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Minimum 1.5 Carat Round On a $10k budget quick

diamonddoof

diamonddoof

Rough_Rock
Joined
Nov 25, 2017
Messages
9
Hi PS! So glad I found this community. Currently looking for a >= 1.5 ct Round, near colorless >H,I (?), "Eye clean", and would like to spend no more than $10k. Also, need to get this in the next couple weeks :D. Been checking out a lot of stones and "vetting" them with idealscope when possible and HCA. The more I search the more questions I have including but not limited to:
  1. Can I get away with an H/I for color if s/o wants colorless in a halo setting? I have read that in halo round color is more important and should be better than or same as side/pave stones
  2. How can I really tell "eye clean". I've had some James Allen people suggest to me stones that had very visible inclusions on the 20/10x zoom. Does this have anything to do with setting.
  3. Can IGI be trusted/should I buy a diamond with a non AGS/GIA cert?
I've had a couple JA chat folks recommend this stone: https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...h-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-3623323 which is $9600 (currently on hold). The HCA is very good and looks eye clean to me, but perhaps the color is a little worse than other H stones I see? Also, it seems to be less $ than similar maybe because of the IGI cert? Idealscope is here: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7jISqPlGl0KUnlPNmtxNU0zQzgyNEJMMjMyZmtYZ2xvakRR/view?usp=sharing which to my untrained eye looks "ok" when comparing to the reference chart.

Basically it's 2am (west coast) and I could really use your expert advice/words of encouragement/admonishments :twirl: Thanks!
 
diamonddoof said:
Can I get away with an H/I for color if s/o wants colorless in a halo setting? I have read that in halo round color is more important and should be better than or same as side/pave stones
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I disagree with this. As long as the stones are well-cut and within 2 color grades, there should not be an issue.

diamonddoof said:
How can I really tell "eye clean". I've had some James Allen people suggest to me stones that had very visible inclusions on the 20/10x zoom. Does this have anything to do with setting.
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Relative to inclusions, go cut out a circle that is 7.5 mm. That is the real size of a diamond. So, there are lots of things you can see at 10x, that are impossible to see with your eyes. So, there is truth in what they are saying -- depending on the inclusion type and location.

diamonddoof said:
Can IGI be trusted/should I buy a diamond with a non AGS/GIA cert?
Click to expand...
The problem with IGI is that they are VERY lax on the grading. So, they say it is H VS2, but GIA or AGS may call it and I or J, J - VS2 or SI1. Based on the video, I think your concern about color is valid, but I don't see any inclusions. Unless they will send it to GIA to confirm the grading, it would be a NO. Keep in mind that the cost to get a diamond graded by IGI, GIA and AGS is about the same.

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...h-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-3623323
The numbers here are of more 60/60 type stone. It will yield more white light than fire. While the angles are complimentary, the low Crown Angle will further limit the fire. But, its going to be spready at 7.56 mm. An IS (idealscope) will tell you if it is leaking light.

I like these better for fire/performance. You can hold up to 3 stones and request IS on those (but, JA is only going to give 3 IS per email, so ponder your choices)
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...f-color-si1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-3510213 {7.48 mm and raises color to F}***
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...h-color-si2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-3619158 {7.36 mm, eyeclean via the video and with SI2 it gets a big discount)
https://enchanteddiamonds.com/v/39863651Z {You'd have to confirm that the feather is not impacting performance {ASET ok, but one arrow is off from the others}
 
Rockysalamander answered most of the things I would say. But if she is wanting colorless, I would not consider going under H color (which is not colorless, but it should work well in a halo IF it's really well cut). I do not like the one you have on hold at JA. I would not go below SI1 clarity and some of those are better than others. I'll see if there is anything else, but the JA 1.55 F SI1 appears to be a very good choice if you are okay with strong fluorescence. Jewelers in general look down on it, but I actually like it.
 
Thanks so much for your help guys! It is much much appreciated. I have the 2 JA diamonds rockysalamander suggested on hold and am awaiting the idealscope images. Will share once I get them.

So flourescence... why is that generally deemed undesirable? It looks like that means your rock will glow under a uv light? Is there any real world scenario where that would be noticed by a non-gemologist? Should I stay away from black lights in real life? :)
 
Its one of those things that waxes in wanes in preference. It can rarely have an impact on the diamond, so we always recommended having the gemologist check, but it is rare. However, so do all the normal inclusions like clouds, feathers and twinning whips in certain circumstance. I actually think it is super-cool and if any of my diamonds had flour, I'd part a black-light over my desk. But, you can use the current trend to your advantage as diamonds with flour are usually a bit lower in price.

"GIA has studied the effect of blue fluorescence on diamond appearance. The Institute screened a large number of diamonds, assembling four sets of six diamonds, with each group representing a different color grade (E, G, I, and K). The diamonds in each set were as similar as possible in all respects except the intensity of blue fluorescence. Diamond graders, trained professionals, and average observers viewed the diamonds in controlled conditions to make a judgment about their appearance.

Here is what GIA found: “For the average observer, meant to represent the jewelry buying public, no systematic effects of blue fluorescence on the face-up appearance of the groups of diamonds were detected. Even experienced observers did not consistently agree on the effects of fluorescence from one stone to the next.”

Simply put, blue fluorescence had a negligible effect on the face-up appearance of diamonds in the colorless or near-colorless grade ranges (grades D through J) except for a slight improvement in the rare instances of very strong fluorescence intensity." From GIA

What's not to love when your diamond does this???

howdiamondslooklikeunderUVlight.jpg
 
Although, most of the time you won't see the blue. Your diamond would look like this. Not a real visible effect.

diamond-flou.jpg
 
@HDer,
Do you have any words of wisdom you may contribute? ;)2
 
Thanks for the further information regarding fluorescence!

I am still waiting on the Idealscope images for both (I guess one has to be flown in to JA New york office). I've been doing a lot of side by side viewing (using the "super mega HYPER" zoom feature on JA) as well as searching using the Pricescope price research tool for similar diamonds and I keep coming back to this https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...h-color-si2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-3619158 which RockySalamander recco'd. It might just be the price but I like the look at it and have a hard time even seeing face-up color difference (bad eyes?) comparing the the F colored stone linked in the second post. Am I just thinking with my wallet here or what are people's thoughts on this? Again will share the Idealscope once I have it so hopefully that will tell the tale.
 
I can't handle the SI2 clarity on that one. That is why I vastly prefer the other one! Also, the F is larger in diameter and has better angles, in my opinion. In other words, I'd personally consider buying the F and would not consider the other.
 
Thanks for the opinion! Based on the size and color difference I am now leaning towards the F. I anxiously await the Idealscope image and gemologist inspection. I've specifically asked them to ensure the fluorescence will not impact performance.

Also, while waiting for the inspection to go through, JA was nice enough to put a setting on hold for me at the black friday/cyber monday 25% discount so I don't miss out on the sale. I have received great cs from them so far
 
diamonddoof said:
So flourescence... why is that generally deemed undesirable? It looks like that means your rock will glow under a uv light? Is there any real world scenario where that would be noticed by a non-gemologist? Should I stay away from black lights in real life? :)
Click to expand...
Here is my VSB under the UV light and under the sun.IMG_2403.JPG IMG_2765.JPG
 
diamondseeker2006 said:
I can't handle the SI2 clarity on that one. That is why I vastly prefer the other one! Also, the F is larger in diameter and has better angles, in my opinion. In other words, I'd personally consider buying the F and would not consider the other.
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I'm usually one for higher clarity and avoiding black on the table. But, I played this video on both my monitors for a long time before posting it. At least in the video, the only visible inclusion is at 10'oclock and I recall this being substantially less expensive (can't see the prices as it is on hold now). Its all about trades, but would personally be willing to give the SI2 a chance pending a good IS and if the JA gemologist agrees its eyeclean and the additional clouds are not impacting the diamond. I would still request and post the IS on this one.
 
Thanks for the ping @Matthews1127. Does the setting have to be platinum/white gold or can it be rose gold or yellow gold? If the latter, you can go lower in color.

I wouldn't worry about inclusions too much at 20x. Take it down to something like 4x and see if you can still see them. 4x on your computer monitor is still much larger than what the diamond will look like in person. BGD actually specifically tells you to look for inclusions at a lower magnification because of this problem.

IGI Antwerp grades will be slightly inflated. Oftentimes they're used for border-condition diamonds where the vendor thinks they can get a more profitable grade. So a lot of IGI SI2s are right in there between SI2 and I1. GIA would put them at an I1, whereas IGI will give them a SI2. Similarly, H VS2 you have there might be graded as an I or SI1 by GIA. For this reason a lot of people stay away from IGI diamonds. In my opinion, I've definitely seen some decent value for money in IGI diamonds, as long as you know that the grade might be inflated a bit. A lot of people will say "you get what you pay for" but that sentiment is also mostly true the other way around, which is that diamond drop shippers tend to put a consistent margin on the wholesale price, and wholesale prices are generally set at where the diamond cutter thinks the diamond will sell. So an IGI grading doesn't necessarily mean that a diamond is overpriced.

If you care about return and buyback policies, James Allen and Blue Nile are pretty decent places to start. If you don't, you can try doing what I did, which takes more legwork and carries a bit more risk: https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/2-07-carats-for-8-2k-conclusion-and-pictures.234668/
 
I'm with RS on the H SI2--the inclusions seem pretty subtle for an SI2. Probably worth a look.
 
Well looks like James Allen really screwed the pooch here and released my hold for the two diamonds recommended by RockySalamander. After talking with a cs rep for 30 minutes, they say they have no record of the hold even though I have literally contacted them every day for a status update and been told to wait another day and that the hold was still there.

After finally getting in contact with a manager, he informed me that he did see the hold, but blamed the supplier for having to release them without any notification to me. He then offered to re-request them and update me tomorrow re availability. Man, this online diamond shopping thing is no Amazon... there appears to be some major kinks that need working out. le sigh...

Anyone other recommendations meeting the criteria outlined in my first post would be greatly appreciated as I'd love being done with this sale sooner than later :)
 
IS looks decent. But I can't take a feather (crack) that significant (assuming that's the feather reaching to the girdle at about 1:00 on the IS). I can deal with a few clouds and even a crystal or two as long as I can't see them with my eye, but I'd just never buy any diamond with a crack unless it is really tiny. It's just a place where I draw a line personally, and I prefer some balance in specs...if the diamond is going to be excellent cut, I'd at least like a reasonably good color and clarity to go along with it. An engagement diamond is not one I'd sacrifice quality in any of the specs. But again, that's my personal bias. I also wouldn't buy a crown angle under 34.

I'd still rather have the F which I think has smaller feathers as far as I can tell and is SI1, larger, and within budget. Better stone all around.
 
Thanks for your opinions on the IS! I was able to get the hold issue for the F stone figured out, but now JA is saying they can't get me an IS image since it is from an overseas supplier. Should I abandon this one or is it worth moving forward, doing an IS myself and returning if not good? Is this just a JA tactic because they know the scan isn't favorable?
 
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Wow beautiful! Congratulations on your engagement and great job on the ring. We wouldn't cry if you posted more pics. Just sayin :whistle:
 
Start a thread over in Show me the Bling!
 
Congrats on your engagement. Beautiful ring!
 
HI:

DD--your ring turned out beautifully. Congrats.

cheers--Sharon
 
Congratulations! Beautiful ring.
 
So happy for you!:love::appl:
 
It's beautiful!! Congrats!! :love:
 
Congratulations! Well done
 
It’s beautiful! Is that a James Allen setting? Sorry if I missed that!
 
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