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jade66

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jun 30, 2014
Messages
7
1.05 ct or above
ideal cut, F/VS1 or above
round shape, go with 6-prong platinium ring
budget 10k.

I am searching bluenile.com. Here are some:

item A
1.15 ct/Ideal cut/Color F/Clarity VVS2 /Excellent Polish/Excellent Symmetry/Strong Blue Fluorescence/Depth 62.3/Table 58
Item B
1.13 ct/Ideal cut/Color E/Clarity VS1 /Excellent Polish/Excellent Symmetry/Strong Fluorescence/Depth 60.8/Table 59
Item C
1.11 ct/Ideal cut/Color F/Clarity VVS2 /Excellent Polish/Excellent Symmetry/Medium Fluorescence/Depth 60/Table 61

price A>B>C, but not significant. only about $200 difference.

I can not see them in person for online purchase. I need some help to make a decision.
1. Will the strong Fluorescence affect adversely a E/F diamond?
2. What's the difference between strong and strong blue? which is worse?
3. Overall, which is a better value?

And I find if I lower the clarity from VS1 to VS2, I could buy a larger stone with this budget. Here is item D:
1.26 ct/Ideal cut/Color F/Clarity VS2 /Excellent Polish/Excellent Symmetry/Strong Fluorescence/Depth 62.6/Table 57
item D is the almost the same price as Item A.
Will 1.26 ct diamond be noticeably larger than 1.15 ct? Does it worth sacrificing the clarity for a larger stone?

Any suggestion appreciated. Thanks in advance
 
The entire purpose of faceting a diamond is to reflect light.
How well or how poorly a diamond does this determines how beautiful it is.
How well a diamond performs is determined by the angles and cutting. This is why we say cut is king.
No other factor: not color, not clarity has as much of an impact on the appearance of a diamond as its cut. An ideal H will out white a poorly cut F. And GIA Ex is not enough. And you must stick to GIA and AGS only. EGL is a bad option: [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/egl-certification-are-any-of-them-ok.142863/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/egl-certification-are-any-of-them-ok.142863/[/URL]
So how to we ensure that we have the right angles and cutting to get the light performance we want?
https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/diamond-cut
Well one method is to start with a GIA Ex, and then apply the HCA to it. YOU DO NOT USE HCA for AGS0 stones.
https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/holloway-cut-advisor
The HCA is a rejection tool. Not a selection tool. It uses 4 data points to make a rudimentary call on how the diamond may perform.
If the diamond passes then you know that you are in the right zone in terms of angles for light performance. Under 2 is a pass. Under 2.5-2.1 is a maybe. 2.6 and over is a no. No score 2 and under is better than any other.
Is that enough? Not really.
So what you need is a way to check actual light performance of your actual stone.
That's what an idealscope image does. https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/firescope-idealscope
It shows you how and wear your diamond is reflecting light, how well it is going at it, and where you are losing light return. That is why you won't see us recommending Blue Nile, as they do not provide idealscope images for their diamonds. BGD, James Allen, GOG, HPD, ERD and WF do.

The Idealscope is the 'selection tool'. Not the HCA.
So yes, with a GIA stone you need the idealscope images. Or you can buy an idealscope yourself and take it in to the jeweler you are working with to check the stones yourself. Or if you have a good return policy (full refund minimum 7 days) then you can buy the idealscope, buy the stone, and do it at home.


Now if you want to skip all that... stick to AGS0 stones and then all you have to do is pick color and clarity and you know you have a great performing diamond. Because AGS has already done the checking for you. That's why they trade at a premium.
 
You budget is low for what you want. Color and clarity aren't enough. You need light performance. Otherwise all you have is a really expensive rock.

Ideal light performance is one thing you do NOT want to compromise on. And it does drive the price up.

So I'm adjusting your carat weight down to a full carat. And also going down to eyeclean VS2 clarity.

http://images.b2cjewels.com/Images//Certificate//4226556.pdf B2C can get you an idealscope image.

http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/12296/ Eyeclean VS2 saves you money.

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/1.02-carat-e-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-290381 Vs2 and will be eyeclean (see what I mean about your budget?) JA will get you an idealscope

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/1.10-carat-f-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-320034 Get idealscope.

Basically you are either going to have to increase your budget or relax your size and clarity requirements.

These don't have pictures, but B2C can get them for you.
http://images.b2cjewels.com/images//b2cdiamonds//Certificate//4754167.pdf
http://www.b2cjewels.com/dd-4763381-1.12-carat-Round-diamond-F-color-VVS2-Clarity.aspx?sku=4763381&utm_source=pricescope.com&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=pricescope.com 60/60 with great spread. Might be an option for you. But does go over your budget with the setting. Get pictures and an idealscope image.
 
jade66|1404107961|3703611 said:
1.05 ct or above
ideal cut, F/VS1 or above
round shape, go with 6-prong platinium ring
budget 10k.

I am searching bluenile.com. Here are some:

item A
1.15 ct/Ideal cut/Color F/Clarity VVS2 /Excellent Polish/Excellent Symmetry/Strong Blue Fluorescence/Depth 62.3/Table 58
Item B
1.13 ct/Ideal cut/Color E/Clarity VS1 /Excellent Polish/Excellent Symmetry/Strong Fluorescence/Depth 60.8/Table 59
Item C
1.11 ct/Ideal cut/Color F/Clarity VVS2 /Excellent Polish/Excellent Symmetry/Medium Fluorescence/Depth 60/Table 61

price A>B>C, but not significant. only about $200 difference.

Post the links then we can go from there.

I can not see them in person for online purchase. I need some help to make a decision.
1. Will the strong Fluorescence affect adversely a E/F diamond? The only way to know is to ask the vendor to check the stone out for undesirable effects such as milkiness, BN might be able to arrange this, negative effects from strong blue are rare - assuming this is strong blue on the report, fluorescence can be found in different colours. A benefit to some fluorescence in colourless diamonds is that they can be discounted as a result.
2. What's the difference between strong and strong blue? which is worse? Neither, if both are strong blue then they are similar on paper, one might be slightly stronger than another but again an expert with the stone in hand can check for undesirable effects.
3. Overall, which is a better value? No way to tell from the info we have regrettably, we might be able to tell you which might be the better choice if you can get us the info from the reports.

And I find if I lower the clarity from VS1 to VS2, I could buy a larger stone with this budget. Here is item D:
1.26 ct/Ideal cut/Color F/Clarity VS2 /Excellent Polish/Excellent Symmetry/Strong Fluorescence/Depth 62.6/Table 57
item D is the almost the same price as Item A. This stone is a bit deep, this could make the stone look smaller but we need the diameter measurement to be able to check the spread or face up size.
Will 1.26 ct diamond be noticeably larger than 1.15 ct? Does it worth sacrificing the clarity for a larger stone? That depends on the cut quality, carat weight does not always equal spread or face up size if the stone is badly proportioned or cut for weight rather than beauty.

Any suggestion appreciated. Thanks in advance
Click to expand...


Hi Jade and welcome!

My thoughts are in bold above. Do you prefer to shop with BN? If so, that's fine, but it can be preferable to work with a vendor that can offer images such as Idealscope so we can check out the optical performance ( all important sparkle **) of the diamond before purchase. BN do not offer such services at this time unfortunately. In order to give you some info on your choices above, we would need the links to the diamonds please or all of the info from the reports posted here, it might be easier for you to add the links directly.

Is it important to you to have such high colour and clarity? If so, that's no problem at all but just to let you know you could lower both without visual sacrifice if the cut quality is superb.
 
If you do want to buy from Blue Nile, I highly suggesting sticking to their Signature Line and using the HCA to reject stone with unfavorable angles. Signature line stones do come with GCAL reports and that is a big help too as there is an image at least on them.

Signature lines are also guaranteed eyeclean, so you can go safely down to VS2 (and there is nothing VS1 or higher for your price range in F or better color).

http://www.bluenile.com/diamond-search?pt=setform&track=NavDiaSeaRD#diamonds_pid=LD04516167 this is a very nice stone.

If you don't want to drop clarity (though really it is the easiest thing to drop, it will not be detectable in any way that a stone is an eyeclean VS2 versus a VVs1) you can drop color. An F will be indistinguishable from a G (in fact you can set F's and G's together side by side in a ring and not tell):
http://www.bluenile.com/diamond-search?filter_id=0&pt=sig&track=NavDiaSigRD#diamonds_pid=LD03854351


Or increase the budget and get this:

http://www.bluenile.com/round-diamond-1-carat-signature-ideal-cut-f-color-vs1-clarity_LD04440091
 
Thanks for your kind reply!
here is the link of
A:
http://www.bluenile.com/build-your-own-ring/diamond-details/LD04370386
B:
http://www.bluenile.com/build-your-own-ring/diamond-details/LD04524216
C:
http://www.bluenile.com/build-your-own-ring/diamond-details/LD04539952

D:
http://www.bluenile.com/build-your-own-ring/diamond-details/LD04424600


I understand that 'cut" is the most important. "Ideal" is the highest for all stores. Bluenile add a "signature ideal". How much is the difference between the two? In its GIA certificate, I think both will be written as "Ideal", right?

I only visited Costco so far to take a look at the diamond on display. and Bluenile seems much cheaper than Costco. That's why I shopped on Bluenile ...
 
Vendor labels are meaningless when it comes to CUT QUALITY and light performance. "Ideal" or "Signature Ideal" ... No difference. ANY stone in either category could be great or terrible. The reason I said to stick to the Signature ideal line is because they are guaranteed eyeclean and because of your budget I had to drop you to VS2 clarity and I wanted to make sure the stone were eyeclean. It has NOTHING to do with the cut quality. Only with clarity.


Please go back and read the first POST I wrote for you. Your most recent post shows you didn't read what I wrote. I didn't talk about vendor labels. I talked about ANGLES and light performance and Idealscope images. And about the HCA.

Re-read that. Click on the links.

THEN:

RUN the stones you have through the HCA (link is posted above). 2.0 and under is a pass. Over 2.0 a FAIL for you. Because BN doesn't have idealscope images. If you work with a vendor that DOES provide idealscope images you can go up to 2.5. BUT ONLY WITH AN IDEALSCOPE.
 
Thanks, Gypsy.

I believe the stone you recommend must be good since you are so knowlegable about diamond.

I did read your posts and am trying to understand why you pick this stone.
"ANGLES and light performance and Idealscope images. And about the HCA."
From the bluenile diamond grading report, I can see none of the four factor you mentioned. Only the four "C"s and table and depth.
I cannot find the crown and pavilion angle stats so cannot run the HCA rejection tool. where did you find the numbers on bluenile website?

Can you tell me more why this stone is better than Item E and F? (it must be, since it is smaller and more expensive than the two I picked. :) You have numbers that not show in bluenile website?
 
it is said "The actual diamonds you purchase may weigh slightly more or less than the fractional weight"
and here is the range of carat weight:
•1 carat total weight may be 0.95 to 1.10 carats

Does it mean that 1.1 carats diamond would guarantee the stone to be 1 CT?
A 1.05 CT diamond may actually only 0.95 CT?
 
OK

If you click on the GIA certificate of each stone, you will see a diagram of the diamond in profile like the below:
scheme.gif


On that diagram, among other information, you will find the following:
Table %
Depth %
Crown Angle %
Pavilion Angle %

The last two are the numbers I am talking about when I say angles.

Take ALL FOUR of those numbers I listed above and put them in the HCA found here: http://www.pricescope.com/tools/hca

Then hit "Go"

And it will give you a result like the below:
http://www.pricescope.com/files/images/hca_6060.jpg[img]

Since you are not working with a vendor that offers idealscope images you must stick with stones with a score of 2.0 and under. Anything over 2 is not worth buying for you.

That will help you narrow down the selections to diamonds that are worth your time.

Is that clearer?

The diamond I posted scores under 2.0. That's why I keep posting it. The angles are complimentary and should result in excellent light return, which is what you want.
 
jade66|1404197931|3704277 said:
it is said "The actual diamonds you purchase may weigh slightly more or less than the fractional weight"
and here is the range of carat weight:
•1 carat total weight may be 0.95 to 1.10 carats

Does it mean that 1.1 carats diamond would guarantee the stone to be 1 CT?
A 1.05 CT diamond may actually only 0.95 CT?
Click to expand...

No. It means they only go to a certain decimal point and then they round up or down.

The weight posted on the GIA lab report is the actual weight (rounded past the third decimal point).

So the certificate might say 1.346 and they might list it as 1.35 or 1.34. Either way they list it, the number is rounded.
 
jade66|1404196955|3704274 said:
Can you tell me more why this stone is better than Item E and F? (it must be, since it is smaller and more expensive than the two I picked. :)
Click to expand...

Price isn't always definitive, but yes the stone I posted is smaller and more expensive. Why? The pavilion and crown angles indicate light return in the optimal range for ideal light performance. So it costs more. Because it has better cut QUALITY than the large ones you chose. Regardless of the "Excellent" cut grade by GIA of both or Blue Nile's label of "ideal" or "signature ideal", the ANGLES and the TABLE and DEPTH together indicate better performance than the larger cheaper diamonds you chose.

:wavey:
 
jade66|1404197931|3704277 said:
it is said "The actual diamonds you purchase may weigh slightly more or less than the fractional weight"
and here is the range of carat weight:
•1 carat total weight may be 0.95 to 1.10 carats

Does it mean that 1.1 carats diamond would guarantee the stone to be 1 CT?
A 1.05 CT diamond may actually only 0.95 CT?
Click to expand...



Hi Jade,

Just to clear this up for you if I am reading your question properly. With accent diamonds for some jewellery pieces, you can find a range for 1 CTW such as 0.95- 1.10 cts, this is usual practice which refers to the total weight of tiny melee stones used to make up the finished jewellery piece/s.

I have also seen in the past some vendors sell single diamonds referred to as among their 1 carat stones that actually weigh less such as .95 etc, you won't find that with Pricescope vendors, look for the actual weights on the reports or the stone's links, each diamond will be a particular weight, it won't be a weight range.

I hope this helps and I understood what you were asking!
 
Thanks, Lorelei. I don't know if Bluenile is the vendor you mentioned.
I want to make sure the weight on Bluenile GIA report is the actual weight. say, 1.01 ct is guaranteed above 1 ct.
 
hi, Gypsy. thank you so much for the education and clear instruction.
I used the hca tool to select one more
http://www.bluenile.com/build-your-own-ring/diamond-details/LD04207965

How is this one compare with the one (1.05 ct) you recommended?

the hca score of this one is 1.4. the one you recommended is 1.1.
By reading the small prints in the hca tool, my understanding is that it does not make much difference once the score is below 2.0. is my understanding correct?
 
jade66|1404280408|3705040 said:
hi, Gypsy. thank you so much for the education and clear instruction.
I used the hca tool to select one more
http://www.bluenile.com/build-your-own-ring/diamond-details/LD04207965

How is this one compare with the one (1.05 ct) you recommended?

the hca score of this one is 1.4. the one you recommended is 1.1.
By reading the small prints in the hca tool, my understanding is that it does not make much difference once the score is below 2.0. is my understanding correct?
Click to expand...


Yes. HCA is Pass/Fail so your stone passed.

It looks like a nice option.

Great job! Good size too. And it's under budget!!

You did good!
 
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