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Help Choosing Between Two Diamonds

Seems I started a proxy war ;)2 but seriously thanks for all the input/advice.

I went with diamond 1, the paper champion, and there’s a return policy.

Once the diamond arrives do I take it to a rebuttable jeweler and get his/her opinion? Any other next step advice to make sure it was the right diamond?
 
TODiamonds said:
Look I'm not trying to discredit anyone on this forum. I've actually learned most of what I know about diamonds by lurking on this forum. And without a doubt... all the regulars here have good intentions.

I just think the view generally held among the PS community is not reflective of what the views of the general public would be when it comes to diamonds. I think we can agree almost all the regulars on this forum would sacrifice size for super-ideal proportions. In reality, most people (ie: 99% of the general public who know nothing about diamonds) would favor a larger rock - all else being the same. That's what would make them happier. I actually put this to the test, I brought some of my female friends with the keenest eyes with me, and we looked at ... *gasp* a bunch of actual diamonds IN REAL LIFE. I showed them super-ideals and I showed them normal ideals (ie: GIA average XXX). Let me tell you... they ALL chose the bigger rock (which was cheaper than the super ideal). HCA 2.3, 2.5 it didn't matter. As long as it was eye clean and had decent proportions, they all wanted the size. That's what made them happy... not an HCA of 0.8 (which by the way is only ONE person's subjective opinion of what a beautiful diamond should look like).

Typical PS thread:
Newbie: Tell me what you guys think of this diamond. (usually a decent diamond, not super ideal, but better than 95% of what's out there. Price is decent.)
PS: What does HCA say? Greater than 2? Throw it out.
Newbie: Well, my budget is __________
PS: The crown angle is 35%.. that can be problematic. and that 41% pavilion can lead to leakage. Let us do some digging for you.
PS: Comes back with list of Whiteflash, HPD, CBI, BG diamonds. By the way for JUST a few x hundred / y thousand dollars more... you can have this super ideal! It will look fantastic! AND you can upgrade it in the future cause they have this great policy! (again shows how distorted PS is because 99% of the population out there will never "upgrade" their diamonds. Who has money for that shit?)
OP: goes crazy, enters the black hole of analysis paralysis - over something his fiance or 99% of the general population would never have even noticed, and is convinced to spend more.

Sometimes, I even see newbie's irritated in threads because they feel as though the crowd here is pushing something on them that they weren't ever interested in (ie: branded super-ideals). They just want an opinion on the diamond THEY chose - why? maybe because it was affordable for them, maybe because they like how it looks, maybe because they actually saw it in person, who knows.

Again, while everyone has good intentions, my opinion (which I'm sure most of you will disagree with but that's ok) is that PS'ers live in a bubble and generally aren't able to put themselves in the shoes of the average consumer who doesn't have a PHD in diamonds. The concerning threads are the ones that push people's budgets... how do you know what that person's individual financial circumstances are? What if that extra few thousand you're urging them to spend is the difference between whether or not they take out a second mortgage on their home? What if it's a student or young recent graduate who hasn't paid off their school loans? These are the threads I find somewhat irresponsible because you are urging someone to stretch financially without knowing anything about that person or his/her financial situation.

The reality is that WF, HPD, BG's businesses are catered to the 1% out there... their price points are not meant to appeal to the general population. That's their business model. And whether the "value" offered by these super ideal brands is worth it is a whole subjective thing that I don't think we need to get into here. But at the end of the day, value and beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and I would bet the farm that the majority of common folk out there who don't know a thing about diamonds would be happier with a larger diamond, with maybe a 2.3 HCA, instead of the superideal with the 1.8 HCA. So if your woman will be happier with the bigger rock, and you save a thousand bucks in the process, then why blow your brains out over these specs.

I apologize if this rubs people the wrong way. I have the utmost respect for the expertise of the folks on this forum and I know they all want to be helpful. I use this forum extensively because I'm genuinely interested in learning more and I'm fortunate enough to be in that higher income bracket where I can shop at branded super-ideal vendors that are prominent here. I just wanted share my honest views in the hopes that this will help some of you be more empathetic and sensitive towards the many folks who come here seeking your advice. And Yes - my examples above are exaggerated and over generalized, just to prove a point :)
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Standing ovation!
 
scaredofclowns said:
Seems I started a proxy war ;)2 but seriously thanks for all the input/advice.

I went with diamond 1, the paper champion, and there’s a return policy.

Once the diamond arrives do I take it to a rebuttable jeweler and get his/her opinion? Any other next step advice to make sure it was the right diamond?
Click to expand...
Just curious... what was the deciding factor in your choice?
When you get it, if you want an opinion, then take it to a qualified INDEPENDENT appraiser. I wouldn’t take it to a jeweler... what would be the point?... they want you to buy THEIR diamond! So unless you are interested in what they have to offer (which, if you were, you would’ve been shopping with them and not online), there is no need.
Although, I think you have the info you need... now you just have to see what you think of it in real life. If you don’t love it, and the other one is still available, you can give that one a shot.
 
Couldn’t get over the potential issues with 36 crown on diamond 2 after reading up on it and it was hard to ignore the HCA “excellent” (all excellent HCA projection and good size) vs the “very good” (very good and average size) even if I was supposed to only focus on the under 2 passing grade.
 
TODiamonds said:
brought some of my female friends with the keenest eyes with me, and we looked at ... *gasp* a bunch of actual diamonds IN REAL LIFE. I showed them super-ideals and I showed them normal ideals (ie: GIA average XXX). Let me tell you... they ALL chose the bigger rock (which was cheaper than the super ideal). HCA 2.3, 2.5 it didn't matter. As long as it was eye clean and had decent proportions, they all wanted the size. That's what made them happy... not an HCA of 0.8 (which by the way is only ONE person's subjective opinion of what a beautiful diamond should look like).
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Not true. My diamond sparkles way more than the $1999 1ct special at Zales...:praise:
 
[QUOTE="
I apologize if this rubs people the wrong way. I have the utmost respect for the expertise of the folks on this forum and I know they all want to be helpful. I use this forum extensively because I'm genuinely interested in learning more and I'm fortunate enough to be in that higher income bracket where I can shop at branded super-ideal vendors that are prominent here. I just wanted share my honest views in the hopes that this will help some of you be more empathetic and sensitive towards the many folks who come here seeking your advice. And Yes - my examples above are exaggerated and over generalized, just to prove a point :)[/QUOTE]

I totally understand where you're coming from. I came here 6 years ago and spent two months reading before purchasing my first diamond. Time for an upgrade so I’m back to learn more. When I see people recommending Whiteflash and HP Diamonds I was motivated to see what’s so special about them. So I have pages of notes on diamond proportions from those two vendors so I can decide if I want to look for a needle in a haystack or pay the money to have someone else do it for me.

Unfortunately, I see a lot of people come here and say I bought this diamond, what do you think? What they really want to hear is “You did an amazing job! You picked a winner and your significant other is going to be so happy!” This really isn’t the place for that. Any salesperson in America can make you feel good about spending your money. What the people here can help with is making sure you get a great diamond.

If you ask Julia child for recipe advice your going to get a very different perspective than if you ask your college roommate. It all depends on what want to eat for dinner.;)2
 
And often times folks coming here aren't even aware of a super ideal cut stone. This is a diamond education forum so people won't always be patted on the head for choosing a diamond that won't perform as well as another could. People have different criteria for purchasing a diamond and of course the price point is one of the most important. It is always up to the consumer to choose and decide which option is best but the idea of showing them options is a core value to PS.
 
Dancing Fire said:
Not true. My diamond sparkles way more than the $1999 1ct special at Zales...:praise:
Click to expand...

No one suggested that a zales diamond would perform remotely close to a super ideal. No one.
 
scaredofclowns said:
Couldn’t get over the potential issues with 36 crown on diamond 2 after reading up on it and it was hard to ignore the HCA “excellent” (all excellent HCA projection and good size) vs the “very good” (very good and average size) even if I was supposed to only focus on the under 2 passing grade.
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I totally get it. My diamond has all Excellents for the “performance” categories and, while I’ve been told here a million times that it doesn’t matter, it somehow continues to matter to me! IMO if only an overall scored mattered, I don’t know why it isn’t just set up to plug in the numbers and receive 1 score, not have it broken down into categories. If those things don’t matter individually then why even have them. Maybe @Garry H (Cut Nut) will oblige me and further comment. I know everyone here wishes I would give it a rest lol but I’m just curious as to why the separate ratings if they don’t matter!
 
mwilliamanderson said:
[QUOTE="
If you ask Julia child for recipe advice your going to get a very different perspective than if you ask your college roommate. It all depends on what want to eat for dinner.;)2
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Most of the PSers here prefer a filet mignon over a ground beef steak. :bigsmile:
 
headlight said:
I totally get it. My diamond has all Excellents for the “performance” categories and, while I’ve been told here a million times that it doesn’t matter, it somehow continues to matter to me! IMO if only an overall scored mattered, I don’t know why it isn’t just set up to plug in the numbers and receive 1 score, not have it broken down into categories. If those things don’t matter individually then why even have them. Maybe @Garry H (Cut Nut) will oblige me and further comment. I know everyone here wishes I would give it a rest lol but I’m just curious as to why the separate ratings if they don’t matter!
Click to expand...
Maybe you can understand it better compared to car reviews? You may have a truck win best in class and a hybrid car win best in class. Both are top performers, but both have their strengths and weaknesses. The hybrid car isn't able to tow, and the truck doesn't get great gas mileage. Still top cars, but both have their own characteristics.
 
The HCA is helpful with GIA Ex cut stones because it can show where the stone likely will have deficits. What we always aim for is a result of excellent on light return, fire, and scintillation, and very good on spread. A shallow spready stone usually will score lower on some of the other categories.

We tell people to look for 34-35 crown angle and up to 35.5 if the pavilion angle is on the low side (40.6). I have seen a 36 crown angle before with a good ASET image, but I have seen more than show a ring of leakage. I wouldn't even consider a 36 crown angle without an ASET image.

I realize not everyone cares about the perfection of superideal cuts. But why not buy a GIA ex cut stone that will look very close to one?!
 
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