Kevin Spacey

[AGBF]

Going into rehab seems to be the only means to disappear from radar for a while these days. It's doubtful that seeking help was the primary objective.

You are a very polite person. Someone brought you up well.

Deb

 

[monarch64]

The 14 year old being at a cast party among adults issue reminds me of Drew Barrymore's tumultuous youth. She divorced/became emancipated from her parents at 14, so she would've been about 16 in 1991 when this Kevin Spacey/14 year old incident took place. I'm only comparing the two because I do think context is important just to gain a fuller picture of some things that were happening back then with kids and drugs and parties in acting circles.
https://www.theguardian.com/culture...ore-mother-locked-up-in-institution-interview

 

[Arkteia]

Yes.
Of course.
I agree 100%.

My post was in response to a "How could this happen?" question.
I was pondering what kind of male impulses might be pervasive because of zillions of generations of Darwinian advantage.

I was not arguing unlimited male promiscuity was okay today.

I know. Only it was not necessarily advantageous for the male himself. Male promiscuity was terrifically advantageous for his tiny tribe.

What is interesting is that recently several things happened very close in time. Overpopulation with climate changes, some of which (e.g. ozone hole) being clearly man-made; invention of birth control pill; male promiscuity becoming socially inappropriate.

Very interesting coincidence.

 

[jewelryislife]

The monogamous men left FAR! fewer offspring.
The math, and zillions of generations of this pattern, rewarded the men who impregnated the most women.

Reminds of that James Brown song "It's a maaaan's world". Regrettably people forget about the second line in that song.

 

[Phanie]

I am so pissed off.
I loved Kevin Spacey and could not wait to see HoC #6.
He always looked like a good guy to me (and even though he "finallly" came out, it was not a secret he is bisexual/gay).
All I could think of was " ok hopefuly this is a regretful one time shit moment of drunk/not all his self behavior and did not mean to scar this boy". Just waiting that no more other people would come out with similar stories.

And of course, fricking tough luck, more are opening the flood gates of 'he is a shit guy of the worse cloth'.

Sexual predators and pedophiles do not care one second about being caught because in their head they won't because they are doing whatever they are entitled to. They do it because they can because they won't have much consequences.
Because , historically, up to I want to say now, nothing was happening, because it was normal/OK/expected. (I keep thinking a awful law that used to be https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Droit_du_seigneur and wikipedia saying it is BS of course...).
Women due to various reasons (biologic not as physically powerful as men, religion try to control women sexuality and imprinting that women do not /should not enjoy or have sex, etc...) have been oppressed by power and silenced.

Also One of the things that just surprises me right now is it took ONLY one MAN to take down Kevin Spacey; if the world would believe women and react as fast to women being preyed upon or raped or harassed, it would feel a bit less unsettling. See how many women it took for Cosby, Weinstein (still working on Trump though, see my gist?)...
men's words are still more "reliable' and believable than women's in this situation.

The other point that makes me icky is why would Rapp's parents let a 14 yo go to an adult party by himself? This is really weird (OK I am missing context of what goes on in the show biz but still, and btw why would this be OK and normal just because it is showbiz? WHY??? ). Not victim blaming at all, I just wish that his parents would have been a bit more proactive in telling him if you feel like not staying, call we'll get you. Rapp said he almost felt right away out of place, this is the perfect situation for a predator to act. Predators thrive because non predators have no idea what the grooming and steps they use to get to their victimcs.

 

[House Cat]

I’m not ok with reducing sexual assault to a person giving into his or her sexual urges. Sexual predators are much more than a person looking to get off. Let’s face it, many people (maybe even some people on this very forum!!) have acted on their sexual impulses! These acts are called one night stands, public sex, affairs, kinky sex, etc...

Rape, sexual assault, the ability to commit this heinous act has nothing to do with spreading seed or sexual pleasure. It’s about making another person powerless. It is about doing harm. It’s about degradation and fear. It’s about intimidation.

To reduce sexual assault/rape to orgasm, dicks, men, what people see on the surface, spreads falsities that do harm to the people who are involved in these crimes. It leads to “maybe she should just lie back and enjoy it.”


Lastly, women rape too. The CDC has been classifying forced insertion as a violent sex act rather than rape. They have changed that practice. We won’t have accurate numbers for some time, but this act has been on the rise.

 

[kenny]

... Also One of the things that just surprises me right now is it took ONLY one MAN to take down Kevin Spacey; if the world would believe women and react as fast to women being preyed upon or raped or harassed, it would feel a bit less unsettling. See how many women it took for Cosby, Weinstein ...

Good point.
That had not even occurred to me.

I do consider myself pro-equality to the core, but sometimes I notice how I'm not immune to being a man brought up in a "man's world".
... much like how many whites don't recognize, some even deny, white privilege.
It's easy to just get used to how it is for your group when your group is the privileged one.

 

[minousbijoux]

Your points are well taken, House Cat. It is so clear to me now that Spacey was about fulfilling his needs and controlling others to do so with clear contempt. It seems that he thought he was above it all, which he was for what, over 30 years? The thing that gets me every time is how many people must be complicit - they knew it was happening and didn't say or do anything to prevent it, or report him.

I guess I shouldn't be that surprised. After seeing 'Spotlight' I was stunned at the magnitude of the abuse and pedophilia, but even more so that it everyone seemed to look the other way for decades.

 

[Allisonfaye]

Kenny, most study of the social, evolutionary data out there suggests that humans are "monogamish" That is we tend towards pair bonding, but with some "cheating". While men may spread their dna far and wide, most likely those who were in stable pair bonds were more likely to successfully reproduce for future generations, since babies are evolutionarily "expensive" (babies are really dependent, and take a long time to mature). but yeah it promotes different "strategies" for the two sexes.

http://www.slate.com/articles/healt...he_evolution_of_human_mating_strategies_.html

They were not monogamous in tribal time. A man's lifespan was about 20 years. So the goal was to leave as many children with as many women for gene diversity, and to protect the tribe.

But we are 7 bln people now, living in globalization time, with long lifespans. We would die if men still strived for gene diversity, so to say. Different times require different behaviors, from men and women.

There's a great book called The Selfish Gene that explains this stuff from a biological point of view.

Men are pigs and think with their dicks, sense of entitelment, powet trip. I'm so fed up with the freakin excuses, I say let's pass a law to Castrate all males at birth an we hopefully no longer have a problem in the long run........ yeah no more procreation seems to be the solution.

Wow. Seriously?

Because the bad person felt he was getting away with being bad.

Now he's in career damage control mode.
I doubt there is any remorse, except for getting caught.

I fully believe anyone capable of pedophilia is a sociopath, not capable of feeling remorse. And there are way more of them than people realize. Just because they don't kill you, doesn't mean they aren't sociopaths. Often they are people who didn't attach to someone as an infant and although I haven't read all the stuff about him, apparently Spacey had some bad childhood trauma, which could explain why he is like this.

 

[telephone89]

Also One of the things that just surprises me right now is it took ONLY one MAN to take down Kevin Spacey; if the world would believe women and react as fast to women being preyed upon or raped or harassed, it would feel a bit less unsettling. See how many women it took for Cosby, Weinstein (still working on Trump though, see my gist?)...
men's words are still more "reliable' and believable than women's in this situation.

I think this is important to note. I KNOW this is true for sexual harrassment/assault - a woman calls out a man, its easily deflected "what are you on your period?" "C'mon it was just a joke" etc, but as soon as a MAN calls another MAN out, it actually becomes a thing. They actually stop to think about it and its like "wow, if john thinks thats bad, is it actually???". It sucks that they dont think that if the persons name is "wendy" or "jane", but its one of the main reasons I try to get men on our side for these issues.

 

[Arkteia]

The other point that makes me icky is why would Rapp's parents let a 14 yo go to an adult party by himself? This is really weird (OK I am missing context of what goes on in the show biz but still, and btw why would this be OK and normal just because it is showbiz? WHY??? ). Not victim blaming at all, I just wish that his parents would have been a bit more proactive in telling him if you feel like not staying, call we'll get you. Rapp said he almost felt right away out of place, this is the perfect situation for a predator to act. Predators thrive because non predators have no idea what the grooming and steps they use to get to their victimcs.

Rapp's parents were divorced. Maybe this?

I am also thinking that we have read that Spacey had a horrible childhood, but no one ever wrote how many men abused him when he was young before he got where he was. Maybe, just maybe, his treatment of Rapp was learned behaviour? Not trying to condone, just to understand.

(Because Weinstein was not the only predator in Hollywood, that is for sure).

 

[kenny]

Not trying to condone, just to understand.

Thanks for articulating this and ... Bingo.
You've pointed out a very important distinction.

Often the lynch mob doesn't want to understand, just hang the bastard, NOW !

Over the years I've gotten sh!t for my attempts to understand what's behind bad behavior ... and I get accused of condoning it.

 

[lyra]

As all is laid bare in the news, it seems Spacey and his siblings grew up in an extremely abusive home. No excuses, but I do feel empathy. He should have received treatment over his lifetime for that. His father was the embodiment of evil it sounds like. No one can just deal with that alone. As for the others, I haven't heard any similar stories yet. Just entitlement issues so far. This is so ugly. Yes, they deserve to be punished. I hope there is also some rehabilitation if it's even possible.

 

[Phanie]

If Spacey was a childhood abuse victim (with possible sexual abuse too; when I say if it is just for the sake of arguing, not to doubt it), it does explain the behavior. Pedophile/abuse victims often reproduce what they have lived because they do not know better and because they have been groomed for years to think it is normal.
But then, it explains some of the behaviors and does not excuse/absolve.
This is so crummy.

 

[telephone89]

Riddley Scott re-shooting a movie to remove Kevin Spacey. Was due out next month.

http://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-41925767

 

[nala]

This whole spacey thing is why I️ insisted in the Weinstein thread that sexual harassment in Hollywood was more than just a female issue but is so deeply entrenched in the Hollywood culture. It dorsnt justify it, of course. But the other thread made it seem like it was only a women’s issue. I continue to suspect that many men will remain silent for fear that they will be associated with gasp— homosexual acts.

 

[kenny]

This whole spacey thing is why I️ insisted in the Weinstein thread that sexual harassment in Hollywood was more than just a female issue but is so deeply entrenched in the Hollywood culture. It dorsnt justify it, of course. But the other thread made it seem like it was only a women’s issue. I continue to suspect that many men will remain silent for fear that they will be associated with gasp— homosexual acts.

Nala, in your post the second sentence begins with a box.
What does the box mean?

Screen capture:

 

[nala]

Nala, in your post the second sentence begins with a box.
What does the box mean?

Screen capture:

Lol. It means nothing. I updated My new iPhone and this box kept popping up in my reply.