Need Advice on Discipling Little Kids

[Allisonfaye]

I watch Super Nanny. I pride myself on being consistent and firm. My kids are sweet girls. But we are beginning to develop a bit of a discipline problem. A bit of background: My girls are 3.5 and 5. My five year old, Isabella, is basically a sweet girl, but not the most energetic kid in the room (which I totally understand siince I am the same way). My 3 year old is a little sparkplug and has a million times my energy. She gets that from her dad. With Isabella, the biggest problem is getting her to keep moving. She knows what she is supposed to do, she just can''t seem to follow through. She says ''it is not fun to get ready''...but she loves where we are going...preschool, swim lessons, whatever. I tried reward charts (stickers), marble jars, screaming, you name it...I can be screaming in her face and she is moving so slow, I think she is going to go backwards. I know I shouldn''t be screaming. I just don''t know what to do.

My other daughter, Olivia, is the little rule breaker. If you draw a line in the sand, she crosses it EVERY TIME. She thinks it is fun. It wasn''t so bad if she wasn''t tired, but now, even if she is not tired, she breaks the rules. She KNOWS what they are. Don''t throw your cup on the floor. Don''t climb through the rungs on my other daughters footboard (I am afraid she will get choked). But she just goes for it. I take away her books (we read every night). I put her to bed without songs. I tried a marble jar for her. Didn''t work. I admittedly have spanked her. She laughs. I worry that if I don''t get her in line now, she will be in jail by the time she is 16.

Then sometimes, they just egg each other on. Like when I am taking them both home from camp. I know they are stimulated from camp. But they hang on me and roll on the floor and tickle each other. I want to crawl under the rug, I am so embarrassed by their behavior. They aren''t like this everywhere. They can go into a store and behave appropriately. They seem to have difficulty with transitioning from one enviornnment to another, which I guess is somewhat common.

I am at my wits end and I feel like I am a terrible mom. My husband is supportive and he is firm with them, too. I notice that when HE puts Olivia in the corner, she tends to stay, but when I do it, she gets out over and over. I tend to think that they know the mom is the soft place to land so they can only be so fearful of her. Also, a mans voice is deeper and maybe a little scarier?

HELP!

 

[LtlFirecracker]

I just saw a child like this yesterday, very difficult to deal with, and I know how frustratng this can be. I think mental health is they way to go for someone with these problems. I usually send kids with these issues for an evaluation and request training for the parents to help them find effective behavior modification skills. It is best to deal with this now, because as you alluded, this is only going to get more difficult as she gets older.

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 6/17/2009 2:44:48 PM
Author:Allisonfaye
I watch Super Nanny. I pride myself on being consistent and firm. My kids are sweet girls. But we are beginning to develop a bit of a discipline problem. A bit of background: My girls are 3.5 and 5. My five year old, Isabella, is basically a sweet girl, but not the most energetic kid in the room (which I totally understand siince I am the same way). My 3 year old is a little sparkplug and has a million times my energy. She gets that from her dad. With Isabella, the biggest problem is getting her to keep moving. She knows what she is supposed to do, she just can''t seem to follow through. She says ''it is not fun to get ready''...but she loves where we are going...preschool, swim lessons, whatever. I tried reward charts (stickers), marble jars, screaming, you name it...I can be screaming in her face and she is moving so slow, I think she is going to go backwards. I know I shouldn''t be screaming. I just don''t know what to do.

My other daughter, Olivia, is the little rule breaker. If you draw a line in the sand, she crosses it EVERY TIME. She thinks it is fun. It wasn''t so bad if she wasn''t tired, but now, even if she is not tired, she breaks the rules. She KNOWS what they are. Don''t throw your cup on the floor. Don''t climb through the rungs on my other daughters footboard (I am afraid she will get choked). But she just goes for it. I take away her books (we read every night). I put her to bed without songs. I tried a marble jar for her. Didn''t work. I admittedly have spanked her. She laughs. I worry that if I don''t get her in line now, she will be in jail by the time she is 16.

Then sometimes, they just egg each other on. Like when I am taking them both home from camp. I know they are stimulated from camp. But they hang on me and roll on the floor and tickle each other. I want to crawl under the rug, I am so embarrassed by their behavior. They aren''t like this everywhere. They can go into a store and behave appropriately. They seem to have difficulty with transitioning from one enviornnment to another, which I guess is somewhat common.

I am at my wits end and I feel like I am a terrible mom. My husband is supportive and he is firm with them, too. I notice that when HE puts Olivia in the corner, she tends to stay, but when I do it, she gets out over and over. I tend to think that they know the mom is the soft place to land so they can only be so fearful of her. Also, a mans voice is deeper and maybe a little scarier?

HELP!

Allison, I am not a mother of a child that age, but my friend is the mom of a 5 year old boy who is a sweetheart. She had the exact same problem you had with your older one and every morning was a battle.

She picked up a book and said it really helped. I can''t remember the title of the book, but I did ask her what she did. Basically she let him go at his pace for a few mornings before preschool. He just takes forever choosing clothes, etc. So she just relaxed and let him take as LOOOOOOOONG as he liked. Well, as he soon found out, it is NOT FUN being late for things. The other kids look at you. Teachers get annoyed. You miss fun events at parties (and she made sure he KNEW what he missed because they were late.) I am not sure if she told the teacher she was doing this strategy or not (so they would be more understanding), but it did not take very long. Soon after, he was making sure that his MOM wasn''t going to make him late!

 

[lili]

Date: 6/17/2009 2:58:45 PM
Author: TravelingGal

Date: 6/17/2009 2:44:48 PM

Author:Allisonfaye

I watch Super Nanny. I pride myself on being consistent and firm. My kids are sweet girls. But we are beginning to develop a bit of a discipline problem. A bit of background: My girls are 3.5 and 5. My five year old, Isabella, is basically a sweet girl, but not the most energetic kid in the room (which I totally understand siince I am the same way). My 3 year old is a little sparkplug and has a million times my energy. She gets that from her dad. With Isabella, the biggest problem is getting her to keep moving. She knows what she is supposed to do, she just can''t seem to follow through. She says ''it is not fun to get ready''...but she loves where we are going...preschool, swim lessons, whatever. I tried reward charts (stickers), marble jars, screaming, you name it...I can be screaming in her face and she is moving so slow, I think she is going to go backwards. I know I shouldn''t be screaming. I just don''t know what to do.


My other daughter, Olivia, is the little rule breaker. If you draw a line in the sand, she crosses it EVERY TIME. She thinks it is fun. It wasn''t so bad if she wasn''t tired, but now, even if she is not tired, she breaks the rules. She KNOWS what they are. Don''t throw your cup on the floor. Don''t climb through the rungs on my other daughters footboard (I am afraid she will get choked). But she just goes for it. I take away her books (we read every night). I put her to bed without songs. I tried a marble jar for her. Didn''t work. I admittedly have spanked her. She laughs. I worry that if I don''t get her in line now, she will be in jail by the time she is 16.


Then sometimes, they just egg each other on. Like when I am taking them both home from camp. I know they are stimulated from camp. But they hang on me and roll on the floor and tickle each other. I want to crawl under the rug, I am so embarrassed by their behavior. They aren''t like this everywhere. They can go into a store and behave appropriately. They seem to have difficulty with transitioning from one enviornnment to another, which I guess is somewhat common.


I am at my wits end and I feel like I am a terrible mom. My husband is supportive and he is firm with them, too. I notice that when HE puts Olivia in the corner, she tends to stay, but when I do it, she gets out over and over. I tend to think that they know the mom is the soft place to land so they can only be so fearful of her. Also, a mans voice is deeper and maybe a little scarier?


HELP!

Allison, I am not a mother of a child that age, but my friend is the mom of a 5 year old boy who is a sweetheart. She had the exact same problem you had with your older one and every morning was a battle.


She picked up a book and said it really helped. I can''t remember the title of the book, but I did ask her what she did. Basically she let him go at his pace for a few mornings before preschool. He just takes forever choosing clothes, etc. So she just relaxed and let him take as LOOOOOOOONG as he liked. Well, as he soon found out, it is NOT FUN being late for things. The other kids look at you. Teachers get annoyed. You miss fun events at parties (and she made sure he KNEW what he missed because they were late.) I am not sure if she told the teacher she was doing this strategy or not (so they would be more understanding), but it did not take very long. Soon after, he was making sure that his MOM wasn''t going to make him late!

TGal--
That sounds like a good strategy.
I''ll have to keep that in mind for the future.

 

[VegasAngel]

Sorry I don''t have any advise but I do understand, my 3 year old is a handful.

Our particular problem is that discipline is not consistent. When you have a kid who will challenge a time out for a few hours (Like some of the kids on supernanny

) It''s very hard to stick to your guns.

 

[soocool]

I am a lucky mom as my DD was and still is a sweetheart! My sister has 3 boys and they were a handful. I think my DD is the way she is because I learned a lot from my sister and how she handles her boys.

Kids will test you constantly and if they see that they will get their way after 3 no's and the 4th time yes they will continue to drive you crazy until you break. In our house when we say "NO" we mean "NO". And if she continues to ask, then we will never revisit the issue (not really, but she can't know that). You and your DH have to be consistent, otherwise, kids are smarter than you think and they will learn what it takes to get their way.

My DD also is slow to move, even now. Therefore, she gets her stuff ready the night before. Showers the night before, packs her snacks, water bottle, backpack, etc. and leaves everything next to the door. If she is late for the bus because she overslept etc. she pays me to drive her to school. She has only been late once! She knows what time her activities start and has learned the hard way what happens when she is late for practice (she didn't get to play in the final playoff game) Sometimes, you have to learn what disappointment means and try harder next time to avoid it and kids don't want to be disappointed. Geting your kids into some kind of sport activity teaches a lot of discipline!


All kids have their own personalities, but have to learn that there are rules they have to follow in certain places. Once they get into school, they will quickly learn, because they want to please their teachers.

You just have to have patience and I personally know that it is hard to be patient all the time. Don't worry you and your DH will survive this stage. Then you can look forward to the teen years!

 

[Aloros]

Tgal''s friend''s strategy reminds me of the Parenting with Love and Logic book. Great book, and focuses a lot on letting kids experience consequences, because the consequences they experience now are smaller than those they would face grown up!

 

[Allisonfaye]

I have tried variations of the natural and logical consequences thing. Once, she was taking so long putting on her jammies, I told her that she had 5 minutes to put them on and whatever she had on at the time, that was what she would sleep in. She slept in a pullup and a jammy top. She hated that and it worked but the next time, she was completely naked and DH was out of town (and I don't sleep well anyway when he is gone) so I didn't want to be up changing her wet sheets in the middle of the night.

 

[Mara]

Date: 6/17/2009 5:36:08 PM
Author: Allisonfaye
I have tried variations of the natural and logical consequences thing. Once, she was taking so long putting on her jammies, I told her that she had 5 minutes to put them on and whatever she had on at the time, that was what she would sleep in. She slept in a pullup and a jammy top. She hated that and it worked but the next time, she was completely naked and DH was out of town (and I don't sleep well anyway when he is gone) so I didn't want to be up changing her wet sheets in the middle of the night.

Hey AF...I am not a parent but the one thing that my friends with kids tell me is CONSISTENCY above all else. I notice that a lot of times parents seem to have a hard time being consistent because it inconveniences them. So they change the routine because it's easier for the parent than to continue with the consistency training on the child, and ends up basically confusing the child and prolonging whatever you are trying to teach.

I have a friend whose daughter is not sleeping through the night and she is almost 9 months or something crazy. When I was telling her that my friend has a son who slept through at like 2 months, she was amazed. When she asked how and I said consistency, she was like 'yep figures'...and turns out her kid has absolutely none. The parents do what suits THEM and what makes it easier for THEM.

It must be tough to have to put things on hold the way you would WANT them to go, in order to try to further your teachings onto the children. But honestly from what people have told me that seems the most 'effective' way to have them be taught. If the kids know that the parents aren't consistent in what they say or do, they will take advantage of it and you. I definitely used to do this.

 

[mia1181]

Date: 6/17/2009 5:01:30 PM
Author: Aloros
Tgal''s friend''s strategy reminds me of the Parenting with Love and Logic book. Great book, and focuses a lot on letting kids experience consequences, because the consequences they experience now are smaller than those they would face grown up!

Big FAT DITTO. I''m pretty sure this is the book Tgal is talking about too and it is definitely worth a read. I just lent my copy out so I can''t remember who wrote it but it sounds like it would really help in your situation.

It''s all about logical consequences for misbehaving. But you can also impose your own consequences for misbehaving with things like time outs (which are probably exactly what your little 3.5yo needs). So a couple of examples:

Olivia throws her cups on the floor:
I would warn her before she does it if you can and say "Olivia cups are not for throwing, if you can''t use the cup the right way, you lose it." From what you describe, it sounds like little O will look at you defiantly and throw the cup, once challenged. Here''s the important part, you take it away and she gets no drink. Maybe not for the rest of the day. She will learn that if she ever wants to drink again, she''d better not throw her cup.

If she throws a fit when you take away the cup, you say something to the effect of "That''s not how we behave in the kitchen, would you like to stop that, or would you prefer to do that in your room? Now you are giving her a choice she either has to stop what she is doing or she can carry on alone in her room. Of course she will choose to carry on at first. So you have to put her in her room while saying "Oh it looks like you''ve decided to go to your room" (let them know it''s a decision they''ve made). You put her in her room and tell her "feel free to join us in the kitchen once you''ve calmed down." Now at this point you have to trust that she will calm down eventually, but first she will probably try everything she can to get you to lose it first. Just keep putting her back into her room if she comes out and remain firm. Finally, when she calms you can say something like "Oh I''m glad you''ve decided to come and join us at dinner." You may have to repeat this a few times but eventually she won''t bother to test you.

Anyway, that''s just one example. You''ll find plenty more in the book so please get it. As for your older daughter there should be a few ideas in the book as well. One thing that comes to mind is that if she doesn''t get dressed in the morning she goes to school in her pajamas.

And BTW, please no more screaming or spanking (I have a feeling you agree these are not helpful). If you really are as firm as you think you are you should never have to resort to these things.

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 6/17/2009 7:17:53 PM
Author: mia1181

Date: 6/17/2009 5:01:30 PM
Author: Aloros
Tgal''s friend''s strategy reminds me of the Parenting with Love and Logic book. Great book, and focuses a lot on letting kids experience consequences, because the consequences they experience now are smaller than those they would face grown up!

Big FAT DITTO. I''m pretty sure this is the book Tgal is talking about too and it is definitely worth a read. I just lent my copy out so I can''t remember who wrote it but it sounds like it would really help in your situation.

It''s all about logical consequences for misbehaving. But you can also impose your own consequences for misbehaving with things like time outs (which are probably exactly what your little 3.5yo needs). So a couple of examples:

Olivia throws her cups on the floor:
I would warn her before she does it if you can and say ''Olivia cups are not for throwing, if you can''t use the cup the right way, you lose it.'' From what you describe, it sounds like little O will look at you defiantly and throw the cup, once challenged. Here''s the important part, you take it away and she gets no drink. Maybe not for the rest of the day. She will learn that if she ever wants to drink again, she''d better not throw her cup.

If she throws a fit when you take away the cup, you say something to the effect of ''That''s not how we behave in the kitchen, would you like to stop that, or would you prefer to do that in your room? Now you are giving her a choice she either has to stop what she is doing or she can carry on alone in her room. Of course she will choose to carry on at first. So you have to put her in her room while saying ''Oh it looks like you''ve decided to go to your room'' (let them know it''s a decision they''ve made). You put her in her room and tell her ''feel free to join us in the kitchen once you''ve calmed down.'' Now at this point you have to trust that she will calm down eventually, but first she will probably try everything she can to get you to lose it first. Just keep putting her back into her room if she comes out and remain firm. Finally, when she calms you can say something like ''Oh I''m glad you''ve decided to come and join us at dinner.'' You may have to repeat this a few times but eventually she won''t bother to test you.

Anyway, that''s just one example. You''ll find plenty more in the book so please get it. As for your older daughter there should be a few ideas in the book as well. One thing that comes to mind is that if she doesn''t get dressed in the morning she goes to school in her pajamas.

And BTW, please no more screaming or spanking (I have a feeling you agree these are not helpful). If you really are as firm as you think you are you should never have to resort to these things.

Sounds like a great book, I will have to get it.

But I disagree with the last line. My friend (another one, and the one who I look up to most as a parent) is a GREAT mom. The most darn consistent mom I have ever met. Her children are extremely well behaved, and it''s owed to their mother who is always on the ball. However, at some point, spankiing is the last resort punishment and on them, even them threat works well. But when they overstep all boundaries, they get a proper spanking, i.e., one not done in anger and very controlled.

Spanking, when done correctly is a tool that can be used in discipline. I know this is a hot topic, but saying you should never have to resort to these things is a disservice to many parents who use spanking carefully and to great success. Trust me, her kids haven''t learned that it''s OK to hit people, blah blah blah. Some toddlers (especially the very young ones) can''t be reasoned with!!

 

[mia1181]

Date: 6/17/2009 5:36:08 PM
Author: Allisonfaye
I have tried variations of the natural and logical consequences thing. Once, she was taking so long putting on her jammies, I told her that she had 5 minutes to put them on and whatever she had on at the time, that was what she would sleep in. She slept in a pullup and a jammy top. She hated that and it worked but the next time, she was completely naked and DH was out of town (and I don''t sleep well anyway when he is gone) so I didn''t want to be up changing her wet sheets in the middle of the night.

I don''t think getting to wear whatever you want to bed is a real consequence in this case. A better solution would be "Would you like to put your jammies on yourself, or would you like me to?" Either way she is getting the jammies and the pullups, it''s just up to her if she wants to do it herself. Also, it seems to me like if she wants to go to bed without a pullups she gets to sleep in a wet bed. I know this sounds harsh but trust me that it is a struggle at first but as soon as they realize that your threats are serious they won''t need to test you all the time.

Children like to stall before bed so another easier solution would be to pick a desirable activity before bed and say something like "hurry up and get your jammies on so that we can read a book together before bed." No jammies=no book, which = bed earlier and you puts the jammies on her anyway. Trust me, after a few nights of this she will be eager to get the jammies on in the first place. But you really have to carry out your threats.

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 6/17/2009 7:28:07 PM
Author: mia1181

Date: 6/17/2009 5:36:08 PM
Author: Allisonfaye
I have tried variations of the natural and logical consequences thing. Once, she was taking so long putting on her jammies, I told her that she had 5 minutes to put them on and whatever she had on at the time, that was what she would sleep in. She slept in a pullup and a jammy top. She hated that and it worked but the next time, she was completely naked and DH was out of town (and I don''t sleep well anyway when he is gone) so I didn''t want to be up changing her wet sheets in the middle of the night.

I don''t think getting to wear whatever you want to bed is a real consequence in this case. A better solution would be ''Would you like to put your jammies on yourself, or would you like me to?'' Either way she is getting the jammies and the pullups, it''s just up to her if she wants to do it herself. Also, it seems to me like if she wants to go to bed without a pullups she gets to sleep in a wet bed. I know this sounds harsh but trust me that it is a struggle at first but as soon as they realize that your threats are serious they won''t need to test you all the time.

Children like to stall before bed so another easier solution would be to pick a desirable activity before bed and say something like ''hurry up and get your jammies on so that we can read a book together before bed.'' No jammies=no book, which = bed earlier and you puts the jammies on her anyway. Trust me, after a few nights of this she will be eager to get the jammies on in the first place. But you really have to carry out your threats.

Ha, I don''t think it is harsh, but didn''t want to come across sounding like a nazi. The kid goes to bed naked and in a wet bed. Tough. It will NOT kill them. Yes, it''s a pain for the parent and you probably won''t be able to sleep because you feel bad, but the lesson needs to be learned.

The same aforementioned friend offers her children a couple of choices for dinner. They choose. She makes. I was there and I watched her son decided he didn''t want that dinner anymore. Fine, she takes it away and he gets NOTHING (dessert, or any other substitute) until breakfast. If he can''t go to sleep because he''s hungry, tough. He''s had his chance to eat the dinner that HE asked for.

I said to her afterwards, wow, you''re strict. She just said, "trust me TGal, it doesn''t kill them. I am not a short order cook and they know that." These days he eats what he initially chose for dinner.

 

[mia1181]

Date: 6/17/2009 7:26:06 PM
Author: TravelingGal

Date: 6/17/2009 7:17:53 PM
Author: mia1181

Date: 6/17/2009 5:01:30 PM
Author: Aloros
Tgal''s friend''s strategy reminds me of the Parenting with Love and Logic book. Great book, and focuses a lot on letting kids experience consequences, because the consequences they experience now are smaller than those they would face grown up!

Big FAT DITTO. I''m pretty sure this is the book Tgal is talking about too and it is definitely worth a read. I just lent my copy out so I can''t remember who wrote it but it sounds like it would really help in your situation.

It''s all about logical consequences for misbehaving. But you can also impose your own consequences for misbehaving with things like time outs (which are probably exactly what your little 3.5yo needs). So a couple of examples:

Olivia throws her cups on the floor:
I would warn her before she does it if you can and say ''Olivia cups are not for throwing, if you can''t use the cup the right way, you lose it.'' From what you describe, it sounds like little O will look at you defiantly and throw the cup, once challenged. Here''s the important part, you take it away and she gets no drink. Maybe not for the rest of the day. She will learn that if she ever wants to drink again, she''d better not throw her cup.

If she throws a fit when you take away the cup, you say something to the effect of ''That''s not how we behave in the kitchen, would you like to stop that, or would you prefer to do that in your room? Now you are giving her a choice she either has to stop what she is doing or she can carry on alone in her room. Of course she will choose to carry on at first. So you have to put her in her room while saying ''Oh it looks like you''ve decided to go to your room'' (let them know it''s a decision they''ve made). You put her in her room and tell her ''feel free to join us in the kitchen once you''ve calmed down.'' Now at this point you have to trust that she will calm down eventually, but first she will probably try everything she can to get you to lose it first. Just keep putting her back into her room if she comes out and remain firm. Finally, when she calms you can say something like ''Oh I''m glad you''ve decided to come and join us at dinner.'' You may have to repeat this a few times but eventually she won''t bother to test you.

Anyway, that''s just one example. You''ll find plenty more in the book so please get it. As for your older daughter there should be a few ideas in the book as well. One thing that comes to mind is that if she doesn''t get dressed in the morning she goes to school in her pajamas.

And BTW, please no more screaming or spanking (I have a feeling you agree these are not helpful). If you really are as firm as you think you are you should never have to resort to these things.

Sounds like a great book, I will have to get it.

But I disagree with the last line. My friend (another one, and the one who I look up to most as a parent) is a GREAT mom. The most darn consistent mom I have ever met. Her children are extremely well behaved, and it''s owed to their mother who is always on the ball. However, at some point, spankiing is the last resort punishment and on them, even them threat works well. But when they overstep all boundaries, they get a proper spanking, i.e., one not done in anger and very controlled.

Spanking, when done correctly is a tool that can be used in discipline. I know this is a hot topic, but saying you should never have to resort to these things is a disservice to many parents who use spanking carefully and to great success. Trust me, her kids haven''t learned that it''s OK to hit people, blah blah blah. Some toddlers (especially the very young ones) can''t be reasoned with!!

Yes get the book!

I will respectfully disagree however on the spanking. I don''t think spanking ever has to be used as a last resort punishment. I am a nanny and since I would be fired on the spot if I ever spanked a child (no matter carefully, or correctly I did it), I can tell you that in almost 9 years of nannying there is no situation that I can''t get around without spanking to prove my point to a child. I know you aren''t looking for a spanking debate, and I agree that it is a hot topic and certainly each parent''s right to decide what is best for their child. I just think there are lots of ways to teach children consequences without it.

Even small toddlers who are too young to reason can be given consequences that are related to their misbehvior. For instance if an infant bites his mommy, i''ve heard some parents say the correct thing to do is bite the child back to show the baby it hurts to be biten. I would rather just put the baby down and walk away. No reasoning required, but the baby will learn "when I bite people they want nothing to do with me" a very important lesson, IMO. Just an example, but I hope you get what I am saying.

 

[chrono]

That''s an interesting method, TGal where the child experiences the consequences.

For me, I nip it right in the bud. I am pretty strict and consistency is the key. Trust me, the children pick up on it very quickly. I will give a warning, explain what I will do next if what I tell them is not followed right away, and if it continues, I follow up on it. There will be tantrums, breakdowns and all the sob stories but if you can hang tough, you will see the effect very quickly. I call it tough love. Parenting is difficult and many times it can break your heart but as long as I know I am doing it in the best interest of the child (without causing harm), I will stick to my guns.

 

[TravelingGal]

Mia, you DO know that children are different with their nannies than they are with their own parents?

We''ll agree to disagree. I think spanking with an effective tool, when used PROPERLY. The problem is that there are very few people who know how to do so. As my mother spanked me properly, I can tell you how effective it was.

 

[Mara]

hehe TG i got spanked as well and i endorse it. of course not for every little thing, etc...but sometimes just the threat of getting spanked, having had the treatment before, was enough to set me straight.

i was a TOTAL handful though...i loved testing the limits.

funny because one of my good friends totally does not believe in spanking and she and i have had some debates on the subject....it will be interesting as you have said previously to see how when we have our own child, our parenting styles might not mesh. her boy is a hitter right now and she tends to believe in positive reinforcement and distractions rather than discipline... so we''ll see how it works out in the future. she is appalled i believe a swat to the booty can be effective.

 

[packrat]

We were a bit spoiled w/London..she was super easy. She did throw fits at times. She used to fling herself backwards to the floor..guess what, if someone doesn''t catch you, it hurts. We''d grab her and lower her to the floor so she didn''t smuck her head on the concrete if we were in a store, and then stand there and talk about whatever while she freaked out. She figured out real quick she wouldn''t get a reaction, and it was a lot of work to fling about and screech..so then she started just laying on the floor and staring at us. Trapper however...he''s one of those kids that if you tell him "No, don''t do that", he''ll look right at you and do it over and over as much as he can until you get to him and take him away, usually w/a swat on the butt. He needs redirection to get past whatever he''s upset about, whether it be a tap on the butt, or hand if he''s throwing something, or to take his arm and speak loudly and sternly to get his attention. My mom was really strict w/us too, growing up. If we didn''t eat lunch, it was put in the fridge until supper and if we didn''t eat it that time, we just had to be hungry. It''s hard to be consistent, and sometimes it makes you feel like a horrible person to send your kids to bed w/no supper or stick them in their room and shut the door while they cry, but it''s best for them in the long run.

 

[Italiahaircolor]

Most of my girlfriends have children--many around the age of your children. For me, as a non-mom, it''s very interesting to observe the different parenting skills when it comes to discipline. So, while I cannot speak from personal experience...the outside looking in POV is pretty interesting.

I have two girlfriends who both have 4.5 year olds. They don''t know each other since one friend is "work" and one is "social".

My one friend, lets call her R, is very laid back with her son. He can do whatever--so long as it doesn''t sum up with him hospitalized. R also has two other older sons...so she''s not a newbie by any means. R''s son M is pretty well behaved, but when he''s not--he''s really, really not. He throws temper-tantrums, flings himself about the room, ignores instruction and will flat-out refuse adult direction. He''s a PITA when he wants to be. R is like a rain storm when it comes to discipline...she blows hard, but fades fast. She will say "that''s it M, if you keep at this, no ice cream" but if M shapes up eventually she will cave and give him ice cream. In my opinion, her behavior has let M know that he can do whatever and she will still eventually give in. It''s incredibly annoying. He has never suffered the consequence of his behavior because she can''t stand to see him go without. Instead of teaching him that if he refuses to do his ABC''s he''ll miss out on a treat, she just gives in, which is actually reinforcing the bad behavior. M has taken to projecting his bad attitude on other adults...talking back, ignoring them, and R rarely interjects and corrects him and his behavior. R has no one to blame but herself.

My other friend, we''ll call her A, is really diligent in her reinforcement. She will "wait it out"...if she askes her daughter J to do something...and J doesn''t, then J goes in time out until J is ready to cooperate. ''A'' calls it a battle of the wills...but, I''ll tell you, J really does go along with the program far more often than your average 4 year old. J understands what the expectations are...and if she decides not to follow, there are serious consequences.

So...I guess what I''m trying to say it that by setting consequences you''re willing to live with, you''ll set a routine the girls can depend on. Rather than trying a multitude of various disciplines ... finding one, giving it time, and making it work may actually get you farther. As opposed to expecting immediate gratification by trying and failing at various things...you''ll show the girls "these are our house rules...they aren''t changing...but your behavior will".

 

[AGSHF]

Allisonfaye,

I don''t watch Super Nanny consistently but have seen parts of a couple of episodes. I think that her approach is a variation of dispassionate consistency. Whatever discipline you wish to impose has to be applied consistent and, if at all possible, with as little emotion or yelling as feasible (impossible, I know very well, in the heat of the moment).

When my daughter was (is) driving me nuts, my natural tendency is to reason with her and explain things. She''s bright and pretty mature for her age, and I just assumed that she''d see things the way I see them and naturally follow my lead. The "reasoning and explaining" route doesn''t work very well with small children, especially children the age of yours. It didn''t work well with my daughter.

Anyway, I looked for help at the library and found an approach that you may want to try. It''s basically a time-out method but it is applied without, for the lack of a better description, the parent getting angry or any emotional demonstration. It''s essentially a "counting" technique. You explain to your child that you will start counting 1-2-3 and if she hasn''t started to cooperate by the time you get to 3, it is a time out. There''s more to it, of course, so you might want to look for these books or DVDs to see if the approach might work for you:

http://www.parentmagic.com/

It made a lot of sense to me. And, good luck!

 

[mia1181]

Date: 6/17/2009 7:50:21 PM
Author: TravelingGal
Mia, you DO know that children are different with their nannies than they are with their own parents?

Ha Ha yes, but why is that? Hmmm.... I think some would argue that children behave better with nannies or other caregivers because we are more logical, rational and consistent with the children than their own parents can be. Parents are more emotional about discipline ("Am I being a bad parent?" "Will she end up resenting me?", etc.) and nannies can take the emotions out of it when disciplining ("I don't care if you hate me you aren't going to do that"). I do believe that there are some biological forces there and I know it's not exactly the same as if they were own kids. But since I am with these kids 50+ hours a week,(more waking hours than their own parents), lets hope my opinions on raising kids count at least a little. I guess I'll have to wait to have children of my of my own to see for sure the differences! I might become a total sap!

We'll agree to disagree. I think spanking with an effective tool, when used PROPERLY. The problem is that there are very few people who know how to do so. As my mother spanked me properly, I can tell you how effective it was.

Sure, I am perfectly happy to agree to disagree with you T-Gal. I don't always agree with your views on things, but I ALWAYS respect your opinions because you seem like the type of person who has a very intelligent process when forming an opinion on something. But for the record, my parents used spanking improperly. It was to cause pain as an act of revenge, or just to get the anger out, so I won't claim to be unbiased!

 

[hlmr]

Consistency, natural consequences, and following through with what you say are all very important.

As far as spanking goes, I was spanked. I did spank a few times, but never felt good about it. It was always done in frustration, but if I had waited until I was calmer, I would never have done it. If I had it to do over again, I would choose not to spank my child.

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 6/17/2009 10:14:13 PM
Author: mia1181

Date: 6/17/2009 7:50:21 PM
Author: TravelingGal
Mia, you DO know that children are different with their nannies than they are with their own parents?

Ha Ha yes, but why is that? Hmmm.... I think some would argue that children behave better with nannies or other caregivers because we are more logical, rational and consistent with the children than their own parents can be. Parents are more emotional about discipline (''Am I being a bad parent?'' ''Will she end up resenting me?'', etc.) and nannies can take the emotions out of it when disciplining (''I don''t care if you hate me you aren''t going to do that''). I do believe that there are some biological forces there and I know it''s not exactly the same as if they were own kids. But since I am with these kids 50+ hours a week,(more waking hours than their own parents), lets hope my opinions on raising kids count at least a little. I guess I''ll have to wait to have children of my of my own to see for sure the differences! I might become a total sap!

We''ll agree to disagree. I think spanking with an effective tool, when used PROPERLY. The problem is that there are very few people who know how to do so. As my mother spanked me properly, I can tell you how effective it was.

Sure, I am perfectly happy to agree to disagree with you T-Gal. I don''t always agree with your views on things, but I ALWAYS respect your opinions because you seem like the type of person who has a very intelligent process when forming an opinion on something. But for the record, my parents used spanking improperly. It was to cause pain as an act of revenge, or just to get the anger out, so I won''t claim to be unbiased!

I think your opinions count a lot, because you''ve probably dealt with more children that I''ve ever dealt with...which is one.

I think emotion and frustration is a huge factor. I''m with the kid because I''m her mother. I''m stuck, if you will. My nanny is getting paid and it''s her job - hopefully one she wants to do well. You know how no one else can get your goat better than your partner? Well, I''ll assume my kid can get my goat far more than she gets my nanny''s. However, I''ll tell you what, I am not worried if my kid resents me, or likes daddy better, or whatever. She already does! No one else is going to discipline here like I do, and I''m far more worried she''ll be a crazy brat than someone who resents me. Plus I really do think I have a lot of love to give her to counterbalance (I hope!)

I do think other options should be tried before spanking, but I know right now that I don''t have a full fledged toddler, so I really don''t have the experience. I have observed many children, as I am the last of my very close friends to have kids. 2 of my friends spank, 1 doesn''t. All have really good kids. Some kids may not really need to get spanked...I don''t remember my brother being spanked very often, if at all. I was the problem child, for sure.

But yes, from all my friends and family (cousins) who were spanked, it seems that I was the only one spanked in a proper manner. My cousin was beat (with objects). I was spanked. It stung, but never hurt after the spanking. Never a mark or bruise. My mom always told me beforehand why she was spanking me and held me afterward and told me she loved me. It was obvious to me, even at a young age that it was something that really hurt my mom to do, and that I should not do bad things so I could spare us both the grief. I have never, not once, felt that my mom spanking me was a bad thing. Now, my father...he was abusive and I have been beaten by him, so believe me, I know the difference. My mom was not home at the time and I think it was the closest she ever came to divorcing him when she saw what happened.

I think that spanking gets its (probably deserved) reputation because 90% of spanking parents do not do it correctly. They spank out of anger and frustration, and yelling accompanies it. Trust me, my mom yelled at me plenty, but never during a spanking. Spankings were ALWAYS controlled.

 

[VegasAngel]

Date: 6/17/2009 10:22:23 PM
Author: hlmr
Consistency, natural consequences, and following through with what you say are all very important.

As far as spanking goes, I was spanked. I did spank a few times, but never felt good about it. It was always done in frustration, but if I had waited until I was calmer, I would never have done it. If I had it to do over again, I would choose not to spank my child.

Definitely agree.

I was spanked a handful of times as a kid no hard feelings. My mom was hair puller & that stands out in my mind. I do spank once in a blue moon & I really, really hate doing it because I know I have/had other options & wind up feeling bad later. There has been only one time I have spanked her that I felt ok afterwards. After I did it I got comments from strangers (I was in public) saying they wished more parents spanked

.

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 6/17/2009 11:08:17 PM
Author: VegasAngel

Date: 6/17/2009 10:22:23 PM
Author: hlmr
Consistency, natural consequences, and following through with what you say are all very important.

As far as spanking goes, I was spanked. I did spank a few times, but never felt good about it. It was always done in frustration, but if I had waited until I was calmer, I would never have done it. If I had it to do over again, I would choose not to spank my child.

Definitely agree.

I was spanked a handful of times as a kid no hard feelings. My mom was hair puller & that stands out in my mind. I do spank once in a blue moon & I really, really hate doing it because I know I have/had other options & wind up feeling bad later. There has been only one time I have spanked her that I felt ok afterwards. After I did it I got comments from strangers (I was in public) saying they wished more parents spanked

.

Ha, they probably said that because a lot of people who use non spanking methods aren''t really doing it well either! We have an entire generation that grew up being spanked, and most would say we turned out OK . Not only that, we work hard, are innovative and didn''t turn out to be lazy slackers. So the generation that spanked us seem to think they did something right and this new generation seems to be turning out spoiled and entitled (just a generalization here). Thus older folks think a few spankings are in order.

btw, I''ve never had my hair pulled, ears pulled or anything else spanked other than my little tushie. Like I said, my mom was very controlled.

 

[TravelingGal]

FYI, I asked my friend for the title of the book. It''s called "How to Have a New Kid By Friday."

 

[PinkTower]

Whew, it sounds as if you have a lot going on, and that might be contributing to your frustration. Small children thrive on order and routine. Anything out of their routine ''wears them out.'' Everything is new to them and they are devoting a great deal of energy to filing everything away and making sense of their world. They do not have the filters on their brains that we as adults take for granted.

One question I had was that you said they were overstimulated when you picked them up from camp. Have you observed the environment to see what the cause might be? Usually young children are rather calm (and hungry) after dismissal. It is common to end a morning with a circletime and then an orderly, quiet lineup for carpool. Anything else would be dangerous during a dismissal around traffic. Speaking with the director about concerns would be appropriate.

Are the swim lessons you mention during camp? That is an excellent activity to tire them out,
but again, if these activities are in addition to camp, the child can be overstimulated. Even your choice of videos can contribute to chaos. Try to choose material such as stories read by a narrater , for example, Eric Carle''s The Hungry Caterpillar, or John Lithgow type videos which are just sing alongs, or Mr. Rogers, where nothing much happens at a fast pace. Children like to watch things over and over. Repetition is part of their learning process, so the investment in some quality items for them to watch is worth your money. That way you can get dinner on the table, etc. I can make some suggestions, or your librarian is a good resource.

Try slowing things down, and enjoying simple activities together. Childhood is fleeting; enjoy your girls.

 

[House Cat]

Date: 6/17/2009 2:44:48 PM
Author:Allisonfaye
I watch Super Nanny. I pride myself on being consistent and firm. My kids are sweet girls. But we are beginning to develop a bit of a discipline problem. A bit of background: My girls are 3.5 and 5. My five year old, Isabella, is basically a sweet girl, but not the most energetic kid in the room (which I totally understand siince I am the same way). My 3 year old is a little sparkplug and has a million times my energy. She gets that from her dad. With Isabella, the biggest problem is getting her to keep moving. She knows what she is supposed to do, she just can''t seem to follow through. She says ''it is not fun to get ready''...but she loves where we are going...preschool, swim lessons, whatever. I tried reward charts (stickers), marble jars, screaming, you name it...I can be screaming in her face and she is moving so slow, I think she is going to go backwards. I know I shouldn''t be screaming. I just don''t know what to do.

My other daughter, Olivia, is the little rule breaker. If you draw a line in the sand, she crosses it EVERY TIME. She thinks it is fun. It wasn''t so bad if she wasn''t tired, but now, even if she is not tired, she breaks the rules. She KNOWS what they are. Don''t throw your cup on the floor. Don''t climb through the rungs on my other daughters footboard (I am afraid she will get choked). But she just goes for it. I take away her books (we read every night). I put her to bed without songs. I tried a marble jar for her. Didn''t work. I admittedly have spanked her. She laughs. I worry that if I don''t get her in line now, she will be in jail by the time she is 16.

Then sometimes, they just egg each other on. Like when I am taking them both home from camp. I know they are stimulated from camp. But they hang on me and roll on the floor and tickle each other. I want to crawl under the rug, I am so embarrassed by their behavior. They aren''t like this everywhere. They can go into a store and behave appropriately. They seem to have difficulty with transitioning from one enviornnment to another, which I guess is somewhat common.

I am at my wits end and I feel like I am a terrible mom. My husband is supportive and he is firm with them, too. I notice that when HE puts Olivia in the corner, she tends to stay, but when I do it, she gets out over and over. I tend to think that they know the mom is the soft place to land so they can only be so fearful of her. Also, a mans voice is deeper and maybe a little scarier?

HELP!

Allison,

I haven''t read everyone''s responses, because I want mine to come from my perspective. I will read after I''m done.

First...salve for your wounds. I have to tell you that everything you''ve described about your children sounds completely age appropriate. Your children aren''t heading for jail, nor are they completely out of hand! Your three year old is in the developmental stage where she is testing boundaries and gaining autonomy. She does this by "rebelling," for lack of a better term. (To be honest, she sounds really intelligent and active.)

You aren''t the worst mother in the world either! We all get to the point to where we are at our wits end sometimes. Our kids wear us out. This is the time when we might need a new perspective on things. This is what you''re doing now. Let me tell you that parenting rarely looks like the idealized stuff we read in books. It never looks like what we imagined in our heads. Our children, they like to break those molds for us. They are teaching us lessons each and every day.

So, what are your kids teaching you? I hear a lot of anxiety in your post. I hear that you''re worried that you''re the worst mom in the world. Why? because your daughter won''t get ready on time? Really? The worst mom in the world to me is some crack addicted person who doesn''t feed her kids..but that''s a whole other topic. You, no. So, daughter not getting ready on time. Buy a timer, make a game of it. Give her WAY more time then she will ever need, allow her to set the timer, let her get ready on time! But, put it in perspective for yourself too, if you''re late to wherever you''re going, what is the worst that is going to happen? Being late isn''t a reflection of you as a mother. Being late isn''t the worst thing in the world. I think there might be a part of your daughter that senses the anxiety from you about being late and so she pushes back. Don''t give her that option.

Can I ask why you''re embarassed by their behavior when you''re picking them up from camp? They''re wound up and they''re acting like kids. I''m certain the people at camp have seen worse and even more certain the people at camp have ENCOURAGED more rambunctious behavior. Where do you think the kids got the energy from?

Now, you might think from this post that I might be the most permissible parent ever. I''m not. But I think it is a balance of accepting your children for who they are, quelling your anxieties, AND having clear concise rules.

It really helped me to understand that my 4 year old, who sounds a lot like your 3 year old was at a certain developmental stage where a lot of his behavior was normal. So, you work with it. You allow them to grow, but you don''t allow them to win every battle. The rungs in the footboard would be off limits for me and there would be no question. Time out each time. I also learned that all of my children sense anxiety and doubt and they feed on it like wolves, so I do my best to stay out of that mode of parenting. It isn''t a pleasant way of parenting anyway.

One last thing, I used to worry a lot of what others thought of me as a parent. One day I woke up with a big SCREW THEM attitude. You know why? Because I know that I''m doing my best! I know that I''m loving my children with all of my heart and giving them everything that I think they need. Some stranger''s judgement of me means nothing! Even some person who might know me a little bit or a lot means nothing because they aren''t living my life or raising my children. What works for some, might not work for others. You must know in your heart that you ARE a good mother because you have a deep love for those children and you are doing all that you can! I''m thinkin these were the only requirements needed, otherwise some great and wise handbook would have come out of the womb with the baby!

Anyway, off the soap box. I hope that you can see that this stage will pass and that your children won''t end up in jail. I hope that you will see that you are a good mother. Anxiety gets the best of us sometimes, you just need to put things into perspective.

 

[Allisonfaye]

Date: 6/18/2009 7:53:29 AM
Author: Pink Tower
Whew, it sounds as if you have a lot going on, and that might be contributing to your frustration. Small children thrive on order and routine. Anything out of their routine ''wears them out.'' Everything is new to them and they are devoting a great deal of energy to filing everything away and making sense of their world. They do not have the filters on their brains that we as adults take for granted.

One question I had was that you said they were overstimulated when you picked them up from camp. Have you observed the environment to see what the cause might be? Usually young children are rather calm (and hungry) after dismissal. It is common to end a morning with a circletime and then an orderly, quiet lineup for carpool. Anything else would be dangerous during a dismissal around traffic. Speaking with the director about concerns would be appropriate.

Are the swim lessons you mention during camp? That is an excellent activity to tire them out,
but again, if these activities are in addition to camp, the child can be overstimulated. Even your choice of videos can contribute to chaos. Try to choose material such as stories read by a narrater , for example, Eric Carle''s The Hungry Caterpillar, or John Lithgow type videos which are just sing alongs, or Mr. Rogers, where nothing much happens at a fast pace. Children like to watch things over and over. Repetition is part of their learning process, so the investment in some quality items for them to watch is worth your money. That way you can get dinner on the table, etc. I can make some suggestions, or your librarian is a good resource.

Try slowing things down, and enjoying simple activities together. Childhood is fleeting; enjoy your girls.

I should just add a few things:
We are the most routine oriented people you could ever meet. The kids know the drill. They know the rules.

I ordered the Magic 123 thing once and the manufacturer canceled the order due to being out of stock. But I should reorder, I guess.

They have camp three mornings a week from 9-12:30 and they eat lunch there. I didn''t mean they were being overstimulated by the camp per se. I just figured after a full morning of activities, they might be (to give them a little understanding). Swim lessons are on a different day.

We definately were doing times outs but when I put Olivia in, she gets out over and over and that''s why we resorted to spanking. The spanking threat has somewhat improved Isabella''s behavior lately.

 

[Allisonfaye]

Date: 6/18/2009 10:59:15 AM
Author: House Cat

Date: 6/17/2009 2:44:48 PM
Author:Allisonfaye
I watch Super Nanny. I pride myself on being consistent and firm. My kids are sweet girls. But we are beginning to develop a bit of a discipline problem. A bit of background: My girls are 3.5 and 5. My five year old, Isabella, is basically a sweet girl, but not the most energetic kid in the room (which I totally understand siince I am the same way). My 3 year old is a little sparkplug and has a million times my energy. She gets that from her dad. With Isabella, the biggest problem is getting her to keep moving. She knows what she is supposed to do, she just can''t seem to follow through. She says ''it is not fun to get ready''...but she loves where we are going...preschool, swim lessons, whatever. I tried reward charts (stickers), marble jars, screaming, you name it...I can be screaming in her face and she is moving so slow, I think she is going to go backwards. I know I shouldn''t be screaming. I just don''t know what to do.

My other daughter, Olivia, is the little rule breaker. If you draw a line in the sand, she crosses it EVERY TIME. She thinks it is fun. It wasn''t so bad if she wasn''t tired, but now, even if she is not tired, she breaks the rules. She KNOWS what they are. Don''t throw your cup on the floor. Don''t climb through the rungs on my other daughters footboard (I am afraid she will get choked). But she just goes for it. I take away her books (we read every night). I put her to bed without songs. I tried a marble jar for her. Didn''t work. I admittedly have spanked her. She laughs. I worry that if I don''t get her in line now, she will be in jail by the time she is 16.

Then sometimes, they just egg each other on. Like when I am taking them both home from camp. I know they are stimulated from camp. But they hang on me and roll on the floor and tickle each other. I want to crawl under the rug, I am so embarrassed by their behavior. They aren''t like this everywhere. They can go into a store and behave appropriately. They seem to have difficulty with transitioning from one enviornnment to another, which I guess is somewhat common.

I am at my wits end and I feel like I am a terrible mom. My husband is supportive and he is firm with them, too. I notice that when HE puts Olivia in the corner, she tends to stay, but when I do it, she gets out over and over. I tend to think that they know the mom is the soft place to land so they can only be so fearful of her. Also, a mans voice is deeper and maybe a little scarier?

HELP!

Allison,

I haven''t read everyone''s responses, because I want mine to come from my perspective. I will read after I''m done.

First...salve for your wounds. I have to tell you that everything you''ve described about your children sounds completely age appropriate. Your children aren''t heading for jail, nor are they completely out of hand! Your three year old is in the developmental stage where she is testing boundaries and gaining autonomy. She does this by ''rebelling,'' for lack of a better term. (To be honest, she sounds really intelligent and active.)

You aren''t the worst mother in the world either! We all get to the point to where we are at our wits end sometimes. Our kids wear us out. This is the time when we might need a new perspective on things. This is what you''re doing now. Let me tell you that parenting rarely looks like the idealized stuff we read in books. It never looks like what we imagined in our heads. Our children, they like to break those molds for us. They are teaching us lessons each and every day.

So, what are your kids teaching you? I hear a lot of anxiety in your post. I hear that you''re worried that you''re the worst mom in the world. Why? because your daughter won''t get ready on time? Really? The worst mom in the world to me is some crack addicted person who doesn''t feed her kids..but that''s a whole other topic. You, no. So, daughter not getting ready on time. Buy a timer, make a game of it. Give her WAY more time then she will ever need, allow her to set the timer, let her get ready on time! But, put it in perspective for yourself too, if you''re late to wherever you''re going, what is the worst that is going to happen? Being late isn''t a reflection of you as a mother. Being late isn''t the worst thing in the world. I think there might be a part of your daughter that senses the anxiety from you about being late and so she pushes back. Don''t give her that option.

Can I ask why you''re embarassed by their behavior when you''re picking them up from camp? They''re wound up and they''re acting like kids. I''m certain the people at camp have seen worse and even more certain the people at camp have ENCOURAGED more rambunctious behavior. Where do you think the kids got the energy from?

Now, you might think from this post that I might be the most permissible parent ever. I''m not. But I think it is a balance of accepting your children for who they are, quelling your anxieties, AND having clear concise rules.

It really helped me to understand that my 4 year old, who sounds a lot like your 3 year old was at a certain developmental stage where a lot of his behavior was normal. So, you work with it. You allow them to grow, but you don''t allow them to win every battle. The rungs in the footboard would be off limits for me and there would be no question. Time out each time. I also learned that all of my children sense anxiety and doubt and they feed on it like wolves, so I do my best to stay out of that mode of parenting. It isn''t a pleasant way of parenting anyway.

One last thing, I used to worry a lot of what others thought of me as a parent. One day I woke up with a big SCREW THEM attitude. You know why? Because I know that I''m doing my best! I know that I''m loving my children with all of my heart and giving them everything that I think they need. Some stranger''s judgement of me means nothing! Even some person who might know me a little bit or a lot means nothing because they aren''t living my life or raising my children. What works for some, might not work for others. You must know in your heart that you ARE a good mother because you have a deep love for those children and you are doing all that you can! I''m thinkin these were the only requirements needed, otherwise some great and wise handbook would have come out of the womb with the baby!

Anyway, off the soap box. I hope that you can see that this stage will pass and that your children won''t end up in jail. I hope that you will see that you are a good mother. Anxiety gets the best of us sometimes, you just need to put things into perspective.

Thank you. This helped me a lot. (Actually, one of my favorite books is Confessions of a Slacker Mom. Have you read it? )

It''s ironic but sometimes right after I punish either of my daughters, they tell me they love me. I hope it is because they know the energy it takes to discipline them is out of love.
And sometimes when I yell at Olivia, she says ''You don''t love me, Mommy?" and no matter how mad at her I am, I always say I do love you, very much. If they say they hate me, which on occasion they do when they are mad, I say, "Ok, but I love you''.

By they way, Olivia ate a few bites of dinner last night and threw her cup on the floor. She got nothing else the entire night.
Ok, so if you guys think I should have let Isabella go to bed totally naked, I maybe should have. I will get the book, too.
Thank you so much for all of your posts. It really helps to feel that I am not alone here. My husband is great but he gets to go to work all day. Haha. Lucky him.