Find your diamond
Find your jewelry
shape
carat
color
clarity

Help with pre-worn Tiffany e-ring

A

Athena10X

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Apr 17, 2018
Messages
269
Hello fellow PSers, diamond, and Tiffany experts,

I am trying to help a gf out. She is looking at e-rings with her bf,yesterday I took her to a local high end shopping center that had Tiffany’s, Cartier, Shreve & Co. (HOF and Fire & Ice retailer), and C&H Jewelers (Forevermark retailer). I brought my ASET and Ideal scopes, and 10X loupe to use on our excursion as an opportunity to educate my friend on cut and light performance (based on what I’ve read on these forums). I’ve become a huge cut nut and proponent thanks to the wonderful PS community.

In any case, after looking at the different brands and comparing stones to my own super ideal CBI from HPD, I was impressed with HOF, but shocked by the sticker price. Under the ASET scope, there was some light leakage under the table as I expected based on the specs on the certificate, but not too drastic. The Fire & Ice stone’s didn’t seem to be consistent and didn’t perform as well as the HOF. Cartier was a joke, and of course she loved Tiffany’s.

Even though I’d like to direct my gf to HPD, WF, BGD, GOG, VC, JA, and some of the other super-Ideal brands highly recommended by PS, my friend has had her heart set on a Tiffany ring. Ultimately, in the end I want her to love her ring.

Her budget of $8K will not allow for a new Tiffany ring with a .8-1 ct center stone. However, she is open to a pre-worn Tiffany ring since Tiffany’s will still service. I searched loupe troupe, idonowidont, and diamond bistro (avoiding eBay) and found the following ring recently listed:

https://diamondbistro.com/image/56807/item.html

To me, the photos and certificate look legit, but I’m not an expert. This is where I come to you to beseech your advice. First, is the ring authentic (based on the photos), is the price good (even with symmetry only scoring a very good ), and what questions, if any should I ask the seller to glean more information.

I would also appreciate it if the replies could be focused on this ring or potential Tiffany rings (cushion cut solitaire or halo) until I can convince my gf otherwise.

Thank you!
 
There’s no reason to avoid eBay. They will absolutely refund your money if there’s any problem and it’s probably the biggest resale
Forum for Tiffany. This ring is listed there also for more money. Ask for photos of the inside of the band. It should have the logo and the specs for the diamond. I can’t really comment on authenticating, it’s not my area, but the price looks good. If your gf wants a big Tiffany ring and isn’t too concerned with the diamond performance, then it looks like a good buy.
 
Thank you @scarsmum. Is a different price on eBay a red flag? I will ask seller for the photos you recommended and post if/when I get them.
 
I don’t know what ebay commission is but I would guess she’s trying to cover it.
 
Athena10X said:
Wow!!! The seller was very prompt (less than 1hour) at sending additional photos, although I think there’s only one image of the inner band.

https://photos.google.com/share/AF1...?key=Zzh3aUg0Y285U3FuTUZoVlpaT0dobGd5Nkl4bzRn

Looking forward to your thoughts. Thanks!
Click to expand...

Beautiful ring and has all of the certificates and documentation that I would expect to see from T&Co. I personally love the legacy collection, but has your gf tired that ring in person? If someone wants a solitaire from T&Co for example, I would not recommend that ring, even though it it beautiful.
 
Since Tiffany won’t honor their upgrade policy on a second-hand ring, would my gf be better off buying a new Tiffany ring with a smaller center stone (most likely solitaire setting for budget) so that she can upgrade to a 1+ ct later instead of trying to sell a pre-worn ring again (might not fetch as much $ since she wouldn’t be original owner). Trying to consider future value.
 
My gf LOVES cushion/square halo, but trying to be considerate of budget constraints
 
@SimoneDi, thank you for your valuable input on the first ring. I’ve read your expert Tiffany advice on similar threads and appreciate your confidence in my initial selection.
 
How about this one:

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/152953149017

I know that D, IF is excessive, but just slightly outside budget, but guaranteed colorless. My gf is color sensitive. Non super ideal G-I looked yellow to her compare to my CBI G, VS2. To avoid a potential yellow tint with a sub-prime cut, I’m think a higher color grade would be better. Granted, I’m not expecting ideal light performance from majority of Tiffany diamonds, but trying to work within the limited constraints I posed earlier.
 
Athena10X said:
How about this one:

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/152953149017

I know that D, IF is excessive, but just slightly outside budget, but guaranteed colorless. My gf is color sensitive. Non super ideal G-I looked yellow to her compare to my CBI G, VS2. To avoid a potential yellow tint with a sub-prime cut, I’m think a higher color grade would be better. Granted, I’m not expecting ideal light performance from majority of Tiffany diamonds, but trying to work within the limited constraints I posed earlier.
Click to expand...

Only 0.5ct Center, I am not sure if it is worth it. Also, the cushion prefers to be very much “crushed ice” like, which is not necessarily “bad”, but a different look. Personally, I much prefer the look and size of the legacy halo.
 
I see what you mean about the “crushed ice” look. Haven’t seen in person to know her opinion on it.
 
Hi! I would like to share some thoughts if I may...

What ring did your GF try on at Tiffany? I assume it was the Legacy. Did she try on the classic solitaire and did she not like it?

The Tiffany solitaire is a classic setting, and the diamond is the star in that setting. There is no competiton and your eye is taken straight to the sparkly diamond.

The Legacy is more about the setting. It creates a larger look due to the halo and diamond shank, but this ring becomes less about the diamond. Your eye first wanders to look at the setting and finally, your eye shifts to the center stone. The Legacy is also a very flat top setting and the diamond is enclosed. Be sure she really likes that as the center diamond sparkles different in the two settings.

For me, for an e-ring, I like my diamond to be the star and I would spend my entire budget on the center diamond and not waste it on all the side stone distractions. However, I do realize some prefer more finger coverage.

The question is... do you want to highlight the diamond or do you want to highlight the setting. For me, for an e-ring, I want it to be all about the diamond, not the setting. It’s preference but it is a key decision that needs to be made.

On buying new, I am a fan of buying new. Pick a budget and buy new within your budget. I am not a fan of buying used just to have a bigger ring. For Tiffany, it matters even more to buy new as the original owner can upgrade. Tiffany gives you 100% the price you paid for the ring towards an upgrade. You will never take a loss. Also, for any service, your GF will never feel embarassed at the boutique. A Tiffany ring is different in that one should always get it serviced at the boutique, so the mental feeling of being able to walk into Tiffany anytime without concern may be a factor to consider. She may need to resize it or she may want to polish up the platinum. She may want to get revised appraisals, Tiffany will be glad to do it as the original owner. They will not appraise a used ring.

And... buying from luxury boutiques is a long-term relationship... she may want some future pieces from Tiffany and it certainly sounds like she would want to upgrade. For me, knowing that I am a true Tiffany client matters.

That’s my two cents. I hope that was helpful.
 
By the way, I disagree with you on Tiffany diamonds and performance. I have both a HOF super ideal and a Tiffany ideal only, and the Tiffany sparkles more than the HOF.

I think your GF will love her Tiffany, they sparkle like crazy.
 
Last edited:
Miki Moto said:
By the way, I disagree with you on Tiffany diamonds and performance. I have both a HOF super ideal and a Tiffany ideal only, and the Tiffany sparkles more than the HOF.

I think your GF will love her Tiffany, they sparkle like crazy.
Click to expand...

@Miki Moto, thank you for your real life comparison of a Tiffany vs HOF diamond. If my GF decides to get a new Tiffany for all the valid points you made, I’ll make sure it’s ideal for the optimum sparkle. However, I noticed that their cut grade goes to Excellent, unless I’m mistaken. How would one ask for an “ideal” Tiffany from a SA?
 
For a new Tiffany, would most likely be the classic solitaire to maximize the cushion cut carat size.
 
Athena10X said:
@Miki Moto, thank you for your real life comparison of a Tiffany vs HOF diamond. If my GF decides to get a new Tiffany for all the valid points you made, I’ll make sure it’s ideal for the optimum sparkle. However, I noticed that their cut grade goes to Excellent, unless I’m mistaken. How would one ask for an “ideal” Tiffany from a SA?
Click to expand...

Hi! An Excellent, Excellent, Excellent cut is considered ideal. Also, if you really want to get specific, an Ex Ex Ex cut can also be super ideal like HOF, but a super ideal does not mean it sparkles more than an ideal.

Your GF has to look at the stone and see each characteristic... the white scintillation (sparkle), the fire (color)... as each stone is different.
 
@Athena10X -- your friend should not rely on this, I'm sorry to say:
Miki Moto said:
For Tiffany, it matters even more to buy new as the original owner can upgrade. Tiffany gives you 100% the price you paid for the ring towards an upgrade. You will never take a loss
Click to expand...
I don't know when-where Miki Moto purchased her Tiffany ring, but the current upgrade policy -- offered only in the US, Canada & Australia, not any Tiffany store elsewhere --
  • is only for 5 years from the purchase date;
  • the new ring must be at least 2x the price of the original; and
  • you are not guaranteed that the full purchase price of the original will be credited to the new ring.
https://www.tiffany.com/Engagement/ConciergeDetails5.aspx
https://www.pricescope.com/communit...ed-on-tiffany-engagement-ring-upgrade.197579/

Also, a Tiffany diamond is not necessarily superior to a HoF diamond (or stones from any other source). It's not as if all the diamonds Tiffany sets in its e-rings are of AGS 000 or even GIA triple X caliber. Here's an example of a Tiffany e-ring with a 2017 GIA report, cut grade of merely Very Good:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/GIA-Certif...nd-Solitaire-Diamond-Ring-I-VVS1/371937642532

P.S. A surprisingly high percentage of diamonds graded by GIA get the XXX designation*, plus GIA "rounds" some spec measurements. So it's no surprise that GIA XXXs do not all perform to the same level;))
* I can't state the percentage with true confidence, but Trade members such as @Texas Leaguer, @Wink and/or @Garry H (Cut Nut) have provided the forum with the percentage.
 
I’m from the “other side” I would never buy a new Tiffany ring because I don’t think the premium you pay is worth the $$$$$.
I just recently helped another PSer purchase a pre loved 1 carat + for $9,995 off eBay. New this ring with the similiar specs is $18,000.
eBay can be a great place to purchase a pre loved Tiffany ring BUT you have to choose your seller well and be sure to be receiving all the important original documentation as well. This is crucial to buying pre loved.
While this lady can’t “up grade” at Tiffany let me explain it this way.
If she had spent her $10,000 at Tiffany’s, she would have only got a diamond around .85 carats. To upgrade later, at Tiffany’s, the 1 carat plus she really desires is still $18,000 so she still has to find an extra $8,000.
By buying second hand she already has the size she wanted.
That said, it is a personal choice. Many people would never consider a pre loved ring and that’s fine. Many people will only consider a pre loved ring because they want to get the very best value for money they can.
Neither way is right or wrong, it’s about personal choices and personal comfort levels.
If your friend definitely want the “new” Tiffany experience, she should go to Tiffany.
 
MollyMalone said:
@Athena10X -- your friend should not rely on this, I'm sorry to say:

I don't know when-where Miki Moto purchased her Tiffany ring, but the current upgrade policy -- offered only in the US, Canada & Australia, not any Tiffany store elsewhere --
  • is only for 5 years from the purchase date;
  • the new ring must be at least 2x the price of the original; and
  • you are not guaranteed that the full purchase price of the original will be credited to the new ring.
https://www.tiffany.com/Engagement/ConciergeDetails5.aspx
https://www.pricescope.com/communit...ed-on-tiffany-engagement-ring-upgrade.197579/
.
Click to expand...

This is quite interesting, and I see it is posted on their website. I purchased my ring at Tiffany, 14 years ago. I went to Tiffany about 4 weeks ago to look at an upgrade. They pulled up my old purchase and offered me full purchase price. So my guess is this is not a hard rule.

Thank you for this info. I will need to remember this.
 
Also look at truefacet.com and therealreal.com. Tons of pre owned Tiffany rings
 
MollyMalone said:
@Athena10X -- your friend should not rely on this, I'm sorry to say:

I don't know when-where Miki Moto purchased her Tiffany ring, but the current upgrade policy -- offered only in the US, Canada & Australia, not any Tiffany store elsewhere --
  • is only for 5 years from the purchase date;
  • the new ring must be at least 2x the price of the original; and
  • you are not guaranteed that the full purchase price of the original will be credited to the new ring.
https://www.tiffany.com/Engagement/ConciergeDetails5.aspx
https://www.pricescope.com/communit...ed-on-tiffany-engagement-ring-upgrade.197579/

Also, a Tiffany diamond is not necessarily superior to a HoF diamond (or stones from any other source). It's not as if all the diamonds Tiffany sets in its e-rings are of AGS 000 or even GIA triple X caliber. Here's an example of a Tiffany e-ring with a 2017 GIA report, cut grade of merely Very Good:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/GIA-Certif...nd-Solitaire-Diamond-Ring-I-VVS1/371937642532

P.S. A surprisingly high percentage of diamonds graded by GIA get the XXX designation*, plus GIA "rounds" some spec measurements. So it's no surprise that GIA XXXs do not all perform to the same level;))
* I can't state the percentage with true confidence, but Trade members such as @Texas Leaguer, @Wink and/or @Garry H (Cut Nut) have provided the forum with the percentage.
Click to expand...

@MollyMalone, thank you for sharing the link to Tiffany’s upgrade policy. I’m surprised, though I know I shouldn’t be, that such an establishment that sells at a high premium, only supports their clientele for a limited time. You’d think that after spending $100K, you’d have some piece of mind, but obviously not the case anymore.

Interestingly, the ring on eBay shows the cut and symmetry grades by Tiffany and GIA reverses. Could this be a mistake by one of the graders?

The vast amount of knowledge and variety of perspectives validated by facts is why I love the PS forum. Now, I just need to guide my GF through all of this without over complicating the process, which is already overwhelming her.
 
Athena10X said:
* * * Interestingly, the ring on eBay shows the cut and symmetry grades by Tiffany and GIA reverses. Could this be a mistake by one of the graders?.
Click to expand...
Heaven only knows what criteria Tiffany uses when classifying the "precision of cut" on their reports, but "precision of cut" isn't synonymous in my view with "cut grade". (fyi: plugging in the numbers from the Tiffany report results in a HCA score of 4.1)

If you or your friend are interested, here are a couple of GIA publications that offer intriguing, useful info re their cut and related gradings, such as symmetry:
https://www.gia.edu/doc/booklet_finish_culet_girdle.pdf
https://www.gia.edu/doc/Estimating-a-cut-grade-booklet.pdf
https://www.gia.edu/doc/booklet_cut_estimation_tables_lowres.pdf
So far as I know, Tiffany doesn't make available anything like this.

Although I wasn't recommending that ring, I don't share in Miki Moto's dismissal of its authenticity. I've seen Tiffany rings at, e.g., Betteridge Jewelers with all of the original owner's paperwork -- and a D on the inside shank by the ct weight. The GIA report for the Very Good cut, Tiffany ring I linked is in GIA's online database for easy verification,
https://www.gia.edu/report-check?reportno=2183284333&s=1530510218605
and attests to the Tiffany numerical inscription. The odds of a con man coming across such a "papered" diamond -- an essential requirement for then fabricating both a counterfeit setting & bogus Tiffany Diamond Certificate corresponding to, but not exactly mirroring the GIA report as I expect most counterfeiters would do -- seem highly unlikely to me. Plus, that vendor has a 30-day return, full refund policy, so the purchaser has ample opportunity to take it to a jeweler or independent appraiser for a viewing of the Tiffany number on the diamond and running, e.g., a Sarin report, if the customer wanted that.

The "no returns" policy of the Diamond Bistro seller, who also isn't willing to accept a return of the 1.33 Legacy ring if purchased via her eBay listing, would be a deal breaker for me, but I gather your friend is comfortable with that, OK with pursuing a "significantly not as described " claim if need be.
 
I believe the "D" on the inside shank is with newer models (past 5 years-ish).

It's great that you had a chance to look at and compare a variety of diamonds in person! Since you have your CBI, I'm very surprised that didn't sway your gf away from Tiffany. How cool that you got to use your Idealscope/ASET/loupe on all those wares! :geek2:

I'd also suggest catherine trenton jewellery for checking out second-hand, authenticated Tiffany rings.
For example, this one: https://www.catherinetrentonjewelle...1-legacy-diamond-and-platinum-engagement-ring

0.87 tcw F VVS1 legacy with all paperwork and boxes etc, for under 7k USD.
 
Tophat1 said:
Also look at truefacet.com and therealreal.com. Tons of pre owned Tiffany rings
Click to expand...

Just checked theses sites out. Nice selection of wedding band options for myself and e-rings for my GF. What I especially like is the sites vetting and backing the authenticity of the item (at least my understanding). Wishlisted and shared a few options with my GF. Thank you @Tophat1
 
MollyMalone said:
Heaven only knows what criteria Tiffany uses when classifying the "precision of cut" on their reports, but "precision of cut" isn't synonymous in my view with "cut grade". (fyi: plugging in the numbers from the Tiffany report results in a HCA score of 4.1)

If you or your friend are interested, here are a couple of GIA publications that offer intriguing, useful info re their cut and related gradings, such as symmetry:
https://www.gia.edu/doc/booklet_finish_culet_girdle.pdf
https://www.gia.edu/doc/Estimating-a-cut-grade-booklet.pdf
https://www.gia.edu/doc/booklet_cut_estimation_tables_lowres.pdf
So far as I know, Tiffany doesn't make available anything like this.

Although I wasn't recommending that ring, I don't share in Miki Moto's dismissal of its authenticity. I've seen Tiffany rings at, e.g., Betteridge Jewelers with all of the original owner's paperwork -- and a D on the inside shank by the ct weight. The GIA report for the Very Good cut, Tiffany ring I linked is in GIA's online database for easy verification,
https://www.gia.edu/report-check?reportno=2183284333&s=1530510218605
and attests to the Tiffany numerical inscription. The odds of a con man coming across such a "papered" diamond -- an essential requirement for then fabricating both a counterfeit setting & bogus Tiffany Diamond Certificate corresponding to, but not exactly mirroring the GIA report as I expect most counterfeiters would do -- seem highly unlikely to me. Plus, that vendor has a 30-day return, full refund policy, so the purchaser has ample opportunity to take it to a jeweler or independent appraiser for a viewing of the Tiffany number on the diamond and running, e.g., a Sarin report, if the customer wanted that.

The "no returns" policy of the Diamond Bistro seller, who also isn't willing to accept a return of the 1.33 Legacy ring if purchased via her eBay listing, would be a deal breaker for me, but I gather your friend is comfortable with that, OK with pursuing a "significantly not as described " claim if need be.
Click to expand...

Agree, would definitely want at least a 10-day return policy that would permit my GF to assess the ring and decide in person if she likes or not. Too much of a risk/gamble to deal with a seller that doesn’t honor returns, even if authentic.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
GET 3 FREE HCA RESULTS JOIN THE FORUM. ASK FOR HELP
Jewelry Blog
PriceScope-Concierge-Ad
Find prime cuts.
Top