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IGI ok?

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ziad

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 22, 2003
Messages
6
Hello,

I was about to go for a diamond for my wife on mother''s day, but I read the many feedback about the IGI reports, I paused abot and now need your urgent opinion if this is worth the money:

IGI cert
.93ct
H
VS2
V good/V good
table 58%
pav depth: 43.5%
crown: 15.5%
girdle: medium (2%)
culet: none
price: $ 3270

is this a fair price for it or is it that IGI is not worth it?
I looked at the GIA charts, the diamond falls mainly on the 1A and only 1 in the 1B scale.
is HRD antwerp a safer cert?

Please help
 

Rank Amateur

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Feb 26, 2003
Messages
1,553
The better stones here in the USA are graded by GIA or AGS. That says a lot to me.

If you are really serious about this stone, get an independent opinion about the color and clarity, and decide from there if the price (which seems good on its surface) is right.

Lots o' fish in the sea!
 

Giangi

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 23, 2003
Messages
2,530
From the data you posted, it looks like an IGI Antwerp. I like their work and I use them often because of their low prices, good grading and fast turn-around. For those of you who think IGI Antwerp = IGI NY... Well, no way! Luckily they are faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaar stricter!
 

ziad

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 22, 2003
Messages
6
Hi,
It is indeed IGI in Antwerp. I applied the proportions to HC advisor and it gave this:

Light Return Good
Fire Good
Scintillation Good
Spreador Very Good
Total Visual Performance 4.9 - Good - Only if price is your main criterion

Now the concern is:
1. Are IGI tolerant in terms of measurement(like giving % not angles)or evaluation of color and clarity? If measurement is definite, then the HCA is giving satisfactory answers (opinions please?).

2. Opinions from the experts about the dimensions assuming the 3 other Cs are true

SHALL i GO FOR THIS PEOPLE!? hesitation is my middle name
 

Giangi

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 23, 2003
Messages
2,530
IGI uses Sarin, so they're accurate 100% on proportions... BUT they round up or down the percentages to the nearest 0.5%... This means that a 56.1% table is listed as 56% and a 57.4% as 57.5%... So your HCA won't be 100% accurate... Even if the score isn't that high, recently I had a stone with almost the same proportions and it was VERY nice looking and VERY sparkly.
As per color and clarity grades, they're sometimes --not that often-- a bit off on clarity (usually not more than one grade, though). They're good on color.
Can you tell me the cert number?? It's very important because since 2002 they seem to be quite a lot stricter... If I have the number, then I can tell you how old the cert is...
 

ziad

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 22, 2003
Messages
6
Thanks for the response. The cert number F3C35802, but if you'r wondering about the date it is written on the cert copy:
Antwerp, Jan 16 2003

what do u think?

The measurements are: 6.2 x 6.21 x 3.9 mm if it is of any help on the measruements) could it be used to get back the % accurately or are they rounded to nearest decimal too
 

Giangi

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 23, 2003
Messages
2,530
The cert is new, so it SHOULD be accurate... From the measurements I can tell you the stone has a 62.9% depth... The stone looks very round at 6.20x6.21...
Have you seen it in person?
 

Richard Sherwood

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Sep 25, 2002
Messages
4,924
Hi Ziad. With a 15.5% crown height and a 58% table, this stone should have an average crown angle of approximately 36.4 degrees, which is a "2B" characteristic. Since it's the only "2B" characteristic, and since it falls within 2 degrees of the "2A" grade, then the stone would rank "2A" on the AGA Cut Class scale.

"2A" is traditionally considered a "fine" or "very good" make. That said, the 36.4 degree crown angle combined with an approximate average pavilion angle of 41 degrees creates an area of light leakage just inside the table. That's what's driving the HCA scores down on the stone.

A possible image is recreated with the DiamCalc software showing the following light return analysis:

Light Return (mono)…...: 0.86 Good to Very Good
Light Return (stereo)…..: 0.90 Good to Very Good
(Non) Leakage (mono)..: 0.53 Poor (I would say "Fair")
(Non) Leakage (stereo).: 0.60 Poor to Good ("Fair"-Good)
Contrast............................: 1.00 Very Good
(Non) FishEye Effect…...: 1.00 Very Good

A simulated IdealScope image follows. The leakage is shown in the white area just inside the table. Stones like this tend to be a little weak around the edge as well.
In the photoreal image following, the leakage area shows as being darker.

That said, this stone probably looks better than 85% of the stones out there. The price is also excellent as well. Almost too good, to be truthful. It's priced more in line with an "I" color, so I would be sure and have it checked out by an independent appraiser to know what you've really got. Even if it's an "I", the price is great.

-----------
IdealScope- In general, the darker pink areas indicate areas of greater light return, with the lighter pink areas indicating areas of lesser light return. The black areas indicate areas of greater contrast, with the gray areas indicating areas of lesser contrast. The white areas indicate areas of light leakage. A good explanation of the IdealScope image along with examples can be found at https://www.pricescope.com/idealscope_indx.asp

Disclaimer- The facet arrangement and symmetry of the image will probably vary from your actual diamond, which may affect the light performance indicated. The computer generates an image with “perfect” symmetry, which is rare. Also, the star/lower girdle facet lengths may be different from your diamond. The computer simulation is reproduced best when the actual diamond is being viewed and the image "tweaked" to the appearance of the diamond, or Sarin info is downloaded directly into the program. However, this "blind" reproduction should be helpful in considering the major light performance aspects..
-----------

Ziad.jpg
 

ziad

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 22, 2003
Messages
6
This forum rocks. Thanks for the time, energy and sincerety of the posts.

As for the stone:
table 58%
pav depth: 43.5%
crown: 15.5%
girdle: medium (2%)

I assumed you just add the table+crown+girdle and you get 61%! I am novice in this so what would make the total depth be 62.9%

After this evaluation by diacalc, would you go for it for $3270, and does it obey the genral public taste of fire and scintilation. I have to buy or decline by tomorrow so I'm zooming in on a decision.


Thanks
 

Richard Sherwood

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Sep 25, 2002
Messages
4,924
-----------
I assumed you just add the table+crown+girdle and
you get 61%! I am novice in this so what would make
the total depth be 62.9%
-----------

The table+crown+girdle total measurement comes up short because the girdle measurement is taken from the average of the girdle measured at it's "valleys", instead of it's "peaks".

The peak measurement is usually 1.7% more (in this case 1.9%), giving you the correct total.

-----------
After this evaluation by diacalc, would you go for
it for $3270, and does it obey the genral public
taste of fire and scintilation.
-----------

The price is excellent, no problem there (if it's correctly graded).

"Does it obey the general public taste of fire and scintillation?". Probably. Have you seen the stone? Does it look good to you?

If it looks good to you, it's probably going to look good to most people.

Let me ask you this though...

Does it give you pause now that you've seen the less than optimal cut performance demonstrated on both the HCA and DiamCalc?

There's an old maxim I've followed all my life that has never let me down. "When in doubt, do nothing."

What's the rush? Mother's Day is 7 weeks away, and you are now becoming armed with knowledge. Next thing you know, you're going to be deadly. Instead of settling for a diamond which will make the "general population" happy, you will have the ability to hone in on one which would make even the pickiest of connoiseur's suck his breath in. Wouldn't that be a good feeling?

Give some of these guys on the forum a shot. You won't believe the stones they're selling. Take a good look at that diamond again tomorrow, and then have one of these cut geeks on here cherry pick a stone for you. See for yourself what all the fuss is about.
 

ziad

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 22, 2003
Messages
6
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

Ok confession time:

I wonder if I'm learning by the kilos or tons here! Thanks a llllot!

I did not see the stone yet! No surprise, I got a copy of the certificate which fell in the specs and prop ranges I was asking for. Tomorrow I will take a look at it, if I like I would buy. That WAS the plan.

Now? After the HCA and Diacalc,I'm in doubt and a bit down so I will ...do nothing...I guess.


As for picking a stone for me from the forum. This is new to me! How and where? You know roughly what I want( from specs of this stone) so shall I say it now..............HEEEEEEEEEELP.


Richy, Thanks again.
 

Richard Sherwood

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Sep 25, 2002
Messages
4,924
It's a piece of cake.

Here, watch this -

Vendor's, there is a consumer here asking for one of those "cherry" stones that you love so much to buy and sell.

Why don't you send him some PM's of your favorites in his price range? Looks like he wants to stay under 4 grand.

Consumer's, if you've had a good experience purchasing from some of these cut geek vendors, let Ziad know. He would like expansion of his comfort zone regarding an internet purchase.

Ziad, bear in mind that many of these vendors operate on GIA and AGS cert stones, which carry a lot more weight than the IGI cert you were looking at. In other words, you'll really get what is being represented, at a price which is correct, instead of a stone which seems like a "steal", and then just turns out to be overgraded.
 

justme

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Dec 5, 2002
Messages
184
Hey ziad,

Per Rich's request: I purchased my stone from Jonathon at GoodOldGold.com - A great experience!

I am going to being writing a review in the next couple of days. I "saved" myself approx. $4,000 over the best stone I could find locally which was a branded Hearts on Fire (HOF) stone 10 pts smaller than what I bought from Jonathon.

I couldn't be happier with the stone, the ease of purchase and the information/time that he was willing to spend 'educating' me about stones in general with no pressure to purchase.

It would be helpful for all of the vendors if you could post your general specifications of what your looking for and a budget so that they can email you with what they have available.

Would you like to stay just under the carat price point? Are you looking for a H&A ideal cut or a very good cut but not necessarily an ideal? Specific color and clarity or best for budget?

If you can answer these questions the vendors here will be to respond with diamonds that fit within your budget and specifications and not send you info on stones that are out of price, not right color etc.

Good Luck and enjoy the education - by the time you purchase I guarantee that you'll have a beautiful gift for your wife that will knock her socks off
! What a great way to thank a woman for being your wife and mother to your children!

Hope this helps.

Justme
 

AnnaMagdalena

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 13, 2003
Messages
70
Hi Ziad,
I am about to post a thread entitled, "Happy SuperbCert buyer" describing my experiences with Barry and SuperbCert. Take a look--I hope it's helpful.

I strongly suggest that you at least check out superbcert.com. You have an excellent chance of finding something gorgeous there and making your wife very very happy with it!

Good luck!
-Anna Magdalena
 

dimonbob

Brilliant_Rock
Trade
Joined
Dec 12, 2000
Messages
670
In response to what Rich said go back to the pricescope page that has Select by cut quality and dial in:
.90 - .99 ct
H - I color
VS2 clarity
GIA or AGS cert
and you come up with one diamond :)

I
VS2
0 (H&A)
A Cut Above
1.4-EX
ex-ex-ex-vg
62
56
34.2°
40.9°
AGS
thintoslightlyt
pt
id
id

$4080

Just answering the call.
 

Noono

Rough_Rock
Joined
Aug 21, 2003
Messages
2
i have a certificate from igi dated december 4 , 2001
is it ok or what?
appricate your opinion
 
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