Flanders, Radiant, HOF Dream, Regents, OH MY!

[Nicrez]

I am seeking a stone that is neither square nor round, but has the squared look, with the brilliance and all of a round brilliant. I started at a princess, but it was too square... the more I read, the more I hear of Radiant (which I like), but now I hear of Hearts on Fire Dream cut square stones, and Flanders, and the Regent. What are the main differences of these?

I looked at The Radiant Cut and HOF Dream

for their precision in cut, since I am a stickler for a lovely stone and perfect angles, but are they worth the premium prices?

If not, what is a good alternative for price? Anyone have any favorites? Any suggestions. The more I learn, the more confused I get! Please let me know your views... THANKS!

 

[icelady]

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On 1/22/2004 12:58:10 PM Nicrez wrote:

... but has the squared look, with the brilliance and all of a round brilliant.

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This sounds like you are describing a Regent!
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On 1/22/2004 12:58:10 PM Nicrez wrote:

... I looked at The Radiant Cut and HOF Dream

for their precision in cut, since I am a stickler for a lovely stone and perfect angles, but are they worth the premium prices?
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I think the only way to tell is to view them!

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On 1/22/2004 12:58:10 PM Nicrez wrote:

...
The more I learn, the more confused I get!
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I felt that way also. It was as though I learned enough to be scary! Do your homework, take every opportunity to see as many different cut styles as you can, and the right one will come along!

 

[aneelcon]

The regents are great stones. Good symmetry and I hear Jonathan is a real sweetheart to work with. He has tons of info on the stones too.

I don't know how the prices are with the regents since they aren't listed on his website.

 

[godiva]

Can I get everybody's opinions on the Dream diamond?
Is it worth the price? They are beautiful but one store was asking for little over $12000 for a carat on a platium setting.

 

[Nicrez]

I just went to Michael C. Fina to see the Dream Diamond, and it is truly brilliant. I saw a 1.22, G color, VVS2 under the Performance scope they had, and it had such perfectly cut facets, excellent polish, and great ratios of the table and depth. Only thing is it was $18K! For that price I could get a similar/better stone at 2.0 c! I am waiting for the price on a 1.75, G, VS1.

I did see a 2.15c, G, SI1, set in a platinum bezel setting (open sides), but it was $34K...NOT worth it.

She compared a Radiant cut stone and it did not have the same fire or brilliance (the Radiant was an F), but it's your money. If you think the perfect, brilliant stone is worth it for a smaller size, but better cut, go for it...If you find in your search that no other stone will do, go for it...but keep looking for that fabulous alternative, you could save a lot of money! Good luck!

 

[godiva]

Yeah, I went to Christian Bernard. They are beautiful but like you I rather get a nicely sized round brilliant for that kind of money. Thanks.

 

[Daniela]

When we were shopping for my engagement ring, we also looked at Regents. We ended up getting an H&A round, but only because we couldn't find my specs in a Regent.

Jonathan told me that the pricing is very comparable to what you would pay for one of his H&A rounds with the same specs, thus, they will be less expensive than the Dream cut. So all you have to do to figure out the ballpark pricing would be the price out a similar round.

And Regents are so stunning! They definitely get my vote. I am still coveting them.

 

[Nicrez]

Anyone have some good dealers for Regents? I am also looking for Radiant dealers, other than The Radiant Cut...

Oddly, I went the other way, instead of round, which to me doean't look right on my finger, I was looking at Princess, but didn't like the sharp corners. Plus the rbilliance of these roundish/square cuts are so much better than the Princess' rectangular cuts!

 

[aneelcon]

why don't you go to jonathan's site:
GOG

 

[icelady]

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On 1/22/2004 3:06:59 PM Nicrez wrote:


She compared a Radiant cut stone and it did not have the same fire or brilliance (the Radiant was an F), but it's your money. ----------------

Hi Nicrez,

I have to ask if your sales person was deliberately showing you a poor example of a non branded radiant to promote the more expensive HOF Dream diamond?

My radiant is an F and has a ton of fire and sparkle (it is 1 to 1.15 length to width)with no visible bow tie and I have a friend who has a more square radiant cut that is an F and it is also firey and sparkly!

I do agree though, that if godiva looks around and still has a burning desire for the HOF Dream diamond, go for it!!

 

[Mara]

From what I know there are only a few jewelers/vendors who carry the Regent line. GOG is one and I think Wink Jones is another. Jonathan at GOG has a bunch of them. Prices are not listed because I believe that the manuf. does not allow it. Anyhow, Regents are priced competitively to similar sized H&A stones. So there IS some markup there in terms of a Regent vs a regular princess stone...but IMO it's worth it! I have a small .37c Regent and I adore it. It's amazing in person.




Also something else to consider is that any type of squared modified stone that is not a typical princess or radiant WILL have some markup associated with it if its branded. That includes stones like Regent, Queen of Hearts, Lucere, Flanders..anything NAMED will have a markup. If you go for something like a radiant with good #'s but no name attached, you will save some $$. But you have to determine what you love the best, because IMO with fancy shapes its not just about the cost: sometimes you CANT get the same thing elsewhere. Not like with a round.

So you end up paying more but you love the stone.




Lastly, the HOF Dream is an amazing stone, I have seen it in person... but IMO not worth the 30-40% markup on it over another branded modified square. For example, if you wanted something like a 1c G VS Regent stone from GOG or similar...chances are you'd pay around $7k or similar. Typical to a H&A round stone. BUT with a HOF 1c G VS Dream stone...you will end up paying around $10k..which is the price we were quoted for one! So not only do you pay a markup....but you pay MORE of a markup than even another H&A rounded square stone! Markup on top of the markup.

Good luck!!

 

[Nicrez]

Hi Icelady, She could have. Her radiant stone was not the best I have seen, but I do have to say the HOF stone is well cut and always a AGS rating of 0, I believe. Can I afford the size stone, and quality stone I want in that cut...NOT FOR $30K! So, I will shop around with the named cuts, Lucere, Regent, Radiant, etc...

Any contact info for Wink Jones? Does anyone have Jonathan's e-mail address at GOG? My computer is not set up with the built-in e-mail at work, so it won't let me e-mail directly, and there seems to have it written in their website anywhere. Thanks for the HELP!

 

[sfbayarea]

nicrez,

just wanted to add my two cents in...one of the big differences that i noticed between the regent and HOF dream stone are that the prior seems to have 12 sides while the latter has 8 when viewed from the table. i personally liked the 8 sided look better and so ended up buying a dream stone. i've heard wonderful things about regents but they just seemed a little bit 'puffier' to me (not sure if that makes sense). overall, i just preferred the unique dream shape and didn't mind paying the premium (though i know there are many on this forum that see no reason to buy a branded, overpriced stone). i ended up with a 1.25 F VS1 and i absolutely love it and can't stop staring at it.

but ultimately, it's really a matter of personal taste and choosing the stone that calls out to you. i was lucky in the sense that i'm not a 'size' girl so it wasn't like i was weighing "should i get the smaller HOF or a bigger regent for the same price?" those are things that you may want to consider in your quest for your perfect stone. if i were you, i'd try to see the different stones that you're considering in person and just see what catches your eye most.

 

[diane5006]

Hi ho...Major Regent fan here...I have seen the dreams as well and they are very lovely...but very pricy...I am a modified square fan (not Princess) and like the looks af them...I find the regent to be the best...i like the great brilliance and the elegant look not toooooo square but with a very unique shape...

You can reach Jonathan at goodoldgold@earthlink.net

They have lots of information on the other square cuts as well

Sorry I don't have too much time to write more...

there is a thread in the "show me the ring" forum that has pictures of Regents set...it is called Regent pics

Best of luck in your search

 

[Nicrez]

Thanks Diane...anyone have any opinions on a radiant vs. regent? are there any price differences? Crown, paviliion angles and percentages difference? THanks for his e-mail address, I will see what I can find out from there. Anyone have Wink Jones' contact info? Thanks!!

 

[godiva]

I love dream diamonds. I can't afford them but I love them.
What is the difference between Dream and Regent cut?

 

[Nicrez]

All I know is that the Dream is purportedly "cut to only the AGS0 standard" where the cuts are the best possible on a modified square with a hearts and arrows type cut. They claim their hand cut angles are more percise than machines. Regents may have higher crown angles (so I was once told, as well as a smaller table, but more facets on top) Anyone can verify this?

 

[Mara]

The Dream also displays H&A patterns, as does the Regent. The Regent claims to be the only square modified with H&A I think...so maybe the Dream doesn't GUARANTEE perfect patterns. I don't really know the specifics.




Anyhow, the Radiant has a different look than the Regent IMO. I think the Regent looks more like a round brilliant in terms of how it captures and returns light to your eye.




We have some Radiant pictures in the Show me the Ring forum...see if you can compare, but best to see in person what a Radiant looks like. May be hard to see a Regent though, due to limited availability. However, I have to say that I was NOT disappointed when I received my Regent after all listening to all the 'hype'. The stones are simply amazing.

Lots of FIRE! I was similarly impressed with the Dream when we saw one, they are very beautiful and lively...but for the difference in price, I would go for the Regent every time.

You definitely don't sacrifice a bit of beauty between the two.

 

[godiva]

Yeah, we've been drooling over the Dream diamond we saw at Christian bernard. But in the end (not that we bought a ring yet), we decided to go for a RB since we can get bigger and better quality stone for the price we would have paid for a dream diamond. Yet, I still have a craving for it. I also saw a similar stone at Finks... but they called it Elara or something like that. Not as pretty as the Dream diamond. How does the price compare between a Regent and a RB?

 

[icelady]

I have both a Round Brilliant and a Radiant cut. If the Regent is more like the RB, as I have heard quite a lot, there is definitely a difference in the type of look. You really need to see them to decide which one is for you.

My RB has beautiful facets (larger that the Radiant) and reflects fire and light (if that makes sense). The Radiant looks like cracked ice, lots of reflection and fire, but different thatn the RB.

 

[MichelleCarmen]

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Lastly, the HOF Dream is an amazing stone, I have seen it in person... but IMO not worth the 30-40% markup on it over another branded modified square. ----------------

I have to vent here. . .

You know what, I just looked online here to see where the closest HOF dealer is and discovered it's a local chain at a maul jewelery store I had just visited the other day. While in there, the sales girl had said, "hi," and i turned and recognized her as the girl who also works in our grocery store deli. She's super sweet so we chatted for quite a while. Turns out she works a whopping ****60 hours**** a week at both jobs to pay the bills. I was amazed and commented that she must be making good money, then. She said, at the deli, yet, at the jewelry store NO!

This just flat out sickens me that these HOF diamonds are so horribly overpriced and yet the sales girls selling them aren't even able to bring home the bacon on the paychecking their getting from pushing these "dreamy stones." That's warped.

I'd NEVER buy a HOF!

Okay, vent over. lol

Michelle

 

[Nicrez]

Michelle, I saw the HOF at Michael C. Fina, also a authorized retailer...trust me, the sales lady who helped me was definately NOT working at a deli. It depends on the Actually Jewelry store...Yes, HOFs are TOP quality, TOP dollar, and higher class, but it doesn't mean the jeweler has ANY class...

If she is young and with little experience, she may have to bear it...but if she tries other places, like car rental shops, etc, she can make more money...Welcome to the US, where you can be a millionaire without a degree or a welfare recipient with a PhD! It's all about opportunity and seeking it...like buying diamonds...and finding a cheap retailer for HOF...anyone?!

 

[MichelleCarmen]

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On 1/23/2004 1:28:49 PM Nicrez wrote:

Michelle, I saw the HOF at Michael C. Fina, also a authorized retailer...trust me, the sales lady who helped me was definately NOT working at a deli. It depends on the Actually Jewelry store...Yes, HOFs are TOP quality, TOP dollar, and higher class, but it doesn't mean the jeweler has ANY class...

If she is young and with little experience, she may have to bear it...but if she tries other places, like car rental shops, etc, she can make more money...Welcome to the US, where you can be a millionaire without a degree or a welfare recipient with a PhD! It's all about opportunity and seeking it...like buying diamonds...and finding a cheap retailer for HOF...anyone?!

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So true! She was younger (early 20s)

I just think if HOF held up to strong standards and had good justification for their overinflated prices, they'd be sure their stones were ONLY being sold by informed sales people, not underpaid deli girls at any old crappy store. . .and believe me, when I saw that this particular jeweler was carrying this line I was floored. It's beyond a doubt, at the lower end of maul jewelers, and has *PINK* as its theme color (lol).

There is NOTHING I've seen that supports purchasing HOF over the other well cut lower cost diamond options!

Michelle

 

[Mara]

Regents are priced about the SAME as a H&A RB.




'Cracked ice' is an excellent analogy on the Radiant look...I was trying to think of a term but could not..that one is perfect.

 

[godiva]

Radiant cuts are more rectangular and Dream and Regent is square, right? Could you describe them as cushion cuts?

 

[Mara]

Godiva..have you seen any pictures of Radiants? Go over to the Show Me the Ring forum and look at some. That will definitely help you figure out the differences. Look at pictures of Regents (Also in that same forum) and HOF stones, on the HOF website. Hopefully that will give you an idea of what the differences are.




Some people tend to note that the Regent is like a modern cushion. I don't think the HOF Dream can really be construed as the same look.




Radiants can be square or rectangular.

 

[valeria101]

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On 1/23/2004 12:22:11 PM Mara wrote:


The Dream also displays H&A patterns, as does the Regent. The Regent claims to be the only square modified with H&A I think...so maybe the Dream doesn't GUARANTEE perfect patterns.
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The Dream has harts on the back but no arrows on the front, but yes, they do guarantee the hart pattern and excellent symmetry, as well as optics... The Regent and the Dream seem to have the same philisophy to me: a square with the thrill of an ideal round.
Hope there will be some price war between these one day... and that the Regent would have looked more square than it does now. QOHs fit that bill though. Did anyone mention the Queen of Harts cut lately? It surely deserves it.

 

[godiva]

Geese.. talking about the Dream diamonds again is making me want it even more. What's a QQ cut Valerie?

 

[valeria101]

QOH.. it is a cut developed in the same time withe the Regent. I only know one distributor for it (which does not mean there are no more of them). It seems to have a Regent's pavilion but a different crown, which makes it look more square. Here's one.

 

[valeria101]

Sorry Jonathan, I just could not help post this!