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Native cut

kenny

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What is native cut?
 

tyty333

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Guys with very few clothes and lots of body painting that chop stones with handmade tools ;-) .
 

kenny

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tyty333|1304536883|2912252 said:
Guys with very few clothes and lots of body painting that chop stones with handmade tools ;-) .
w.jpg
 

tsavvy

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Check out the second link here: http://lmgtfy.com/?q="native+cut"+versus+"precision+cut"

Technically, a native cut stone is a stone that is faceted in the country from which it originated. This would mean that montana sapphires faceted in the US, regardless of the type of cutting/faceting used, are native cut.

However, the term native cut is typically mis-used to refer to gemstones that are poorly cut, often on a jamb peg machine rather than a precision machine. This term is a misnomer (and rather condescending) because it is used to describe the quality of the cut rather than whether the stone was cut in its country of origin. Many of the so-called native cuts are not cut in their country of origin, but in cutting houses in Thailand and other countries. There are also many true native cut stones that are faceted on jamb peg machines that have excellent cuts and are spectacular gemstones.
 

iLander

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kenny

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Thanks for the links guys. :wavey:
 

davi_el_mejor

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LD

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tsavvy|1304537659|2912262 said:
Check out the second link here: http://lmgtfy.com/?q="native+cut"+versus+"precision+cut"

Technically, a native cut stone is a stone that is faceted in the country from which it originated. This would mean that montana sapphires faceted in the US, regardless of the type of cutting/faceting used, are native cut.

However, the term native cut is typically mis-used to refer to gemstones that are poorly cut, often on a jamb peg machine rather than a precision machine. This term is a misnomer (and rather condescending) because it is used to describe the quality of the cut rather than whether the stone was cut in its country of origin. Many of the so-called native cuts are not cut in their country of origin, but in cutting houses in Thailand and other countries. There are also many true native cut stones that are faceted on jamb peg machines that have excellent cuts and are spectacular gemstones.
I understand your comment absolutely - and don't necessarily disagree - but would point out that this term is used widely to describe poorly cut gemstones by lapidarists, in many publications etc where it is not used in a condescending manner but more a descriptive term rather racial slur.
 

Pandora II

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Having recently come back from Sri Lanka I can vouch for the standard of cutting being extremely high - the majority of stones that I looked at had no windows, no big bellies, no off-centre culets and near-perfect meet points. There were a number of stones that would rival any of the precision cut ones here. I need to take some pics but I'll post them up when I have them. The guys out there are really understanding about good cuts these days and I even saw some beautiful Asscher cuts.

As far as the term 'native cut' goes I think it's used in a variety of ways, some good and some bad:

a) to imply traditional faceting styles as opposed to fancy precision cuts.
b) to imply 'cut in the country of origin'. Some still cut on jamb-peg but more and more often cut on precision machines.
c) to imply poor cutting or cutting for weight - very derogatory and not necessarily true. There are amazing native cuts, good native cuts and blooming awful native cuts.
 

blithesome71

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Mar 20, 2009
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Nice topic...

@Kenny & tyty333
haha u made me laugh w/ your posts. Very clever & funny :D
 

T L

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I just wanted to say that just because a gem is cut by a precision cutter doesn't always guarantee it will be cut well. As for the "native" cuts, or non-precision cut stones, those need to be judged on their own merits. Some are cut well enough, and maybe they don't have perfect facet meets, and/or proportions, etc. . . people like me generally buy them because we love the color or some other aspect of the gem aside from the cutting. There are some people that require perfect facet meets, polish, proportion in a stone, or they will not buy it no matter what. It's a judgement call based on what the person wants from a particular gem.
 

T L

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davi_el_mejor|1304539286|2912296 said:
iLander|1304537928|2912269 said:
Yes, the topic was beaten to death here:

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/precision-vs-native-cuts.132150/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/precision-vs-native-cuts.132150/[/URL]

Native cut versus precision cut = careless cutting for size rather than beauty versus artistically cut for beauty

Hotel room paintings versus museum paintings

:errrr: Tell that to some of my "carelessly" cut native stones...

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Without very close inspection of the gems, and a lapidary may correct me if I'm wrong, but without checking facet meets, and other aspects, we don't know if those are not cut on a precision lapidary machine. They may very well be, in which case, they would be precision cut stones. I don't like the term "native" cut, but it is commonly used. I prefer using the terms non-precision cut and precision cut, to delineate which stones have been taken great care in as far as cutting is concerned. There is more information on the meaning of precision cutting on this page.

http://www.osirisgems.com/precision_cutting

Also, when inspecting a precision cut gem, it should be viewed from more than vantage point than through the table, to determine if the proportion is acceptable. I have seen gems with perfect facet meets and polish, but with poor proportions.
 

Pandora II

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I agree with you on all of that TL.

Personally I would like to see the following terminology or version of accepted so everyone knew what page they were on!

Traditional faceting - the normal cuts that have been around for donkeys whether cut on a jamb-peg or on an ultra-precision machine.

Precision faceting - fancy cuts that need a computer system to do them and are as much about the cut itself as about making the most of the material.

Poorly cut - the bad results of both the above.
 

MontageCreations

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Apr 17, 2011
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In the end the machine used doesn't matter near as much as the person guiding it. I started with a jamb peg machine, as I couldaford little else, my means were meager and I thought it better to hone my eye and hand skills, as well as gain appreciation for the efforts of those faceters that had been producing beautiful cuts for hundreds of years before me.

Is the Hope Diamond native cut? No, nor is it precision cut, but it is a beautiful stone nonetheless. There are many other notable stones that fit in this category, and they were all cut using what we might call inferior machines, but the skill of the operator more than compensated for it.

Most of us that do cut, have seen remarkable skill presented in native cutting, we have also seen the worst from precision machinery, it's not nearly as dependant on the tools as it is the person behind the tools. We should give credit where it's due, circumstances, laws, means, and honor all impact the native cutter's innate ability to produce beauty. The fact that they can do so in the worst of conditions, when the nearest electical outlet is 200 km and 2 days away... still amazes me.
 
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