shape
carat
color
clarity

Help! I suspect I got duped by Michael hill

Lovesparklesparle

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jun 9, 2017
Messages
495
Update: I have emailed Jewelers Association of Australia detailing situation and asking for advice, industry insight and course of action.

I have also emailed GSI re provenance of stone.

Fingers crossed. If I'm just being crazy, so be it and I'm sorry everyone, but I'll have peace of mind at least
 

Lovesparklesparle

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jun 9, 2017
Messages
495
Yes it's an E I1. If the 12o'clock carbon spot in the white gold pic is an inclusion (looks to be reflected in other facets?), it definitely isn't there now! There are no black spots, the major flaw is the large cloud? Near the 2 O'clock/7 O'clock prong. Apart from this in house lighting it is pretty much eye clean. It's a mess when it's flurescing though.

My confidence is low in MH, is it plausible/probable they actually dissassembled one showcase ring, sent the stone to USA, remade the ring and sent it back?

image.jpg
 

Lovesparklesparle

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jun 9, 2017
Messages
495
I'll make sure I'm well prepared for the next diamond purchase! I'm sure everyone has an experience which is a big, fat, crappy learning curve, not great at the time, but *insert wise adage*
 

Katesimone

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 26, 2017
Messages
61
My confidence is low in MH, is it plausible/probable they actually dissassembled one showcase ring, sent the stone to USA, remade the ring and sent it back?

image.jpg

No - you at expecting far too much from Michael Hill to be honest. Michael Hill is a chain jeweller, and as far as I know do not have jewellers on site (if it's in a Westfield they cannot have a jeweller on site), so I doubt they sent the ring away, had the diamond taken out, sent the diamond to America to be set in your ring and hen sent it back to Australia (although I could be wrong and stranger things have happened).

I really don't understand why you're upset and want to go to the ACCC now, almost a year later? If you were unhappy with the ring you really had to act at the time, but I think it's unreasonable to expect anything to happen now after you've been wearing the ring for so long. You did get a diamond of the same specs you were promised after all.
 

MollyMalone

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jun 2, 2013
Messages
3,413
Thanks for posting the GSI Report of Authenticity card you received with the ring. Although you informed us that the "certificate" number on the initiating work order matches the number on the GSI card you received, it wasn't clear to me until now that the center stone in the ring you received is also inscribed with that same number.

Given those facts, seems like it will be nigh impossible for you to establish that the stone in the ring you received is not the same one you saw in the showcase ring.

is it plausible/probable they actually dissassembled one showcase ring, sent the stone to USA, remade the ring and sent it back?
To pull the "bait and switch" you're thinking of, wouldn't the store manager have to have ESP? How else could he write down -- on the initiating work order form -- a GSI report number that's not only different from the number etched on the display ring diamond, but which would also end up being the GSI report number for the ring diamond you received?

P.S. Not sure why you think a ring was "remade." The ring you ordered and received -- yellow gold with 6 prongs -- is a new build, not a modification of the showcase ring in white gold with 4 prongs.
Is it common practice for jewellers to destroy one ring to have a stone remade into another, or do they just make it with a comparable one?
Removing the center diamond from the showcase ring would not have destroyed it (unless the person was a complete idiot who had no idea how to safely remove a diamond from a simple 4-prong setting).
 
Last edited:

mrs-b

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Aug 18, 2013
Messages
11,542
hi Lovesparklesparle,

Am I right in thinking your $7500 is AU dollars? If so - let me just convert to US $ because the comparison will be easier for people here in the US, which is where the vendors I'm going to recommend are.

Firstly, you bought a GSI graded stone, so you were going with a grading below GIA/AGS standards right off the bat. You didn't buy an ideal cut stone - even given the GSI grading. You looked at it in jewelry store lighting - BIG mistake. Even my dog sparkles in jewelry store lighting. It's a GSI I1 grade; to give you an idea, Blue Nile, the biggest online diamond retailer here in the US doesn't even carry I1 graded stones. It has a 64% depth. Look, let's embrace the pain first before moving on; the truth is, you bought a bad stone - and in your ring, out of the store - it looks bad. To be honest, that was to be expected.

So - to the numbers. In US numbers, you spent around $5625 on your ring. Allow $1500 for the setting, which I believe you want to keep. That means you spent the equivalent of around $4100 on your diamond. To trade up, you need to spend triple. So that's a BAD deal. I suggest you keep the setting and get a new stone. I found a .81 G SI1 stone, just a smidge over 6mm, for $2731 US. It's a FAR better diamond than the one you have, it's less than half what you originally paid (which is a pretty big improvement on having to spend 3 x to correct this mistake), and its specs are lovely.

I'm sure this isn't money you want to spend right now, and probably dont have in the budget. But just know that this option is out there when the time comes where you want to fix this. You can ship this to Australia and pay duty, or you can ship it to a friend in the US who might be coming over to Australia. Some people here will jump on me for saying that. But in my experience, when push comes to shove, most people are willing to cut corners to get where they need to go. Blue Nile also has a few brick and mortar stores now, so were you ever in the US, you could walk in with your ring, purchase a new stone, and go home with everything fixed. If you have someone you trust who is traveling to the US, they could do this for you, using a stone you chose online.

So I'm suggesting a 'wait for now' policy. Your diamond ISN'T forever - regardless of what the ads say, and everything can be fixed down the road. And when you DO get the diamond you want - sell the one you have, if you can, and recoup a few bucks. But be aware - it will only be 'a few bucks' - and nothing like what you spent on it. But even a thousand AU dollars would go some way to easing the pain.

Good luck! :wavey:
 

WillyDiamond

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Dec 7, 2004
Messages
1,452
OP, I hope you read mrs-b's post.
She hit the nail on the head for you
 

Lovesparklesparle

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jun 9, 2017
Messages
495
Yes I have read everyone's posts carefully, Ireally appreciate your words. :)

I know I have myself to blame...I was holding on to the romance of it all hoping the feeling would go away and in doing so shot myself in the foot.

The manager kept changing his story which makes me doubt everything he has said, and also tried to charge another $900 aud on top of the agreed price when fiance picked it up (settled on $550), and we also bought the care plan.

My diamond is nothing compared to most on here lol, but I thought it would be forever. And it looks better out of the store lighting which is strange. I read gsi usually grade 1 higher than they should. Do you find this to be true?

Can I get it independently graded and have a case if it comes back 2 grades worse than the "certificate"?

Anyway, I will update on what responses I get from the bodies I have emailed.

Thanks again everyone
 

MollyMalone

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jun 2, 2013
Messages
3,413
* * * The manager kept changing his story which makes me doubt everything he has said, and also tried to charge another $900 aud on top of the agreed price when fiance picked it up (settled on $550), and we also bought the care plan. * * *
I read gsi usually grade 1 higher than they should. Do you find this to be true? Can I get it independently graded and have a case if it comes back 2 grades worse than the "certificate"?
Well, I didn't indicate in my previous post how exasperated I was, but since you've returned to add the foregoing, I'll now say that I didn't appreciate you telling us
( 1)
The certificate [I received]is very basic- 3 dimensions, colour, clarity, treatment and says girdle is inscribed with Michael hill jeweller not a cert number. * * *
and (2)
The work order form was the carbon copy paper notepad they fill out in the store for jobs. It said use this stone with the matching certificate number with the one I have now. Since the diamonds are not inscribed with said number, they could potentially assign that number to any stone with matching grading.
When, in fact, the GSI Report of Authenticity -- when you finally posted it today, 2 days after starting this thread, 2 days after Snowdrop 13 asked if you would post the certificate (post #2, the very first response you received) -- shows that the diamond in the ring you received IS indeed inscribed with the GSI "cert" number (which matches the number on the initiating work order from).
You could have saved us PSers much of the time and attention we collectively gave you over the past couple of days by being candidly straight-forward with us early on. And candor from the get-go also would have resulted in you receiving more truly meaningful counsel from the start. Even if that wouldn't have been what you wanted to hear.

And although you previously said
I will try to talk to the store manager (he is the one who served me), and if I am right [about being "duped"], continued lying to my face on three occasions
this is the very first time we've heard that the manager tried to charge nearly $1000 more at the time the ring was picked up. An odd thing to leave out imo, if true, of your lengthy original post and your subsequent posts (until now).

So all this is why I'm now not inclined to help you make another kind of "case" against MH & am bowing out of this thread.
 
Last edited:

Lovesparklesparle

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jun 9, 2017
Messages
495
MollyMalone I am sorry I mislead you and that you are so offended. I honestly didn't intentionally do it.

I didn't think the extra charge at the end had any relevance to the stone? It was an honest, careless and stupid yes, mistake re the certificate number. When I posted the certificate I realised it was actually inscripted. I have no interest in wasting people's time and have not fabricated incidents such as the extra charge, but to everyone who helped me I'm sorry that I didn't provide 100% accurate information re the inscription, it's very embarrassing. I am new to all this and know nothing about the industry and forums etc that's why I came here for insight. I never meant to troll or upset anyone, and definitely not to cause trouble.
 

mrs-b

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Aug 18, 2013
Messages
11,542
Lovesparklesparle -

Firstly - don't beat yourself up about this. The point I was trying to make before WASN'T - 'this is all your fault'. It was 'I don't think you have a lot of recourse with this because, sadly, you bought a bad stone and this is how bad stones look.'

I completely understand throwing oneself into the world of diamonds with little-to-no information or experience. But having done that, I think our collective opinion here is that you're going to have to wear this one. I have no idea why the store attempted to charge you an extra chunk of change - but in my experience, elaborate cover-ups are rarely the case, mainly because they just take too much time and effort to concoct. Michael Hill is already ripping off its customers with the prices they charge - and I mean a LOT. So they don't really need another avenue to do it. An I1 stone is an I1 stone is an I1 stone - not a lot to be gained by anyone in switching out one for the other.

One thing, however, that I can safely say; this will only get a lot more sour and stressful if you don't let it go at this point. Law suits, letters to store owners, comparative appraisals - anything and everything you can try from this point is going to ramp up your stress and upset both you and your fiance.

In my opinion, the inscription part is unarguable. Even if they have a stack of pleasant looking I1 stones that they use to show customers, that they then switch out for horrible I1 stones, you're just not going to be able to get past that inscription. They'll say that you, as a newbie, didn't notice the clouds etc, and it will be impossible to argue against that. And of course, sad to say, it's possible that this might BE what happened.

Lovesparklesparle - I'm so sorry this has turned into a misery. My very best advice here, given in the spirit of support, is to let this go and replace your stone when you can afford it with one from a better dealer, preferably from America, where diamonds are SO much cheaper. Look forward, not back....

(I say all this as someone who had their engagement diamond stolen and replaced by a jeweler when she got engaged and who didn't realize until years later when it was removed and weighed and found to be 25% SMALLER than what we gave him to set. So I get it!)

Best wishes and good luck!
 

bmfang

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 2, 2017
Messages
1,851
Lovesparklesparkle, when you are ready to upgrade from your current stone (which is separate from the setting it is in, which is quite beautiful!) you should either purchase from the USA over the web or visit reputable independent jewellers (NOT massive national chains like Michael Hill, Shiels, Prouds or Angus & Coote). I would be hesitant about recommending that you go to one of the smaller regional chain stores either (like Wallace Bishop, Hardy Brothers or even Salera's) unless you know exactly what you want and you give ranges of specifications to their staff members.

Re: reputable independent jewellers, if you are based in Melbourne, you might want to visit Holloway Diamonds to check out quality stones with great light performance. Holloway Diamonds is home to one of the PS founders who posts on here from time to time.

If in Brisbane, Ashley Douglas, Hofstays, Stones and Robert White in Brisbane Arcade or LeGassick at one of their 3 stores on the Gold Coast. These ones (in my experience) are willing to work with customers to source stones for them rather than just sell them what is on their display racks.

But I doubt that they would be able to beat the price or cut quality of PS forum suggested vendors (with the exception of the range at Holloway Diamonds).
 

tkyasx78

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
May 28, 2017
Messages
1,640
I get that you have a case of buyers remorse.
I get that you dont like the stones inclusions and that it looks different to you than how you remember it at the time of purchase. Months after buying any stone that isnt 100% eye clean you are going to notice the inclusions different. It is normal to notice new things after seeing stones in a wide variety of lights which is why we encourage people to only buy stones that are 100% eye clean even when looked at really closely

How ever - They didnt scam you . You knew you were getting an I clarity stone. They didnt lie about that. They never claimed it was a VS clarity. You have the rings. You have the diamond. You have it laser inscribed with the number and a matching certificate. You took possession of it months ago knowing the certificate said it was I clarity and I do NOT see ANY reason that michael hill owes you anything. I would not spend any more time bothering michael hill. You were not duped and they didnt tell you it was a vs clarity stone and then give you an i clarity stone.

This was a very expensive lesson. I hope you learned in the future that you ONLY want stones that are eyeclean. And if you want a new stone - buy one.
At some time in the future take the I clarity center stone and either sell it or have it made into a pendant. Get a stone that is eyeclean and have it put in the ring.
 

ChristineRose

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Aug 5, 2012
Messages
926
The mall jewelry industry is sleazy. I am sorry you fell into their traps.

If I were in your situation, I'd sell it and buy something nicer. Even if it's only a tiny superideal diamond, or even a precision cut colored stone. Or even a one of a kind piece with minimal precious metal and/or stones. This is just my bias towards one of a kind art jewelry, but it's impossible to look at something designed and made for you and feel like you were duped every time.
 

WillyDiamond

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Dec 7, 2004
Messages
1,452
OP
I am sorry but I am losing patience with this thread, not sure why you keep going back to this vendor. When your fiancé went to pick up the ring and the guy wanted more money, that is the first sign that things have gone south.
I wish you the best of luck.
 

Lovesparklesparle

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jun 9, 2017
Messages
495
Thank you everyone, like really, for all your time and suggestions. Hearing people with knowledge has talked some sense into me. I will come to terms with what's happened- have learned a lot. I'll just do my best to ensure my next purchase is a cracker.

Mrs B- that's so upsetting, what did you do when you found out your diamond was switched??! Did they deny it?

So last question, who would/did you get your rings from online? I would like to order the marquis wedder as in the photo... and avoid Michael Hill or similar...(I don't have one yet, I was trying different ones on in all the mall stores when the pics were taken.. cringe*)
 

bmfang

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 2, 2017
Messages
1,851
So last question, who would/did you get your rings from online? I would like to order the marquis wedder as in the photo...

For round brilliant stones: Whiteflash, Brian Gavin Diamonds, High Performance Diamonds, James Allen, Blue Nile (only for stones where they have videos).

For fancy cuts: James Allen

If you are looking for Pricescope quality stones on a budget, contact Yekutiel at ID Jewelry (http://idjewelry.com/). I believe they also can do custom orders if you can't find something to that marquise wedder online.
 

HopeSpringsEternal

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 4, 2017
Messages
37
Hi Lovesparkle,
I am a newbie on this board but wanted to respond to your thread in the hope of helping you feel a bit better.

I personally think your ring is gorgeous
and the fluorescence is cool. Yes the diamond may not be the best quality unfortunately and I can totally understand how you might feel even worse that you feel responsible for this by choosing that stone and overpaying. I'd say feel the annoyance and sadness that it isn't 'perfect' etc and then look forward.

I would look at it like this:
1. You have a lovely fiancé and you are getting married which is exciting in itself but also you have the opportunity to choose a really lovely blingy wedding band.

2. Your fiancé clearly just wants you to be happy which means that he probably will be open to an upgrade in the future. Yay!

3. You have lovely hands and you can rock this stone. Only you in real life will realise it's not a great stone, everyone else will think it's just a beautiful ring.

Personally I think it's a symbol that life and especially marriage isn't perfect. You do the best you can at the time and look forward to improve in the future.

If it were me I'd set up a bling fund and look to upgrade at my 5 year anniversary or something. By then you may even have different tastes and want a different style of ring - how exciting to have that opportunity, most don't and have to stick with what they were given that may not reflect their changing style.

I myself received an engagement ring that is not what I would have chosen and my husband probably way overpaid for it, it's not even certificated. I can tell you that once you stop focusing on it you'll start to enjoy it again and before you know it you can start planning your upgrade. There will be jewellery to keep you going in between and thankfully as you now have PS you won't end up with a lifetime wardrobe of mall jewellery.

Sometimes seeing everyone's beautiful bling on PS can make you feel a bit dissatisfied but always good to remember that a lot of these beautiful jewels are upgrades for ladies who've 'done their time' and earnt them and started out with much less than you have now. An engagement ring is a token, much like relationships it doesn't need to be perfect. Enjoy your ring for what it is and have fun learning on PS to plan for that upgrade.
 

mrs-b

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Aug 18, 2013
Messages
11,542
Thank you everyone, like really, for all your time and suggestions. Hearing people with knowledge has talked some sense into me. I will come to terms with what's happened- have learned a lot. I'll just do my best to ensure my next purchase is a cracker.

Mrs B- that's so upsetting, what did you do when you found out your diamond was switched??! Did they deny it?

So last question, who would/did you get your rings from online? I would like to order the marquis wedder as in the photo... and avoid Michael Hill or similar...(I don't have one yet, I was trying different ones on in all the mall stores when the pics were taken.. cringe*)

Hi Lovesparklesparle -

By the time we realized it, it was years after and the jeweler who stole our stone had gone. We had the paperwork for the stone we'd given him (because it had originally been my mother's e-ring diamond), so there was no chance it was anything other than theft.

We just took the hit, but I can tell you - the substituted stone lost ALL value to me at that point; I thought I'd been wearing my deceased mother's e-ring diamond, given to me by my father - only to find I'd had something very different foisted on me. But it wasn't all bad in the end....we upgraded....

...a lot. :mrgreen:

IMG_2427.JPG
 

mochiko42

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Sep 28, 2013
Messages
2,663
Hi Lovesparklesparle -

By the time we realized it, it was years after and the jeweler who stole our stone had gone. We had the paperwork for the stone we'd given him (because it had originally been my mother's e-ring diamond), so there was no chance it was anything other than theft.

We just took the hit, but I can tell you - the substituted stone lost ALL value to me at that point; I thought I'd been wearing my deceased mother's e-ring diamond, given to me by my father - only to find I'd had something very different foisted on me. But it wasn't all bad in the end....we upgraded....

...a lot. :mrgreen:

IMG_2427.JPG

He stole your mother's diamond?!?! Oh my god, that makes it even worse. I hope karma came back to bite that guy in the a**. What an ugly, despicable thing to do! Beautiful upgrade, though! :)
 

Natylad

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Nov 17, 2009
Messages
2,904
Hi Lovesparkle,
I am a newbie on this board but wanted to respond to your thread in the hope of helping you feel a bit better.

I personally think your ring is gorgeous
and the fluorescence is cool. Yes the diamond may not be the best quality unfortunately and I can totally understand how you might feel even worse that you feel responsible for this by choosing that stone and overpaying. I'd say feel the annoyance and sadness that it isn't 'perfect' etc and then look forward.

I would look at it like this:
1. You have a lovely fiancé and you are getting married which is exciting in itself but also you have the opportunity to choose a really lovely blingy wedding band.

2. Your fiancé clearly just wants you to be happy which means that he probably will be open to an upgrade in the future. Yay!

3. You have lovely hands and you can rock this stone. Only you in real life will realise it's not a great stone, everyone else will think it's just a beautiful ring.

Personally I think it's a symbol that life and especially marriage isn't perfect. You do the best you can at the time and look forward to improve in the future.

If it were me I'd set up a bling fund and look to upgrade at my 5 year anniversary or something. By then you may even have different tastes and want a different style of ring - how exciting to have that opportunity, most don't and have to stick with what they were given that may not reflect their changing style.

I myself received an engagement ring that is not what I would have chosen and my husband probably way overpaid for it, it's not even certificated. I can tell you that once you stop focusing on it you'll start to enjoy it again and before you know it you can start planning your upgrade. There will be jewellery to keep you going in between and thankfully as you now have PS you won't end up with a lifetime wardrobe of mall jewellery.

Sometimes seeing everyone's beautiful bling on PS can make you feel a bit dissatisfied but always good to remember that a lot of these beautiful jewels are upgrades for ladies who've 'done their time' and earnt them and started out with much less than you have now. An engagement ring is a token, much like relationships it doesn't need to be perfect. Enjoy your ring for what it is and have fun learning on PS to plan for that upgrade.

I don't know you but i love you for everything that you wrote. It's the best advice for the OP in my opinion. Your post really spoke to my heart. Posts like this remind me of why i joined PS in the first place.
 
Be a part of the community Get 3 HCA Results
Top