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How do you respond to “diamonds are bullshit”

MakingTheGrade

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Mar 2, 2009
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10,218
@bmfang I’m glad you did. An exam isn’t exactly romantic haha! I wonder how the guy would feel if his lover also tested him... not a recipe for a healthy relationship!!:lol:
Traditionally speaking, I think men worry women want them for money, and women worry men just want them for sex. Haha so I think the reverse "test" is when women have rules about withholding sex for X amount of time to see if the guy will still care enough to put the effort in.

And again, I think the same logic would apply that guys would probably be fine with it if it was reflecting of the woman's values/comfort etc, but not if it was clearly manipulative or a "test".

Doesn't matter what your gender is, "games" are a headache for everyone involved!
 

partgypsy

Ideal_Rock
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Nov 7, 2004
Messages
6,156
90% of the time this comes up, it is a guy, who has a specific sexist axe to grind. Someone who is overly invested in other people's decisions, when it is a free country. I know there is a sexist slant to it because the guy when asked will have 0% issues with spending money on expensive iphones or other expensive electronics, watches, cars and other expensive vehicles, etc. Rather than going down the rabbit hole of stupid internet arguments best not to engage.
The other 10% are from my environmentally conscious friends who feel any gem, jewelry, non-essential and/or environmentally damaging product is bad, and I am, guilty as charged. I try to atone by walking to work, stopped drinking coffee and if I do buy shade grown, and reduced how much meat I and my kids eat.
The guy I was recently seeing, though not perfect, had a good attitude when I told him I was getting myself an expensive piece of jewelry and I felt guilty about spending the money. While he is very careful with his money he didn't chide me and just said to get something I'd know i'd get enjoyment from, and referenced his irrational car interest.

I would fail the Mcdonalds test because I've been to McDonalds probably less than 10 times in my life and so would decline. And I don't do first or 2nd dates at a guy's house. I would do a cup of tea type date though.
 
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msop04

Ideal_Rock
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Dec 3, 2011
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Traditionally speaking, I think men worry women want them for money, and women worry men just want them for sex. Haha so I think the reverse "test" is when women have rules about withholding sex for X amount of time to see if the guy will still care enough to put the effort in.

And again, I think the same logic would apply that guys would probably be fine with it if it was reflecting of the woman's values/comfort etc, but not if it was clearly manipulative or a "test".

Doesn't matter what your gender is, "games" are a headache for everyone involved!
To the man who says diamonds are BS: "okay... then sex [with you] is bullshit. I'll let you rethink the 'bullshit' in life..." ;-)
 

bmfang

Brilliant_Rock
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Jan 2, 2017
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1,852
To the man who says diamonds are BS: "okay... then sex [with you] is bullshit. I'll let you rethink the 'bullshit' in life..." ;-)
Dammit, there isn’t a thumbs up smiley!!!!

Maybe I was one of those weird guys who had no compulsion to want to have sex with someone on a first date. My parents always said to me: “If you ain’t willing to have a baby with that girl you are about to put your dick into, don’t even think about it. Not even with a condom. Save it for the one who you will marry.”

TBH, I’m glad that I actually did follow this piece of advice they gave to me.
 

msop04

Ideal_Rock
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Dammit, there isn’t a thumbs up smiley!!!!

Maybe I was one of those weird guys who had no compulsion to want to have sex with someone on a first date. My parents always said to me: “If you ain’t willing to have a baby with that girl you are about to put your dick into, don’t even think about it. Not even with a condom. Save it for the one who you will marry.”

TBH, I’m glad that I actually did follow this piece of advice they gave to me.
HA!! You crack me up, @bmfang!!
 

mockturtle

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 13, 2017
Messages
54
I’d say, they may be bullshit, but they are MY bullshit. Everyone is entitled to at least one such thing.
 

Sagebrush

Brilliant_Rock
Trade
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Nov 16, 2003
Messages
645
Kmoro,

If you are a sucker, it is fair to say you are not alone. Diamonds have been objects of desire since at least the 4th century BC. They are mentioned in the Vedas, The Upanishads, The Arthashastra their beauty extolled by poets and writers since ancient times. It was the ancient Indians who first named diamond the King of Gems.

It has become fashionable among critics to claim that diamond demand, particularly the engagement ring, is an artificial construct created by De Beers advertising firm, N. W. Ayer. The fact is, however, that diamonds have been associated with romance going back to Roman times in the West.

That said, it is also true that diamonds, at least colorless diamonds under ten carats are not particularly rare. It is also true that advertising has had a great impact on demand and that prices are controlled by the big producers. Unlike most other gemstones, diamonds are found in large deposits and that those deposits are controlled by big companies who often exploit and mistreat their workers. The Kimberly Process is something of a joke and many conflict diamonds make their way into the market. The diamond you are buying may have a bloody history.

Them's the facts,

RWW
 

lambskin

Ideal_Rock
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Aug 22, 2012
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2,087
Maybe reply that 'judgemental friends are B.S.' I love Rockysalamander's response with the bioloigcal breakdown of Diamonds and Bullshit. Still cracking up.
 

LisaRN

Ideal_Rock
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Nov 1, 2007
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3,064
I refuse to take the bait from anyone with strong opinions who just wants an audience. I usually just shrug and say "uh huh" and either change the subject or walk away.
 

ChristineRose

Brilliant_Rock
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Aug 5, 2012
Messages
926
Nice topic to raise rage from all points of view.
Why waist your time on bull.... t. Buy Zircons, they are bright enough for him.
Life is short my friend -waist it on the positive side.
All is B---t, fashion, cars, watches, phones, throw them all and go to Amazon jungles.
Cubic Zirconias. Zircons are something else.
 

ChristineRose

Brilliant_Rock
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926
Diamonds are a form of communication. Pretty much everything else in our culture is a form of communication. Communication IS culture.

Clothes have been much talked about here. If a woman goes to work in sloppy jeans and a tee, she'll get a vastly different reaction than will a man. If a woman wants to communicate that she's a maverick who doesn't follow stupid rules, so be it. But people will answer her with that.

Likewise if a man thinks his legs look good in a skirt, and can do that, but he's going to be saying some things that will get him problematic feedback.

It is what it is. Buck the trend if you like, but keep in mind that that's just what it is. Telling people what you think of social convention.
 

vintageloves

Shiny_Rock
Joined
May 30, 2013
Messages
350
Diamonds are a form of communication. Pretty much everything else in our culture is a form of communication. Communication IS culture.

Clothes have been much talked about here. If a woman goes to work in sloppy jeans and a tee, she'll get a vastly different reaction than will a man. If a woman wants to communicate that she's a maverick who doesn't follow stupid rules, so be it. But people will answer her with that.

Likewise if a man thinks his legs look good in a skirt, and can do that, but he's going to be saying some things that will get him problematic feedback.

It is what it is. Buck the trend if you like, but keep in mind that that's just what it is. Telling people what you think of social convention.
I think you're reading too much into the supposed societal importance of a diamond ring. It also puts a huge amount of burden on young men to buy something they potentially can't afford (what will people think of your beloved if she doesn't have a ring!) and shames women who are in relationships with them. My husband didn't buy me a diamond engagement ring. So I should have been considered the same as someone who goes to work dressed like a slob? I should have been seen as rebellious and disturbing the social order? I have to say the people in my life were nothing but happy for me and didn't care about my ring.

I mean, I knew DeBeers had some good marketing, but to the point that not buying or wearing a diamond ring is seen as anti-social behavior? That's some impressive brainwashing.
 
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ChristineRose

Brilliant_Rock
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I think you're reading too much into the supposed societal importance of a diamond ring. It also puts a huge amount of burden on young men to buy something they potentially can't afford (what will people think of your beloved if she doesn't have a ring!) and shames women who are in relationships with them. My husband didn't buy me a diamond engagement ring. So I should have been considered the same as someone who goes to work dressed like a slob? I should have been seen as rebellious and disturbing the social order? I have to say the people in my life were nothing but happy for me and didn't care about my ring.

I mean, I knew DeBeers had some good marketing, but to the point that not buying or wearing a diamond ring is seen as anti-social behavior? That's some impressive brainwashing.
It depends on what circles you move in.

Did any of your girlfriends say anything? How about your mother? Did you announce your engagement to your co-workers? There are a lot of mothers who wouldn't like that.

In the work context, I don't consider jeans and tees slobby, especially if that's the standard for male workers, as I mentioned. I'm not sure if you caught that, but if you did, it's interesting that you accept the double standard as indicating "slob" for women but not for men.

There are certainly other choices. I'm seeing sapphire (Princess Di and Kate) and Morganite (Think Pink!) and plenty of unique rings. People who are happy with that can buy a CZ and be careful about what they say. I still contend no one can tell the difference in the wild.
 

iluvshinythings

Brilliant_Rock
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May 15, 2009
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818
I don't know anyone who has ever said that diamonds are an investment. I have literally never heard anyone say that so I think the entire premise of the article was flawed. Perhaps the author has been seeking financial advice from the wrong person.

I also have never felt that an engagement/marriage starts with a diamond ring and I've been engaged more than once. My own mother didn't have a diamond until her 40th anniversary. My grandmother wore a plain gold band until she died and she was happily married for 63 years. I think DeBeers is brilliant in their advertising and control of the diamond market, but I give most people credit for independent thinking.

I buy diamonds because I like them. They sparkle and they're pretty. I don't care anything about the "status symbol" and I don't buy them because they're an investment. They're something I enjoy looking at.

No one ever talks negatively when a guy wants to go out and finance a Harley Davidson, a boat or buy a luxury car. I think those are a bigger measure of a man's manhood (or lack thereof) than the size of the diamond he buys for his partner.

I had a co-worker who used to complain about diamonds all the time. I have no idea why he was so opposed to diamonds, but when he started in on his rants, I'd just smile and excuse myself. The one commodity none of us are ever going to get more of is time. I choose not to waste mine on someone so focused on something that doesn't have any impact on them.
 

megthered

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jul 31, 2014
Messages
28
I don't care for diamonds, they look very cold to me. My engagement and wedding rings are emeralds, that I wear every day. But women expect a diamond and people buy them. Mostly because it's expected, maybe as a status thing. But no one can say DeBeers was stupid.
 

LLJsmom

Ideal_Rock
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Oct 24, 2012
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9,150
I don't care for diamonds, they look very cold to me. My engagement and wedding rings are emeralds, that I wear every day. But women expect a diamond and people buy them. Mostly because it's expected, maybe as a status thing. But no one can say DeBeers was stupid.
Excellent choice. These can be even MORE expensive than diamonds. Whoever uses “diamonds are bull$hit” excuse to a potential fiancé will have just screwed himself if she agrees and prefers emeralds.
 

bmfang

Brilliant_Rock
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1,852
Same goes for natural rubies and sapphires. Well at least where I am in Australia.
 

ChristineRose

Brilliant_Rock
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I don't know anyone who has ever said that diamonds are an investment. I have literally never heard anyone say that so I think the entire premise of the article was flawed. Perhaps the author has been seeking financial advice from the wrong person.
A quick Google search for "diamonds investment" will get you hundreds of sites urging you to invest in diamonds. Many of them are jewelers. Many jewelers will push customers into an "investment grade stone," invoking that mythical day when you will sell or trade up. (I never quite get why trading up is supposed to be an investment. You give away your money twice.) One of the big criticisms of lab stones and simulants is that they "won't hold their value."

Not that these are the right persons to give you financial advice but I can't imagine someone talking about diamonds for very long without investments coming up.
 

Johnbt

Shiny_Rock
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Mar 13, 2018
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236
"No one ever talks negatively when a guy wants to go out and finance a Harley Davidson, a boat or buy a luxury car."

Finance? Well, there are a number of us who think financing anything is best avoided and we tend to actively hate debt. Iow, save up first and then buy. I was raised that way decades prior to Dave Ramsey writing his first financial advice book in 1992. Many folks with similar thoughts on excessive saving and investing can be found at the Bogleheads forum (3-fund investment philosophy, John Bogle, Vanguard Funds, etc.) and https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com (living frugally with the goal of a very, very early FIRE - Financial Independence, Retire Early).

Okay, so maybe we're a little extreme. :mrgreen2:
 

PreRaphaelite

Brilliant_Rock
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Feb 2, 2015
Messages
1,357
My mother always said "I used to think diamonds were vulgar... until I had some."

I think she was paraphrasing someone like Mae West but I can't seem to find the author.
 

LaylaR

Shiny_Rock
Trade
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Dec 8, 2016
Messages
457
There are a lot of things I wouldn't spend my money on. Even if I won the lottery and had nearly all the money I would ever need, there are things I just wouldn't buy. But that doesn't mean that I can't respect someone else's opinions. Especially if I am married to them or dating them. I don't think this is about diamonds at all. It's about respect.
 
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