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E-ring help/opinions (diamond comparison)

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ukjeeper21

Rough_Rock
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Apr 15, 2009
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4
Hello all. I am going to Tiffany''s (yeah I know I can find cheaper and better quality diamonds online but I''ve come to terms with this and am willing to pay the markup price) this weekend to look at some e-rings for my girlfriend. Listed below are the diamond attributes and prices I received from the sales associates. I''m awaiting a response from the sales associates for more specific diamond specs (ie depth, pavillion angle, etc).

I was wondering if I could get your opinions on these rings based on these initial specs. The cut (round brilliant), polish, and symetry are all "excellent". Her ring size is either a 6.25 or 6.5 and my current budget is $14K.


1.27 carats, H color, VS1 clarity for $13,500
1.30 carats, H color, VS1 clarity for $13,800
1.33 carats, H color VS2 clarity for $13,000
1.41 carats, H color, VS2 clarity for $14,000
1.38 carats, H color, VS2 clarity for $13,800 (has a "very good" polish)


This is the criteria I used initally:

Cut: Excellent
Carat size: Between 1.0-1.5
Clarity: VS2 or better
Color: H or better
Polish: Excellent
Symmetry: Excellent
Cutlet: None
Fluorescence: None
Griddle: Medium to slightly thick


Thanks all for your advice....
John
 

Lorelei

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 30, 2005
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42,064
Date: 4/15/2009 7:07:05 PM
Author:ukjeeper21
Hello all. I am going to Tiffany's (yeah I know I can find cheaper and better quality diamonds online but I've come to terms with this and am willing to pay the markup price) this weekend to look at some e-rings for my girlfriend. Listed below are the diamond attributes and prices I received from the sales associates. I'm awaiting a response from the sales associates for more specific diamond specs (ie depth, pavillion angle, etc).
Hi John,

Thats fine if you value the Tiffany name and don't mind paying the mark up, don't let anyone put you off. Some ladies dream of Tiffany all their lives! Some DO value the name highly. I can't tell much from the info given but if you post the depth, table, crown and pavilion angles, pavilion depth, girdle thickness, diameter, polish and symmetry - then I will take a look and try to help. What I would say at this stage is to consider the VS2 clarities, as these should be eyeclean and you can get a bigger diamond for the money if you prefer.
 

Daisi2112

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jan 5, 2009
Messages
356
Hello! Yes, I agree with Lorelei, go for vs2, they are eyeclean and you can get a bigger stone with that clarity rating.
 

vespergirl

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 29, 2007
Messages
5,497
All the diamonds at Tiffany are gorgeous. I would go for the H VS2 1.4 ct. Your girlfriend will love it, congrats!
 

LadyBlue

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Mar 14, 2009
Messages
1,616
If all of them are excellent cut diamonds, I will go for the biggest one
 

ukjeeper21

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 15, 2009
Messages
4
Thanks all for the responses. I really appreciate your input. Is there a noticeable difference between the 1.41, 1.33 and 1.30...or even a VS2 vs VS1?

Any tips on what to look for or what questions to ask when I go to Tiffany''s this weekend?

Here are the additional specs for each ring. Do you all still recommend the larger carat ring?


CARAT WEIGHT 1.41 CARATS
MEASUREMENTS 7.18 - 7.19 x 4.48 mm
COLOR GRADE H
FLUORESCENCE NONE
PRECISION OF CUT EXCELLENT
SYMMETRY EXCELLENT
POLISH EXCELLENT
CLARITY GRADE VS2
TOTAL DEPTH PERCENTAGE 62.4% PAVILION ANGLE 40.8°
TABLE SIZE PERCENTAGE 56% LOWER HALF LENGTH PERCENTAGE 80%
CROWN HEIGHT PERCENTAGE 15.9% GIRDLE THICKNESS MEDIUM
CROWN ANGLE 35.3° GIRDLE FINISH FACETED
STAR LENGTH PERCENTAGE 50% CULET NONE
PAVILION DEPTH PERCENTAGE 43.1%


CARAT WEIGHT 1.33 CARATS
MEASUREMENTS 7.18 - 7.21 x 4.28 mm
COLOR GRADE H
FLUORESCENCE NONE
PRECISION OF CUT EXCELLENT
SYMMETRY EXCELLENT
POLISH EXCELLENT
CLARITY GRADE VS2
TOTAL DEPTH PERCENTAGE 59.5% PAVILION ANGLE 40.9°
TABLE SIZE PERCENTAGE 60% LOWER HALF LENGTH PERCENTAGE 80%
CROWN HEIGHT PERCENTAGE 13.8% GIRDLE THICKNESS THIN TO MEDIUM
CROWN ANGLE 34.3° GIRDLE FINISH FACETED
STAR LENGTH PERCENTAGE 55% CULET NONE
PAVILION DEPTH PERCENTAGE 43.2%

CARAT WEIGHT 1.30 CARATS
MEASUREMENTS 6.99 - 7.04 x 4.28 mm
COLOR GRADE H
FLUORESCENCE NONE
PRECISION OF CUT EXCELLENT
SYMMETRY EXCELLENT
POLISH EXCELLENT
CLARITY GRADE VS1
TOTAL DEPTH PERCENTAGE 61.0% PAVILION ANGLE 40.8°
TABLE SIZE PERCENTAGE 58% LOWER HALF LENGTH PERCENTAGE 75%
CROWN HEIGHT PERCENTAGE 14.7% GIRDLE THICKNESS MEDIUM TO SLIGHTLY THICK
CROWN ANGLE 34.8° GIRDLE FINISH FACETED
STAR LENGTH PERCENTAGE 50% CULET NONE
PAVILION DEPTH PERCENTAGE 43.1%


 

ukjeeper21

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 15, 2009
Messages
4
Ok so I ran the rings numbers through the HCA tool and got the following results...

Ring 1 (1.41 ct)
HCA score: 2.2
Light Return: Very Good
Fire: Very Good
Scintilation: Very Good
Spread: Very Good

Ring 2 (1.33ct)
Light Return: Very Good
Fire: Very Good
Scintilation: Very Good
Spread: Excellent

Ring 3 (1.30ct)
Light Return: Excellent
Fire: Excellent
Scintilation: Excellent
Spread: Very Good


So I''m a little confused
If all three rings have an "excellent" cut,polish and symetry which I assume is a good thing based on what I''ve read on the forum, why are the results of ring 1&2 over of 2. Is it because of the clarity? That''s the only thing I noticed that were different. Should I even be concerned with this?

Will someone please shed some light on this.

Thanks!
John
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 11, 2006
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55,981
Well, guess what? The cut of these stones does not meet the standards for the super-ideal cuts we generally see around here on a daily basis. I originally would have picked the 1.41, but it is the same size as the 1.33 due to being too deep! The 1.30 has the best cut numbers, but seriously, I wouldn't pay the price for that stone when you could get one even better cut and larger for less money. Clarity has nothing to do with the cut advisor scores.

As much as I'd like to have a Tiffany ring, I wouldn't settle for any of these. I'd want closer to the 1.4 but I'd want my cut numbers to line up with ideal cut. Here are some parameters:

table 54-57 (58 is okay)

depth 60-62

crown angle 34-35

pavilion angle 40.6- 41.0

The stones posted by Stone Cold from WhiteFlash are great examples of true ideal cut stones.
 

Lorelei

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 30, 2005
Messages
42,064
As you prefer to stick to Tiffany, out of the diamonds you listed I would look at the second and third ones, the first I would pass on.

You could also see if they have any diamonds which fall within these guidelines.

depth - 60 - 62% - although my personal preference is to allow up to 62.4%
table - 54- 57%
crown angle - 34- 35 degrees
pavilion angle - 40.6- 41 degrees
girdle - avoid extremes, look for thin to slightly thick, thin to medium etc
polish and symmetry - very good and above

note - with crown and pavilion angles at the shallower ends ( CA 34- PA 40.6) and steeper ( CA 35- PA 41) check to make sure these angles complement in that particular diamond - eyeballs, Idealscope, trusted vendor input - check as appropriate!


As the above implies, configurations depend on each other. A little give here can still work with a little take there.


From expert John Pollard.


With that said, here's a "Cliff's Notes" for staying near Tolkowsky/ideal angles with GIA reports (their numbers are rounded): A crown angle of 34.0, 34.5 or 35.0 is usually safe with a 40.8 pavilion angle. If pavilion angle = 40.6 lean toward a 34.5-35.0 crown. If pavilion angle = 41 lean toward a 34.0-34.5 crown.


GIA "EX" in cut is great at its heart, but it ranges a bit wider than some people prefer, particularly in deep combinations (pavilion > 41 with crown > 35).


 

ukjeeper21

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 15, 2009
Messages
4
So I took everyone''s advice and had the sales associate search the database for a better ring. I''ve narrowed my search down to the following 2 rings and would like to get your opinion on them. Ring 2 cost $1500 more than Ring 1. I also have a couple questions:

a. Does a lower HCA score mean its a better quality ring?
b. Which of these rings will show more sparkle?
c. Can you visually tell the difference between the two when compared side to side?
d. Is Ring 2 worth the extra money?
e. Ladies....which ring would you want?

Ring 1
CARAT WEIGHT 1.24 CARATS
MEASUREMENTS 6.86 - 6.88 x 4.28 mm
COLOR GRADE H
FLUORESCENCE NONE
PRECISION OF CUT EXCELLENT
SYMMETRY EXCELLENT
POLISH EXCELLENT
CLARITY GRADE VS1
TOTAL DEPTH PERCENTAGE 62.3% PAVILION ANGLE 40.9°
TABLE SIZE PERCENTAGE 56% LOWER HALF LENGTH PERCENTAGE 75%
CROWN HEIGHT PERCENTAGE 15.4% GIRDLE THICKNESS MEDIUM TO SLIGHTLY THICK
CROWN ANGLE 34.9° GIRDLE FINISH FACETED
STAR LENGTH PERCENTAGE 55% CULET NONE
PAVILION DEPTH PERCENTAGE 43.2%

HCA score: 1.9 excellent
LR: Excellent
Fire/Scintilation/Spread: Very Good

Ring 2
CARAT WEIGHT 1.35 CARATS
MEASUREMENTS 7.15 - 7.19 x 4.38 mm
COLOR GRADE H
FLUORESCENCE NONE
PRECISION OF CUT EXCELLENT
SYMMETRY EXCELLENT
POLISH EXCELLENT
CLARITY GRADE VS1
TOTAL DEPTH PERCENTAGE 61.1% PAVILION ANGLE 40.7°
TABLE SIZE PERCENTAGE 55% LOWER HALF LENGTH PERCENTAGE 75%
CROWN HEIGHT PERCENTAGE 15.5% GIRDLE THICKNESS THIN TO MEDIUM
CROWN ANGLE 34.0° GIRDLE FINISH FACETED
STAR LENGTH PERCENTAGE 55% CULET NONE
PAVILION DEPTH PERCENTAGE 43.0%


HCA score: 0.8 excellent
LR/Fire/Scintilation: Excellent
Spread: Very Good


Thanks!!!!!
 

Stone-cold11

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Sep 9, 2008
Messages
14,069
2 will have better spread at least which is the most noticeable. So you will have to decide if that is worth it. Any images?
 

Lorelei

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 30, 2005
Messages
42,064
Date: 4/22/2009 8:41:41 PM
Author: ukjeeper21
So I took everyone''s advice and had the sales associate search the database for a better ring. I''ve narrowed my search down to the following 2 rings and would like to get your opinion on them. Ring 2 cost $1500 more than Ring 1. I also have a couple questions:

a. Does a lower HCA score mean its a better quality ring?
No a lower HCA score is not better than a higher one, the HCA is used for rejection not selection. The aim is to score below 2 then evaluate from there.
 

Lorelei

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 30, 2005
Messages
42,064
Date: 4/22/2009 9:46:53 PM
Author: AmberGretchen
Based on just that information, I''d lean towards ring #2.
Ditto Amber.
 
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