Is this normal?

[WinkHPD]

Date: 9/1/2005 4:21:05 PM
Author: Pricescope

PS advertisers are used to get ''bitten'' here from time to time and should improve and resolve the issues.

Bitten, and occassionally spanked. But it makes us work harder to be better!

Wink

 

[igs]

Date: 8/31/2005 7:02:41 PM
Author:jazmine
I am considering a few different diamonds from some of the PS vendors. Most of them have been very helpful, offering to send me digital photos, have Sarins run etc. One of the vendors however claims that they do not send photos because they really do not show the true quality of a stone (which I kind of understand but even a crappy photo is better than none) and she said they would not run a Sarin because it is a marquise and the Sarin is not accurate with this cut. I know the Sarin is not as consistant as it would be with say a round but do you think that this response is normal or should I shop elsewhere. Unfortunatly the diamond that she has is my favorite so far (on paper).

Hi Jazmine. Oftentime, a vendor will try his best to fulfill a client''s requirements. A lot of diamond wholesale companies will not supply photos for clients because they feel it does no justice. We have one diamond wholesale company who supplies excellent quality photos of all their diamonds and as a result we not only satisfy our clients'' needs but we have substantially increased our business with them. So if the vendor can''t supply a photo it''s probably because the diamond wholesale company is refusing to do it for them. Sarin reports are always available and even then, there are some diamond wholesale companies who won''t even do them. If a diamond looks extremely promising ie. ideal proportions, EX polish, EX symmetry or AGS000 it might be worth your while to have it further analyzed at a recognized appraiser. You would probably be expected to pay the appraiser''s fee though. Do as much investigative work on the diamond before sending it to an appraiser. As a sidenote I am sure all the vendors are quite anxious to make sales and you wouldn''t believe the multitude of problems and precarious situations each vendor encounters on a day to day basis. If a vendor doesn''t reply to you it''s because he got caught up in a number of other critical situations. The vendor will always appreciate your call and will reprioritze your needs if you call. That extra phone call or email will show the vendor that you are eager and want their help. Just offering this advice from years of experience. Good Luck!!!!!

 

[Rhino]

Date: 9/1/2005 11:58:17 PM
Author: Catmom

Date: 9/1/2005 10:38:46 PM
Author: Matatora
Catmom who was the vendor who was less then helpful?

It was not my intention to name names here but I have been asked by several people to do so, so I guess I will. My disappointing experience was with GOG. I did experience the situation where the three stones I was interested in were not there even though they appeared on the PS list and/or directly on the GOG website. Rhino I''m glad to see that you are taking measures to help with this issue. When I called about the stones I was told ''I don''t know where you are coming up with these stones''. When I replied that I found them on the PS list and on your own website I was told that ''these lists are not updated very often.'' That didn''t leave me with a very good feeling as this was my first internet purchase experience. I was then told that a search would be done from other locations to see if a stone could be found that met my requirements. I said fine, and gave my name, email address, etc. I was told that I would hear back shortly. It has now been almost three weeks and I have heard nothing back.

In the mean time I found a gorgeous stone from another vendor. We emailed several times and spoke on the phone several times and within 2 days from the initial contact I had my stone mounted and in my hands. It was quite a different experience. So while I am very happy that I got my pendant, I was disappointed with the service from GOG. I would have liked to be told if they couldn''t find a stone with my requirements or that they didn''t want to pursue it for whatever reasons. .

Hi Catmom,

Thank you for your candid and honest criticism. While we do enjoy the positive reviews we would never learn if we didn''t get the more critical ones as well. It is these we learn from most. Over the past year we''ve been exploring various options for our website to help eliminate this kind of problem and after investigating multiple options we believe we have found one that finally takes care of this problem (and actually a few others) once and for all. When you had contacted us initially we did have a rash of stones move out under the 1ct range (strange and unpredictable market this is) and certain qualities we could just not attain as hard as we tried. I don''t understand why you were not contacted back as we generally keep each email flagged that we know we must follow up on, however once the new site is finished Tim and I will be splitting the incoming email load to help avoid those situations as well. I am happy that you finally did find your stone. Please understand this mistake was not intentional Catmom as we always strive to improve our services, not just to our clientele but also folks who are just looking for answers to their diamond questions (we field many emails simply answering questions even if they are not purchasing from us too).

Once again thanks and I am sorry that that had happened.

Just an FYI, we do update Leonid at the very least, once a week with our updated inventory and many times even 2x a week. It is a common problem not just with us but all vendors who sell via the net.

Leo, once our site is complete and the inventory listed will be live and in realtime, perhaps there is some way a direct link to a realtime inventory can be set up?

Warm regards,

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 9/2/2005 9:54:52 AM
Author: igs

As a sidenote I am sure all the vendors are quite anxious to make sales and you wouldn't believe the multitude of problems and precarious situations each vendor encounters on a day to day basis. If a vendor doesn't reply to you it's because he got caught up in a number of other critical situations. The vendor will always appreciate your call and will reprioritze your needs if you call. That extra phone call or email will show the vendor that you are eager and want their help. Just offering this advice from years of experience. Good Luck!!!!!

Martin, I can appreciate that on any individual given day, a vendor may run into a critical situation or two. However, those days occur often enough to become a norm, then it signals that the vendor needs to improve his processes to ensure such disruptions don't impact potential business.

Anyone can have an off day, but there are those vendors who seem to have calamity with regularity. There is *always* some fluke crisis occurring. If crisis can strike that easily, it means something in the processes aren't right.

While I can be sympathetic to your troubles, it doesn't mean that I should have to settle for less than *reasonable*, responsive service. As a customer, I refuse to accept that I have to chase a vendor around *showing him how eager I am* and begging to spend my money with him. Won't happen.

I'll also tell you that you lost an opportunity at my business. I phoned you not once, but twice to ask about 2 stones. I wasn't asking for stuff the supplier won't give you.....all I asked you for was copies of the grading reports. You promised to email them, and never did. You lost a sale.

I had a similar problem to Catmom with GOG as well. I was asking about stones that weren't inhouse, and grading reports that were promised weren't delivered. After a week went by with no information, Jon explained how difficult it was to get information from the suppliers.

I think if this is true, then vendors need to be more cautious and forthright in setting their expectations on what they can deliver and when they can deliver it by. The key really is good, honest communication from the vendor to the customer and customer to vendor. Vendors should be realistic about what they can deliver and within a realistic time frame. That would eliminate 80% of the problem, I think.

For the other 20%, if you run into problems, a simple phone call to us as customers saying "hey, I'm having trouble getting that" would go a long way toward smooth customer relations instead of no communications weeks later.

I really think in both cases, the problem is more prevalent with brokered stones, and that's why I tend to stick to inhouse inventory.

 

[Regular Guy]

aljdewey...

Note to self...with next contact with a Pricescope vendor, be sure to identify self as:

(Sally Smith) aka aljdewey.

Regards,

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 9/2/2005 12:01:47 PM
Author: Regular Guy
aljdewey...

Note to self...with next contact with a Pricescope vendor, be sure to identify self as:

(Sally Smith) aka aljdewey.

Funny.

Not for nothing, RG......but at the time this happened with GOG, he *did* know I was "aljdewey" from Pricescope.

In that case, I think part of the issue was the stones were brokered, not inhouse. I think the other part is Jon was going out of his way to find a real winner for me, and he was working his plan behind the scenes to make it happen, but *I* didn''t know it. So, from my end, it was a lack of responsiveness. Had he communicated with me then, it would have been a much better experience.

Honestly, I think there are times that being a PSer works against us, not for us. The impression I''ve gotten from many vendors here: we KNOW them, so they feel we''re more willing to cut them slack. It''s almost like saying "well, my friends will understand, so I''ll take care of the folks who wouldn''t understand first and then get to my friends." I don''t think it''s intentional, I think it''s just how many of them triage.

But in all seriousness......one shouldn''t have to identify one''s self as a PS member to get reasonable service. I shouldn''t have to name-drop to be treated well.....especially as a repeat customer.

 

[cute330xigrl]

Date: 9/2/2005 12:12:53 PM
Author: aljdewey

Date: 9/2/2005 12:01:47 PM
Author: Regular Guy
aljdewey...

Note to self...with next contact with a Pricescope vendor, be sure to identify self as:

(Sally Smith) aka aljdewey.

Funny.

Not for nothing, RG......but at the time this happened with GOG, he *did* know I was ''aljdewey'' from Pricescope.

In that case, I think part of the issue was the stones were brokered, not inhouse. I think the other part is Jon was going out of his way to find a real winner for me, and he was working his plan behind the scenes to make it happen, but *I* didn''t know it. So, from my end, it was a lack of responsiveness. Had he communicated with me then, it would have been a much better experience.

Honestly, I think there are times that being a PSer works against us, not for us. The impression I''ve gotten from many vendors here: we KNOW them, so they feel we''re more willing to cut them slack. It''s almost like saying ''well, my friends will understand, so I''ll take care of the folks who wouldn''t understand first and then get to my friends.'' I don''t think it''s intentional, I think it''s just how many of them triage.

But in all seriousness......one shouldn''t have to identify one''s self as a PS member to get reasonable service. I shouldn''t have to name-drop to be treated well.....especially as a repeat customer.

Excellent comments! You really shouldnt have to say you''re so and so from PS. To( I guess) stress the commonality here w/ GOGand their responsiveness, my fiance and I dealt w/ the same thing. We were one of the very 1st few couples to be told of the Jubilee which was due in 2wks past our visit. So instead of purchasing a round , we decided to wait. We were sent a pic of a .60 stone that came in. We (like others) were floored and put in a request to buy one of those squares. We followed-up a few times (few weeks apart) when we heard nothing of the stones coming in. Something like 3 months passed and we never recieved a follow-up from GOG that the stones were on their way, nor that they were in the store. We called at either the 4th or 5th month to find that all the stones were already spoken for. And yes a few stones in our range existed. At the time we wrote off our experience as the "norm" for the industry and still went on to purchase a round from them since they were local. But we were not too pleased w/ the lack of follow-up. Especially given this case where the next batch of jubilees to come in wouldnt be for another 4-8months AND we had already given GOG $7k of our $$ towards a stone. We just knew we had top priority.

. Well, such is life. We''re happy w/ the round.

 

[Daniela]

Date: 9/5/2005 6:08:41 AM
Author: cute330xigrl

Date: 9/2/2005 12:12:53 PM

Author: aljdewey

Date: 9/2/2005 12:01:47 PM

Author: Regular Guy

aljdewey...


Note to self...with next contact with a Pricescope vendor, be sure to identify self as:


(Sally Smith) aka aljdewey.

Funny.

Not for nothing, RG......but at the time this happened with GOG, he *did* know I was ''aljdewey'' from Pricescope.

In that case, I think part of the issue was the stones were brokered, not inhouse. I think the other part is Jon was going out of his way to find a real winner for me, and he was working his plan behind the scenes to make it happen, but *I* didn''t know it. So, from my end, it was a lack of responsiveness. Had he communicated with me then, it would have been a much better experience.


Honestly, I think there are times that being a PSer works against us, not for us. The impression I''ve gotten from many vendors here: we KNOW them, so they feel we''re more willing to cut them slack. It''s almost like saying ''well, my friends will understand, so I''ll take care of the folks who wouldn''t understand first and then get to my friends.'' I don''t think it''s intentional, I think it''s just how many of them triage.


But in all seriousness......one shouldn''t have to identify one''s self as a PS member to get reasonable service. I shouldn''t have to name-drop to be treated well.....especially as a repeat customer.

Excellent comments! You really shouldnt have to say you''re so and so from PS. To( I guess) stress the commonality here w/ GOGand their responsiveness, my fiance and I dealt w/ the same thing. We were one of the very 1st few couples to be told of the Jubilee which was due in 2wks past our visit. So instead of purchasing a round , we decided to wait. We were sent a pic of a .60 stone that came in. We (like others) were floored and put in a request to buy one of those squares. We followed-up a few times (few weeks apart) when we heard nothing of the stones coming in. Something like 3 months passed and we never recieved a follow-up from GOG that the stones were on their way, nor that they were in the store. We called at either the 4th or 5th month to find that all the stones were already spoken for. And yes a few stones in our range existed. At the time we wrote off our experience as the ''norm'' for the industry and still went on to purchase a round from them since they were local. But we were not too pleased w/ the lack of follow-up. Especially given this case where the next batch of jubilees to come in wouldnt be for another 4-8months AND we had already given GOG $7k of our $$ towards a stone. We just knew we had top priority.

. Well, such is life. We''re happy w/ the round.

Do you mean that GOG had your $7000 for four months and you still never saw a Jubilee?

 

[Mara]

"We were one of the very 1st few couples to be told of the Jubilee which was due in 2wks past our visit. So instead of purchasing a round , we decided to wait. We were sent a pic of a .60 stone that came in. We (like others) were floored and put in a request to buy one of those squares. We followed-up a few times (few weeks apart) when we heard nothing of the stones coming in. Something like 3 months passed and we never recieved a follow-up from GOG that the stones were on their way, nor that they were in the store. We called at either the 4th or 5th month to find that all the stones were already spoken for. And yes a few stones in our range existed. At the time we wrote off our experience as the 'norm' for the industry and still went on to purchase a round from them since they were local. But we were not too pleased w/ the lack of follow-up. Especially given this case where the next batch of jubilees to come in wouldnt be for another 4-8months AND we had already given GOG $7k of our $$ towards a stone. We just knew we had top priority. . Well, such is life. We're happy w/ the round."

______________________

WOW you are way more forgiving than I would be. After 5-6 months of someone having my $7k and no product to show for it after promises around the 3rd month, I would have taken my money and RUN. Not reward the vendor (any vendor!) for their lapse in customer service by still purchasing from them. You have the opportunity to vote with your $$.

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 9/5/2005 6:08:41 AM
Author: cute330xigrl

Especially given this case where the next batch of jubilees to come in wouldnt be for another 4-8months AND we had already given GOG $7k of our $$ towards a stone.

HOLY COW! You had 7K of your money tied up for 4-5 months? God, I hope you got interest on it!

Seriously, that's whacked. Even a home purchase only requires 1-2K in earnest money!

I agree with Mara in that I wouldn't likely reward a vendor with a purchase who didn't respond, but that's just me. You got a stone you're really happy with, and that's what counts.

 

[cute330xigrl]

Do you mean that GOG had your $7000 for four months and you still never saw a Jubilee?

Yes Daniela. Reason being, FI purchased a QOH from them and found I didnt want it. So he returned it after a few days ? That's where the 7k credit came from. I do believe he got to see the .6 jube. We just never got the chance to pick a jube from the batch that were in our specs/price range.

 

[cute330xigrl]

WOW you are way more forgiving than I would be. After 5-6 months of someone having my $7k and no product to show for it after promises around the 3rd month, I would have taken my money and RUN. Not reward the vendor (any vendor!) for their lapse in customer service by still purchasing from them. You have the opportunity to vote with your $$.

Mara the FI is the one who was way more forgiving! Now that jubes were out of the picture, I found like 3 rounds that I was ecstatic about! Two were from WF. They were H VS stones. I asked him to take a look but he sounded so emotionally drained/stressed out about the whole process. I''m sure that had to do w/ me rejecting his original purchase.

He said , he didnt want to go thru the whole ordeal of getting to know someone else all over again AND contact GOG for a $$ refund AND deal w/ an out of state vendor. So who am I to push the man?

. I dropped it, did a few wooossaaaa''s and told him to pick whatever stone he wants!

So he picked an I VVS.

hah! And why you ask? Cos we just missed an H VS by a day. lol! Aiya. I now LOVE my I VVS. Having a VVS is like having equity in a stone for my future upgrade.

 

[cute330xigrl]

Date: 9/5/2005 1:03:38 PM
Author: aljdewey

Date: 9/5/2005 6:08:41 AM
Author: cute330xigrl

Especially given this case where the next batch of jubilees to come in wouldnt be for another 4-8months AND we had already given GOG $7k of our $$ towards a stone.

HOLY COW! You had 7K of your money tied up for 4-5 months? God, I hope you got interest on it!

Seriously, that''s whacked. Even a home purchase only requires 1-2K in earnest money!

I agree with Mara in that I wouldn''t likely reward a vendor with a purchase who didn''t respond, but that''s just me. You got a stone you''re really happy with, and that''s what counts.

LoL! Yea, I did forget to mention that the 7k came from a store credit return. But nonethless... water under the bridge...

I have caterers to spank now.

 

[Mara]

hee hee yes it seems like boys have less patience sometimes when it comes to these sparkly objects, i could see Greg doing the same thing!!!

 

[Maxine]

Date: 9/5/2005 1:48:40 PM
Author: cute330xigrl

WOW you are way more forgiving than I would be. After 5-6 months of someone having my $7k and no product to show for it after promises around the 3rd month, I would have taken my money and RUN. Not reward the vendor (any vendor!) for their lapse in customer service by still purchasing from them. You have the opportunity to vote with your $$.

Mara the FI is the one who was way more forgiving! Now that jubes were out of the picture, I found like 3 rounds that I was ecstatic about! Two were from WF. They were H VS stones. I asked him to take a look but he sounded so emotionally drained/stressed out about the whole process. I''m sure that had to do w/ me rejecting his original purchase.

He said , he didnt want to go thru the whole ordeal of getting to know someone else all over again AND contact GOG for a $$ refund AND deal w/ an out of state vendor. So who am I to push the man?

. I dropped it, did a few wooossaaaa''s and told him to pick whatever stone he wants!

So he picked an I VVS.

hah! And why you ask? Cos we just missed an H VS by a day. lol! Aiya. I now LOVE my I VVS. Having a VVS is like having equity in a stone for my future upgrade.

So, did you end up getting the round there?????

 

[cute330xigrl]

Date: 9/5/2005 2:30:29 PM
Author: Maxine

Date: 9/5/2005 1:48:40 PM
Author: cute330xigrl

WOW you are way more forgiving than I would be. After 5-6 months of someone having my $7k and no product to show for it after promises around the 3rd month, I would have taken my money and RUN. Not reward the vendor (any vendor!) for their lapse in customer service by still purchasing from them. You have the opportunity to vote with your $$.

Mara the FI is the one who was way more forgiving! Now that jubes were out of the picture, I found like 3 rounds that I was ecstatic about! Two were from WF. They were H VS stones. I asked him to take a look but he sounded so emotionally drained/stressed out about the whole process. I''m sure that had to do w/ me rejecting his original purchase.

He said , he didnt want to go thru the whole ordeal of getting to know someone else all over again AND contact GOG for a $$ refund AND deal w/ an out of state vendor. So who am I to push the man?

. I dropped it, did a few wooossaaaa''s and told him to pick whatever stone he wants!

So he picked an I VVS.

hah! And why you ask? Cos we just missed an H VS by a day. lol! Aiya. I now LOVE my I VVS. Having a VVS is like having equity in a stone for my future upgrade.

So, did you end up getting the round there?????

Yes we did

 

[Rhino]

Hi all,

Hope everyone had a good labor day. I''m not going to pretend I remember every detail of a transaction that took place over a year ago but some things don''t jive about this story. I''ll be the first to admit we make mistakes but the gist of the post sounds like I held onto your fiance''s 7k against somebody''s will. In all fairness, please clarify to the readers that this indeed was not the case. That would be a very unreasonable practice and we do not operate like this. This post makes it sound like I held onto the money against your fiance''s will. If I remember this correctly your fiance purchased a Queen of Hearts diamond, then returned it wanting to get a Jubilee. At that time we offered him a FULL REFUND but HE refused to take it. He expressed to me that he enjoyed our services and enjoyed doing business with us and he and I got along very well. If he came into our store today I would know his face and the times we have dealt face to face, I think he will tell you himself we were always on the level and it was a joy each time, even when he returned the QoH. He left the money with us ... why? Because he was comfortable with us and trusted us. Did I violate that trust? If I did I don''t think he would have purchased from us. We did not get in any Jubillee''s that met his criteria and it could not have been a .6xct stone because no .6xct Jubilee cost 7k in the quality your fiance was asking for. This does not make sense. If I am mistaken please pm me and clarify.

While there are no problems with Jubilee diamonds there are and always will be shortages of certain qualities. Every vendor experiences the same thing with various diamonds and when people are waiting for a certain diamond or specific quality within a shape AND ESPECIALLY IF THEY HAVE MONEY DOWN we do not malisciously skip over them to sell the diamond to somebody else. That would be unethical and we do not and would never operate under those principals. We have built our business on the principals of honesty and integrity and just simply do not do this to people. That would be mean and if perchance it *ever* happened it was never done out of will or malicious intent. Mara and Al are right ... if a vendor operated under this auspices they would not deserve your fiance''s business.

Cute330, if you feel in any way that I have acted malisciouslly towards you or your fiance and you are truly not happy please contact me via pm and I will take whatever steps necessary to rectify your situation. I don''t appreciate being painted in a bad light based on circumstances that were out of my control regarding the availability of certain diamonds. I have no control over how many Jubilee''s are cut and when they will be released.

There happen to be many clients who were waiting for Jubilee''s that just never showed up. When time begins to draw longer than anticipated I try to suggest alternatives. Some go with those alternatives some want to wait. I don''t twist anyone''s arm either way but please, just because your fiance chose to leave his 7k with us, don''t make us out to be some horrible type of people with no ethics. It gives people here a totally false impression about how we do business.

 

[Rhino]

Date: 9/5/2005 12:59:26 PM
Author: Mara
''We were one of the very 1st few couples to be told of the Jubilee which was due in 2wks past our visit. So instead of purchasing a round , we decided to wait. We were sent a pic of a .60 stone that came in. We (like others) were floored and put in a request to buy one of those squares. We followed-up a few times (few weeks apart) when we heard nothing of the stones coming in. Something like 3 months passed and we never recieved a follow-up from GOG that the stones were on their way, nor that they were in the store. We called at either the 4th or 5th month to find that all the stones were already spoken for. And yes a few stones in our range existed. At the time we wrote off our experience as the ''norm'' for the industry and still went on to purchase a round from them since they were local. But we were not too pleased w/ the lack of follow-up. Especially given this case where the next batch of jubilees to come in wouldnt be for another 4-8months AND we had already given GOG $7k of our $$ towards a stone. We just knew we had top priority. . Well, such is life. We''re happy w/ the round.''

______________________

WOW you are way more forgiving than I would be. After 5-6 months of someone having my $7k and no product to show for it after promises around the 3rd month, I would have taken my money and RUN. Not reward the vendor (any vendor!) for their lapse in customer service by still purchasing from them. You have the opportunity to vote with your $$.

For clarification I NEVER make promises I can''t deliver on. When a person puts in a request for a stone that we do not have in inventory I never say I promise you I''ll have this specific stone in such and such a time. That would be foolish. I *always* say we''ll keep our eyes open and as soon as anything remotely close to your call becomes available we will let you know about it and secure it for you until we publish the details.

 

[belle]

okay...first of all, i am not one to normally speak out on issues like this, but i feel something needs to be said here...

rhino, i have read your responses to consumers lately when they post about your less than desirable services and you enevitably turn it into the consumers fault. of course every side has two stories, and you are more than welcome (encouraged actually) to give your side of it, but painting the consumer as the bad guy is not cool. earlier in this thread (need i quote?) you said that consumers need to tell the good as well as the bad so that vendors can learn from their mistakes, yet i''ve noticed when someone comes on here to post about something that goes wrong at gog, you always have an excuse. and you don''t leave it at that....you have to take a jab at the consumer as well, suggesting they were at fault in some way. no wonder people are scared to post their experiences.....
good for you...bad for consumers.

 

[JohnQuixote]

As a fellow vendor I want to offer another side.

I was feeling bad for Rhino when I read the part that indicated perhaps he was just holding onto money after a return. That doesn’t sound like something any PS vendor would do. I don’t know the details but on Rhino’s behalf I would like to state that we're all very sensitive to things that sound negative. If I were in his shoes I would want to seek clarification on that too - not to be contrary, just to see it resolved.

 

[Kaleigh]

I bought my asscher from Rhino, and I know that my experience was awesome in dealing with the whole team at GOG. If there are things that need to be improved great, but he is hardly the kind of person that would hold someone''s money unecessarily. I don''t blame him for seeking clarification on this. He is true blue in my book.

 

[belle]

Date: 9/5/2005 9:48:00 PM
Author: JohnQuixote

As a fellow vendor I want to offer another side.

I was feeling bad for Rhino when I read the part that indicated perhaps he was just holding onto money after a return. That doesn’t sound like something any PS vendor would do. I don’t know the details but on Rhino’s behalf I would like to state that we''re all very sensitive to things that sound negative. If I were in his shoes I would want to seek clarification on that too - not to be contrary, just to see it resolved.

point taken sir john.

just as you were empathetic to the plight of rhino, i was to that of a fellow consumer. i may have been oversensitive to the issue as well, but i just don''t want people to feel like they can''t share their experience here for fear of getting blamed in some way. if you read earlier in the thread, no one wanted to mention names...why?
it sure wasn''t because they couldn''t remember them.

 

[cute330xigrl]

Hope everyone had a good labor day. I''m not going to pretend I remember every detail of a transaction that took place over a year ago but some things don''t jive about this story. I''ll be the first to admit we make mistakes but the gist of the post sounds like I held onto your fiance''s 7k against somebody''s will. In all fairness, please clarify to the readers that this indeed was not the case. That would be a very unreasonable practice and we do not operate like this. This post makes it sound like I held onto the money against your fiance''s will. If I remember this correctly your fiance purchased a Queen of Hearts diamond, then returned it wanting to get a Jubilee. At that time we offered him a FULL REFUND but HE refused to take it. He expressed to me that he enjoyed our services and enjoyed doing business with us and he and I got along very well. If he came into our store today I would know his face and the times we have dealt face to face, I think he will tell you himself we were always on the level and it was a joy each time, even when he returned the QoH. He left the money with us ... why? Because he was comfortable with us and trusted us. Did I violate that trust? If I did I don''t think he would have purchased from us. We did not get in any Jubillee''s that met his criteria and it could not have been a .6xct stone because no .6xct Jubilee cost 7k in the quality your fiance was asking for. This does not make sense. If I am mistaken please pm me and clarify.

Ok Jonathan I will clarify:

1. I never said you did anything "malicious". I simply said you had poor follow-ups. The whole thing that even encouraged me to post my experience was YOUR comment stating : " While we do enjoy the positive reviews we would never learn if we didn''t get the more critical ones as well. " Well here''s one of those more "critical" reviews you asked for. So lets set the customer flaming aside shall we.

2. I never said you refused to give us a refund. I did however state "...he didnt want to go thru the whole ordeal of getting to know someone else all over again AND contact GOG for a $$ refund AND deal w/ an out of state vendor."

Translation - FI wanted to stay working w/ GOG in hopes of obtaining a stone. Yes he did have a great relationship w/ you. We both did which is why we didn''t think anything "malicious" of the incident. And it is the same reason why we were so generous o still give you our business. I thought that fact was pretty obvious.

3. The .6x ct stone was simply a SAMPLE photo to show us what they looked like. I never said the .6ct stone is what we could purchase at $7k. Here''s my quote : "We were sent a pic of a .60 stone that came in. We (like others) were floored and put in a request to buy one of those squares."

The Jubilee batch eventually arrived but went w/ you (I believe) to some Vegas Convention before we had the chance to choose a stone. We, over the course of many weeks initiated contact after not hearing from you for some time. What we found is, the ones that were in our criteria were sold @ the convention. What remained from your trip were those jubilees that were not in our criteria being less that 1.2x tcw.

While there are no problems with Jubilee diamonds there are and always will be shortages of certain qualities. Every vendor experiences the same thing with various diamonds and when people are waiting for a certain diamond or specific quality within a shape AND ESPECIALLY IF THEY HAVE MONEY DOWN we do not malisciously skip over them to sell the diamond to somebody else. That would be unethical and we do not and would never operate under those principals. We have built our business on the principals of honesty and integrity and just simply do not do this to people. That would be mean and if perchance it *ever* happened it was never done out of will or malicious intent. Mara and Al are right ... if a vendor operated under this auspices they would not deserve your fiance''s business.

Again, mistakes are never malicious in nature. However, they do produce the same outcome as something malicious.. which is to say, DISAPPOINTMENT. There was poor communication on your part. That''s all Jonathan. No one is ridiculing your honesty or integrity. Therefore I find your comments on that subject irrelevant and would appreciate focussing on the issue at hand... communication.

Cute330, if you feel in any way that I have acted malisciouslly towards you or your fiance and you are truly not happy please contact me via pm and I will take whatever steps necessary to rectify your situation. I don''t appreciate being painted in a bad light based on circumstances that were out of my control regarding the availability of certain diamonds. I have no control over how many Jubilee''s are cut and when they will be released.

FI & I understand the "lack" of avaiable diamonds. You''re talking as if I requested you to buy a rough and cut the stone yourself. You have control over communication and how much of it you provide your customer base. In MY scenario you failed to provide adequate follow-ups. The conversations for the most part were initiated by my darling, soft spoken, well-demeanored and non-confrontational FI you speak of. But privately, I flat-out told FI that it sucked to wait this long and find stones listed on your site that passed us. All the while, our money is graciously sitting w/ you. You were recommending us stones up to $13k! You mean to tell me that in the batch of jubilees that came in during those 4-5months, there weren''t any in that price range? LOL!

There happen to be many clients who were waiting for Jubilee''s that just never showed up. When time begins to draw longer than anticipated I try to suggest alternatives. Some go with those alternatives some want to wait. I don''t twist anyone''s arm either way but please, just because your fiance chose to leave his 7k with us, don''t make us out to be some horrible type of people with no ethics.

I think you spoke here w/ alot of misguided emotion. After re-reading my comments I''m sure you''d recant on some of your assumptions/comments. So I''ll ignore this entire paragraph. (Just as we "ignored" the lack of communcation we experienced a year ago.)

It gives people here a totally false impression about how we do business.

I think you''re giving ppl impressions on just how you do business all on your own. Whether they choose to see you in a better or worse light after reading your comments, you will soon know. It was interesting to read how YOU flamed me even tho we still spent our money with you. Nice going.

 

[Rhino]

Whew... busy for Rhino on the forums lately. While I am the last person in the world who would like to raise this thread to the front again I would like to bring clarity and closure to some of the things that have transpired in this thread. Some here have seen this spiral out of control so I would like to clarify as much as possible the issues that have transpired and why things were getting a little heated.

Firstly ... I do not mind the fact that people complain when we make a mistake. I do it too and I do not recant my statment that vendors, including myself learn most from constructive critcism. In fact I invite it. Any business looking to improve their services should be attentive to the voices of their clients and potential clients even if these things are more than a year old (incidentally it was only Catmom that was fairly recent, the other 2 (Alj and Cute) are more than a year old).

Cute330... I hear you 100% on your first post. The issue was you would have liked more frequent correspondence while you and your fiance were waiting for the Jubilee''s to come. I can appreciate that and we have taken steps to help this although as humans we still do slip from time to time. No excuses. A pattern we find with following up with certain people is many guys are like ... I don''t want an email every day telling me you haven''t got the stone yet ... CONTACT ME ONCE YOU GOT IT, while the ladies like to be contacted more frequently. I''m not saying this is the case each and every time, just an observation. I honestly can''t recall how often your fiance wanted updates but I take responsibility nonetheless. Most clients are cool with contacting them once we''ve found what they''re looking for and don''t necessarily look for emails from us telling us we haven''t located it yet. On the new site we''ll be featuring a field on our finders forms asking, while we''re searching for their stone, how often they would like to be updated ... daily, weekly, or once it arrives and act on that.

One issue that spiraled out of control here is the issue that we had the clients 7k while they were waiting for a Jubilee. 3 regulars came here and highlighted this fact making an issue out of it when in fact it was not an issue at all. Cute330 herself said so in her last post. This issue of the 7k was never an issue at all yet a big stink was being made over the fact "that I held their 7k" while Jubilee after Jubilee came in which we just sold out from under them. This is a false dichotomy that was being painted making me appear to be withholding thier funds from them when in fact he could have came here at any time to get all of his money back. Not only this but he also had 30 days after the receipt of his round diamond to receive a full refund or exchange. If there are 2 things you don''t mess with in another person''s life ... its their family and their money. The issue of the 7k was highlighted to appear that we were messing with another person''s money when that in fact was not the case at all. This is why I was seeking clarity on this issue and John Quixote picked up on this as well. I was not seeking a fight or looking to point the finger elsewhere... I just wanted the truth brought to light.

Did Jubilee''s come in and were sold that were in their range while I had their 7k? It is possible but let me also clarify. When Jubilee''s were first introduced there was a large waiting list. While cute330''s fiance did have a deposit with us, that did not bump him up in the line of clients who were waiting for stones. I developed that list based on a first come first serve basis and even if a person left me 30k for a 5k diamond that did not put them any higher on the list. Truth is I didn''t require any deposit at all and still don''t. If a person wants a stone that we don''t have in stock we do everything within our means to find and locate it without any deposit at all. This is a service we do for our clients as do many other vendors. At times we can get a Sarin beforehand to weed out what we do and don''t want to call in but other times we do need to ask for a deposit to cover our shipping expenses if a person would like our appraisal of the diamond to post online.

So if perchance cute330 and her fiance saw stones that did indeed fall in their specs, in all fairness I had to serve the clients who were before them on the list.

BTW, none of this was cute330''s fault or intent, if anyone thinks I am attacking, flaming, or jabbing her READ MY RESPONSE AGAIN... there is nothing in my response that attacked her or anything remotely close. I had hoped that she was seeing what was going on and would have clarified to others the fact that the issue of the 7k was indeed a non issue, but the damage had already been done. I did express the fact that I was not happy with how this was transpiring but to accuse me of jabbing, flaming or attacking a consumer ... you are reading things into my words that are simply not there.

Belle, of all the posts your response was perhaps the most surprising to me.

Date: 9/5/2005 9:16:25 PM
Author: belle

rhino, i have read your responses to consumers lately when they post about your less than desirable services and you enevitably turn it into the consumers fault. of course every side has two stories, and you are more than welcome (encouraged actually) to give your side of it, but painting the consumer as the bad guy is not cool.

I do not see anywhere in my words that I point the finger at cute330 accusing her of being "the bad guy", nor Catmom or Alj. If I am mistaken and there are words in my post that you have miscontrued or could have been miscontrued as being an attack on any of them, please point it out to me. You saying this skews this thread into another direction with no basis in fact, to the point where even cute330 seems to think so! By all means I NEVER WANT TO BE PERCEIVED AS ATTACKING A CONSUMER so if you could point out to me specifically which of my words could be construed as an attack, I will be sure to NEVER use those words again as long as I live.

I am perturbed about another comment you make in this post.

Date: 9/5/2005 9:16:25 PM
Author: belle

yet i''ve noticed when someone comes on here to post about something that goes wrong at gog, you always have an excuse. and you don''t leave it at that....you have to take a jab at the consumer as well, suggesting they were at fault in some way. no wonder people are scared to post their experiences.....
good for you...bad for consumers.

Always have an excuse? Don''t leave it at that? Jab at the consumers?!? Suggesting my mistakes are their fault?!? These are some pretty agressive statements. I''ve been participating on these forums since 2000 belle. Where in the 5 years I''ve been participating have I done this to anyone?!? I''m not a preacher or anything but the tenets of my faith tell me to recognize my faults, admit them and confess them and do something about correcting it. The person you are describing above is not consistent with my character nor the way we do our business. People who know me will tell you plainly including strm, John Quixote, nad many others who know me and have dealt personally with me. I am careful to treat all people as I myself like to be treated. With dignity and respect. We operate quite transparently and are not only this way with our business but also in my personal life. I am always striving to be a better person and while I lay no claim to perfection, your portrait of me here is completely unfair to me, it is rather insulting and I would appreciate an apology as I have never done anything that you are claiming here.

In closing ... I hold no hard feelings towards anyone in this thread. I realize how statements can be miscontrued and if the regulars who were making issue of the 7k and their wait did so unintentionally, I of course, give you the benefit of the doubt. I do not believe the regulars here would maliciously lash out at me like this but as John said earlier ... us vendors are very sensitive to comments made and when they are not grounded in truth or fact it is only fair that the truth be presented. I am not looking for special treatment. Just the truth. Can ya''ll understand where I''m coming from?

Warm regards,
Jonathan

 

[mrssalvo]

thanks for the clarification Rhino

 

[Mara]

There was no 'malicious lashing out' Rhino...people were merely commenting on what the original customer had noted...responding and reacting to it. As I noted in my original response, if ANY vendor had strung me along for months then I seriously doubt I would have continued to shop with them. You note that's not what happened, well that's fine then....but my response was just in reaction to the original post.

Clarify something for me willya...while their $7k was sitting.....the customer notes that you went to a convention and sold stones there without giving the existing waiting customers the first pick of the litter? If that's the case, I'd be ticked off too. You didn't really address that in your last response?

It seems really hard for me to understand that someone would have to wait up to 6 months with money banked with you while you found them another appropriate stone, even knowing that Jubilees are not pouring out the window. How can you address that time lapse? More frequent communication? With $7k on the line, sure I'd like that too!!! But after about 3 weeks of hearing nothing, I probably would have become that seriously squeaky wheel you just wanted to oil so I'd go away.

I never would have made it to 3 months, nevermind 6!

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 9/7/2005 3:17:55 PM
Author: Rhino

A pattern we find with following up with certain people is many guys are like ... I don't want an email every day telling me you haven't got the stone yet ... CONTACT ME ONCE YOU GOT IT, while the ladies like to be contacted more frequently. I'm not saying this is the case each and every time, just an observation. I honestly can't recall how often your fiance wanted updates but I take responsibility nonetheless. Most clients are cool with contacting them once we've found what they're looking for and don't necessarily look for emails from us telling us we haven't located it yet.

I think this really highlights what I'd mentioned before about setting reasonable expectations through good communication and specifics.

I think that operating on *general* assumptions like those bolded above are dangerous. (Not saying you're relying on them, Jon....just a general comment for all.) Just as diamonds are individual, unique things, so too are customers unique. Some may prefer less communication and some may prefer more. As you noted, even the patterns you've observed don't apply each and every time. For vendors who are willing to spend that hour or two helping folks learn about stones, it seems like it should be a no-brainer to spend an extra minute or two making sure expectations are clear and detailed with each customer as a routine part of the sales process.

Cute's first post says "we were among the very 1st couples to be told of the Jubille, which was due in 2 weeks after our visit". I may be wrong, but I get the sense from reading this that Cute330 wasn't clear that you already had a large waiting list (since she thought she was among the first told about it), nor that the Jubes coming in 2 weeks may all be earmarked for that "large waiting list".

This is an example where clear and detailed communication may have been helpful: "There is a shipment coming in two weeks, so I may have examples for you to see, but we have a large waiting list for them, and that parcel may all be accounted for. Because they are limited availability, it could take some months before more are available. How should be proceed from here? We don't typically communicate until they come in, but if you'd like a follow-up call 2/3/4/whatever months out just to update on our updated expectations for arrival of available stones at that point, we can do that."

The responsibility for clear and specific communications is a SHARED one, though....the onus is not on just the vendors, but the customers as well. Customers need to be equally clear and specific about their expectations; it helps vendors understand what will make us happy customers.

Date: 9/7/2005 3:17:55 PM
Author: Rhino

One issue that spiraled out of control here is the issue that we had the clients 7k while they were waiting for a Jubilee. 3 regulars came here and highlighted this fact making an issue out of it when in fact it was not an issue at all. Cute330 herself said so in her last post. This issue of the 7k was never an issue at all yet a big stink was being made over the fact 'that I held their 7k' while Jubilee after Jubilee came in which we just sold out from under them. This is a false dichotomy that was being painted making me appear to be withholding thier funds from them when in fact he could have came here at any time to get all of his money back. ........I just wanted the truth brought to light.

...........if the regulars who were making issue of the 7k and their wait did so unintentionally, I of course, give you the benefit of the doubt. I do not believe the regulars here would maliciously lash out at me like this..........

Jon, I gotta say it: the one making it a "big stink" is you. We (the 3 regulars) didn't realize when we posted that it was a credit from refund and that her FI elected not to do refund because it wasn't mentioned initially. The post sounded as though it was a deposit for the stone. HOWEVER, when Cute realized it wasn't clear, she did clarify it, and that was the end of it.....no stink, no nothing, until you brought it up seven hours after she clarified it.

Also, I think it's important to reassure you that none of the regulars lashed out at *you* personally. In fact, no one *lashed out* at all. What each of us essentially said is we *personally* wouldn't likely do business with ANY vendor (not just you) if there were months of waiting with no communication. For me, that's still a true statement.

Incidentally, held and withheld are different things. Withheld suggests that you wouldn't give it back or held the money hostage. Cute never suggested you withheld the 7K, nor did I think that's what she meant. I'll bet no one else thought that either.

Date: 9/7/2005 3:17:55 PM
Author: Rhino

I do not see anywhere in my words that I point the finger at cute330 accusing her of being 'the bad guy', nor Catmom or Alj. If I am mistaken and there are words in my post that you have miscontrued or could have been miscontrued as being an attack on any of them, please point it out to me. ...........I NEVER WANT TO BE PERCEIVED AS ATTACKING A CONSUMER so if you could point out to me specifically which of my words could be construed as an attack, I will be sure to NEVER use those words again as long as I live.

I have to be honest and admit I was stunned after reading your initial response. If I had been the customer to receive this response, I would have been offended. The overall tone felt defensive and combative to me. It would seem from Belle's and Cute's reactions that I'm not alone. Since you're asking, here are phrases that especially struck me.

" some things don't jive about this story" - calling it a "story" and saying it doesn't jive suggests she's lying on purpose. I'm sure it's not what you meant, Jon; I'm just telling you how it could be received.

"I don't appreciate being painted in a bad light based on circumstances that were out of my control regarding the availability of certain diamonds." - suggests she's being unreasonable for being upset about things that aren't in your control. She wasn't critical about of the lack of availability of diamonds...she was critical about the lack of communication, which is well within your control.

"but please, just because your fiance chose to leave his 7k with us, don't make us out to be some horrible type of people with no ethics." - To me, this remark feels very flip...."don't blame us for your fiance's choices".

She said "a few stones in our range existed." You replied "we didn't get any in his range in, and it couldn't have been X because......" I think that one is probably self-evident.

Interestingly, this fact was modified in your second post to "we didn't get any in his range in that weren't already promised to others on the waiting list." Huge difference between "we didn't get any" and "we didn't get any that weren't already spoken for". Again, specific communication can avoid this type of misunderstanding.

It's interesting that you point out some experiences are a year old. This appears to be offered in a way that suggests they are somehow not relevant now. I wonder if the same holds true for positive experiences. Do you tell people about positive experiences that customers had with you more than a year ago? I think you may get a sense of what Belle was trying to say from this.

I honestly don't believe this thread was intended to be malicious at all, and it's regrettable that it was perceived that way all around.

 

[Rhino]

You''re welcome mrssalvo.

Hi Mara,

Date: 9/7/2005 5:12:11 PM
Author: Mara
There was no ''malicious lashing out'' Rhino...people were merely commenting on what the original customer had noted...responding and reacting to it.

I know that. That''s why I said "I do not believe the regulars here would maliciously lash out at me..." What''s dangerous Mara is another person reading your post might take your comment and say see... Rhino is saying that everyone is "maliciously lashing out" at him! When in fact I never said such. That''s how words get twisted and is an example of what has happened in this thread. Woops... I inherited your font! kewl

As I noted in my original response, if ANY vendor had strung me along for months then I seriously doubt I would have continued to shop with them. You note that''s not what happened, well that''s fine then....but my response was just in reaction to the original post.

Mara dear. The "stringing along" is never intentional. We currently have a client who wants a 4ct H&A that just simply does not exist on the market. We''ve been investigating stones for this client for months. I mean months. If you were to ask them about our service they will swear up and down about us. We are doing everything within our means to find what they are looking for. I am not withholding anything from them and I myself have told them, if you want to shop with others that''s perfectly fine with me. Some diamonds take time to find and people know I do not string them along on purpose. It''s just the conditions of the market. Something that is completely out of my control. If a person thinks its my fault that stones aren''t showing up I can''t help that but in all sincereity I can not control what becomes available and when. YES ... the wait is frustrating. It is for me as well. If you were a vendor and I were buying from you and you had trouble locating what it is I wanted I would not leave you Mara because you''re having trouble finding it. Especially since I like you. Sure I may shop around to see if I could find it but when I know you''re working for me to find it, TO ME, that would not be a reason for complaint. I would appreciate the work you put into it and I''d also ask to reimburse you for any funds you spent trying to locate it if I wound up getting it elsewhere but I would not put your back against the wall if you failed to let me know every single move you made to try and get it. Also, I know, as I have stated, that you would never intentionally try to make an issue out of something the original poster did not intend to become an issue. Peeps here were responding but I was seeing MAJOR issues being made out of non-issues and this is why I was seeking clarification.

Clarify something for me willya...while their $7k was sitting.....the customer notes that you went to a convention and sold stones there without giving the existing waiting customers the first pick of the litter? If that''s the case, I''d be ticked off too. You didn''t really address that in your last response?

Thank you for bringing this up. The convention she was speaking of was the 2004 JCK Las Vegas convention. Jubilee stones were supposed to be available to me *before* the show but if I took them all the manufacturer would have nothing to present at that show. I did not go there to sell stones. Only manufacturers are there to sell stones. I went there to get stones. After the show I was sent all avialable Jubilee''s and each stone went to the person who was next in line on the list in the order with which they placed their call. Nobody was skipped that I know of. Yes there may have been a stone that was in their call (cute330) but if another person was before them that person had dibs on the stone. Now ... if I were a consumer waiting I''m sure that would have bothered me but it would not have been fair to place other people before others who were not before them on the list. That would have been unfair to those who were before them. I hope you can understand this (you too cute).

It seems really hard for me to understand that someone would have to wait up to 6 months with money banked with you while you found them another appropriate stone, even knowing that Jubilees are not pouring out the window. How can you address that time lapse? More frequent communication? With $7k on the line, sure I''d like that too!!! But after about 3 weeks of hearing nothing, I probably would have become that seriously squeaky wheel you just wanted to oil so I''d go away.

I never would have made it to 3 months, nevermind 6!

LOL... I can appreciate that Mara. Hey ... my font is back! You are talking to a person here who likes to tackle jobs as quickly as possible AND I TOO PERHAPS WOULD HAVE BECOME IMPATIENT but this is just the nature of the beast. Hey... if I had ten 1.2x-1.3xct Jubilee stones F-H VS2-SI1 here I''d sell em all and pretty quickly too I''d imagine however it''s been over 6 months that I''ve seen one in this category. I know it sounds impossible but Mara, believe me when I tell you, some stones just take longer to get and the shortage of rough does not help the situation. More frequent communication, while nice does not answer the problem either. I know if I were the client waiting, getting an email or phone call each day saying ... NOT YET ... might aggravate me more. I''d eventually get sick of hearing that and probably move onto a different shaped stone more quickly.

That is why, these days when we locate excellent stones we purcahse them outright for inventory asap. When a stone is here and we''re not spending time hunting there''s no breakdown in communication and any information the client is looking for, be it verbal, optical, written, etc their requests are answered within minutes of the conversation (as long as it''s not a weekend... our weekends are Sunday/Monday). My assistant Tim generally has all inquiries answered within a 24 hour span if not the same day except perhaps on Tuesday when we''re answering all the stuff that came in on Sat eve, Sunday & Monday.

Thanks for the questions and for giving me the opportunity to answer and clarify.

 

[Daniela]

Date: 9/7/2005 5:45:29 PM
Author: aljdeway


Jon, I gotta say it: the one making it a 'big stink' is you. We (the 3 regulars) didn't realize when we posted that it was a credit from refund and that her FI elected not to do refund because it wasn't mentioned initially. The post sounded as though it was a deposit for the stone. HOWEVER, when Cute realized it wasn't clear, she did clarify it, and that was the end of it.....no stink, no nothing, until you brought it up seven hours after she clarified it.

Amen to this. Questions were asked and answered, no accusations were made, and the matter was cleared up prior to Rhino's post. Since I was among the people who asked Cute for clarification, I can speak for myself and say that it happened for me just the way Al explained above.

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 9/7/2005 6:41:38 PM
Author: Rhino
Also, I know, as I have stated, that you would never intentionally try to make an issue out of something the original poster did not intend to become an issue. Peeps here were responding but I was seeing MAJOR issues being made out of non-issues and this is why I was seeking clarification.

OK, I''m confused by the above. Maybe you can help me to understand a bit better.

You say "I know you wouldn''t intentionally try to make an issue out of something.....", but then in the next breath saying "I was seeing MAJOR issues being made out of non-issues". I don''t see that. Can you show me specifically what comments served to make MAJOR issues of non-issues?