Find your diamond
Find your jewelry
shape
carat
color
clarity

Different inclusions in same clarity grade

Status
Not open for further replies. Please create a new topic or request for this thread to be opened.

silverbuggy

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Feb 18, 2009
Messages
188
Both of these diamonds have a GIA clarity grade of VS2. However, I am able to see more inclusions in A. Is A worse then in that sense?

In this H&A arrows picture, you see that black dot in the table of A. I am able to see that same black dot with a 10x loupe as well.

Inclusion-ArrowsAB.JPG
 

silverbuggy

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Feb 18, 2009
Messages
188
In this H&A hearts picture, you see that the little dots in A or more apparent and more in number. Actually when I look down from the crown at a slight angle, I see dots seemingly lined around the inside perimeter, but I guess they''re actually closer to the pavilion.

I''m not sure if I should let this bother me. Could A have been graded wrong, or perhaps these images aren''t suffiicient to analyze from?

Inclusions-HeartsAB.JPG
 

Todd Gray

Brilliant_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jan 20, 2009
Messages
1,297
Every clarity grade is actually a "range" of clarity and every diamond contains inclusions that are slightly different in type, size and location than any other diamond, thus each specimen of a clarity grade that you consider will be different.
 

silverbuggy

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Feb 18, 2009
Messages
188
Date: 3/12/2009 6:21:56 PM
Author: Todd Gray
Every clarity grade is actually a 'range' of clarity and every diamond contains inclusions that are slightly different in type, size and location than any other diamond, thus each specimen of a clarity grade that you consider will be different.
Hmmm when a diamond is priced, is this "range" taken into consideration or will all VS2 diamonds (given that everything else is EXACTLY the same) be priced the same?
 

AndyMN

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jun 2, 2008
Messages
47
You are correct, given that everything else is equal the two VS2''s will be priced similarly. You may see some slight variation because the person selling it realizes that one is nicer than the other. This is a reason why it''s nice to be able to view a diamond in person before purchasing. A couple of reasons why there is a range; no two diamonds are alike (obviously because they are naturally occurring like a finger print or snowflake) and that the grade assigned to each stone is done so by a human being who is essentially giving their opinion based on set parameters. By the way, the inclusions in your A and B images look to me like they are one inclusion reflecting onto the other facets which when graded are looked at as multiple inclusions.
 

Wink

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
May 3, 2001
Messages
7,496
Date: 3/12/2009 7:54:16 PM
Author: AndyMN
You are correct, given that everything else is equal the two VS2''s will be priced similarly. You may see some slight variation because the person selling it realizes that one is nicer than the other. This is a reason why it''s nice to be able to view a diamond in person before purchasing. A couple of reasons why there is a range; no two diamonds are alike (obviously because they are naturally occurring like a finger print or snowflake) and that the grade assigned to each stone is done so by a human being who is essentially giving their opinion based on set parameters. By the way, the inclusions in your A and B images look to me like they are one inclusion reflecting onto the other facets which when graded are looked at as multiple inclusions.
Andy,

Normally I agree with what you have to say, but this statement is just wrong in my opinion. I have never in my life been offered a diamond at a higher or lower price based on where it falls in a clarity grade, and if I am I am likely to run screaming from the room. There is enough confusion about pricing and values already without artificially creating a bunch more categories. I have to pay the same, so I will sell them for the same, other wise ...

This diamond is $x because it is the basic VS2 but really it sucks and is almost an SI1. This diamond however is $x + 5% because it is a really nice middle of the road VS2 but this one, well it is $x + 15% because it is really nice top of the line VS2 with real leather seats and an AM FM radio included. Help SAVE ME, I am going insane...........................
 

elle_chris

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Feb 19, 2004
Messages
3,156
Wink- I''ve been told that. That a stone was discounted because he felt the lab (GIA) was a little liberal with the clarity grading and thought the stone was closer to an SI1. I was a bit surprised the jeweler was being honest.
 

strmrdr

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Nov 1, 2003
Messages
23,295
keep in mind there are 3 things that can make a diamond a vs1 or vs2

1: size of 1 inclusion with or without other minor inclusions, this is called a grade setting inclusion.

2: a bunch of smaller inclusions with no 1 grade setting inclusion.

3: type of inclusion.
 

Lorelei

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 30, 2005
Messages
42,064
You can''t tell from these greatly magnified images if something that is perhaps in reality a little bigger than a pencil eraser ( can''t remember the exact sizes of these diamonds) will show a small inclusion to the naked eye. Check with the seller if the diamond meets your standards concerning '' eyecleanliness.''
 

arjunajane

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 18, 2008
Messages
9,758
Honestly? I think you are over-thinking it abit..I mean, you will not be louping your diamond every 5 mins once its mounted..
and if VS2 is not mind clean for you, perhaps you need to step up?

Plus ditto Wink on that issue of scale - that would send me round the bend too!
 

silverbuggy

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Feb 18, 2009
Messages
188
Date: 3/13/2009 3:31:35 AM
Author: arjunajane
Honestly? I think you are over-thinking it abit..I mean, you will not be louping your diamond every 5 mins once its mounted..
and if VS2 is not mind clean for you, perhaps you need to step up?

Plus ditto Wink on that issue of scale - that would send me round the bend too!
Some may call me crazy but I actually kind of like the inclusions on the left diamond because it makes it identifiable and unique. It's very easy for me to spot the dot under the table with 10x magnification, and when I peer into the crown towards the girdle, I see 3 dots pretty much any angle I turn the diamond. So as I rotate it, the dots seemingly line up all around the inside perimeter, 1 on each pavilion facet. I think AndyMN might be right that it's just 1 or 2 inclusions reflecting off everywhere.

After reading some more articles on grading though, I'm wondering whether that left diamond should be an SI instead (which would bother me). If the inclusions are very easy to see for an inexperienced grader under 10x, would it still qualify as VS2?
 

Lorelei

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 30, 2005
Messages
42,064
Date: 3/13/2009 3:39:43 AM
Author: silverbuggy

Date: 3/13/2009 3:31:35 AM
Author: arjunajane
Honestly? I think you are over-thinking it abit..I mean, you will not be louping your diamond every 5 mins once its mounted..
and if VS2 is not mind clean for you, perhaps you need to step up?

Plus ditto Wink on that issue of scale - that would send me round the bend too!
Some may call me crazy but I actually kind of like the inclusions on the left diamond because it makes it identifiable and unique. It''s very easy for me to spot the dot under the table with 10x magnification, and when I peer into the crown towards the girdle, I see 3 dots pretty much any angle I turn the diamond. So as I rotate it, the dots seemingly line up all around the inside perimeter, 1 on each pavilion facet. I think AndyMN might be right that it''s just 1 or 2 inclusions reflecting off everywhere.

After reading some more articles on grading though, I''m wondering whether that left diamond should be an SI instead (which would bother me). If the inclusions are very easy to see for an inexperienced grader under 10x, would it still qualify as VS2?
Does sound like it is reflecting. If you are concerned, get an independant appraiser to look at the diamond if you are favouring it for purchase - or you could get them to examine both if you have them both with you, that might help tip the scales.
 

arjunajane

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 18, 2008
Messages
9,758
Date: 3/13/2009 3:39:43 AM
Author: silverbuggy

Date: 3/13/2009 3:31:35 AM
Author: arjunajane
Honestly? I think you are over-thinking it abit..I mean, you will not be louping your diamond every 5 mins once its mounted..
and if VS2 is not mind clean for you, perhaps you need to step up?

Plus ditto Wink on that issue of scale - that would send me round the bend too!
Some may call me crazy but I actually kind of like the inclusions on the left diamond because it makes it identifiable and unique. It''s very easy for me to spot the dot under the table with 10x magnification, and when I peer into the crown towards the girdle, I see 3 dots pretty much any angle I turn the diamond. So as I rotate it, the dots seemingly line up all around the inside perimeter, 1 on each pavilion facet. I think AndyMN might be right that it''s just 1 or 2 inclusions reflecting off everywhere.

After reading some more articles on grading though, I''m wondering whether that left diamond should be an SI instead (which would bother me). If the inclusions are very easy to see for an inexperienced grader under 10x, would it still qualify as VS2?
I agree, it sounds like one inclusion reflecting - if they do not disturb your perception of eye or mind clean, I also agree small inclusions like this are useful for identification purposes.

In re to your last question, only an independent appraiser will be able to tell you if the grade is not accurate, by inspecting the diamond in person.
 

silverbuggy

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Feb 18, 2009
Messages
188
Thanks Lorelei and arjunajane! I already have an appointment with an appraiser. I originally was going to pick a diamond beforehand and have him just appraise that, but I think I''ll take your advice and have him look at both. Or maybe just have him appraise the one I favor and then if there are any problems, then I pull out the backup. :razz:
 

Lorelei

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 30, 2005
Messages
42,064
Date: 3/13/2009 3:54:30 AM
Author: silverbuggy
Thanks Lorelei and arjunajane! I already have an appointment with an appraiser. I originally was going to pick a diamond beforehand and have him just appraise that, but I think I''ll take your advice and have him look at both. Or maybe just have him appraise the one I favor and then if there are any problems, then I pull out the backup. :razz:
I would do that, you have a great opportunity to have an impartial expert examine both and I think it could really help.
 

arjunajane

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 18, 2008
Messages
9,758
Ha ha, jinx Lorelei!

Good luck with the appraiser S.B
 
Status
Not open for further replies. Please create a new topic or request for this thread to be opened.
Be a part of the community It's free, join today!
    Push Present: Engagement Ring Upgrade
    Push Present: Engagement Ring Upgrade
    20th Anniversary Upgrade
    20th Anniversary Upgrade
    Horses for Courses: Polo Match Jewelry
    Horses for Courses: Polo Match Jewelry

Need Something Special?

Get a quote from multiple trusted and vetted jewelers.

Holloway Cut Advisor



Diamond Eye Candy

Click to view full-size image.
Top