shape
carat
color
clarity

First time diamond shopper -- 2 carrots

AdaBeta27

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
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Sep 7, 2004
Messages
950
Strong blue fluorescence combined with low price indicates it might be an "overblue" that looks hazy or milky. ( Comments: Additional clouds, pinpoints and internal graining are not shown. Even though it's VS1 it might be hazy all over, or at least I think it could be.)

HCA score 4.9 is bad. It's a rejection tool to estimate light return and cut quality. You want score 2 or less.
https://www.pricescope.com/tools/hca
Poor cut is not something that you want.
4.9 - Good - Only if price is your main criterion

GIA grade is "excellent." but GIA excellent is more generous that AGS 000 and does include some stones that Pricescope jewelers generally regard as inferior cut.
 

motownmama

Ideal_Rock
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7,941
Best of luck with your search! I'm sure some experts will be chiming in to help you. In the meantime, please don't think I'm being a jerk, but "carrot" is a vegetable - you mean "carat"
 

AdaBeta27

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Sep 7, 2004
Messages
950
Read a thread on here called "cheat sheet for rounds." Also read NiceIce.com, Diamond Education, The Fast Track. Those will give you a summary of what to look for. Or at least what Pricescope considers to be the peak performing RBs. Not saying that you can't buy "very good" cut grade or and Old European Cut or whatever else you might prefer.

AGS 000 stones, generally you don't need to bother running the HCA cut adviser. GIA, probably do it. EGL, some of those reports can be "soft" or inflated by 1-2 or even 3 grades on either color or clarity or both. Beware of any EGL stone that has great paper and a price too good to be true. Generally you get what you pay for with diamonds.
 

asphaltmixer

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 9, 2015
Messages
9
motownmama|1449672155|3959339 said:
Best of luck with your search! I'm sure some experts will be chiming in to help you. In the meantime, please don't think I'm being a jerk, but "carrot" is a vegetable - you mean "carat"

Thanks! I must be having a horrible cases of the monday. Carat not Carrot :D :D
 

telephone89

Ideal_Rock
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Aug 29, 2014
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The JA is a pretty great price. It does have a brownish/gray tinge, vs a yellow tint (I personally prefer this, but many do not). I think it might be eyeclean, given that the inclusions are not dark.

Also, I might be crazy, but I swear I see a tiny culet (even though the GIA says none), and I kind of love that! I see the kozibe in the close up photo, probably not visible IRL.
 

asphaltmixer

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 9, 2015
Messages
9
Thanks for the reply!! I'm going to bite the bullet and buy this one later tonight. My hope is that this is the best I can get for the price
 

Rockinruby

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Joined
Dec 27, 2013
Messages
2,740
asphaltmixer|1449681508|3959395 said:
Thanks for the reply!! I'm going to bite the bullet and buy this one later tonight. My hope is that this is the best I can get for the price

Op, please ask JA about the inclusions and whether eyeclean, durability or clouds are an issue. :wavey:
 

Diamond_Hawk

Brilliant_Rock
Trade
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Apr 8, 2014
Messages
1,227
asphaltmixer,

In regard to all diamonds (I cannot comment on this particular selection) - Anytime a diamond is graded at I or SI clarity (particularly larger diamonds 1.5+carat) it is a great idea to ask a gemologist to verify that it is eye-clean before purchase - some are , many are not. Most vendors on PS will be able to do that in-house before shipping the diamond to you.

Best wishes.
 

ringo865

Ideal_Rock
Premium
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Feb 14, 2014
Messages
2,656
Even though the inclusions are detailed on the report, you may not see them in real life with your naked eye. That's what is called "eye clean". SI1 and SI2 stones may be eye clean or they may have eye visible inclusions. Ask JA And they can tell you whether this particular stone is eye clean. While some stones may have eye visible inclusions, if they'd clear like a crystal or white like a feather, those may be harder to see, or could be in a location that can be covered by a prong. Also an ideal cut stone can disguise some inclusions just by the vast amount of light play.

Some people will get a stone even if it's not eye clean at 6 inches or 12. Some people don't want to see any inclusions, ever, even under magnification. I have vs2 and an si2 eye clean at 6 inches, and I love them both (and want more).
 

asphaltmixer

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 9, 2015
Messages
9
the representative said the diamond is eye clean but i should examine it closer when I receive to see if it is up to my satisfaction.

unrelated to the actual gemstone, is getting the setting from jamesallen advisable vs going to the diamond district in NYC?
 

VRBeauty

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Apr 2, 2006
Messages
10,489
telephone89|1449678967|3959380 said:
The JA is a pretty great price. It does have a brownish/gray tinge, vs a yellow tint (I personally prefer this, but many do not). I think it might be eyeclean, given that the inclusions are not dark.

Also, I might be crazy, but I swear I see a tiny culet (even though the GIA says none), and I kind of love that! I see the kozibe in the close up photo, probably not visible IRL.

I think you're right about the culet! You can see it reflected in some angles when you use the 360 viewer, particularly early in the rotation.
 

telephone89

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Aug 29, 2014
Messages
3,931
VRBeauty|1449695577|3959489 said:
telephone89|1449678967|3959380 said:
The JA is a pretty great price. It does have a brownish/gray tinge, vs a yellow tint (I personally prefer this, but many do not). I think it might be eyeclean, given that the inclusions are not dark.

Also, I might be crazy, but I swear I see a tiny culet (even though the GIA says none), and I kind of love that! I see the kozibe in the close up photo, probably not visible IRL.

I think you're right about the culet! You can see it reflected in some angles when you use the 360 viewer, particularly early in the rotation.
I love a culet, so I think it's wonderful. I'm glad I'm not crazy!!
 

telephone89

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Aug 29, 2014
Messages
3,931
asphaltmixer|1449693608|3959475 said:
the representative said the diamond is eye clean but i should examine it closer when I receive to see if it is up to my satisfaction.

unrelated to the actual gemstone, is getting the setting from jamesallen advisable vs going to the diamond district in NYC?
Are you in NY? You can certainly go have a look. You can even take your diamond there and do some comparison shopping. JA has a generous return policy, so you'll have time to really look at it and decide for yourself.
 

asphaltmixer

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 9, 2015
Messages
9
Yup, my office is a few blocks away from the 47th st diamond shops. Is it advisable to bring the diamond when shopping?
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,198
Round diamond 101:

The entire purpose of faceting a diamond is to reflect light.
How well or how poorly a diamond does this determines how beautiful it is.
How well a diamond performs is determined by the angles and cutting. This is why we say cut is king.
No other factor: not color, not clarity has as much of an impact on the appearance of a diamond as its cut. An ideal H will out white a poorly cut F. And GIA Ex is not enough.
So how to we ensure that we have the right angles and cutting to get the light performance we want? Well, we have tools to help you with that. But that is not enough.
What you need after that is a way to check actual light performance of your actual stone.
That's what an idealscope image does. https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/firescope-idealscope
It shows you how and wear your diamond is reflecting light, how well it is going at it, and where you are losing light return. That is why you won't see us recommending Blue Nile, as they do not provide idealscope images for their diamonds. All our best vendors do though.

Now if you want to skip all that... stick to AGS0 stones and then all you have to do is pick color and clarity and you know you have a great performing diamond. Because AGS has already done the checking for you. That's why they trade at a premium. With AGS0 stones you don't strictly need an idealscope image. But getting one is nice to confirm performance and that is why almost all our best vendors provide them for you. Not all AGS0's are created the same though, so if you want to make sure it's the very best cut, post it and we'll evaluate it for you.

Generally you will want a table 60% or less. A depth between 59 and 62.4. Crown angle 33.5-36. Pavilion Angle: 40.6-41 (there is a little give on this)

And the crown and pavilion angles must be complimentary which is what the HCA does for you.

ON COLOR:

It is important to remember is that color is graded FACE DOWN. Where there is NO light return. Not face up where there is light return and refraction. You wear diamonds set. FACE UP.

Within one color grade, even the labs can't agree on the color grades of stones and something could be a "high" H or a "low" E. So... no. Not really. Within 2 color grades it is hard. Not impossible. But very hard. And it gets harder once set. If you are talking ideal rounds, or any stone with ideal light return and no sharp corners it gets harder still because the ideal light return masks body color.

Generally we say to be conservative stay above H in a round. But MANY people have happily bought white I or even J diamonds when trying to eek out a little more size.

This is how I think of it.

Ever gotten one of those HUGE paint fan decks? Where there are literally 100s of colors of whites? And when they are RIGHT next to each other you can TOTALLY tell that one is bluer/colder and one is a bit warmer and which one is one is TOTALLY warmer. One there's one that's slightly greener. One that's slightly pinker? But really. They are all white?

Then you pick one after agonizing over this white or that white and when it's on the walls and people are like: Oh. You painted again. And it's STILL white. Great.

And you're all... BUT it's BLUE white. Or it's a WARM white now. It used to be ____ white. It's TOTALLY different.

It's like that. You are talking about shades of white. D is colder... J is warmer. But it's all white.

YES. If you have an accurately graded F and an H THAT HAVE THE SAME PERFORMANCE you are going to be able to tell them apart when you compare them. Just like you would be able to tell if you painted your walls a warm white, but painted the crown molding a cold/straight white. But both are STILL white.


I want you notice all the qualifiers thought. I'm talking about stones with the SAME performance. An ideal H will out white an F that has compromised light performance from a poor cut.

NOTHING impacts the appearance of a diamond as much as cut. CUT is king.

You want the shinest whitest and brightest diamond out there: Cut is King. No other factor, not color or clarity or anything else impacts how white bright an shiny a stone is.

ON CLARITY:
http://www.goodoldgold.com/4Cs/Clarity/SI/ and http://www.goodoldgold.com/4Cs/Clarity/VS/ Generally we say that eyeclean SI1 and VS2 are as high as you need to go with round brilliants.


Okay?
 

asphaltmixer

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 9, 2015
Messages
9
Gypsy|1449711041|3959616 said:
Round diamond 101:

The entire purpose of faceting a diamond is to reflect light.
How well or how poorly a diamond does this determines how beautiful it is.
How well a diamond performs is determined by the angles and cutting. This is why we say cut is king.
No other factor: not color, not clarity has as much of an impact on the appearance of a diamond as its cut. An ideal H will out white a poorly cut F. And GIA Ex is not enough.
So how to we ensure that we have the right angles and cutting to get the light performance we want? Well, we have tools to help you with that. But that is not enough.
What you need after that is a way to check actual light performance of your actual stone.
That's what an idealscope image does. https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/firescope-idealscope
It shows you how and wear your diamond is reflecting light, how well it is going at it, and where you are losing light return. That is why you won't see us recommending Blue Nile, as they do not provide idealscope images for their diamonds. All our best vendors do though.

Now if you want to skip all that... stick to AGS0 stones and then all you have to do is pick color and clarity and you know you have a great performing diamond. Because AGS has already done the checking for you. That's why they trade at a premium. With AGS0 stones you don't strictly need an idealscope image. But getting one is nice to confirm performance and that is why almost all our best vendors provide them for you. Not all AGS0's are created the same though, so if you want to make sure it's the very best cut, post it and we'll evaluate it for you.

Generally you will want a table 60% or less. A depth between 59 and 62.4. Crown angle 33.5-36. Pavilion Angle: 40.6-41 (there is a little give on this)

And the crown and pavilion angles must be complimentary which is what the HCA does for you.

ON COLOR:

It is important to remember is that color is graded FACE DOWN. Where there is NO light return. Not face up where there is light return and refraction. You wear diamonds set. FACE UP.

Within one color grade, even the labs can't agree on the color grades of stones and something could be a "high" H or a "low" E. So... no. Not really. Within 2 color grades it is hard. Not impossible. But very hard. And it gets harder once set. If you are talking ideal rounds, or any stone with ideal light return and no sharp corners it gets harder still because the ideal light return masks body color.

Generally we say to be conservative stay above H in a round. But MANY people have happily bought white I or even J diamonds when trying to eek out a little more size.

This is how I think of it.

Ever gotten one of those HUGE paint fan decks? Where there are literally 100s of colors of whites? And when they are RIGHT next to each other you can TOTALLY tell that one is bluer/colder and one is a bit warmer and which one is one is TOTALLY warmer. One there's one that's slightly greener. One that's slightly pinker? But really. They are all white?

Then you pick one after agonizing over this white or that white and when it's on the walls and people are like: Oh. You painted again. And it's STILL white. Great.

And you're all... BUT it's BLUE white. Or it's a WARM white now. It used to be ____ white. It's TOTALLY different.

It's like that. You are talking about shades of white. D is colder... J is warmer. But it's all white.

YES. If you have an accurately graded F and an H THAT HAVE THE SAME PERFORMANCE you are going to be able to tell them apart when you compare them. Just like you would be able to tell if you painted your walls a warm white, but painted the crown molding a cold/straight white. But both are STILL white.


I want you notice all the qualifiers thought. I'm talking about stones with the SAME performance. An ideal H will out white an F that has compromised light performance from a poor cut.

NOTHING impacts the appearance of a diamond as much as cut. CUT is king.

You want the shinest whitest and brightest diamond out there: Cut is King. No other factor, not color or clarity or anything else impacts how white bright an shiny a stone is.

ON CLARITY:
http://www.goodoldgold.com/4Cs/Clarity/SI/ and http://www.goodoldgold.com/4Cs/Clarity/VS/ Generally we say that eyeclean SI1 and VS2 are as high as you need to go with round brilliants.


Okay?


Thanks so much for taking the time to help me through this. So if the diamond for JA (http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/2.00-carat-i-color-si2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-612716) is eye-clean, it should be fine given the BCA score? The diamond is an I and SI2, so I think that is on the cusp of your rating but has an excellent cut which should offer a good shine
 

solgen

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Apr 10, 2015
Messages
563
asphaltmixer|1449693608|3959475 said:
the representative said the diamond is eye clean but i should examine it closer when I receive to see if it is up to my satisfaction.

unrelated to the actual gemstone, is getting the setting from jamesallen advisable vs going to the diamond district in NYC?

First, it sounds like it isn't eye clean. By conventional definition it might be in a static view at a distance of say 18". Maybe at 12" or closer its not. Also you might notice some transparency issues when you tilt the diamond a bit. I say this because I've received similar ones and they may have been eye clean by industry definition. But if you viewed them how you might when worn on your finger then they clearly were not.

You could go to the diamond district to see what settings are available. I wouldn't necessarily bring the diamond as they'll probably try to sour you on it and coerce you to purchase one from them.
 

asphaltmixer

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 9, 2015
Messages
9
To give everyone an update and a happy ending:

I received the diamond today. The stone looks great from the, very eye clean, can't see any inclusions. from the side and bottom, some of the inclusions are noticable. looks very clear and white from teh top, but from the bottom there is a slight yellowish tint.

otherwise very happy with the diamond. I just wish it wasn't so expensive.

Now off to find the right setting!
 

cinnamonstick

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jun 14, 2009
Messages
572
Awesome! Good luck! I just bought a 2ct SI2 also. Boy was that an ordeal to find "the one" (appearently, I am sensitive to all 4 Cs lol). Had a custom setting made by ID Jewelry (who also found my 2ct). I totally recommend them! I will be posting pictures and write up shortly if you're curious. Meantime good luck with your setting! And congrats!
 
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