shape
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HELP!!!! J COLOR DIAMOND

Discussion in 'RockyTalky' started by Alexandro, Oct 16, 2014.

  1. Alexandro
    Rough_Rock

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    by Alexandro » Oct 16, 2014
    Hello all! I'm about to get engaged and my budget is really like really reduced. So I was looking at a J color round stone I1. The jeweler told me that it's clean to the naked eye. I'm worried it will look yellow because the cut grade is GOOD and it has no fluorescence. Polish and symmetry are graded as good as well. The diamond is GIA certified.

    Any opinions??!
     
    


    


  2. Pandabear90
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    by Pandabear90 » Oct 16, 2014

    supply us with GIA certificate + ask for idealscope image...

    what is your budget...

    help us help you...you gave us pretty much a book with no pages inside lol.
     
  3. Alexandro
    Rough_Rock

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    by Alexandro » Oct 16, 2014
    Sorry!!

    Here are the specs:

    Shape: Round Brilliant
    Carat Weight: 1.40
    Color: J
    Clarity: I1
    Cut Grade: Good
    Table %: 55.00
    Depth %: 64.50
    Girdle: Slightly Thick to Thick
    Polish: Good
    Symmetry: Good
    Fluorescence: None
    Measurements: 6.94-6.99x4.49

    My budget is $3500
     
  4. Alexandro
    Rough_Rock

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  5. Pandabear90
    Rough_Rock

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    by Pandabear90 » Oct 16, 2014
    That's not an idealscope image, ask him/her for one...also you need to get the GIA certificate...the jeweler should have it or the GIA number you can look up.

    Table
    Depth
    Crown
    Pavillion


    Base on what you've shown me, looks like you can do better. You may want to sacrifice the carat size for better quality of a diamond... for that price range...

    Check out Whiteflash.com


    you can probably find a .70tcw +- thats worth your budget.
     
  6. Wednesday
    Rough_Rock

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    by Wednesday » Oct 16, 2014
    The reason the above poster was asking for the GIA report number was so they could look at angles to assess performance.

    However, based on what you posted, it sounds like this is not well-cut. A well-cut 1.4 carat round brilliant diamond should face up larger than 6.9mm.

    Usually you would want to consider only Excellent cut diamonds. "Good" is not very good if you are looking for optimal light return.

    Here is an example of a chart that shows what a well-cut round should measure: http://pics.bluenile.com/assets/chrome/pdf/diamond_carat_size_0810.pdf

    I am not much of a shopper but if you wanted help finding stones in your price range, there are many people here that could help you! If so: Do you have a particular size in mind? It sounds like you want a stone with not much tint that is eye-clean - is that right? And is your budget of $3,500 for only the stone or for the stone and setting?
     
  7. Gypsy
    Super_Ideal_Rock

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    by Gypsy » Oct 16, 2014
    That is a terrible diamond. It is so deep it is an iceberg. The J color is the least of your worries. The cut on that thing is terrible. I don't even NEED the rest of the specs to tell you that. The "good" cut grade coupled with that depth disqualifies it as anything other than a doorstop.

    Here's what you need to know:
    The entire purpose of faceting a diamond is to reflect light.
    How well or how poorly a diamond does this determines how beautiful it is.
    How well a diamond performs is determined by the angles and cutting. This is why we say cut is king.
    No other factor: not color, not clarity has as much of an impact on the appearance of a diamond as its cut. An ideal H will out white a poorly cut F. And GIA Ex is not enough. And you must stick to GIA and AGS only. EGL is a bad option: https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/egl-certification-are-any-of-them-ok.142863/
    So how to we ensure that we have the right angles and cutting to get the light performance we want?
    https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/diamond-cut
    Well one method is to start with a GIA Ex, and then apply the HCA to it. YOU DO NOT USE HCA for AGS0 stones.
    https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/holloway-cut-advisor
    The HCA is a rejection tool. Not a selection tool. It uses 4 data points to make a rudimentary call on how the diamond may perform.
    If the diamond passes then you know that you are in the right zone in terms of angles for light performance. Under 2 is a pass. Under 2.5-2.1 is a maybe. 2.6 and over is a no. No score 2 and under is better than any other.
    Is that enough? Not really.
    So what you need is a way to check actual light performance of your actual stone.
    That's what an idealscope image does. https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/firescope-idealscope
    It shows you how and wear your diamond is reflecting light, how well it is going at it, and where you are losing light return. That is why you won't see us recommending Blue Nile, as they do not provide idealscope images for their diamonds. BGD, James Allen, GOG, HPD, ERD and WF do.

    The Idealscope is the 'selection tool'. Not the HCA.
    So yes, with a GIA stone you need the idealscope images. Or you can buy an idealscope yourself and take it in to the jeweler you are working with to check the stones yourself. Or if you have a good return policy (full refund minimum 7 days) then you can buy the idealscope, buy the stone, and do it at home.


    Now if you want to skip all that... stick to AGS0 stones and then all you have to do is pick color and clarity and you know you have a great performing diamond. Because AGS has already done the checking for you. That's why they trade at a premium.
     
  8. Gypsy
    Super_Ideal_Rock

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    by Gypsy » Oct 16, 2014
    Your diamond is the one on the far right below.

    using_IS_Reference_Chart_72.jpg
     
  9. Gypsy
    Super_Ideal_Rock

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    by Gypsy » Oct 16, 2014
    This is what your budget can buy:

    http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3237360.htm?source=pricescope
    In this setting: http://www.whiteflash.com/engagement-rings/diamond-settings/legato-sleek-line-pave-diamond-engagement-ring-422.htm
    Or in this setting if you can stretch the budget: http://www.ritani.com/engagement-rings/french-set-halo-diamond-band-engagement-ring-in-palladium/4775 (Whiteflash is a ritani dealer)

    The stone has a full upgrade policy. So you can upgrade it up to your dream size.

    This is a quality set that any woman will be proud to own.

    That I clarity stone 1.4 stone with I clarity: if it doesn't have visible crystals that means it probably has twinning wisps or clouds that set the clarity grade. Which means the stone will likely be hazy. On top of being WAY too deep and poorly cut... like I said: paperweight.
     
  10. Alexandro
    Rough_Rock

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    by Alexandro » Oct 17, 2014
    Thank you very much Gypsy!! Never thought it was this bad.

    Thanks again!
     
    


    


  11. Pandabear90
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    by Pandabear90 » Oct 17, 2014

    Yea quality over quantity, better to have something nice and smaller then a big pebble LOL
     
  12. Alexandro
    Rough_Rock

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  13. Gypsy
    Super_Ideal_Rock

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    by Gypsy » Oct 17, 2014

    I need the GIA report number. It's not listed. I need the angles. GIA doesn't have an "ideal" cut so the ideal on the listing is meaningless.

    But there is a reason I clarity stones are I clarity. Next to none of them are going to be eyeclean WITHOUT any impact to brilliance and light return AND safe to wear.

    Do you HAVE to have a carat?

    Stretching to K color can get you an SI at 90 points.
     
  14. Gypsy
    Super_Ideal_Rock

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    by Gypsy » Oct 17, 2014
    Here's a cheat sheet for rounds:
    "
    depth - 60 - 62% - although my personal preference is to allow up to 62.4%
    table - 54- 57%
    crown angle - 34- 35 degrees
    pavilion angle - 40.6- 41 degrees
    girdle - avoid extremes, look for thin to slightly thick, thin to medium etc
    polish and symmetry - very good and above

    note - with crown and pavilion angles at the shallower ends ( CA 34- PA 40.6) and steeper ( CA 35- PA 41) check to make sure these angles complement in that particular diamond - eyeballs, Idealscope, trusted vendor input - check as appropriate!

    As the above implies, configurations depend on each other. A little give here can still work with a little take there.

    With that said, here''s a "Cliff''s Notes" for staying near Tolkowsky/ideal angles with GIA reports (their numbers are rounded): A crown angle of 34.0, 34.5 or 35.0 is usually safe with a 40.8 pavilion angle. If pavilion angle = 40.6 lean toward a 34.5-35.0 crown. If pavilion angle = 41 lean toward a 34.0-34.5 crown.

    GIA "EX" in cut is great at its heart, but it ranges a bit wider than some people prefer, particularly in deep combinations (pavilion > 41 with crown > 35)."


    From Lorelei and John Pollard
     
  15. Gypsy
    Super_Ideal_Rock

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    by Gypsy » Oct 17, 2014
    Does it have to be a round?

    We can get you a one carat stone in another shape for the money and stay at SI1.
     
    


    


  16. nukezero
    Rough_Rock

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    by nukezero » Oct 17, 2014
    Here is my review of my J color diamond with tons of pictures for you:

    https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/review-and-pictures-of-my-gog-1-8ct-ideal-round-brilliant.207036/


    My advice is, as long as the cut is great, the J color will face up real white in most lighting conditions. Today I went to Tiffany's and checked out their D, F, G, H diamonds and to be honest, I thought all of them seemed a little yellow possibly due to the yellow spot lighting they use. So remember, color is subjective. Just get the cut down.
     
  17. Gypsy
    Super_Ideal_Rock

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  18. Alexandro
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    by Alexandro » Oct 17, 2014
    I love this one. I'm seriously thinking on buying this specific stone!!

    Thank you!!! You have been of great help!
     
  19. nukezero
    Rough_Rock

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    by nukezero » Oct 17, 2014
    I wouldn't buy a I1 diamond. It will look real bad with the inclusion. I second Gypsy. If it's between J I1 or K VS2, hands down the K VS2 as long as the K has proper cut proportions. Even if the J had good proportions, the I1 would screw it up.

    If you want to see I1, you can go to the mall and check out chain places like Kay Jewelers or Zales. They'll sell exactly those.
     
  20. Gypsy
    Super_Ideal_Rock

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    by Gypsy » Oct 17, 2014
    Good. Considerably better than the original stone you were considering.

    There will be tint visible at times in a K.

    If you want higher color you'll have to go down in size to 80 points.
     
  21. chrono
    Super_Ideal_Rock

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    by chrono » Oct 17, 2014
    I would rather spring for the K VS2 rather than J I1. Keeping it slightly below the 1 carat mark also keeps it from a fairly large $/ct price jump.
     

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