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Hearts and Arrows worth it?

jkheat

Rough_Rock
Joined
Nov 28, 2011
Messages
8
Hi All,

In relation to RB stones, just wondering about Hearts and Arrows diamonds, simple question, can you notice the difference between HnA and an ideal cut stone that is not HnA? As we cannot see the hearts and arrows without the viewer, i guess what we can compare is the visual difference between the stones. So as a broad generalisation, when I went to compare a HnA to a normal ideal cut stone, I couldn't tell any difference between them, thus I would say that the difference is minimum between HnA and normal ideal cut stones. So for me then, I cannot see value in paying more for something I cannot appreciate.

Given the way these HnA are being marketed, I must be missing something. I have assumed the following:
-HnA stones are consistently a better light performing stone in general compared to normal ideal cut stones
-HnA stones can be more appreciated as the size of the diamond gets bigger
-HnA stones are more of a mindclean feature where the fact that the cut is so symmetrical makes you feel good
-HnA stones may only be relatively better performing stones than ideal cut stones but the price reflects the time, cost and effort for that extra few bits of perfection

For discussion, would anyone clarify any of the above and perhaps pass on their opinion on whether they would pay more for a HnA stone and if so under what circumstance?

This will be very insightful for me and I hope it will help me in making my purchase decision. Thank you.
 
jkheat|1323348540|3076981 said:
Hi All,

In relation to RB stones, just wondering about Hearts and Arrows diamonds, simple question, can you notice the difference between HnA and an ideal cut stone that is not HnA? As we cannot see the hearts and arrows without the viewer, i guess what we can compare is the visual difference between the stones. So as a broad generalisation, when I went to compare a HnA to a normal ideal cut stone, I couldn't tell any difference between them, thus I would say that the difference is minimum between HnA and normal ideal cut stones. So for me then, I cannot see value in paying more for something I cannot appreciate.

Given the way these HnA are being marketed, I must be missing something. I have assumed the following:
-HnA stones are consistently a better light performing stone in general compared to normal ideal cut stones
-HnA stones can be more appreciated as the size of the diamond gets bigger
-HnA stones are more of a mindclean feature where the fact that the cut is so symmetrical makes you feel good
-HnA stones may only be relatively better performing stones than ideal cut stones but the price reflects the time, cost and effort for that extra few bits of perfection

For discussion, would anyone clarify any of the above and perhaps pass on their opinion on whether they would pay more for a HnA stone and if so under what circumstance?

This will be very insightful for me and I hope it will help me in making my purchase decision. Thank you.


We're talking strictly about RBs, right? The benefit of high over low optical symmetry is indisputable. The benefit of very high over high optical symmetry is an ongoing debate on here.

I think you have your answer for you right here:
, when I went to compare a HnA to a normal ideal cut stone, I couldn't tell any difference between them, [...] then, I cannot see value in paying more for something I cannot appreciate.

If you're asking if your eyes are missing something obvious, the answer is no - I am the same way, and am very happy with my non-branded RB. But it was a headache to find - there are definitely other good reasons to buy a branded RB: convenience, the surety that you're getting a lovely stone in all ways, a fast and low-stress purchase, the generous guarantees and policies these stones come with, resale value...
 
In my opinion the visual difference is not appreciable in real life from an equivalently proportioned stone having excellent or ideal symmetry.
 
kelpie|1323360649|3077079 said:
In my opinion the visual difference is not appreciable in real life from an equivalently proportioned stone having excellent or ideal symmetry.
i agree but depending on how much more $$$ for the H&A stone with the same grade.
 
Thanks all for your replies:
"convenience, the surety that you're getting a lovely stone in all ways, a fast and low-stress purchase, the generous guarantees and policies these stones come with, resale value..."

That was a very big sticking point. Buying off the internet is a new experience and I think the reliability of a great sparkling diamond does come with the branded HnA.

For my situation, it is hard if not near impossible to look at these diamonds in person due to the logistical reasons. I think paying the premium is almost a value added cost that someone else has looked and verified how good these diamonds are. Based on this and that we are talking about a few thousand (when budget is about 10) over a lifetime where she will constantly look at her diamond, I think it isnt too much of a price to pay.

Having a tough time deciding out of the following:
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2721324.htm
0.84D VS2
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2668679.htm
1.01F SI1
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2676065.htm
1.01G SI1

Would anyone go for a smaller D grade which is 0.4mm smaller than the other 2 when the F and G are comparatively bigger? I am leaning to the F mainly because I have heard a few friends say they wish they had a bigger diamond and would have been happy to sacrifice color. I am thinking the G may provide really good value as it is only 1 colour grade and will save some cash.

But this is based on light performance of each stone been equal... which I cant really tell any difference from the idealscope and ASET images. Would anyone be so kind to point out the differences if any?

Thank you.
 
People generally seem to buy hearts and arrows for symbolic reasons. Then again, people generally are buying diamonds for symbolic reasons so it's not really a giant leap. It's among the least expensive attributes that come with the bragging rights of being the 'best' since there is no such thingas the biggest size and D/IF comes at a BIG premium (also not visible to the unaided eye by the way).
 
I bought H&A just so I wouldn't have to worry since I was not able to see a selection of ideal cut stones in person. But my daughter's e-ring came from WF and is premium select only because polish was excellent instead of ideal, and I can promise you, you can't see any difference! Now I would be open to buying a stone that met ideal cut requirements but did not have perfect hearts. I don't think I could see the difference.

In your case, I would absolutely choose either the F or G 1ct. stones. I would have them pull both and see if they are eyeclean from the top AND sides. I'd buy the cleanest one.
 
I don't get it. Polish is graded excellent by GIA and ideal by AGS. One is not necessarily superior to the other based on grading reports alone. I will grant that the GIA rating is more "relaxed" than AGS standards, but there is no way of knowing what that particular rating meant. Is that a WF-specific rating you are referring-to?
 
MaximusFS|1379427595|3522273 said:
I don't get it. Polish is graded excellent by GIA and ideal by AGS. One is not necessarily superior to the other based on grading reports alone. I will grant that the GIA rating is more "relaxed" than AGS standards, but there is no way of knowing what that particular rating meant. Is that a WF-specific rating you are referring-to?

AGSL grading - EX(1) is one step short of ID(0)

Dunno why you think GIA is more relaxed re. pol/sym - or colour/clarity for that matter, some speculation and a couple of anecdotes and lots of parroting and fear-mongering on here but nothing objective to indicate different metrics/requirements... a couple of isolated historical trends to regroup to match GIA's grading...
Obviously very different cut grading models.
 
OH AGS1 is "excellent". Good to know. Did not know that.
 
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