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EGL TORONTO

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Greatcall

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 5, 2002
Messages
68
I heard EGL opened an office in Toronto. Now we have IGI and EGL which one is better???????? If I am looking to sell diamonds to the U.S via the net which lab should we use to grade the diamonds?
 

barry

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Mar 21, 2001
Messages
441
EGL-Toronto is the branch office of EGL-New York.
This office has been recently set up by Sharon, the very
capable EGL-New York Supervisor.

I would like to see diamond samples of the Toronto graders
before making further comments regarding their
accuracy and consistency.
You might want to submit several diamonds that
you have already graded internally or received
GIA or AGS reports and use this as a basis for comparison.
As with any new venture, you need to give it time to settle
in and develop a rhythm and track record.

As Canada has a dearth of competent,
capable, and accurate grading labs,
the arrival of EGL-New York to Toronto is
welcome and a possible boon to
Canadian diamond consumers.

Time will tell.

Keep us posted.

Barry
www.superbcert.com
 

Greatcall

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 5, 2002
Messages
68
Thankyou for your response. My question still remains which lab does the U.S Market respect more EGL or IGI. The reason I ask is because they both have better turn around times than other local labs here in Toronto.


The feeling we get that given the right price people will Buy a EGL or IGI cert versus GIA. Is this true your input would be appreciated.
 

barry

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Mar 21, 2001
Messages
441
Although there is variability between the EGL labs here in the
States, overall their accuracy and consistency is superior to
that of IGI. So you will have positive carryover from the
EGL name. But, as I said before give them a little time
to get settled in and test a reasonable sample of round and
fancy shapes against your internal classification as well
as GIA & AGS reports.

Barry
www.superbcert.com
 

trichrome

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Dec 9, 2002
Messages
397
I must say that there is a total lack of adequate equipment here
in Canada... only 2 Sarin machines in Montreal!

Trichrome.
 

Greatcall

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 5, 2002
Messages
68
We have a Megascope machine. That is just as good as the Sarin Machine. I know of 3 other companies that have the Megascope. Your field is very narrow.
 

Greatcall

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 5, 2002
Messages
68
I just got back 5 stones from EGL.

here are the specs first is the HRD the second EGL

1.00 VS 1 G VS 2 G
0.95 SI 1 G SI 1 G
0.96 SI 1 H SI 1 H
1.05 VS 2 F VS 2 F
0.97 SI 1 F SI 1 F

As you can see they are just as accurate as HRD. We bought the stones from Belgium based on the HRD cert. So EGL here in Toronto is just as strict as HRD. I have looked at the stones myself and I have agreed with all the specs HRD had given. I have also seen some stones from EGL USA, i dont know if it was LA or New York but they were just awful I1 stones graded as SI 1. So maybe knowing how strict the grading here is in Canada EGL is trying to adapt the same strict guidelines.

Anyone else have any experience with EGL Toronto??????????

Can someone please help. If EGL is inferior to GIA (and as we all know HRd is just as strict as GIA) how can I sell EGL cert stones for -40 when my cost is higher than that. Which leads me to the fact that EGL USA is lot more relaxed than EGL Toronto.
 

trichrome

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Dec 9, 2002
Messages
397
Greatcall,


Toronto is way bigger than Montreal! lol

Are you saying that you bought over -40%off Rap?

Was this for Ideal cuts or very good cuts?

You can get some vg cuts for 60-50% off Rap...it depends on the parcel.

Also, why are you trying to get those stones cert by EGL ? You already
have the HRD cert... it's more than enough.

Trichrome.
 

Giangi

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 23, 2003
Messages
2,530
They seem to be really excellent from the data you posted!! HRD is somewhat stricter than GIA at the moment, so they seem to be pretty accurate. EGL NY isn't that good, though.
 

Greatcall

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 5, 2002
Messages
68
Can you please let me know where I can but GIA or HRD @ -50 or -60 I am ready to buy COD

Thanks
 

barry

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Mar 21, 2001
Messages
441
It's really great to see that EGL-Toronto
compares very favorably with HRD. Big
plus for consumers.

Gemscan? Forget it.

Barry
www.superbcert.com
 

Greatcall

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 5, 2002
Messages
68
I would like to sell these stones on the net to US customers. I dont't think they would recognize Gemscan in Alabam or Arkansas. Plus they use the AGS system of cutting so a stone could read VG VG have 61% table , 11.5 crown 45 pavillion and 2.5 girdle they might give it medium cut. In any other market they would have already gone bankrupt from the lack of business. But good Old Canadians love to make things more difficult for themselves.

No wonder the Canadian jewellery industry is such a joke.
 

Greatcall

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 5, 2002
Messages
68
Im still waiting for an answer where i can purchase HRD VG VG @ -50 or -60. I have notified my bank manager he is ready to wire the money to your account.
 

barry

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Mar 21, 2001
Messages
441
I think you'll do very well with EGL-Toronto if they
have these strict grading standards.
EGL is a known "brand" here in the States.

Here is an idea for you:

Since there is variability in EGL labs here in the States,
you need to eliminate the perception that EGL-TO
is not top-notch. Perhaps you send these same 5 diamonds
to GIA or AGS. If they grade like HRD/EGL-TO you are in
very good position as GIA and AGS have a much stronger
"name" recognition here among consumers than does HRD.
It will make your marketing and selling much stronger.

Best of Luck to you.

Barry
www.superbcert.com
 

Greatcall

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 5, 2002
Messages
68
Thank you for your reply. However there are some big issuses to be considered to send stones to GIA or AGS.

1. Duties and tax problems when they ship back to us
2. Turn around time (2-3 weeks time)

That is why i wanted to get some of the US people's opinion on what do to. My understanding of it is that EGL is widely accepted as 2 or 3rd among certs. And IGI would be 4th. So if IGI and EGL are just as strict here i have no hopes of making my diamonds look attractive enough to sell.
 

barry

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Mar 21, 2001
Messages
441
Greatcall;

Perhaps I did not make myself clear. I do not
recommend that you send all your goods all the time
to GIA/AGS; I agree the costs are too prohibitive.
Just take the 5 diamonds that you have HRD and EGL/TO
reports and SEND THOSE to either GIA or AGS
to serve as a basis for comparison. If the GIA/AGS
reports confirm the HRD you have a solid foundation
with which to garner the confidence of the
American diamond public in the EGL-TO certificates
accuracy.

Barry
www.superbcert.com
 

Greatcall

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 5, 2002
Messages
68
Thanks barry. I will try that. With all the Canadian customs and duties, I should have response within a year or so.

 

barry

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Mar 21, 2001
Messages
441
We ship to Canada on a very regular basis.
It's actually pretty smooth.

Barry
www.superbcert.com
 

trichrome

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Dec 9, 2002
Messages
397
Greatcall,

Are you talking about Ideal Cuts?
Is so, it's impossible to find them at 50% off Rap ... of course ...
However If you're in the market to find stones between 0.90 and 1.20 D-H, VS qualilty,
I know someone who's trying to sell many of them (dozens) in Montreal.
However you won't have necesseraly 50-60% off them since you need to buy
closer to the source. Most of them are very good cuts but Ideals are rare in this lot.

Trichrome.
 

trichrome

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Dec 9, 2002
Messages
397
I do also agree with Barry,

Forget about GemScan......it's simply incredible!!!

I've seen some ... well...hmm....disgusting stones...received a "good cut" on paper...
also they are very lenient on clarity evaluation..... I'm not even talking about color or
fluo.

Doing diamond business here in Canada is very difficult unless you keep most
of your diamonds on the American soil.....and still operate from Toronto for example..
otherwise, if you plan to keep your stones in canada, isn't it bette & easierr to sell them
here?

Trichrome.
 

Giangi

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 23, 2003
Messages
2,530
Have you sent the stones to IGI Antwerp or New York?
 

Rhino

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Mar 28, 2001
Messages
6,275
That is good news GC concerning EGL in TO. A word of advice though ...

The American market is not too fond of EGL reports (among those that research it) as most EGL stones that are graded here in America tend to be liberal. From our suppliers, EGL diamonds are generally always cheaper than their GIA/AGS graded stones. So if EGL TO is a conservative lab you will want to point this out to your clients and specifically show them on your website the example stones that are both HRD and EGL stones and how accurate/conservative ELG TO actually is. Becuaes if you don't point out this fact people will just go on your site ... see EGL certs and assume that they are also liberally graded stones. It would be wise to point out this fact and demonstrate it with the stones you've already bought that were HRD and show/compare them to the EGO TO lab.

I have not had experience with the GemScan Lab grading of round brilliant cuts so I cannot give you an educated opinion to their cut grading parameters. I have both seen and purchased princess cuts that were graded by GemScan and so far no problems (except for the rejects I turn down personally because of cut parameters). After checking the clarities and colors on the princess cuts I've analyzed from GemScan I have not run into any problems worth noting. Barry seems to be familiar with inspecting rounds that came from GemScan though. Barry ... how many rounds (roughly) have you seen come from this lab and what are your findings at to their clarity/color/cut grading for the ones you've personally seen? Curious.

Kind regards,
Rhino
 

Allison

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 25, 2003
Messages
2
Rhino: You mentioned there are people doing "research" on grading reports. Can you tell me your source?

Thanks,
Allison
 

Rhino

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Mar 28, 2001
Messages
6,275
GreatCall... the starter of this thread. He has purchased 5 stones that were already had HRD Reports. He was researching how accurate EGL Toronto was in relation to the grading of HRD which is more conservative. His research shows they are consistent. I have not done this myself as I primarily only deal with GIA/AGS graded stones so I'm interested to hear about this and GREATCALL'S research.

Peace,
Rhino
 

Greatcall

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 5, 2002
Messages
68
The five stones that I sent to GIA have given the same result as EGL Toronto. Is that suprising? I am not familiar with EGL ( i guess i will be soon).
 

Greatcall

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 5, 2002
Messages
68
I just wanted to update you on the stones i sent to GIA

the results are as follows:

1.00 VS 1 G VS 2 G
0.95 SI 1 G SI 1 G
0.96 SI 1 H SI 1 H
1.05 VS 2 F VS 2 F
0.97 SI 1 F SI 1 F

Same as EGL Toronto. Is that surprising to you guys.

Your input is very much appreciated.
 
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