-clarity-sku-634363

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/princess-cut/0.71-carat-g-color-vs2-clarity-sku-417949
Thank you.

I noticed that they were ags and not gia. Should I be concerned about that?
AGS will rate princess cut quality - GIA will not. So a great princess that is AGS0 is usually a safer bet as far as a wonderful cut goes.
Thanks telephone.

Do you have any examples of the rated AGS? Just so I can get an idea
 

ADN

Shiny_Rock
Trade
Joined
Nov 24, 2015
Messages
311
nutman|1453145076|3977597 said:
Thanks for the help ADN.

I am not too concerned about the fx rate as I currently hold some USD and plan to use that in my purchase. But none the less thanks for the heads up.

Thanks for the great tips. I would imagine it would be quite difficult to determine the different types of imperfections from a certificate. Do you have any suggestions of some diamonds that you would recommend? just to get an idea. Like you said if I can get away with a diamond that is Si1 or 2 with no impurities to the naked eye then that'd be great and would save a couple dollars or allow me to go bigger.
Hi nutman - - Yes, it's incredibly difficult to determine inclusions just from a cert - and in all my years buying, I've never bought purely off the cert - you can't tell critical info about the inclusion from a cert plot diagram (colour/size/does it reflect/can it be covered/etc).
If you can't see it in person, or through images/video, make sure you get someone somewhere to eyeball the stone for you (it's generally not to difficult to get images nowadays...at least in 1/2ct+ sizes)
Sorry m8 - would love to offer some suggestions, but rules of the forum - since I'm in the business I can't recommend/comment on specific stones - - but happy to answer general questions if I'm able.
Just a comment on your AGS question - yes they are the only ones that grade 'cut' on princess shapes...but make sure that their idea of a well cut princess matches what you find visually pleasing...there are a lot of opinions, in a lot of different markets, on what a nicely cut princess looks like (which is why most labs don't grade prn cut...there isn't a real consensus out there...exact same reason for all the other fancy shapes).
Good luck
 

ADN

Shiny_Rock
Trade
Joined
Nov 24, 2015
Messages
311
Hey m8 - and so the search continues... ;-)
I can't tell you if it's good or not, or comment on the stone specifically...but as I mentioned in earlier posts, when I buy for stock, I really don't like going past 75% for total depth - I find that anything past that is adding a lot of unnecessary weight in the pavilion, potentially gives a smaller face-up mm outline, and most importantly that extra weight doesn't really giving anything back regarding how the stone looks or its light performance. If you've seen stones and like the look of a deeper cut, then that's one thing, but if not you should try to get some pics.
Also, if you're not finding what you want on one of these sites by doing a basic search, don't be afraid to give them a call - if you find a vendor with good reach into the market, they can source a nice stone for you fairly easily.
Good luck with the hunt :)
 

nutman

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 16, 2016
Messages
12
Thanks ADN. you're help in really appreciated.

Yeah I am still looking. Haven't found anything yet. I was about to buy the diamond I just posted but due to your great advice the hunt will go on. From an overall shine and look standpoint, your take is that 70-75% for depth offers the best look?

I will get in contact with these guys to see what they can do
 

gr8leo87

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Apr 24, 2015
Messages
381
nutman said:
Thanks ADN. you're help in really appreciated.

Yeah I am still looking. Haven't found anything yet. I was about to buy the diamond I just posted but due to your great advice the hunt will go on. From an overall shine and look standpoint, your take is that 70-75% for depth offers the best look?

I will get in contact with these guys to see what they can do
Actually its the combination of depth and table both that should be looked at. Deeper diamonds >72 coupled with smaller tables <68 However I never buy princess cut diamonds on proportions.

Princess cut diamonds and all other fancy cut diamonds may have what is known is Pavilion bulge. And two same depth and table diamonds may appear, weigh and measure very differently.

When you narrow down your search keep the factor of spread/measurement under consideration. I usually value princess on how much they spread and how do they perform visually.

Two diamonds weighing same may have different spread and light play. Striking balance is important. Good luck.
 

E B

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 31, 2005
Messages
9,488
Hi Nutman,

Unfortunately, we can't tell from numbers alone with fancy cuts. An ASET will give you a good idea of its performance, or if you can find an AGS0 ideal, that would be a safe bet as well.

I think you'd find better performers for your budget at around the .7 ct mark. Better performance > slightly bigger.
 

ADN

Shiny_Rock
Trade
Joined
Nov 24, 2015
Messages
311
nutman|1454638283|3986975 said:
Hey - I will say that nice square/well proportioned/eye clean 0.75-0.85 G/H VS1-SI1 princess cuts are as rare as chooks teeth at the moment, so if you find that this one hits the numbers you're comfortable with, then you should just...oh wait :doh: ...unfortunately I'm not allowed to give you any further advice... ;-)
Show us the ring when it's done...if you get this one that is... :whistle:
 

nutman

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 16, 2016
Messages
12
I like this one... can you get away with I colour in princess cuts though?
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,198
Yes, in the size you are looking at, an I would be fine.
 

ADN

Shiny_Rock
Trade
Joined
Nov 24, 2015
Messages
311
Would open more options for you, but it depends on your/her colour tolerance
 

gr8leo87

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Apr 24, 2015
Messages
381
Also if you are on a budget you should factor in import costs from America to Australia for diamond jewelry. The shipping cost is covered by the vendor however other fees aren't. FedEx will send you a bill of those goods and require payment. It would be 10% GST of the declared value + around 50$-100$ for ACS electronic entry fees + around 40$ for FedEx tax advancement fees. Since there's no duty on goods originating in USA thanks to FTA if documentation is proper like origin certificate. Otherwise 5% duty and then all of those charges calculated on the value of goods + CIF + duty.

Good luck.
 

gr8leo87

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Apr 24, 2015
Messages
381
Correction: FedEx will send you a bill of those and require payment.
 

nutman

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 16, 2016
Messages
12
Thanks leo.

I was informed by customs that I should only be paying 10% GST. You're informing me that FedEx will charge their own fees on top of that? maximum 150 bucks extra?
 

gr8leo87

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Apr 24, 2015
Messages
381
nutman said:
Thanks leo.

I was informed by customs that I should only be paying 10% GST. You're informing me that FedEx will charge their own fees on top of that? maximum 150 bucks extra?
Yes. The customs will charge you 10% duty and they will also charge you ACS entry fees. If FedEx does the paper work for you (a 53 field triple duplicate form) that's another 40 bucks for their services.
 
Be a part of the community It's free, join today!
    Handmade diamond studs
    Handmade diamond studs
    5 Diamond Misconceptions: Part 1
    5 Diamond Misconceptions: Part 1
    Three-stone engagement ring upgrade
    Three-stone engagement ring upgrade

Need Something Special?

Get a quote from multiple trusted and vetted jewelers.

Holloway Cut Advisor



Diamond Eye Candy

Click to view full-size image.
Top