Diamond color and metal options

[Rosebloom]

I have read many different threads with various opinions on the affect of metal choice on the appearance of a diamond's color. For my own reference, and because it might be helpful to others too, I was hoping we could discuss the merits of various metals here. I'm going to start with my understanding of the CW but please chime in to correct me or add your own observations!

Platinum: Makes white diamonds (J and higher) look whiter. May make warmer diamonds (K-O/P) look a little warmer due to the contrast.
Rhodium plated white gold: same as platinum
Unplated white gold: depending on the specific metal composition, looks like a cross between white and yellow gold. The metal's warmth matches the warmth in diamonds J-Mish. Because it does not contrast, it draws less attention to the warmth than a stark white metal would. Some vendors consider it difficult to work with and few offer it as an option.
Yellow gold: Makes colorless and high near colorless diamonds (G/H and higher) look whiter due to the high contrast. May make very white diamonds (DEF) look less icy white. Can add warmth to diamonds I and lower, especially if used in prongs or bezels since the metal may be reflected throughout the stone. Can be used to make a very light yellow (S and lower) look more intensely yellow.
Rose gold: Makes colorless and high near colorless diamonds (G/H and higher) look whiter due to the high contrast. May enhance the warmth of diamonds with visible warmth, especially those with brown or pink undertones as opposed to yellow.

Is any of this accurate? What other conclusions could we add?

 

[diamond_concierge]

I would agree with most of your statements. Color is a very subjective criterion and very few people perceive color in the exact same way. Whether a particular metal enhances or detracts from a diamond's body color would largely be a matter of personal taste; however I tend to agree that the high luster of platinum accentuates white diamonds and that yellow gold can impact how we perceive diamond color. When I set important fancy yellows, I always choose a high karat yellow gold alloy because it harmonizes very well.

 

[ClassyRocks]

Rosebloom, I am so glad you started this thread! I am going to keep it for a reference!

 

[kenny]

Gold color doing one thing to D-F diamonds, another to G-Is, and yet a third to J-Zs strikes me as more psychology than science.

Hence I doubt there can be universal agreement on this topic.

 

[yssie]

Is anyone surprised that I can't stay away from this thread?

I'd add one thing - white gold can be surprisingly varied in colour even within the same karat: I've got 18kWG that looks light yellow, 18kWG that looks just-barely-off-white, 18kWG that could almost pass for platinum, and 18kWG that looks pinkish... the alloy composition can make a big difference! And since it's not generally the sort of info that vendors have on the tips of their tongues, matching metal colours can be a bit of a PITA (in addition to the fact that some vendors won't work with some alloys like you noted, Rose).

Gold color doing one thing to D-F diamonds, another to G-Is, and yet a third to J-Zs strikes me as more psychology than science.

Hence I doubt there can be universal agreement on this topic.

I would attribute a number of the differences to biology rather than psychology - the results of our eyes interpreting nuances of colour differently, and since we've all got basically the same eyes I do think it's a topic worth exploring. But I would agree that we're unlikely to ever reach universal agreement. It's a lot like cut in that sense, actually!

 

[TC1987]

The other part of the equation is secondary body tints of gray, green, brown, pink, and I don't know what else, within the diamond. Those might make a certain metal color more or less flattering to a particular diamond. That is something that has to be seen -- you have to put the diamond up against the metal to see what is the most flattering. To use an example that many people have surely seen, moissanite (a sim stone) is said to range from I or J to K or L (or possibly lower )in color. But some of them also have a greenish or "murky" undertone to them that might make them look better in YG than RG or any of the "white" metals.

 

[darkadam]

From what I know it is a mixture of physiology and psychology. The physiological
Aspect affects what we actually see, but the psychological is strong enough to actually overwrite it. I once read an excellent article involving physiology, psychology, and color theory with many examples about how we really see or interpret color. Unfortunately I can't seem to find the article. But I do remember the following chessboard example.

http://whyevolutionistrue.wordpress.com/2011/01/08/do-we-perceive-reality-the-checker-shadow-illusion/

For those that bother to do it in an image editor, shifting the two squares next to each other or using a color picker will show that they are actually if same color, just perceived differently based on what we expect or have learned. Once we accept this aspect, it would be difficult to say exactly what you really see, when you look at a particular stone metal combination. Aspects such as learned expectations, cultural influences and many aspects come into play. Do you want it to be whiter ? Do you believe it will be whiter ? How will it look to others ?

I'm of course not saying that the actual light return and color we perceive does not matter, but rather there are factors which apply a modifier which apply an equal influence, and what we actually expect to see plays an important role.

To answer the question from my perspective, from what I've seen, to me yellow and rose gold makes whiter diamonds stand out more and appear whiter, even up to the colorless def range. BUT based on physiology, from what I know it SHOULD appear warmer. The season I still see it as whites might be my expectations of contrast causing my mind to override what my eye actually perceives. Easiest way would be to view it yourself and decide.

 

[yssie]

From what I know it is a mixture of physiology and psychology. The physiological
Aspect affects what we actually see, but the psychological is strong enough to actually overwrite it. I once read an excellent article involving physiology, psychology, and color theory with many examples about how we really see or interpret color. Unfortunately I can't seem to find the article. But I do remember the following chessboard example.

http://whyevolutionistrue.wordpress.com/2011/01/08/do-we-perceive-reality-the-checker-shadow-illusion/

For those that bother to do it in an image editor, shifting the two squares next to each other or using a color picker will show that they are actually if same color, just perceived differently based on what we expect or have learned. Once we accept this aspect, it would be difficult to say exactly what you really see, when you look at a particular stone metal combination. Aspects such as learned expectations, cultural influences and many aspects come into play. Do you want it to be whiter ? Do you believe it will be whiter ? How will it look to others ?

I'm of course not saying that the actual light return and color we perceive does not matter, but rather there are factors which apply a modifier which apply an equal influence, and what we actually expect to see plays an important role.

To answer the question from my perspective, from what I've seen, to me yellow and rose gold makes whiter diamonds stand out more, even up to the colorless def range.

I've seen examples like this but none quite that vivid and startling - thanks for posting that!

 

[delight]

Shadows will trick our perception of light. I think there's a BBC show called Brain Science or Brain something that also talks about optical illusions the brain processes.

 

[Rosebloom]

From what I know it is a mixture of physiology and psychology. The physiological
Aspect affects what we actually see, but the psychological is strong enough to actually overwrite it. I once read an excellent article involving physiology, psychology, and color theory with many examples about how we really see or interpret color. Unfortunately I can't seem to find the article. But I do remember the following chessboard example.

http://whyevolutionistrue.wordpress.com/2011/01/08/do-we-perceive-reality-the-checker-shadow-illusion/

For those that bother to do it in an image editor, shifting the two squares next to each other or using a color picker will show that they are actually if same color, just perceived differently based on what we expect or have learned. Once we accept this aspect, it would be difficult to say exactly what you really see, when you look at a particular stone metal combination. Aspects such as learned expectations, cultural influences and many aspects come into play. Do you want it to be whiter ? Do you believe it will be whiter ? How will it look to others ?

I'm of course not saying that the actual light return and color we perceive does not matter, but rather there are factors which apply a modifier which apply an equal influence, and what we actually expect to see plays an important role.

To answer the question from my perspective, from what I've seen, to me yellow and rose gold makes whiter diamonds stand out more and appear whiter, even up to the colorless def range. BUT based on physiology, from what I know it SHOULD appear warmer. The season I still see it as whites might be my expectations of contrast causing my mind to override what my eye actually perceives. Easiest way would be to view it yourself and decide.

Ok first off, this blew my mind. I had to replay the video several times to believe it! Crazy.

 

[Rosebloom]

I agree that our individual perception of color is affected by many factors. Additionally, most of my diamond viewing is photographs. So without any way to do some kind of mass color balance it's hard to compare apples to apples.

For instance, look at these pictures of Packrat's (absolutely divine!) L/M colored three stone, first set in yellow gold and then in unplated white gold:




It obviously looks less yellow in the unplated white gold and her comments in her threads support this observation

Meanwhile, Coati has an M OEC (to which I bow down), pictured below in white metal (platinum I believe) and then in high karat yellow gold:

 

[Rosebloom]

I believe she has said in the past, although I cannot find it now, that the stone looks whiter in its yellow gold bezel.

So it also seems to depend on the individual stone in addition to the eyes of the beholder/camera.

Are there any generalities we can draw? Resets are expensive!

 

[Rosebloom]

Is anyone surprised that I can't stay away from this thread?

I'd add one thing - white gold can be surprisingly varied in colour even within the same karat: I've got 18kWG that looks light yellow, 18kWG that looks just-barely-off-white, 18kWG that could almost pass for platinum, and 18kWG that looks pinkish... the alloy composition can make a big difference! And since it's not generally the sort of info that vendors have on the tips of their tongues, matching metal colours can be a bit of a PITA (in addition to the fact that some vendors won't work with some alloys like you noted, Rose).

Gold color doing one thing to D-F diamonds, another to G-Is, and yet a third to J-Zs strikes me as more psychology than science.

Hence I doubt there can be universal agreement on this topic.

I would attribute a number of the differences to biology rather than psychology - the results of our eyes interpreting nuances of colour differently, and since we've all got basically the same eyes I do think it's a topic worth exploring. But I would agree that we're unlikely to ever reach universal agreement. It's a lot like cut in that sense, actually!

I'm so glad you chimed in (in fact I almost named the thread "Paging Yssie..." but didn't want to put you on the spot if you were tired of talking about this!). You make excellent points. For those interested in more of Yssie's insight, I've had these threads bookmarked for a while:

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/which-metal-compliments-a-warm-stone-best.160706/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/which-metal-compliments-a-warm-stone-best.160706/[/URL]
[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/help-bezel-halos-wg-or-yg-and-lower-color-stones.173143/#post-3150115?hilit=favourite#p3150115']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/help-bezel-halos-wg-or-yg-and-lower-color-stones.173143/#post-3150115?hilit=favourite#p3150115[/URL]

 

[diamondseeker2006]

The other issue with pictures is that you don't know what color is reflecting in the diamonds from the environment. Packrat has on a white sweater when her diamonds appear more white, and I would have to believe that there is color reflecting in the stones when they look so yellow since they'd be fancy yellow if they were really that deep.

I prefer white metal for prongs EXCEPT when trying to accentuate the body color, such as a YG bezel or cupping for a yellow stone or rose gold for a brownish or pink stone. I would not use yellow or rose gold for prongs in a near colorless to colorless stone.

 

[yssie]

Oh Rosebloom I'll never tire of this topic, I don't think I took this today and thought it was pretty nifty, and wanted to post it here.

The five middle rings are all 18k-WG (unplated). I white-balanced with an 18% grey card and I think the differences are very true to life:



A - PT950/Ru

B - 18k (custom piece) from DBL, exact composition: "Palladium-WG" - don't know exact alloy

C - 18k WG (custom piece) from RDG, exact composition: [75% Fine Gold] [17% Palladium] [5% Pure Silver] [3% Platinum]
In-person the RDG alloy (C) looks slightly warmer than (B)

D - 18k WG (stock piece) from e-wb, exact composition: ?

E - 18k WG (custom piece) from WF, exact composition: [75%AU] [9.8%CU] [9.8%NI] [5.22%ZN]

F - 18k WG (custom piece) from e-wb, exact composition: [75%AU] [16.5%CU] [4%NI] [4.5%ZN]
In-person (F) is slightly yellower and pinker than (E), especially under fluorescents

G - 14k YG

 

[Niel]

I believe she has said in the past, although I cannot find it now, that the stone looks whiter in its yellow gold bezel.

So it also seems to depend on the individual stone in addition to the eyes of the beholder/camera.

Are there any generalities we can draw? Resets are expensive!

what color is her stone?


for someone in my mind i cant imagine my Ks not looking white in a YG bezel..... but i definitely want to hear more about this before my reset,.

 

[yssie]

I believe she has said in the past, although I cannot find it now, that the stone looks whiter in its yellow gold bezel.

So it also seems to depend on the individual stone in addition to the eyes of the beholder/camera.

Are there any generalities we can draw? Resets are expensive!

what color is her stone?


for someone in my mind i cant imagine my Ks not looking white in a YG bezel..... but i definitely want to hear more about this before my reset,.

I have a new piece with yellow gold details next to the pavilion of one RB and white gold details next to another of similar size, and the stone sitting in YG is visibly yellower from the side, so I completely agree that YG prongs/pavilion details/bezels would make even a well-cut RB look more tinted! Well, from the side view, at least, which means that the effects must propagate to the face-up view as well, even if it's so slight that no-one would appreciate it...

It's logical to conclude that any time a coloured surface makes actual contact with the surface of the diamond some colour will be imparted just by virtue of the fact that at the area(s) of contact light isn't internally reflecting as a function of critical angle, but simply reflecting off the coloured surface. And any time the stone isn't spotlessly clean, the critical angle for total internal reflection changes, allowing some light to "leak" and "re-enter" from the sides. Mike from RDG has talked about plating the insides of prongs when setting white stones in non-white metals - it's an elegant solution, I just have a mind-block wrt. rhodium plating!

 

[Niel]

Rats. Can you even do that with a bezel.

 

[Rosebloom]

Yssie - that picture is amazing. I am way too excited by studying the subtle nuance between each band. Maybe I should have been a chemist!

I love the idea of matching a diamond's color to the metal to create a cohesive look (as you so masterfully did with your DBL five stone in unplated WG and J colored diamonds).

 

[Rosebloom]

Rats. Can you even do that with a bezel.

For some reason I feel like I remember someone had a ring like that - white metal inner part of the bezel but yellow on the outside. Sure would be cool.