Is the store trying to pull a fast one?

[impaul4]

Ok, I am trying to find a new diamond after I looked on the side and underside and saw a large visible black speck. The diamond is a 0.95ct LEO Diamond that is 6.03x6.20x3.93 it is an (F) color and (SI1) clarity. After noticing it is not eye clean we approached the store to return it. We were immediately shown other diamonds to compare so we keep the diamond purchase in house. They had none that were comparable and I was telling them I was looking online. They said "buying online is a nightmare and you shouldn't". As far as the clarity goes, the salesperson said when it comes to clarity grading and reports they grade from the top view of the diamond only, he also said that all inclusions are visible if you look at the diamond from the underside and not the top. He said any inclusion would be eye visible when looking from the underside and not visible when looking from the top, is this true? Is it true that you can see any inclusion from the underside even if it is eye clean from the top?

I feel like they are trying to keep me in house to buy the diamond. The only argument they have in their favor is if I buy the diamond online, it is not covered under warranty for life against it falling out or anything. But if I buy in house, the diamond is covered for life to where if it falls out or anything it gets replaced, and that is a good piece of mind.

Sorry for the exhaustive typing, but I was just wondering about the clarity grading and whether or not the whole inclusion being visible from the bottom or top is true. And does anyone know if I buy a diamond online and I send the setting it would it be covered for life through them against falling out? Or is the whole warranty thing just the downside of buying online? It makes it sound like the only way the diamond and ring is covered is if I buy both in house.

 

[janlwf]

I think so, this diamond is a little smaller carat size but larger spread size and better clarity with excellent HCA optics. Online price is $8147. Is the store where you looked at diamonds have comparible pricing? and you absolutely should be able to get an eyeclean diamond in SI clarity.

http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/9193/

Round
Carat Weight: 0.93ct
Color: F
Clarity: VS2
GIA Cut Grade: Excellent
AGS Light Performance: Ideal
Optical Symmetry: Superior
Polish: Excellent
Symmetry: Very Good
Fluorescence: None
Lab Report: GIA
Lab Report #: 5101019668
In House: Yes
Width: 6.45mm
Length: 6.35mm
Depth: 3.83mm
Table Percentage: 57.00%
Depth Percentage: 59.80%
Crown ∠: 34.00°
Pavilion ∠: 41.00°
Policy: Lifetime Guarantee

Price: $8,176
(Bank wire price: $7,900)

Here is another good old gold diamond.http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/8703/
Round
Carat Weight: 0.96ct
Color: F
Clarity: SI1
GIA Cut Grade: Excellent
AGS Light Performance: Ideal
Optical Symmetry: Superior
Polish: Excellent
Symmetry: Excellent
Fluorescence: None
Lab Report: GIA
Lab Report #: 1136778624
In House: Yes
Width: 6.30mm
Length: 6.32mm
Depth: 3.92mm
Table Percentage: 56.57%
Depth Percentage: 62.20%
Crown ∠: 35.15°
Crown Depth: 15.29%
Pavilion ∠: 40.87°
Pavilion Depth: 43.18%
Policy: Lifetime Guarantee

Price: $7,879
(Bank wire price: $7,613)

 

[slg47]

they are correct that clarity grading is done from the top down but you can certainly find stones that are eye-clean from all angles.

also, make sure what exactly is covered if you buy from them. you may also want an insurance policy (again I am not sure what their warranty covers)

 

[ChrisES]

I don't know a lot about B&M chain shopping, but I've read that actually putting in a claim on their warranties can be very difficult. And, guess what, you can get third party insurance on your ring for a very, very reasonable price. Also, I think the LEO cut is hideous.

Bottom line is they aren't just trying to pull a fast one; they're trying to RIP YOU OFF. Shop online or shop an an independent store like Good Old Gold.

 

[mandasand]

I'm not sure they are "trying to pull a fast one" but if you are shopping at a chain store, you may be sacrificing quality and price. However, SI1 is not always eye clean, so if you want eye clean, you may have to look at a lot of SI1's and if you don't see anything you may have to go for a higher clarity. Buying online is a little scary and you should be happy with your purchase. If this store can't help you, get a refund and try another store (if you're not comfortable buying online).

 

[Amys Bling]

Yes clarity grading is done top down.

 

[slg47]

I don't know a lot about B&M chain shopping, but I've read that actually putting in a claim on their warranties can be very difficult. And, guess what, you can get third party insurance on your ring for a very, very reasonable price. Also, I think the LEO cut is hideous.

Bottom line is they aren't just trying to pull a fast one; they're trying to RIP YOU OFF. Shop online or shop an an independent store like Good Old Gold.

perhaps the OP likes the extra facets? there is nothing wrong with purchasing locally if that meets your needs but I would encourage the OP to research what is covered by the warranty/etc.

 

[milton333]

Yes, clarity is graded from top down. Once set, you might examine the diamond from the side, but settings will obscure a true upside down view, so you won't see that view again.

I would not expect an SI grade stone to be free of visible inclusions from all angles, including bottom up. I have an SI1, it's a great budget choice, but I don't expect it to be IF.

Keep in mind that the b&m warranty usually requires you to take it back for inspection as frequently as every 6 months, and if you miss one, warranty is void. Any jeweler will clean and inspect your ring, often for free. I wore my first solitaire for 15 years with no stone loosening and no prong issues. It's more common to lose small melee stones from settings, but rare to lose a center stone. It's probably cheaper to insure your stone than to pay the b&m markup.

 

[ChrisES]

I don't know a lot about B&M chain shopping, but I've read that actually putting in a claim on their warranties can be very difficult. And, guess what, you can get third party insurance on your ring for a very, very reasonable price. Also, I think the LEO cut is hideous.

Bottom line is they aren't just trying to pull a fast one; they're trying to RIP YOU OFF. Shop online or shop an an independent store like Good Old Gold.

perhaps the OP likes the extra facets? there is nothing wrong with purchasing locally if that meets your needs but I would encourage the OP to research what is covered by the warranty/etc.

Absolutely. It was a mistake for me to toss in my personal opinion of the LEO cut. Thank you for calling me out on it.

The facts that I was trying to convey are that store warranties often sound better than they are, and you pay a premium when you buy from a chain store.

 

[Kalrik]

Don't be afraid to buy online! I haven't had a bad experience but have used only goodoldgold, idj, and james allen. I feel confident in saying you wont have a nightmare with these companies or other pricescope popular vendors.

 

[impaul4]

Yeah the problem wasn't buying online, I have no problem doing that. My biggest concern is having the center covered in case it falls out or gets lost. Do a lot of 3rd party insurance companies cover that? I was thinking of getting Jewelers Mutual and paying for that insurance and I think it covers the center stone falling out or damage. This diamond does not sit right with me, the dimensions seem off and it seems way deep. The grading is from GSI and it does not show full proportions and I feel it is an ok deal but I would be better of shopping online, my main concern was the center stone warranty. And yes, their warranty says i have to bring it in for cleaning and inspection, which is free.

 

[Dreamer_D]

I am willing to bet the store policy would not cover loss or damage like you are concerned about. Ask to see the policy in writing and read it. I don't think it is worth the paper it is written on

Jewelers Mutual insurance covers a very wide range of losses and damage. I have that insurance and like it a lot because I can choose my own replacement in the event of a loss, and jeweler too. It is inexpensive, I pay about $130 per year for $10k coverage.

Most jewelers will inspect and clean your jewelery for free.

 

[Dreamer_D]

Yeah the problem wasn't buying online, I have no problem doing that. My biggest concern is having the center covered in case it falls out or gets lost. Do a lot of 3rd party insurance companies cover that? I was thinking of getting Jewelers Mutual and paying for that insurance and I think it covers the center stone falling out or damage. This diamond does not sit right with me, the dimensions seem off and it seems way deep. The grading is from GSI and it does not show full proportions and I feel it is an ok deal but I would be better of shopping online, my main concern was the center stone warranty. And yes, their warranty says i have to bring it in for cleaning and inspection, which is free.

With a "lab report" like that and buying a branded Leo, you are not likely getting a good deal

 

[AprilBaby]

Again, remember if you miss a "6 month check up" your warranty is void.

 

[impaul4]

I am willing to bet the store policy would not cover loss or damage like you are concerned about. Ask to see the policy in writing and read it. I don't think it is worth the paper it is written on

Jewelers Mutual insurance covers a very wide range of losses and damage. I have that insurance and like it a lot because I can choose my own replacement in the event of a loss, and jeweler too. It is inexpensive, I pay about $130 per year for $10k coverage.

Most jewelers will inspect and clean your jewelery for free.

My friend is who steered me into their direction. He has like $100k covered in watches and says they are the best. I was quoted for $93 a year with a $0 deductible. I think it is an awesome deal for that peace of mind.

So if I go through Jewelers Mutual do you think I don't need to buy and extended service plan at all? The warranty was $200 and it covered free cleanings, inspections, repairs and resizings. Is it worth it to pay the $200 to get those features for life and just buy the insurance separately for the peace of mind to know the diamond is covered?

 

[Amys Bling]

I am willing to bet the store policy would not cover loss or damage like you are concerned about. Ask to see the policy in writing and read it. I don't think it is worth the paper it is written on

Jewelers Mutual insurance covers a very wide range of losses and damage. I have that insurance and like it a lot because I can choose my own replacement in the event of a loss, and jeweler too. It is inexpensive, I pay about $130 per year for $10k coverage.

Most jewelers will inspect and clean your jewelery for free.

My friend is who steered me into their direction. He has like $100k covered in watches and says they are the best. I was quoted for $93 a year with a $0 deductible. I think it is an awesome deal for that peace of mind.

So if I go through Jewelers Mutual do you think I don't need to buy and extended service plan at all? The warranty was $200 and it covered free cleanings, inspections, repairs and resizings. Is it worth it to pay the $200 to get those features for life and just buy the insurance separately for the peace of mind to know the diamond is covered?

If you are indeed keeping the stone- or staying with that store the one time 200 fee is up to you. If you want to do it and have resizings, repairs and cleanings etx covered indefinitely then by all means. I would still get jewelers mutual in addition to it though.

 

[impaul4]

This is the one

http://www.eternitydiamonds.com/diamond_detail.php?id=640250


Triple excellent with a 1.2 with the HCA Tool.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Keep in mind that the b&m warranty usually requires you to take it back for inspection as frequently as every 6 months, and if you miss one, warranty is void. Any jeweler will clean and inspect your ring, often for free. I wore my first solitaire for 15 years with no stone loosening and no prong issues. It's more common to lose small melee stones from settings, but rare to lose a center stone. It's probably cheaper to insure your stone than to pay the b&m markup.

yup, that's how they get ya...

 

[Lula]

This is the one

http://www.eternitydiamonds.com/diamond_detail.php?id=640250


Triple excellent with a 1.2 with the HCA Tool.

This looks like a much better value than what the store is trying to sell you. Yes, you are correct; they want to keep the sale in-house. Retail stores often use those warranties as a reason to buy from them instead of online -- they try to make it seem like those warranties are the only way a consumer can be protected from loss or damage. As others have said, you can get better protection from loss from Jeweler's Mutual or another insurance company. In my experience, those in-store warranties are full of loopholes. Also "GSI" is not a grading laboratory that is recognized on this forum. In fact, it sounds like it's a "gem identification" card that many retail stores provide rather than any sort of standardized grading report. The Eternity Diamonds stone you linked comes with a GIA laboratory report, one of the most respected laboratory reports in the world. Get your money back from this store before the return period is up, and start over.

 

[winternight]

Another thing to point out is that eye clean often means eye clean from a certain distance - for example 6 inches - so if you really want eye clean you from all angles and from close up you probably need to get a VS stone.

I have my insurance with Chubb. I personally don't think the other types are worth it as the others have pointed out.

 

[impaul4]

Another thing to point out is that eye clean often means eye clean from a certain distance - for example 6 inches - so if you really want eye clean you from all angles and from close up you probably need to get a VS stone.

I have my insurance with Chubb. I personally don't think the other types are worth it as the others have pointed out.

Yeah I know from a certain distance. But this looks like someone took a sharpie and just dotted it on the side of the bottom half. it is visible from beyond 6 inches. And when you talk about "other types" are you talking about insurance companies or like the B&M store warranty programs. I think Jewelers Mutual is good and who I will go through.

 

[marygrace]

My homeowners insurance covers jewelry under a rider. I pay about $10 per year for $10,000 coverage with a $500 deductible.

You have many options for theft, loss, or damage. As mentioned earlier, Chubb & Jewlers Mutual are two companies to consider.

Even with a warranty, you should get insurance no matter what.

Good luck with your diamond search!

 

[impaul4]

My homeowners insurance covers jewelry under a rider. I pay about $10 per year for $10,000 coverage with a $500 deductible.

You have many options for theft, loss, or damage. As mentioned earlier, Chubb & Jewlers Mutual are two companies to consider.

Even with a warranty, you should get insurance no matter what.

Good luck with your diamond search!

Wow $10 a year, thats crazy. May I ask who its through?

 

[Dreamer_D]

Read any insurance policy carefully. ETA: also check deductibles. Most home insurance policies have a $500+ deductible. You can choose a deductible with Jewelers Mutual too, it lowers the premium significantly as it means you do not expect to make a claim for small repairs to the mount.

Most homeowner policies do not allow you to replace the diamond with one of your choice through your own jeweler. They will replace with like kind and quality through their jeweler. It is a major PITA in many cases (see sna's recent thread to see how annoying such a process can be).

 

[impaul4]

Read any insurance policy carefully. ETA: also check deductibles. Most home insurance policies have a $500+ deductible. You can choose a deductible with Jewelers Mutual too, it lowers the premium significantly as it means you do not expect to make a claim for small repairs to the mount.

Most homeowner policies do not allow you to replace the diamond with one of your choice through your own jeweler. They will replace with like kind and quality through their jeweler. It is a major PITA in many cases (see sna's recent thread to see how annoying such a process can be).

What is the policy with Jewelers Mutual? Do they replace or do they give you the replacement amount? And what are your overall thoughts, feelings or experiences with Jewelers Mutual?

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Yeah the problem wasn't buying online, I have no problem doing that. My biggest concern is having the center covered in case it falls out or gets lost. Do a lot of 3rd party insurance companies cover that? I was thinking of getting Jewelers Mutual and paying for that insurance and I think it covers the center stone falling out or damage. This diamond does not sit right with me, the dimensions seem off and it seems way deep. The grading is from GSI and it does not show full proportions and I feel it is an ok deal but I would be better of shopping online, my main concern was the center stone warranty. And yes, their warranty says i have to bring it in for cleaning and inspection, which is free.

I'd get my money back, come here, and start over. Many of us have made mistakes in the past and thankfully found PriceScope before making any more! You can do better and many online vendors have lifetime trade-up policies.

What I will tell you is that those warranties are usually worthless (not to mention a pain in the neck to remember the next 50 years to go back every 6 months or whatever for inspection)! You need regular insurance (a jewelry rider or jewelry policy) that covers any type of loss on a diamond ring. You have to have it covered in case she accidentally hits it on something and it chips, if it is stolen, if it falls down the drain, lost on the beach, is taken away in a tornado (not when wearing it, of course! ), mysteriously disappears, and whatever else you can think of!!!

 

[marygrace]

My homeowners insurance covers jewelry under a rider. I pay about $10 per year for $10,000 coverage with a $500 deductible.

You have many options for theft, loss, or damage. As mentioned earlier, Chubb & Jewlers Mutual are two companies to consider.

Even with a warranty, you should get insurance no matter what.

Good luck with your diamond search!

Wow $10 a year, thats crazy. May I ask who its through?

State Farm. We have all our policies under them (home, car, etc.). I would get cash if something is lost, damaged, or stolen. The problem for me is the $500 deductible and our rates might go up if a claim is made. Or, State Farm might drop us entirely.

I wanted Jewelers Mutual for about $110 per year for the same coverage, no deductible, but my fiancé thinks homeowners is better. We still are discussing whether to add JM, because I don't want to risk State Farm dropping us or raising our rates should we make a claim. My mother's ring was stolen, so these things do happen.

 

[impaul4]

Well the diamond I was going to buy was sold. So I had to find new ones and I found these (2). Can anyone tell me which is a better deal?

(1) http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2749190.htm#divShopWithConfidence

(2) http://www.eternitydiamonds.com/diamond_detail.php?id=610231&ref=pricescope

Both scored pretty identical on the HCA Tool. I am leaning towards the Whiteflash but my main concerns are, the inclusion is a needle, I was told those are small cracks. And the Symmetry is only "very good" where the other one has "excellent". Is having a one grade down symmetry going to affect anything?