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sdmparr

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 24, 2003
Messages
1
I recently purchased a 3.01 Ct round cut diamond engagement ring. Bought the stone first and had it set in a platinum, 2 baguette setting. When I was buying the stone I was told it was a VS1-2, G/H color stone with "ideal" proportions. I paid $18,800.00 ($17,800.00 for the stone with tax) out the door and could not see his idependent GIA certified appraiser until a week later......



It is a beautiful stone and appears very lively, grossly, with plenty of fire and brilliance but........



I had it certified to day and it is a ~9.1mm avg diameter, 5.87mm total depth with a table percentage of 57-58%, depth percentage 64%(her calculation), VS1, J color stone with a slightly thick girdle. It was set when evaluated and she initially calculated the weight based on the average diameter and thought it should weigh 2.50-2.75 Ct.


I was very concerned and wanted her to measure the depth but she did not have the tools to remove the stone from the setting so I took the ring back to where I purchased it and then they removed the stone and weighed it for me (3.008 gm) and they measured the depth as above (5.87mm).
Unfortunately I do not have the crown or pavillion angles.

It is obviously not ideally proportioned and I have ~2 weeks and the money to afford a stone that is. I was also concerned about the amount of color in the stone because of the discrepancy between what I was initially told (G/H) and the real color(J). I think the stone is beautiful but am wondering if I should go back and renegotiate for a truely ideal cut stone. I am also wondering if I am getting ripped off. Is this a nice stone or not?


Thanks for any input,

Steven
 

Mara

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Oct 30, 2002
Messages
31,003
Only you can determine if this is a nice stone. When you originally saw it, you said it was beautiful with lots of sparkle and fire--before you knew the appraiser's stats. If so, you may consider keeping the stone if it still appears gorgeous to you--and trying to negotiate the pricing down to something that seems more agreeable to you.

Or you can get your money back completely and buy elsewhere. I have to caution that if you truly want a 3.0c ideal/excellently cut stone with G VS1/VS2 color and clarity, you will pay much more than $18k. More around $25-30k unfortunately.

Here are some pricing comparisons:

3.0c J VS1 stone for sale on Pricescope through a few vendors: $18k
3.0c G/H VS1/VS2 stones for sale on Pricescope through various vendors: $24-30k

You will see the markup. The $24k is for an 3.0 H VS2 stone and the $30k is more for the G/VS1 3.0c stones. These are not even 'ideal/excellent' cut stones, but rather a smattering of what is out there. If you are looking for ideal cuts...

3.0c G/VS2 with excellent HCA scoring A Cut Above Hearts and Arrows AGS 0: $37k

There are also a few other G/H VS2 stones with Hearts and Arrows (excellent symmetry) that are $27-30k.

Anyway hope this helps a bit. If you are stuck with the $18k budget and like the original stone, would try to negotiate a few dollars off for the incorrect grading and hassle. If you can keep the original stone and get a better deal, it might be wise if you want to keep the carat weight. If you cannot go above budget, do not want to keep the original stone, and don't mind dropping the carat weight, you can get the following G VS2 stone from WhiteFlash.Com (it's a ACA H&A stone, excellent cut) for $18673 (special pricescope pricing), but is it only 2.08 carats. There are some other stones in the $18k price range that are Hearts and Arrow branded that range from 2.0c-2.20c. But nothing above that...or else the price goes up.

http://www.whiteflash.com/acut/diamond_details.asp?ItemCode=365073

Good luck!! Let us know what you decide...I'd be interested to know.
 

niceice

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jan 29, 2003
Messages
1,792
How unfortunate! It seems like the old adage "if something seems too good to be true, it probably is" is applicable here. However, we would like to know whether the GIA Graduate Gemologist who you had evaluate the diamond for you is "independent" meaning that they do not work for a jewelry store or sell jewelry themselves - in other words, are they completely impartial regarding how they grade the diamond? When we were in Sacramento, we had several GIA Graded diamonds "burned" by a local gemologist who worked for a store and seemed to thrash any diamond not sold by their store... Food for thought, nothing more...

This scenario is a good example of why consumers are relying more and more on diamonds that have been graded by independent gemological laboratories such as the GIA and AGS Laboratories.

We urge people to ask for "proof" of claims by jewelers that diamonds are "ideal" because the word has become a "catch all" phrase by jewelers who want to hop on the ideal cut bandwagon... They use the term "ideal" incorrectly to refer to any diamond that is round or "ideal" for them to sell... And so often when asked to prove the proportions (or defend their position) they start bantering about "what is ideal anyway?" and "well, this IS my ideal" while there is a standard understanding for what ideal proportions really refer to (although the range for "ideal" could be tightened)...

It sounds like you have a potential case of misrepresenation on several issues, if you are unable to resolve the issue to your satisfaction within a reasonable period of time, we recommend contacting the Jewelers Vigilance Committee in NYC for assistance http://www.jvc.org
 

Richard Sherwood

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Sep 25, 2002
Messages
4,924
Hi Steven. If it makes you feel any better, the price you paid is a good price for a 3 carat Class 3 cut J/VS1. It appears that the jeweler either intentionally or unintentionally exagerrated the color and make, but gave you a good deal for what it really was.

This is pretty common actually. Most jewelers are not gemologists, and many attempt to do their own grading to save the time and money of sending the stone out to an independent lab. Or another scenario is when the jeweler gets a stone in on memo from a wholesaler and relies on the wholesaler's grading. Most wholesalers are not gemologists, and many attempt to do their own grading.....the story goes on and on.

There's no way the jeweler could have sold you a GH/VS1-2 for $17,000. It just wouldn't happen. As Mara pointed out, those stones are considerably more.

All the best,
 
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