Did you get a flu shot this year?

[msop04]

Hey msop04, do you know if they even make a killed-virus measles vaccine anymore? I read that I'm not supposed to have any live, attenuated vaccines, but I'm wondering if I can get any protection at all from a killed one? I know they are not used anymore, but I'm wondering do they still make them?

I'll keep hunting, but if you know, I'd appreciate it.

No, they don't make them anymore, because they weren't effective... the MMR uses a weakened (attenuated) live virus. This is from the CDC regarding the old killed virus measles vaccine:

If you received a measles vaccine in the 1960s, you may not need to be revaccinated. People who have documentation of receiving LIVE measles vaccine in the 1960s do not need to be revaccinated. People who were vaccinated prior to 1968 with either inactivated (killed) measles vaccine or measles vaccine of unknown type should be revaccinated with at least one dose of live attenuated measles vaccine. This recommendation is intended to protect those who may have received killed measles vaccine, which was available in 1963-1967 and was not effective.

 

[ksinger]

Hi, KSinger. I searched the CDC website and I can’t find any information about a killed-virus measles vaccine. There is a certain percentage of people who can’t take live vaccines, including the very young and those who have weakened immune systems. We rely on having most of our population vaccinated so outbreaks can’t spread to vulnerable unvaccinated people.

I would encourage everyone to take the vaccines that are recommended for you. We have very fortunately forgotten the age of severe outbreaks. My grandmother’s little sister died of diphtheria when she was about 7. My grandmother grieved the loss of her sister her whole life. Two of her grandchildren, including me, were named after her. Before her sister died, her daddy lifted her up so she could see the horses outside the window one last time. It was terribly sad. We are so very fortunate to have modern vaccines and they have saved millions of lives.

Thanks MissBeaucoup, for checking. I checked there too and didn't find anything. I know they quit using the killed virus measles vaccine because it was found to be ineffective, but I wondered if there was any response at all to it. Seems not, and I guess I'm being silly to hope there was some response. I would take what I could get, you know? But I guess I'm well and truly screwed on this one. I got vaccinated in that not-so-sweet spot between '63 and '67, so I don't know what type I had, and could have had the killed. They recommend a booster in that case, but I can't get it due to health issues. Grrr.

This is an issue, because we are considering doing some travel, and airports, you know?

 

[ksinger]

No, they don't make them anymore, because they weren't effective... the MMR uses a weakened (attenuated) live virus. This is from the CDC regarding the old killed virus measles vaccine:

If you received a measles vaccine in the 1960s, you may not need to be revaccinated. People who have documentation of receiving LIVE measles vaccine in the 1960s do not need to be revaccinated. People who were vaccinated prior to 1968 with either inactivated (killed) measles vaccine or measles vaccine of unknown type should be revaccinated with at least one dose of live attenuated measles vaccine. This recommendation is intended to protect those who may have received killed measles vaccine, which was available in 1963-1967 and was not effective.

Thanks msop04, I read that too, but I just want to believe there's some way around the issues that make it so that I can't get the vaccine. Sigh. Alas, there just is no way around it. Blech.

 

[msop04]

Oops, I just now saw that @MissyBeaucoup had already answered!

 

[msop04]

Thanks msop04, I read that too, but I just want to believe there's some way around the issues that make it so that I can't get the vaccine. Sigh. Alas, there just is no way around it. Blech.

Ugh... and airports are the worst! I hope you can avoid contracting anything, @ksinger -- especially in your upcoming travel!

 

[YadaYadaYada]

If anyone is wondering if they are immune from a prior vaccination to a disease you could have your antibody titers checked. I did that with my oldest son after his first MMR and he was way past the level necessary for immunity just from the one dose even though they recommend two.

 

[msop04]

If anyone is wondering if they are immune from a prior vaccination to a disease you could have your antibody titers checked. I did that with my oldest son after his first MMR and he was way past the level necessary for immunity just from the one dose even though they recommend two.

That's a great idea for @ksinger and others who may be in the same boat!

 

[Wewechew]

If anyone is wondering if they are immune from a prior vaccination to a disease you could have your antibody titers checked. I did that with my oldest son after his first MMR and he was way past the level necessary for immunity just from the one dose even though they recommend two.

Thanks for the advice. I’m surprised/saddened this isn’t standard practice.

 

[lyra]

I just had the anti body bloodwork done. I still have to sort through it with my doctor. I can't have live virus vaccines either. I had measles as a child, but that didn't give me immunity, and I had MMR vaccines a couple of times later in life. I hope that was enough because I don't think I can get the vaccine now.

 

[ksinger]

Thanks for the advice. I’m surprised/saddened this isn’t standard practice.

I don't really think it would be necessary when herd immunity is strong. But it's weakening, so yeah, I would think testing at some point needs to become standard.

I WAS able to take the Tdap booster recently though. I really really don't want to get whooping cough. I've been around a lot more young children lately, and I don't want them making me sick, or me them.

 

[MissyBeaucoup]

I hope you can check your titer and maybe you will be lucky. Even if the old measles vaccine was said to be ineffective, it could have been 58% responsive or something, enough to help lots of people even if it couldn’t hold an epidemic at bay.

I had a job where I had to be vaccinated against hepatitis B. They checked my titer afterwards and for some reason I didn’t develop a good immunity and needed a booster. But none of my colleagues did—they responded well to the vaccine the first time.

Good luck to you! I hope you enjoy your travels!

 

[msop04]

Ya'll... we just sent an entire family to the hospital. Parents and both kids (8 and 3 yo) tested positive for flu A (and the 8 yo was also strep+). I honestly don't know how they got here, as both parents were so weak. They refused an ambulance (most likely due to cost), but I was nervous about them driving the short distance to the hospital. Very scary.

Please wash your hands as much as possible.

 

[Wewechew]

Ya'll... we just sent an entire family to the hospital. Parents and both kids (8 and 3 yo) tested positive for flu A (and the 8 yo was also strep+). I honestly don't know how they got here, as both parents were so weak. They refused an ambulance (most likely due to cost), but I was nervous about them driving the short distance to the hospital. Very scary.

Please wash your hands as much as possible.

I hope they are ok :-/

 

[lyra]

As soon as I hear similar reports here, I have to go into recluse mode. I can't take chances. It's lonely and isolating but has become a necessity. I hate it.

I hope that family will be okay.

 

[msop04]

I hope they are ok :-/

Me too... they didn't fill scripts with me (and haven't before), or I would call and check on them. However, the clinic will call them in 2 days for follow-up. I'm glad they came in when they did.

 

[msop04]

As soon as I hear similar reports here, I have to go into recluse mode. I can't take chances. It's lonely and isolating but has become a necessity. I hate it.

I hope that family will be okay.

Bless you, @lyra... please be safe and do what you have to do to keep from getting sick.

 

[Ellen]

MSOP, I was going to bump this today myself. I had mentioned that I had some vaccine/vaccine related questions for you and you had agreed to answer if you could. I would prefer to wait until the first of the year to discuss all this. It puts me in a very negative place to discuss vacs, and I really don't want to spend my Christmas season like that. So I hope you don't mind if we temporarily postpone this.

 

[msop04]

MSOP, I was going to bump this today myself. I had mentioned that I had some vaccine/vaccine related questions for you and you had agreed to answer if you could. I would prefer to wait until the first of the year to discuss all this. It puts me in a very negative place to discuss vacs, and I really don't want to spend my Christmas season like that. So I hope you don't mind if we temporarily postpone this.

Not at all... whenever you'd like.

 

[msop04]

Update on the flu fam... the clinic called this morning for standard 2-day check-up.

They did go to the ER after leaving the clinic, and all but the 3 yo were released. The 3 yo child was admitted to the hospital for further observation and more fluids. She is still there, but is doing better and will be released around lunch today, according to the mom. The father and other child were pretty dehydrated, so they were also given fluids in the ER. None received Tamiflu because they were outside the 36 hour window for efficacy. I'm so relieved they are okay!

 

[Calliecake]

Thank you for the update MSOP. One of the children in a town near where I live has been hospitalized for months with the flu that has affected children with polio like symptoms. So scary.

 

[msop04]

Thank you for the update MSOP. One of the children in a town near where I live has been hospitalized for months with the flu that has affected children with polio like symptoms. So scary.

Oh dear... I'd read about the cases with polio-like symptoms... I pray the child recovers. Scary indeed.

 

[ksinger]

Oh dear... I'd read about the cases with polio-like symptoms... I pray the child recovers. Scary indeed.

I've not heard of those. Has it been attributed to one strain over others?

VERY scary, yes! Even polio-like is awful, I wonder if the symptoms are from the same cause - damaged nerves, and if they can be overcome? I have a friend who actually had polio as a child. She recovered with rehab and did pretty well for quite a few years. But she's old enough now that she has post-polio and there's not much that can be done.

 

[msop04]

I've not heard of those. Has it been attributed to one strain over others?

VERY scary, yes! Even polio-like is awful, I wonder if the symptoms are from the same cause - damaged nerves, and if they can be overcome? I have a friend who actually had polio as a child. She recovered with rehab and did pretty well for quite a few years. But she's old enough now that she has post-polio and there's not much that can be done.

Looks like it's not linked to flu, but terrifying nonetheless...

This is just a generic article from WebMD... at the time this article was written (October), there were 127 cases, with 62 of those having documented acute flaccid myelitis - likely more undocumented. AFM affects the muscles, most commonly the extremities, but can affect others. The worst cases can cause respiratory depression.

It says AFM is caused by viruses (Enterovirus and Rhinovirus were specifically mentioned). CDC hasn't ruled out other factors, such as (but not limited to) autoimmune disorders and environmental toxins.

"If children develop an upper-respiratory infection and there is any hint of muscle weakness, those patients need to be evaluated rapidly by a pediatrician and an emergency department," he said. "They need to be followed very carefully, because this is a very aggressive disease. In a matter of hours, the children are paralyzed. They may need respiratory support."

https://www.webmd.com/children/news/20181016/cdc-warns-of-polio-like-virus-striking-more-kids#1

KEEP THOSE HANDS WASHED!!! Very scary!

 

[AGBF]

I just had my second pre-op physical (for the same surgery) with my internist today. (My surgery had to be postponed the first time because one of my blood tests wasn't good. That necessitated the redo of the physical because too much time had passed.) I was asked if I had had my 'flu shot. Yes. But then I was asked about the pneumonia vaccine. No. I have planned to have it done, but no one wants to do it right after a 'flu shot or right before I have surgery. I also volunteered that I'd like the shingles vaccine and I was told that I could be put on a waiting list for that. Apparently it is incredibly popular, at least where I live.

 

[msop04]

I just had my second pre-op physical (for the same surgery) with my internist today. (My surgery had to be postponed the first time because one of my blood tests wasn't good. That necessitated the redo of the physical because too much time had passed.) I was asked if I had had my 'flu shot. Yes. But then I was asked about the pneumonia vaccine. No. I have planned to have it done, but no one wants to do it right after a 'flu shot or right before I have surgery. I also volunteered that I'd like the shingles vaccine and I was told that I could be put on a waiting list for that. Apparently it is incredibly popular, at least where I live.

Yes, I'd absolutely recommend both of those, @AGBF. Funny you mentioned the shingles vaccine, because this morning I received a script for one... but when I went to order it, I saw that it was out of stock and had been since APRIL!!! Our wholesaler hoped that they'd have some back in stock around December 17th though, so you may want to go ahead and be put on the list to order it. Who knows how long it will be after the manufacturer's next batch runs out.

 

[msop04]

 

[AGBF]

Thanks for the heads up, msop. I believe the nurse said that she was going to put me on the waiting list, but given what you just told me, I will call the office back and make sure she did so! I don't want to wait for another year!

Deb/AGBF

 

[msop04]

Thanks for the heads up, msop. I believe the nurse said that she was going to put me on the waiting list, but given what you just told me, I will call the office back and make sure she did so! I don't want to wait for another year!

Deb/AGBF

No problem! ...and I don't blame you one bit!! MFR backorders suck!!

 

[AGBF]

No problem! ...and I don't blame you one bit!! MFR backorders suck!!

I made the call to my doctor's office and I had not , yet, been placed on the shingles vaccine waiting list. I am so glad I mentioned the matter in this thread and so glad you told me about your problem with your back order. Pricescope is amazing. Thank you again, msop!!!

Deb

 

[ksinger]

Looks like it's not linked to flu, but terrifying nonetheless...

This is just a generic article from WebMD... at the time this article was written (October), there were 127 cases, with 62 of those having documented acute flaccid myelitis - likely more undocumented. AFM affects the muscles, most commonly the extremities, but can affect others. The worst cases can cause respiratory depression.

It says AFM is caused by viruses (Enterovirus and Rhinovirus were specifically mentioned). CDC hasn't ruled out other factors, such as (but not limited to) autoimmune disorders and environmental toxins.

"If children develop an upper-respiratory infection and there is any hint of muscle weakness, those patients need to be evaluated rapidly by a pediatrician and an emergency department," he said. "They need to be followed very carefully, because this is a very aggressive disease. In a matter of hours, the children are paralyzed. They may need respiratory support."

https://www.webmd.com/children/news/20181016/cdc-warns-of-polio-like-virus-striking-more-kids#1

KEEP THOSE HANDS WASHED!!! Very scary!

Wow. That sounds actually worse than polio, because there is no vaccine and limited if any recovery.

Since it's in the polio family, I'm surprised they've not tried to come up with a vaccine for it. Although I guess they did say they aren't sure it's JUST enterovirus, or rather enterovirus is just one of maybe several.

The world is indeed a dangerous place.